magic and similar stuff

[salm]

why is magic always a dying out thing?

- the jedi (they are sort of magic) are getting less
- in LOTR the elves are the close to magic creature and they´re all leaving
- in the ultima series magic is going down the drain
- even in terry pratchetts discworld novel magic seems to be disapearing slowly

[Mr Bean]

Because authors never write about when Magic first appeared

Oh and

The EarthSea series Magic is dissapering

[weemadando]

Read The Chronicles of Amber... Magic holds the entire of shadow together. And it is pretty damn powerful.

[neoolong]

Drama.

[haas mark]

And let's not forget the WOT series. Damned Aes Sedai are all leaving, and the males are just going mad.

[lgot]

in my opinion is a repetition of a moderm term that magical things, amazing things are left out is a reflex of the moderm society which have indeed left behind some "magical" stuff that added some sauce in our life.

[Master of Ossus]

To answer this question we must go back to some fundamental mythology. The ancient Greeks believed that sons were inevitably worse than their fathers, though this has been widely interpreted, the meaning is pretty clear. More importantly, many of the ancient structures that we see around us are spectacularly impressive, if only because of the sheer scale of construction and the inevitable number of man-hours required in building such a monument. For many writers, particularly Tolkein and Lucas, this created a sense of nostalgia about the world. If you read the Lord of the Rings, you will find that nearly the entire trilogy is based around nostalgia for the old way of life. It is an anti-technology book (with the Ring being the ultimate technology, as are the Uruk Hai and things like that), but the old ways are really the best (the Shire, Numenor, the Elves, etc.). Since Tolkein was, first and foremost, an English writer, he primarily focused on the loss of the British Empire that he perceived almost first hand, while fighting in the trenches of Europe. Also, as a clearly sentimental author hewas very fond of the old way of doing things.

In Lucas' case, the Jedi are dying out primarily because they are antiquated, but once again he has a similar sense of nostalgia for the old ways. In Arthurian text (from which SW is derived), Arthur is only mortally wounded AFTER the Round Table is cracked; after Lancelot has betrayed him; after his best Knights are almost all killed; his House ruined; his advisor, Merlin, tricked and imprisoned. The old ways have died out to be replaced by the new (in the form of Mordred). Further, Lucas is very influenced by a sense of classicism within his writings. Note how often he focuses on spectacular, but lost bits of technology and magic in Indiana Jones. Note his often idealized sense of writings in his other works, and how often his work focuses on post-modern worlds that are inevitably weaker than those that came before. This is a very common, if slightly subtle, method of employing people's senses.

Think about it. What type of child has never yearned to be a Knight errant, or a Princess, or a King ruling over a castle? What kind of child has never wanted to slay a dragon or be rescued from a tower? What of the highly romanticized Age of Reason? The "gathering of demi-gods" at the Constitutional Convention? When anyone could be anything? When elder statesmen built huge homes and plantations, and spent their leisure hours inventing things in their spare time (the dumbwaiter, electricity, etc.)? How many boys never think of sailing the seas on an old, wooden boat, fighting off pirates? How many girls don't want to live in a Victorian, formal setting within a palace eating lavish dinners? Since the past is so often idealized, it becomes a kind of fixation for the masses. There are always old people telling others "Back in my day," and it's always something that seems better than what we have now, because otherwise they wouldn't talk about it! Thus, the idealized, romanticized, but non-existent or unrealistic past becomes a kind of lure for people who want to escape the troubles of their own lives. Literature and movies and television offer us escapes from reality. They give us an alternative to living in our current world, and while our world is probably better in many respects than the past ones, we inevitably yearn to live in a by-gone era of cowboys or legions or opulence.

Also, in a practical sense, the struggle of good against evil is ALWAYS perpetual. It will never be stopped and can never be stopped. Thus, it builds-up the threat if there is little good (magic) left to oppose evil, heightening the suspense. In this manner, stories avoid falling for the pitfall of "just another victory for the good guys." Instead, it becomes the most difficult struggle ever, because the forces of evil are so powerful this time around, and the forces of good are so weak.

[haas mark]

In this manner, stories avoid falling for the pitfall of "just another victory for the good guys." Instead, it becomes the most difficult struggle ever, because the forces of evil are so powerful this time around, and the forces of good are so weak.

Exactly.

[Hendrake]

Read The Chronicles of Amber... Magic holds the entire of shadow together. And it is pretty damn powerful.

True. But the Amberites are less attuned to the Pattern with each generation. There is NO WAY even Fiona can do half of Oberon's tricks (like with the arm), so you can (very arguably) say it gets weaker with time. Of course, Ghostwheel may come into play in the argument but it is magic-tech hybrid, so I don't think it does really count.

[Majin Gojira]

Well, at least on Buffy, Magic is alive and well. to quote Jenny Calander

"Aw, did the big bad science make the magic go away?" (Taunting, of course).

Hell, any idiot can cast a simple spell, whether they want to or not

[weemadando]

Read The Chronicles of Amber... Magic holds the entire of shadow together. And it is pretty damn powerful.

True. But the Amberites are less attuned to the Pattern with each generation. There is NO WAY even Fiona can do half of Oberon's tricks (like with the arm), so you can (very arguably) say it gets weaker with time. Of course, Ghostwheel may come into play in the argument but it is magic-tech hybrid, so I don't think it does really count.

Yeah, some of the "cyber-magic" coming out of shadow and indeed the courts *hissss* is damn weird.

[SirNitram]

I've read a few where magic is alive and well(Indeed, in my stumbling steps towards authorhood, I'm trying to craft a story where magic is coming back, not leaving.). Forgotten Realms novels, which I am, for better or worse, addicted to, have a world where magic is alive, well, and in the current series(Return Of The Archwizards), getting more powerful and in the hands of the Bad Guys.

But yes. Magic tends to fade, at least for the good guys. I think one reason is it's difficult to make it a struggle for the good guys if they can wield world-shattering power. It's the same reason the Star Wars EU is full of Force-nullifying nonsense: A Jedi at it's height is an unstoppable foe, so it's hard to induce drama.

[Larz]

If magic were strong then anyone could just lob a fireball and someone else and it would be the end... strong magic=to strong of heros and bad guys... its just like the greek mythology... its not fun to watch gods fight because no one wins... but it IS fun to watch the gods mortal subjects fight because there are winners... that plus the drama of it (which goes to show that dark magic is better than light magic because light magic always fades while dark magic gets stronger and stronger)

[Hendrake]

Yeah, some of the "cyber-magic" coming out of shadow and indeed the courts *hissss* is damn weird.

[IC] Verily, it is not. 'Tis Shadows outside the Courts that are strange [/IC]

[Crown]

Well, at least on Buffy, Magic is alive and well. to quote Jenny Calander

"Aw, did the big bad science make the magic go away?" (Taunting, of course).

Hell, any idiot can cast a simple spell, whether they want to or not

My fav, Calander quote is when Giles is trying to explain to her why he prefers books over computers;

Calander: So you like books because they're smelly?

Giles: *pause* Yes.