Eve Vs. Star Trek

[Playerofeve]

Hello all I'm new here and this is my first post, and I thought perhaps a Vs. question that's been on my mind for several months now I suppose it would be a good way to start, I'm not going to place any limits on the argument except that answers be logical and sane(in a way)

The question is simple and the answer I leave up to you I'm Just along for the ride, the question is who is more militarily power full?

The Empires of Eve Or the Empires of Star Trek?

Who do you think would win in a conflict, who do you think would become friends and allies and who would become enemies?

The limits are you you have to use the latest in cannon from both as they are currently, if you play Eve you would know the political climate changes continually as Eve has a constantly evolving player control political environment.

And I assume most of you are very much aware of the current political ans military climate in Trek after the Dominion War.

And there it is, have at it argue away! I'm about to head off to work in a few, damned closing shift;(

[Murazor]

Would this be the universe of EVE Online? If so, I fear that I cannot join in this debate, because I know absolutely nothing about said game.

Also, you might want to provide sources in future debates about this universe, given that it involves a rather obscure 'verse and there are rules about this kind of thing. And the mods in this forum can be pretty harsh when dealing with rule-breaking.

BTW, to whom this may concern, I know that there are also rules against backseat moderation. I am not trying to do such. Rather I'm giving a piece of advice to the newcomer.

That's all.

[Luzifer's right hand]

Do you mean empires from EVE online right?
I know nothing about that game, is there non-game mechanic information available?
Game mechanics are in general rather ill suited for analysis.

[fgalkin]

I'll third the request to post information on the EVE universe and its capabilities.

By the way, Murazor, pointing out the rules is not backseat moderating, you don't need to tremble in fear as you do it.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[PREDATOR490]

Since the OP mentions:

...if you play Eve you would know the political climate changes continually as Eve has a constantly evolving player control political environment...

I think it is fair to assume the subject verse is EVE online.

I play this game but I'm oblivious to any sort of 'canon' like literature etc. however, the ships ingame are rather large. There is a picture scaling of EVE online ships against the Effiel Tower found here: Ship Scaling
Regardless, the EVE universe is heavily industrialised to the point that freelancers can pick up battleships on the open market. These ships are entirely customisable with various technologies from Electronic Warefare to long range bombardments up to 250km. Hence, the factions and empires of EVE should be able to field larger amounts of ships that would swarm the majority of Star Trek space.
With ships as large as the Titans, Motherships, Dreadnaughts and Carriers I would personnally expect them to be able to beat any of the major Star Trek powers. The most compelling reason being the best combat engagements in Star Trek are tactically weak. Just two walls of forces clashing into each other until one runs away / dies etc. The EVE factions have been in a regular state of conflict and have built their entire ship base around it. The EVE online factions have dedicated warships for various roles from scouts, Recons, Transports, Marauders, Battleships, Battlecruisers, Command Ships, Heavy Assualt Ships, Assualt Ships, Black Ops, Destroyers, Frigates, Cruisers, Electronic Warfare...

I would expect the Caldari State and Gallente Federation to be the biggest killers in the ST verse. The Amarr would find it harder but the Minmatar would most likely get their asses kicked since they are supposed to be the technologically weakest species in EVE. This dosent count the various outlaw factions in EVE or the non-playables.

[fgalkin]

Just how large a population/industry base are we talking about here?

Also, what are the quantifiable abilities of EVE ships?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Venator]

It might be a case of relying on game mechanics, but are there any examples in-game of what it takes to frag an asteroid, bombard a planet, etc? Those are classic (and usually, easily quantifiable) examples of firepower.

[Playerofeve]

Ok hey I'm posting from work lol:P

here's some sites that might be usefull,
http://www.eve-wiki.net/index.php?title=Main_Page

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EVE_Online

http://www.eve-online.com/

[Samuel]

Regardless, the EVE universe is heavily industrialised to the point that freelancers can pick up battleships on the open market.

Okay, what is to stop any of the Trek governments from doing this? Because it might not be a fire power problem if the Federation can simply buy their own fleet.

[PREDATOR490]

The game dosent allow attacking asteroids, planets etc. Its basically just shooting other ships and space objects.

The Eve-Online website has various game related breakdowns on the equipment ships can use. Given how flexible the EVE universe is for ship fittings and equipment, the 'quantifiable abilities' can change. Some ships get bonuses to equiping electronic warfare modules while others get bonuses to target painting.

The EVE Database can be found here: Item Database

I believe the absolute peak of destructive power is the Doomsday device. These can only be equiped on the Titans which are the biggest ships available for all races. It is also the biggest one in the scaling list.

Fighting aside, the story of EVE is based on the idea that these races are all from Earth but were cut off when the connection between galaxies was cut. Hence, if they discovered the Starfleet Federation then the Gallente Federation is likely to ally with them the most. The Caldari are capatalists allied with the Amarr Slavers so I can see them becoming Dominion style players in Star Trek.

[fgalkin]

Still not seing anything that can be quantified. Thread worthlessness increasing. Urge to lock rising.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[J Ryan]

Still not seing anything that can be quantified. Thread worthlessness increasing. Urge to lock rising.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

In terms of quantifiable things outside of game mechanics the best bet would be from the eve online novel. There are various mentions of trillions of people over the 5000 systems of the eve cluster, but not much that I can recall that is helpful in debate terms. I'll have a quick scan through and see what I can get.

PS

One thought I have had is lasers in the game. We know how much power is used for them (in terms of MW) and we know what range for them is. Is there anyway that can be used to quantify them? If so it can be used as a comparison against shield, armour and similar weapon devices.

[Playerofeve]

If you want combat details read up on the Amarr/Jove War that should halp out a bit, also the back stories and short stories contain a wealth of info and they are considered cannon.

[Temjin]

If you want combat details read up on the Amarr/Jove War that should halp out a bit, also the back stories and short stories contain a wealth of info and they are considered cannon.

If you're going to do a thread like this, giving out links would be useful. Like this. This way, people don't get pissed at you, and your threads aren't locked.

But remember, the more specific the link, the better. Also, doing some firepower calcs yourself might help. We're not gladiators here to do the work for you.

[Playerofeve]

I'm sorry I'll to be a little more detailed in the future sry:(

[Playerofeve]

If you're going to do a thread like this, giving out links would be useful. Like this. This way, people don't get pissed at you, and your threads aren't locked.

But remember, the more specific the link, the better. Also, doing some firepower calcs yourself might help. We're not gladiators here to do the work for you.

Here's the link to all the trailers and short films of eve and it's major in game events.
http://myeve.eve-online.com/download/videos/

[fgalkin]

I have given you grots an opportunity to make this thread less of a pointless waste of space than it already is. You did not use it.

Playerofeve, the next time you make a vs thread about an obscure series, you're going to need to do more than just post a bunch of links and go, "look, the evidence is there somewhere." Read the forum rules.



Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin