Fantastic Four/Fant4stic

[Cykeisme]

Regarding cinematic presentation of origin stories, while I totally agree with Broomstick's insight that Iron Man's origin story is an actual story as opposed to an exercise in the application of phlebotinum, it still stands out for being absolutely awesome in the movie.
I even greatly enjoyed Captain America's, although perhaps the character enjoys the same sort of story as the aforementioned Iron Man, though to a lesser extent. It was good that they focused a lot of Steve Rogers' qualities as a person prior to receiving his powers.

Meanwhile, I hold the tenuous opinion that Batman Begins wasn't as good a movie as the Dark Knight for reasons other than the fact that the former had to include the hero's origin. The second movie had the whole Heath Ledger Joker thing and stuff, which possibly could have been done in the same movie as Batman's origin. Or maybe not, iunno.
Anyway, I think tying mentor Ducard/Ra's in as the final bad guy in the first movie was a pretty good idea, so the origin stuff in the first half of the movie wasn't "wasted" in the second half of the movie.

[Purple]

Honestly, I think that the best way to do an origin story in a movie would be to squeeze it into the opening sequence like every Fantastic 4 cartoon series ever.

[Borgholio]

Honestly, I think that the best way to do an origin story in a movie would be to squeeze it into the opening sequence like every Fantastic 4 cartoon series ever.

Or Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. That worked too.

[biostem]

IMO, the actual origin story for the Fantastic 4 is so "blah" that I'd basically gloss it over, only having characters mention it in passing. Let the "now" be the focus of the story.

[Tsyroc]

IMO, the actual origin story for the Fantastic 4 is so "blah" that I'd basically gloss it over, only having characters mention it in passing. Let the "now" be the focus of the story.

So many of the FF comics rehashed the origin in a few panels or pages over the years that it really should be the way to go with a movie.

With the Ultimate style origin the movie went with I really wish they would have used that to get the FF involved with the Negative Zone and characters like Annihilus and Blastaar. If they were going to go for the creepy monster version of the FF they should have gone all in and shown people something they hadn't seen in a FF movie before. By having a whole new dimension to deal with they could easily jumped into something that could have stood very well alongside The Guardians of the Galaxy and The Avengers.

[PREDATOR490]

Saw this film, was mind numbingly bored from start to finish.
The superhero scene has certainly been flooded recently but this film made me think even the worst FF attempts were brilliant by comparison. The "action" is extremely weak to the point it feels like watching an extremely long series pilot. Even pilots of series manage more compelling origin stories in their 40 min blocks than the movie length this thing got.
Granted, the powers they have to work with are not really fantastic compared to what is kicking around now but the interactions and dialogue are dull to the point that I feel like I just wasted my time with a shitty soap drama.
It boggles my mind this film could be that long and somehow nothing remotely seems 'fantastic' to me or that heroic of a superhero film. Doom coming back and going bad felt like the movie realized suddenly this was meant to be a superhero film so we get... Doom shows up magically, basically says 'Fuck it, I am evil now' and then kills everyone. No explanation, no backstory of who, what or development of the Doom character at all.

[xerex]

Or maybe I'm not conveying this particularly well. The point I'm fumbling at is that the Iron Man origin is, in some ways, quite different from that of Spiderman or a lot of other heroes.

Basically you can delete the Iron Man suit from the movie and you'd still have a compelling story about Tony Stark and the War on Terror.

Regarding cinematic presentation of origin stories, while I totally agree with Broomstick's insight that Iron Man's origin story is an actual story as opposed to an exercise in the application of phlebotinum, it still stands out for being absolutely awesome in the movie.
I even greatly enjoyed Captain America's, although perhaps the character enjoys the same sort of story as the aforementioned Iron Man, though to a lesser extent. It was good that they focused a lot of Steve Rogers' qualities as a person prior to receiving his powers.

Same for Capt America. Delete the superpowers and Steve Rogers would still be heroic in some capacity.

From what I've read online in the deluge of crap that's come out over the last few days, the director wanted Jordan and the studio insisted on Kate Mara being in the movie.

Back when the casting was coming out on the internet and people were bitching about Johnny Storm being black, it was also postulated that Sue was still white because people wouldn't want to see a white man (Reed) with a black woman.
.

This is the reason the casting raised red flags for me -- it became clear this movie was being built by committee.

[FedRebel]

IMO, the actual origin story for the Fantastic 4 is so "blah" that I'd basically gloss it over, only having characters mention it in passing. Let the "now" be the focus of the story.

I just think it hasn't been played right on film

2005 film turned Doom in Lex Luthor, with Latveria just a tacked on easter egg throw away mention.

Doom should be the ruler of Latveria, a Kim Jong Un/Tony Stark hybrid. The Four have to go to Latveria because Richards research is too fringe for NASA...and the Latverian government gives an extremely attractive offer (have it play on Doom and Richards being in college together and Doom's 'crush' in Susan Storm.) Accident happens, Doom gets the sourest part of the deal leading him to don an exosuit in the iconic visage, and he wants the vivisect the heroes (except Susan.) to either 'cure' himself or gain their abilities. So the Four have to escape Latveria with Doom and his Doombots standing in their way.

^
You have adequate drama, tension, suspense, and action, and it sets the stage for a sequel where Doom will be a credibly bigger threat.

[FSTargetDrone]

FF made an estimated $8 million US this weekend, which is abysmal:

Aug 16, 2015 @ 11:15 AM

Box Office: 'Fantastic Four' Drops 68% For $8M Weekend, 'Rogue Nation' Tops 'Mission: Impossible 3'

This is a weekend box office post for the non-new releases.

Fantastic Four didn’t break any records for a second-weekend plunge, but it was not for lack of trying. The film earned $8 million in its second weekend, which is a drop of 68.75%. I did a piece on Friday about the biggest second-weekend drops for a comic book superhero movie, basically seeing what the would-be worst-case scenario would be for the second weekend of Fantastic Four. The bedeviled 20th Century Fox franchise-killer won’t break any records in that department, but it’s on the list.

The Josh Trank sci-fi actioner has the seventh-biggest drop for a comic book superhero movie, right between Man of Steel (-67.3%) and X-Men Origins: Wolverine (-68.9%). Now both of those films had huge openings and were big hits anyway, but Fantastic Four had just $25.6m last weekend, so it’s just more bad news. The Miles Teller/Michael B. Jordan film will end its tenth day of domestic release with just $42m. At this rate, it will barely top $60m domestic.

In better news, the top holdover was again Mission: Impossible Rogue Nation. The Tom Cruise sequel, which crossed $300 million worldwide on Thursday, earned $17 million (-38%) to bring its total to $138.137m. That puts it over the $133m total of Mission: Impossible III. At this point, it’s still looking like a $170m domestic cume for the Paramount/Viacom Inc. release, with untold riches to be plundered overseas, as it will surely become one of Cruise’s biggest worldwide champions whether or not it ends up among his domestic top-ten.

Last weekend’s surprise overperformer The Gift earned $6.5 million on its second weekend to bring its cume to $23m. The STX Entertainment release dipped 45% over the weekend. That’s not a great hold for the Rebecca Hall/Jason Bateman/Joel Edgerton thriller, especially considering the reviews and the buzz, but it’s still a cheap little hit. It’s also a great movie, so expect it to be a popular VOD recommendation. Walt Disney’s Ant-Man earned $5.5m for its sixth weekend (-30%) to bring its domestic cume to $157.5m. It has proven to be a rather leggy hit, as it should end with just under 3x its opening weekend, putting it closer to Iron Man than Iron Man 3. It has also earned $347m worldwide. Oh, and Inside Out has earned $666.

Vacation, Warner Bros./Time Warner Inc./New Line Cinema’s franchise reboot/sequel, earned another $5.33 million in its third weekend (-40%) for a $46.85m cume. That’s a solid hold after a somewhat sharp second-weekend drop, meaning this one might stick around. Minions, which is just one of Universal/Comcast Corp.’s current big summer hits which has propelled their entire 2015 slate over the $2 billion mark in domestic grosses in record time, earned a $5.16m sixth weekend (-31%) and $312.9m cume. It has earned $957m worldwide (the fifth biggest animated film ever) just as Jurassic World hits $1.6b worldwide.

Meryl Streep’s Ricki and the Flash may be one of the better films of the summer, but it’s not rocking out to packed movie auditoriums. The Sony release, directed by Jonathan Demme and written by Diablo Cody, earned just $4.5m on its second weekend (-31%), which would be a solid hold if the numbers were bigger. Still, a ten-day total of $14.6m isn’t a disaster for the $18m dramedy, especially if the legs can hold up.

Amy Schumer’s Trainwreck earned a $3.836 million fifth weekend (-38%) for a $97.95m domestic cume. Adam Sandler’s Pixels earned $3.373m on its fourth weekend (-40%) for a new $64.4m domestic cume. Shaun the Sheep earned another $2.85m in its second weekend (-30%) and a $11.1m cume. That’s a strong hold for the underperforming, but utterly charming, animated feature. Baa-humbug!

That’s enough for today. Next weekend sees the Jesse Eisenberg/Kristen Stewart action comedy American Ultra, Fox’s Hitman: Agent 47, and Sinister 2 as summer draws to a close. In the meantime, enjoy this Rentrak (NASDAQ: RENT) top-ten list:

It's also dropped to 8% on Rotten Tomatoes with 22% of the audience liking it. Pretty darn dismal. I remember feeling somewhat interested when the trailers came out, but now I have zero desire to see it. Speaking of, there were a bunch of sequences and scenes shown in the trailers that do not appear in the movie. This is not unusual for movies trailers to show scenes that appear different or not at all in the finished product, but 12 seems like a lot? I don't know. There is a piece about all the missing scenes here. I won't bother to copy & paste as it's image-heavy.

I don't particularly care if comic book-based movies (or movies based on novels, for that matter) strictly hold to their source material. I care nothing at all if a character's ethnicity changes or anything like that. I enjoyed Kate Mara and Reg E. Cathey's work on House of Cards but even that isn't making me want to see it. Nearly every movie I enjoy in the theater I will buy on Blu-ray but I won't be buying this movie when it comes out. Perhaps if I was gifted it, I might watch it. Maybe not even then. From what I've read online elsewhere and here, there is nothing that sounds it's worth taking the time ot watch it, never mind buying movie tickets. I'd rather go see Ant-Man for the 3rd time!

[SAMAS]

I'm of two minds about this. On one side, I just can't see me or Clark being black. Sorry. We've been caucasian for three quarters of a century. You better have a 'very' good reason to mess with that.

Clark is an alien - he could be anything.

But Clark isn't "anything", he is a white male. If you want a movie about an alien of African appearance coming to Earth and becoming a superhero, make a spiritual successor to Superman. Don't be one of these fucking cowards who thinks the only way you can make a black superhero popular is by sneaking him in under a white superhero's name.

Or, you know, you can just make a film about Icon.

That said, I wouldn't mind a Black Batman, and maybe even a Black Superman comic, if it's done as a one-shot single Paperback/short series that doesn't change the canon just for the hell of it.

[Tsyroc]

That said, I wouldn't mind a Black Batman, and maybe even a Black Superman comic, if it's done as a one-shot single Paperback/short series that doesn't change the canon just for the hell of it.

Marvel's Supreme Power version of Nighthawk is essentially a Black Batman. He's also a bit racist since his parents were murdered in front of him by some racist white assholes.

[Civil War Man]

A black Human Torch doesn't really add anything on its own, but it also doesn't really subtract anything. It all depends on implementation.

I will say, though, out of all of the members to turn into the token black member, Human Torch and Thing are the two that carry the biggest risk of being turned into walking talking stereotypes if the transition is mishandled.

[Borgholio]

I will say, though, out of all of the members to turn into the token black member, Human Torch and Thing are the two that carry the biggest risk of being turned into walking talking stereotypes if the transition is mishandled.

A flaming black man interpreted as setting a black man on fire (something racists would love), and labeling a black man as a Thing is pretty bad too.

[Civil War Man]

I will say, though, out of all of the members to turn into the token black member, Human Torch and Thing are the two that carry the biggest risk of being turned into walking talking stereotypes if the transition is mishandled.

A flaming black man interpreted as setting a black man on fire (something racists would love), and labeling a black man as a Thing is pretty bad too.

I was talking more in terms of their personalities. Human Torch is typically portrayed as cocky and impulsive, and Thing is generally grumpy. In the hands of a hack writer, these can be quickly transformed into the "Urban" and "Angry Black Man" stereotypes, respectively.

[Elheru Aran]

Honestly? Make Reed the black one. Boom. He's the genius.

Make Sue black. Piss off all the white supremacists twice-- not only is the girl now black, but she's got a thing with a white guy. Although that might be less controversial these days, actually, judging from the number of mixed couples I've been seeing lately.

Torch-- well, never mind.

Thing... is a bit pointless since he undergoes a rather massive transformation anyway. Before his change, sure, you could have him as a black actor, but I don't think it would particularly affect much.