The Race Vs. Earth in 2010

[starslayer]

Yeah, the machinery will last a very, very long time that way, but what of the room? You need to keep the power on, and the room itself is exposed to the outside elements. So the room would need lots of maintenance, especially keeping up the integrity of the airtight seal. Still not worth it unless you bury it inside a geologically stable mountain with a magi-tech effectively inexhaustible power source and seal up the entrance.

[Simon_Jester]

Yeah, the machinery will last a very, very long time that way, but what of the room? You need to keep the power on, and the room itself is exposed to the outside elements. So the room would need lots of maintenance, especially keeping up the integrity of the airtight seal. Still not worth it unless you bury it inside a geologically stable mountain with a magi-tech effectively inexhaustible power source and seal up the entrance.

Right. Though at least in this case we aren't faced with the Yucca Mountain Problem of trying to maintain a facility that will exist after we're gone: the Lizards can dedicate a maintenance crew to keeping their tank boneyard going for millenium after millenium, and watch the structural integrity so as to shore it up if it starts to collapse. They have the option if they choose to do so... but I still think it would be more economical of them to just archive the plans (and, of course, the plans for the tooling).

[folti78]

Yeah, the machinery will last a very, very long time that way, but what of the room? You need to keep the power on, and the room itself is exposed to the outside elements. So the room would need lots of maintenance, especially keeping up the integrity of the airtight seal. Still not worth it unless you bury it inside a geologically stable mountain with a magi-tech effectively inexhaustible power source and seal up the entrance.

Right. Though at least in this case we aren't faced with the Yucca Mountain Problem of trying to maintain a facility that will exist after we're gone: the Lizards can dedicate a maintenance crew to keeping their tank boneyard going for millenium after millenium, and watch the structural integrity so as to shore it up if it starts to collapse. They have the option if they choose to do so... but I still think it would be more economical of them to just archive the plans (and, of course, the plans for the tooling).

Well, as far as human tech (and my limited knowledge) goes, some parts will broke/malfunction over time, no matter whether you store them in your Vault of Deadly Stuff or on your shelf. Examples: batteries will die, electrolyte in electrolytic capacitors breaks down over time, rendering the circuit defective, springs and elastic materials will became "tired"(or "set") and deform under pressure, same goes for seals. Lubricants could degrade into all kind of interesting materials which had to be cleaned out before applying new lubricants(unless they are degrade into something nasty that starts to chew anything not resistant to it). How plastics, polymers (like wire coating for example) and rubber products degrade over time, is another question, I don't know the answer. (except my guess is: badly)

So it's possible that after a while, the vehicles' big dumb metallic parts will remain untouched, but they had to replace everything else, effectively rebuilding the vehicle, using some parts from an earlier one. Same goes for aircraft, which have more delicate parts, than tanks and APCs.

BTW, in the first 6 books, I don't remember anyone claiming, that the Lizards' equipment is works perfectly for millenia. Only that it's more polished, more capable and reliable than human technology. But this true for today's human technology too.

[Junghalli]

What about storing it underground on a Kuiper belt object? Assuming none of the materials were harmed by cold and vacuum I'd think the deep stable cold and vacuum should preserve it pretty well, the KBO's mass should shield it pretty well from radiation, and the mechanism for maintaining that environment will never fail (unless the KBO's orbit changes to take it into the inner system or something).

They have the option if they choose to do so... but I still think it would be more economical of them to just archive the plans (and, of course, the plans for the tooling).

Not to mention that any equipment they built for the campaigns on the other two planets would logically be sitting there, not on Home. They would have to ship it back Home to use it in the invasion of Earth (or have the expedition set out from one of the conquered planets - somebody remind me, did they ever say which planet in the Empire the expedition to Earth set out from?).

BTW, in the first 6 books, I don't remember anyone claiming, that the Lizards' equipment is works perfectly for millenia. Only that it's more polished, more capable and reliable than human technology. But this true for today's human technology too.

I don't remember it either.

[Simon_Jester]

Given the way the Lizards operate, I'd expect their stuff to be more reliable and made to higher tolerances than ours is today, too, but maybe not as much better. Though it would probably have fewer failure modes just from the prolonged debugging phase.

What about storing it underground on a Kuiper belt object? Assuming none of the materials were harmed by cold and vacuum I'd think the deep stable cold and vacuum should preserve it pretty well, the KBO's mass should shield it pretty well from radiation, and the mechanism for maintaining that environment will never fail (unless the KBO's orbit changes to take it into the inner system or something).

...Maybe. But plastics outgas in vacuum, and they might well do it even in cold vacuum. To make matters worse, cooling all your equipment to cryogenic temperatures and then bringing it back up to Homelike warmth is liable to do bad things to metal on the atomic-structure level. And differential contraction could be a problem too.

I'm not sure this would be a good idea, though it would work well for things it was designed to work for.

Not to mention that any equipment they built for the campaigns on the other two planets would logically be sitting there, not on Home. They would have to ship it back Home to use it in the invasion of Earth (or have the expedition set out from one of the conquered planets - somebody remind me, did they ever say which planet in the Empire the expedition to Earth set out from?).

Pretty sure it was Home.

[Mystikal]

Wow.

You knoww, I don't mind reading why someone gets stomped but in cases this severe, why didn't you guys just leave at where I left it. The Lizards get rapestomped into oblivion if they embark on the same course as ITOTL. Not that reading the last few pages wasn't uninteresting, but it seems a bit of a waste unless someone here said the Race could win. Request thread split please. This discusion is interesting but is hardly about the OP subject and thus those who would wish to view it would either have to already know where it is or have it referred. I think I'll report this as well to speed up the process.

[Batman]

That's funny. And here I thought the OP was about what would would happen if The Race met modern Earth. Oh wait. It WAS.

[Mystikal]

Yeah, but it became something else. And unless you think the Race would defeat Modern Earth, then why are we still discussing this in this thread?

[Simon_Jester]

Yeah, but it became something else. And unless you think the Race would defeat Modern Earth, then why are we still discussing this in this thread?

Because it amuses to do so, and for no other reason. Do we need a better one?

[Mystikal]

Yeah, but I already admitted to being interested in the discussion going on. I just want it properly labled so if a google searcher is looking for this kind of stuff, he can find the wonders of SD.net and not wikipissea.

[folti78]

Given the way the Lizards operate, I'd expect their stuff to be more reliable and made to higher tolerances than ours is today, too, but maybe not as much better. Though it would probably have fewer failure modes just from the prolonged debugging phase.

What about storing it underground on a Kuiper belt object? Assuming none of the materials were harmed by cold and vacuum I'd think the deep stable cold and vacuum should preserve it pretty well, the KBO's mass should shield it pretty well from radiation, and the mechanism for maintaining that environment will never fail (unless the KBO's orbit changes to take it into the inner system or something).

...Maybe. But plastics outgas in vacuum, and they might well do it even in cold vacuum. To make matters worse, cooling all your equipment to cryogenic temperatures and then bringing it back up to Homelike warmth is liable to do bad things to metal on the atomic-structure level. And differential contraction could be a problem too.

I'm not sure this would be a good idea, though it would work well for things it was designed to work for.

Issue one: Why do you want all your military ground vehicles to be vacuum and absolute zero proof? It'll make both design and production costs skyrocket. One advantage could be that you don't have to heat the vehicle storage compartment during the voyage, but you lose when you have to thaw the vehicles out at your destination, because you have to use your ships as the staging area during the invasion. Alternatively, landing your ships with still frozen compartments have it's own set of problems and consequences.

Issue two: IIRC the Lizards have a really bad case of planetary chauvinism, they pretty much ignored everything in the solar system, except habitable planets.

[PhilosopherOfSorts]

Well, if you want to land a colony, a habitable planet makes that easier.

[Mystikal]

Not to mention simple comfort and how much taking an inhabitable planet makes so many things easier.

[spartasman]

Okay, here is a revised and (hopefully) better plot.

-Arriving 10 (Earth) years behind the timetable of the original story, the Race enters the solar system in 1952.

-Observing the planet, Atvar realizes that the Tosevites have discovered Atomics, due to several areas on the surface that emit higher than average radiation, concurrent with nuclear detonations.

-Atvar, realizing that the situation is far beyond what he had anticipated, sends a message to Home asking for instructions before proceeding.

-While the fleet awaits the message, most of the fleet personnel are put back into cold sleep. In order to keep constant surveillance on the planet, a skeleton crew is left awake to observe the planet. This crew includes Straha and several of his allies, who had previously demanded that the entire planet be sterilized immediately, and is being punished for his vehement opposition to the Fleetlord's decision.

-As the fleet sleeps, Straha maintains survey lance of the planet. Occasionaly sending down probes to monitor atomic test sites and other areas of interest.

-By the time the message has arrived, most of the fleet and infantrymales have begun to be awoken. However, due to their years of constant surveillance, two things become immediately noticeable to Atvar; 1) Straha and his followers are now extremely valuable, having mastered many of the Tosevites most prevalent tongues and from learning about the situation amongst the natives, and 2) that the Tosevites have become even MORE advanced in the time they had been in cold sleep, something unheard of in the Races history.

-The message orders Atvar to either attack immediately or to attempt to return home with the Colonization Fleet as well. Atvar, not wanting to suffer title of worldfleer, determines that the Race must conquer the planet.

-1966

-The infantrymales are readied and the fleet takes up orbit around Tosev 3. However, this does not go unnoticed by those on earth, who had previously known of alien existence due to intercepted messages and a few probes which had been shot down. All observatories and other installations capable of detecting the fleet are silenced by various governments around Earth, and the U.N. secretly attempts to communicate with the Race.

-After brief diplomatic contact with the Tosevites, mostly involving the Fleetlord stalling for time, the Race begins their invasion. Setting off over a dozen nuclear weapons in high-orbit, with communications severely disrupted or destroyed, civilian electronics and power structures disabled, and several military installations rendered useless by the attack.

-Landing sites are as follows; In Europe: 3 separate sites on the Iberian Peninsula, 1 large site stretching from France and into West Germany, another large landing site in Eastern Poland, a medium-sized site between the two larger ones that runs between West and East Germany. In Asia: Several Large landing sites in China, mostly in the inland areas before the foothills of the Himalayas, one large landing site that stretches between Laos and North & South Vietnam, five medium-sized sites in central India, a large landing site located in Iran, with several smaller ones running West into Iraq and Arabia. In Africa: 3 very large sites located in Sub-Saharan Africa, 2 smaller ones located in the both South Africa and Rhodesia, five major landing sites are located on the fringe of the Saharan near the North African coast. North America: one small landing site in upper New York, 3 large sites located in Ohio, Utah, and Texas, these run into surrounding states as well, 3 large landing sites stretching from the U.S. Mexico border to Ecuador. South America: 4 small landing zones along the Chilean coast, 2 large ones in Argentina, 3 large sites in Brazil, 4 small sites in Colombia. Australia: 2 large sites in central Australia. (A map detailing these sites will be forthcoming)

-Immediately, the landing operations in New York are destroyed, the transports destroyed by still-operational Air Force units as well as several anti-aircraft batteries. The landings in France are called off after the transports suffer 45% casualties in the first 2 hours. In Poland, immediate reaction by Soviet troops nearly overruns the initial landing sites, but the local Polish and Russian units are soon pushed back. In Germany, the landings area under heavy attack by NATO forces, but their efforts are somewhat hampered when East Germany invades West Germany in the confusion.

-In Southeast Asia, Race units quickly overrun any organized resistance, with the exceptions of American Forces operating in Vietnam along with large pockets of NLF giving substantial resistance. In Africa, most resistance is crushed. The only exceptions are Rhodesia and South Africa, Rhodesia due to that country already being in a state of Civil War and therefore heavily militarized, and South Africa due to it being more technologically advanced than other African Nations and able to defend itself. In addition, a great number of rebel groups maintain low-level resistance to the Race, mostly in the Savannah of Central Africa and the Jungles of Western Africa. In South America, most governments are destroyed or sent into hiding after brief contests by local military forces. Argentina manages to stall the Race landings in their territory, and are able to fight the initial attacks to a stand-still. In Brazil and Colombia, guerrilla organizations quickly form from destroyed military units and various drug cartels. In China, immediate attacks from the PLA destroy two of the five initial landing sites, but at huge casualties suffered by the Chinese forces. In Australia, resistance from Australian forces throw the Race's forces back on their heels; this is due to the fact that most of the Race's efforts have been directed elsewhere, leaving only a small force to secure the continent that was considered to be too small and easy to conquer to warrant major deployments.

-In the aftermath of the initial invasion, the surviving governments of the world agree to band together to defeat the invasion forces. Russia and China immediately begin massive attacks on Race territory, leading to mass casualties on both sides. Prompted by Straha, Atvar uses his nuclear arsenal in an attempt to batter the nations of Earth into submission. The capitols of the USSR, the Peoples Republic of China, and the U.S.A are all targeted. In order to destroy these cities, however, the Race's killercraft must deliver the bombs. This is hampered due to the fact that the Race's air superiority is only held tenuously in either their own territory, where it is supplemented by their anti-aircraft arsenal, or in areas of Earth that are bereft of any modern air force. In order to destroy the targeted cities, the Race must deploy their killercraft in high-atmosphere in order to avoid allied air forces or anti-aircraft countermeasures. As a result, the bombings are inaccurate, with the bomb aimed at Washington D.C dropping into the mouth of the Potomac River; this of course destroys the city regardless, but a great deal of the radiation is carried out to sea, sparing several inland communities.

-In the American Midwest, the Race's forces are contained by national guard forces and civilian resistance, destroying the national highway system in their continual retreat. After three weeks, all of the remaining landing sites in the U.S are joined, and begin to expand outward. American Army units are immediately recalled from Vietnam, and the shrinking forces allow the Race to eventually overrun all of southeast Asia. In Europe, non-stop assaults by Soviet armies begin to drive back the Race, who are simply not able to destroy the endless hordes of tanks that are directed against them. In response, Atvar orders additional Soviet cities to be destroyed; Kiev, Kaliningrad, Minsk, and Riga are all destroyed. Despite the losses, the Soviet government continues the assualt. In Germany, the war touched between East and West Germany is halted whilst both governments attempt to deal with the Race incursion. In a massive drive, the Bundeswehr, along with U.S Army Europe, drive the Race out of Central Germany. However, the counterattack by the race nearly overwhelms the force, with it only being able to hold its ground after atomic artillery is used; in response, the city of Nuremberg is nuked.

-In South America, the continents organized governments are largely destroyed, with only the governments of Peru and Argentina existing under-ground whilst remaining armed forces attempt to hold off Race advances. Many of the Argentinian resistance groups are lead by former Nazi officers, among them Otto Skorzeny and Klaus Barbie. The intense activity of these organizations draws the attention of the Race's intelligence service.

-nonstop attacks in Europe and China lead Atvar to the conclusion that nuclear weapons must be used on a tactical scale to defeat Tosevite resistance. In China, the cities of Hong Kong, Harbin, Shanghai, Fuzhou, Hangzhou, Wuhan, and Xian are destroyed, with three other nuclear bombs dropped on military targets assaulting Race positions inland. In Europe, two nuclear bombs are used against advancing Russian forces. However, since Russian tech is designed to operate on a nuclear battlefield, the attacks continue, although severely hampered.

-In Africa, Race forces manage to secure the entire continent except South Africa, Rhodesia, Egypt, and several areas in central and west Africa. In the Middle East, guerrilla warfare leads the Race to withdraw their forces to only the main cities in the areas they have "conquered". However, continuous attacks from local rebels greatly inhibit the mobility of the Race forces in the area, leaving the surrounding countryside effectively out of Race control. In India and South East Asia, resistance keeps the occupying forces heavily occupied, with them unable to effectively secure the entire area, and with elements of the Indian & Pakistani armed forces operating together to drive out the invaders.

-In the U.S.A, regular Army units begin to engage Race forces heavily, surprising infantrymales who had been fighting only national guard units and local franc-tireurs. The Race begins to fall back in the face of this onslaught, and air superiority slowly slips over occupied territory. Because of this, the cities of Chicago and New York are targeted for destruction. while Chicago is destroyed, New York is spared when a modified Lockheed NF-104A, piloted by veteran ace Chuck Yeager, attacks and destroys the killercraft en-route to the city.

-As winter begins to set in, the Race attempts to solidify their gains on the planet. Most of Africa is under the control of the Race, with only Rhodesia and South Africa persisting as organized governments, along with rebel groups that have begun to swell in numbers. In Australia, Commonwealth troops, bolstered by an American carrier group, manage to push the Race away from the coastal areas and secure air superiority over Eastern Australia. In South America, the underground governments launch a surprise attack during the winter which manages to drive the Race out of much of Chile, Argentina, and Peru. In Asia, Race forces are driven out of India, and Chinese forces overwhelm much of the Race's garrisons. In North America, large uprisings in Mexico keep the Race pinned down while U.S Army forces clear out Texas and most of the Southern states.

-With defeat looming over him, Atvar decides to evacuate all Race forces in China and use them to bolster his positions elsewhere. As the Race evacuates China, five nuclear bombs are dropped on advancing PLA forces, killing nearly ten million Chinese troops.

-In Europe, German and American units drive all Race forces from West Germany. In East Germany, however, the situation is dire. With most of the Soviet Army occupied with the Lizard presence in Poland, Race forces in East Germany are contested only by local forces and a few tattered remnants of a few Russian divisions. In a secret pact between the two republics, West German troops are allowed to enter East Germany to aid in that nations defense, although American units are not allowed over the border. The Russian response is near-apoplectic, threatening war with East Germany and breaking the alliance with the West if West German forces are allowed into East Germany. East Germany, in a show of defiance, proclaims that if the Soviet Union was able to defend them from the Race's aggression, or even to punish Germany, that they would be contempt to adhere to the USSR's demands, but since they could do neither, they would be forced to allow West German forces to help defeat the Race. Ultimately, diplomatic effort assuage the USSR enough to allow the Bundeswehr access to East Germany.

-In South East Asia, various rebel groups, equipped by the Chinese, launch a massive uprising coinciding with the Tet new year. Most cities in Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia are taken over in brutal fighting. Unable to maintain their positions, the Race destroys several cities as they pull their remaining forces into more stable territory in Thailand and Burma.

-In Europe, combined East/West German forces force the Race to break out of their encirclement and to link up with their territories in Poland. This Leaves Germany mostly free, with all remaining Soviet and East German forces continuing their attack against Race possessions. Secretly, the government of East Germany negotiates for West German troops to remain in East Germany. The official reason given by the East German government is as a safeguard in case of a Race counter-attack, secretly however, it is to protect East Germany from any possible Soviet aggression in the future due to their earlier defiance.

-With the war going badly, Fleetlord Atvar grows increasingly dire to stop any Tosevite resistance without completely destroying the planet, still hoping to neutralize the planet for the colonization fleet. In order to do this, he orders South America, Africa, and Australia to be secured, and for Race to destroy the attacking armies in Poland and the U.S.A. The nations of Peru, Chile and Argentina are re-conquered, with any surviving military units going underground to continue resistance in tandem with rebel groups in Brazil and Colombia. Attacks in Africa finally overrun the nation of Rhodesia, but most of units defending the nation shrink into small pockets of resistance which the Race are unable to track down and destroy. South Africa manages to survive the attacks due to massive conscription of the black population. Central and West Africa are largely passified, mostly due to rampant disease and famine that the Race are ironically unable to deal with due to rebel resistance. efforts in Australia result in the western half of the continent being secured, with fierce resistance from Commonwealth forces in the East.

-In the U.S.A, a massive offensive cuts Race-controlled territory into several pockets, spearheaded by veteran units from Vietnam. In order to save his forces, Atvar orders the immediate evacuation of the U.S.A, nuking Seattle, Sand Diego, and Denver in response to the American attack, but unable to attack their forces directly due to their proximity with his own forces. Several of the largest pockets are evacuated, but air support quickly dwindles until shuttles are only able to land in convoys. With U.S forces constricting around his forces and his transport fleet unable to evacuate his troops quickly enough, Atvar makes a gamble, sending down three ships from his fleet to evacuate his remaining troops. In a frantic push, the U.S Army manages to overrun one of the landing sites, capturing a ship of the conquest fleet. Atvar immediately orders for the ship to be destroyed. Despite his orders, the killercraft attempting to destroy the ship are destroyed a squadron of F4-105A's engage them at high altitude. At the same instant, 300 ICBMs are launched from across the globe at the orbiting fleet. Although anti-missile systems on the ground are able to destroy half of these missiles, the fleet itself possesses no anti-missile capabilities. 14 ships are destroyed, including the 56th Emperor Jossano, which housed most of the Races nuclear arsenal.

-In response to this defeat and the poor condition of the invasion, Shiplord Straha calls for a vote of no confidence against Atvar. with 89% of the Fleetlords against him, Atvar concedes his position to Straha. Immediately, he orders all Race forces in Europe to evacuate, dropping three nuclear bombs to buy time for them to do so. Unable to destroy the entire planet with his limited nuclear arsenal, Straha begins preparing the fleet for the possibility of fleeing.

-With the United States now free of Race forces, U.S Army units are directed elsewhere in the world to shore up it's allies. Three Marine divisions land in Australia, driving off the most recent Race attack, a task force is also sent to liberate Mexico, which had degenerated into a state of anarchy and revolution after the Race invasion, driving many Mexicans over the border into the U.S.A.

-In Europe, all Race forces evacuate from the continent. Soviet troops begin to re-occupy Poland, meeting resistance from local partisan band who had been fighting against the Race but whom are quickly crushed. When Soviet soldiers reach the border with East Germany, however, they are told that they are not needed. Fearing that the country may intend to turn itself over the West, Soviet command orders several divisions to invade the republic. However, the troops on the ground are in no shape to mount an invasion, having been continuously assaulting the Race for over a year, and the general plea with High Command to give them time to recuperate. Despite these pleas, Soviet Command orders the invasion, quickly overrunning border defenses. When Soviet troops begin to encounter elements of the West German Bundeswehr however, the United States threatens to enter the conflict. In response, the Soviet Union orders all units in Europe on standby to implement a nuclear strike against the U.S and NATO.

-Sensing the increased tensions, Straha takes advantage of the situation to further solidify his gains in South America, Africa, Asia, and Australia. As the two superpowers face off, the Race manages to subdue many resistance organizations in their territories, allowing them to bolster their defenses.

-When Soviet troops resume their attack on East Germany, the United States declares war on the Soviet Union. Implementing MAD, the USSR fires their nuclear arsenal against the United States and the Race simultaneously. The missiles directed against the Race are destroyed by their anti-missiles. As the missiles directed against the United States begin to exit the atmosphere, the U.S fires off their own missiles. However, instead of targeting the USSR, these missiles target the incoming warheads, destroying all but eleven of them, those of which are quickly intercepted by several squadrons of F4-105As. Their nuclear option nulled, the Soviet Union immediately sues for peace, removing it's troops from East Germany and agreeing to aid in the efforts to drive the Race off of the planet.

-Alarmed by the fact that the Tosevites have developed their own anti-missile arsenal, albeit most of the missiles fired by the U.S were captured from the Race, Straha orders that all anti-missile batteries are to only fire at missiles heading into the atmosphere in an attempt to conserve his dwindling supplies.

-With the Race forced out of all of North America, except Mexico, Europe, except some remaining pockets in fascist Spain, and with Race pockets in Asia ever shrinking in the face of constant partisan activity, Straha begins to rethink his options. With him in control of most of Africa, most of South America, and large parts of Australia, the prospect of having to flee becomes ever more present among the fleet. In one last attempt to solidify his hold on the planet below, Straha orders all remaining Race forces on the offensive.

-Organized military units in South America cease to exist, as the Races full effort is given to destroying any resistance in South America. Though many resistance cells continue to operate effectively, the underground governments of South America are finally put out of business. South Africa is nearly overrun, but at the last moment a task force of Commonwealth and U.S forces arrives to hold back he Races assualt. Race operation in Australia are quickly countered and beat back, as a result Straha orders the immediate evacuation of Race units in Australia.

-With the Race attacks petering out, the allied nations launch a major strike. nearly half of all ICBMs from both the United States and Soviet union are fired at once. Many of the missiles are destroyed by anti-missile stations in South America, but the missiles from the USSR reach the upper atmosphere relatively unhindered. The strike devastates the fleet, with 7 ships destroyed with a further 21 heavily damaged. Realizing that his cause may be lost, Straha asks for peace talks aboard his flagship.

-The delegation sent by the allied nations commences talks with Fleetlord Straha. Demanding nothing less than the complete removal of all Race forces on Earth and from orbit, Straha attempts to gain leverage by bringing up the point that he hold 2 of the planets continents under his control. The delegation, headed by Henry Kissinger, attempt to stall Straha while new attacks are organized on the surface.

-With peace talks still ongoing, several coordinated attacks are made throughout Race-controlled territory by resistance cells. In-tandem, American and Commonwealth forces drive north from their positions in South Africa. While Race forces are preoccupied dealing with these incursions, a combined NATO/Warsaw Pact force crosses the Mediterranean into North Africa, driving south to the edge of the Sahara Dessert.

-His positions on Earth crumbling, Straha concedes to the Allied delegation. All Race troops are evacuated from the planet, and the ships begin to turn back towards Home, and to alert the colonization fleet. As part of the armistice, Straha leaves behind technology and information on how to deal with the effects of radiation and other medical fields, with military technology excluded from the deal as Straha had threatened to loose his remaining nukes in Race-held territory if he was made to surrender military technology.

So, that is what I have managed to think up so far, its a bit more complete, by I probably messed up somewhere in it and did not realize it. Anyway, here is a small excerpt that I couldn't help but think up while I was writing this...

Flight Leader Teerts was used to punishment, flying at supersonic speeds in a killercraft had made sure to that. What he wasn't used to, or, at least, what he had not experienced before his capture, was punishment inflicted on him purposefully. The fact that the ones inflicting his punishment were Tosevites was an even greater blow to Teerts than the ones that had made the myriad of bruises that now coated his body. The Tosevites were not supposed to be advanced, they were not supposed to be able to defend themselves effectively, and they certainly were not supposed to have planes capable of shooting down a killercraft.
He shuddered again as the Tosevite in front of him landed another punch on his stomach. Although the punch was not especially painful to his thick skin by itself, the metal gauntlet on the Tosevites hand made every punch against his already-bruised stomach feel as though someone was smashing him with a rock.
"Speak, you piece of shit" barked the Tosevite. Over his past four weeks in captivity, Teerts had learned a few phrases in the language these particular Tosevites spoke, Espanol, he remembered. "You will answer our questions eventually you scaly bastard, or I'll pull out every bone in your body!"
The Tosevite was grinning now, that made Teerts shiver in the wooden chair he was sitting in. Behind the tosevite, a single bare light bulb hung from a wire, shedding insufficient light in the cramped basement they were both in. The only way in or out of the room was a large wooden door with a single slit carved into it at the Tosevites height. That had brought displeasure to his guards, as they couldn't look down far enough to tell whether or not Teerts was hiding up against the door without entering. They had let him know of their displeasure, to, when they had come in one day and fastened a ball and chain on Teerts' ankle.
"You WILL speak, do you hear me" the Tosevite said, more calmly this time. even though Teerts had trouble picking up on the Tosevites tone through the mushy-sounding language he spoke, it made him fearful all the same. He had learned far more about pain in the weeks after he had been shot down and captured than he ever wanted to know, if he ever managed to escape, he knew that it would be enough of a lesson to last him the rest of his life.
The Tosevite had moved away from Teerts, and over towards the small tray that showed an array of instruments. Teerts immediately began to cringe when he picked up a particularly pointy knife and began to grin coldly. Before the Tosevite could do anything more than pick it up, a voice called from the other side of the door, and opened, revealing one of the guards to the room.
"Senior Barbie, the Commander has asked to see you at once", the guard said. Teerts noticed that he never let his eyes stray from the Tosevite with the knife, trying not to notice lizard, or more specifically, whatever he might have done TO lizard. The Tosevite looked even more displeased now than when he had been interrogating Teerts.
"This had better be damn important" he said, throwing the knife back down onto the tray with a clatter that echoed painfully in the small room. The Tosevite guard simply nodded and returned to his post outside the door. "I will be back, and when I am, you will tell me everything I want to know" the Tosevite said with malice hidden behind a sickly smile. Teerts had never seen a creature brandish a smile before he had come to Tosev 3, and from what he had seen of them, they were nothing good.
When the Tosevite left the room, slamming the door behind him, Teerts let out a silent hiss of relief. Yes, all the pain and torture that he would ever need had already happened, but he doubted that it would be the last. As the footsteps outside the door slowly receded, Teerts cursed the day he had ever heard the name Tosev 3, or Argentina, or Klaus Barbie.

[PeZook]

No time now, but In short: everything you wrote related to the Soviet Union is complete shit.

I will disect it in more detail later.

[Simon_Jester]

I'll look at the plot, but I'm not willing to try proofreading your excerpt right now.

-Landing sites are as follows; In Europe: 3 separate sites on the Iberian Peninsula, 1 large site stretching from France and into West Germany, another large landing site in Eastern Poland, a medium-sized site between the two larger ones that runs between West and East Germany.

Bear in mind that Europe is the worst possible place for them to land, because there are huge military forces there with weapons little inferior to the Lizards' own, including enormous numbers of tactical nuclear missiles and artillery shells that can be fired at their grounded starships.

Europe was where both sides in the Cold War planned to fight the main front of World War Three, and it was garrisoned accordingly.

In Asia: Several Large landing sites in China, mostly in the inland areas before the foothills of the Himalayas, one large landing site that stretches between Laos and North & South Vietnam, five medium-sized sites in central India, a large landing site located in Iran, with several smaller ones running West into Iraq and Arabia.

Quiz question for you: what's the terrain in that area like, and is it a good launch point for a spaceborne military operation?

-Immediately, the landing operations in New York are destroyed, the transports destroyed by still-operational Air Force units as well as several anti-aircraft batteries. The landings in France are called off after the transports suffer 45% casualties in the first 2 hours. In Poland, immediate reaction by Soviet troops nearly overruns the initial landing sites, but the local Polish and Russian units are soon pushed back. In Germany, the landings area under heavy attack by NATO forces, but their efforts are somewhat hampered when East Germany invades West Germany in the confusion.

Well, at least you're recognizing how tough a nut Europe would be to crack, but:
-Why did the Lizards land there in the first place?
-Why on Earth would the Eastern Bloc invade NATO at a time like this, when the freaking reptile-monsters from Tau Ceti are landing and nuking the Earth? That's the worst time for any such thing. It is infinitely more reasonable for President Johnson to call Kruschchev on the White House hotline and say "OK, we're both going to have to fight these alien bastards with everything we've got, so let's try and be... understanding, all right?"

In order to destroy the targeted cities, the Race must deploy their killercraft in high-atmosphere in order to avoid allied air forces or anti-aircraft countermeasures. As a result, the bombings are inaccurate, with the bomb aimed at Washington D.C dropping into the mouth of the Potomac River; this of course destroys the city regardless, but a great deal of the radiation is carried out to sea, sparing several inland communities.

Umm... check a map. Look at the distance from "the mouth of the Potomac" to the actual city; a bomb powerful enough to level DC from a ground zero at the mouth of the Potomac would have to be up in the Tsar Bomba range. Just how big are these bombs, anyway? The ones the Lizards used in the novels didn't feel like they were much above one megaton; am I missing something?

Also, remember that the major Cold War powers had extensive plans for nuclear war; it's likely that much of the core government will already have been evacuated by the time Atvar gets around to dropping the bombs.

-In the American Midwest, the Race's forces are contained by national guard forces and civilian resistance, destroying the national highway system in their continual retreat. After three weeks, all of the remaining landing sites in the U.S are joined, and begin to expand outward. American Army units are immediately recalled from Vietnam, and the shrinking forces allow the Race to eventually overrun all of southeast Asia.

Just how much lizardpower are they using down there? I mean, we couldn't "overrun all of southeast Asia" with half a million men; what have they got?

-In the U.S.A, regular Army units begin to engage Race forces heavily, surprising infantrymales who had been fighting only national guard units and local franc-tireurs. The Race begins to fall back in the face of this onslaught, and air superiority slowly slips over occupied territory. Because of this, the cities of Chicago and New York are targeted for destruction. while Chicago is destroyed, New York is spared when a modified Lockheed NF-104A, piloted by veteran ace Chuck Yeager, attacks and destroys the killercraft en-route to the city.

I'd advise a very careful review here of what US plans for high altitude high velocity interception looked like: what the air defenses and especially the SAMs were capable of. At this point the US had extensive high altitude SAM batteries.

-With defeat looming over him, Atvar decides to evacuate all Race forces in China and use them to bolster his positions elsewhere. As the Race evacuates China, five nuclear bombs are dropped on advancing PLA forces, killing nearly ten million Chinese troops.

Again, just how big are these bombs?

[/quote]...In a secret pact between the two republics, West German troops are allowed to enter East Germany to aid in that nations defense, although American units are not allowed over the border. The Russian response is near-apoplectic, threatening war with East Germany and breaking the alliance with the West if West German forces are allowed into East Germany.[/quote]Why are they reacting this way?

South Africa manages to survive the attacks due to massive conscription of the black population.

What would be the political effects of this? Is it plausible?

-In Europe, all Race forces evacuate from the continent. Soviet troops begin to re-occupy Poland, meeting resistance from local partisan band who had been fighting against the Race but whom are quickly crushed. When Soviet soldiers reach the border with East Germany, however, they are told that they are not needed. Fearing that the country may intend to turn itself over the West, Soviet command orders several divisions to invade the republic. However, the troops on the ground are in no shape to mount an invasion, having been continuously assaulting the Race for over a year, and the general plea with High Command to give them time to recuperate. Despite these pleas, Soviet Command orders the invasion, quickly overrunning border defenses. When Soviet troops begin to encounter elements of the West German Bundeswehr however, the United States threatens to enter the conflict. In response, the Soviet Union orders all units in Europe on standby to implement a nuclear strike against the U.S and NATO.

I repeat, why are they reacting this way?

-When Soviet troops resume their attack on East Germany, the United States declares war on the Soviet Union. Implementing MAD, the USSR fires their nuclear arsenal against the United States and the Race simultaneously.

!?

Ah... how much do you know about Soviet nuclear doctrine?

The missiles directed against the Race are destroyed by their anti-missiles. As the missiles directed against the United States begin to exit the atmosphere, the U.S fires off their own missiles. However, instead of targeting the USSR, these missiles target the incoming warheads, destroying all but eleven of them, those of which are quickly intercepted by several squadrons of F4-105As.

Are you seriously proposing the use of ICBMs and jet fighters as ABM defenses!?

[phongn]

Simon Jester has mentioned some points, here are others:

Observing the planet, Atvar realizes that the Tosevites have discovered Atomics, due to several areas on the surface that emit higher than average radiation, concurrent with nuclear detonations.

They probably won't notice the radiation levels from orbit; however, atmospheric sampling will have telltale signs. In addition, since this is 1952 they may be in a position to notice various nuclear tests - including Ivy Mike.

-The infantrymales are readied and the fleet takes up orbit around Tosev 3. However, this does not go unnoticed by those on earth, who had previously known of alien existence due to intercepted messages and a few probes which had been shot down. All observatories and other installations capable of detecting the fleet are silenced by various governments around Earth, and the U.N. secretly attempts to communicate with the Race.

Why? This is completely and totally absurd. You can't just handwave this away because This Is The Way You Want It. Someone in their backyard could see the fleet and get a message out to the press.

After brief diplomatic contact with the Tosevites, mostly involving the Fleetlord stalling for time, the Race begins their invasion. Setting off over a dozen nuclear weapons in high-orbit, with communications severely disrupted or destroyed, civilian electronics and power structures disabled, and several military installations rendered useless by the attack.

As noted before, this is untrue.

-Landing sites are as follows;

Why are they landing in those places? What are the objectives? Can the invasion sites hope to link up before they are defeated in detail? And, as always: logistics, logistics, logistics.

In Europe, non-stop assaults by Soviet armies begin to drive back the Race, who are simply not able to destroy the endless hordes of tanks that are directed against them. In response, Atvar orders additional Soviet cities to be destroyed; Kiev, Kaliningrad, Minsk, and Riga are all destroyed. Despite the losses, the Soviet government continues the assualt. In Germany, the war touched between East and West Germany is halted whilst both governments attempt to deal with the Race incursion. In a massive drive, the Bundeswehr, along with U.S Army Europe, drive the Race out of Central Germany. However, the counterattack by the race nearly overwhelms the force, with it only being able to hold its ground after atomic artillery is used; in response, the city of Nuremberg is nuked.

Are you aware that battlefield nuclear and chemical weapons are likely to be used by both NATO and WARPAC forces in the opening stages of the war? They are first use devices.

nonstop attacks in Europe and China lead Atvar to the conclusion that nuclear weapons must be used on a tactical scale to defeat Tosevite resistance. In China, the cities of Hong Kong, Harbin, Shanghai, Fuzhou, Hangzhou, Wuhan, and Xian are destroyed, with three other nuclear bombs dropped on military targets assaulting Race positions inland. In Europe, two nuclear bombs are used against advancing Russian forces. However, since Russian tech is designed to operate on a nuclear battlefield, the attacks continue, although severely hampered.

Two nuclear bombs aren't going to be doing anything to the Red Army, which was prepared to fight against massive US nuclear superiority. You will need to saturate the front with nuclear weapons (as well as their follow-on forces and logistics staging areas to really halt the Red Army. Also, flattening cities is escalation to strategic warfare, not tactical warfare.

In the U.S.A, regular Army units begin to engage Race forces heavily, surprising infantrymales who had been fighting only national guard units and local franc-tireurs. The Race begins to fall back in the face of this onslaught, and air superiority slowly slips over occupied territory. Because of this, the cities of Chicago and New York are targeted for destruction. while Chicago is destroyed, New York is spared when a modified Lockheed NF-104A, piloted by veteran ace Chuck Yeager, attacks and destroys the killercraft en-route to the city.

As noted, the US has a serious air-defense system at this time and in this altered timeline probably even moreso.

As winter begins to set in, the Race attempts to solidify their gains on the planet. Most of Africa is under the control of the Race, with only Rhodesia and South Africa persisting as organized governments, along with rebel groups that have begun to swell in numbers.

They don't have the numbers to put Africa under their control nor the logistics.

With defeat looming over him, Atvar decides to evacuate all Race forces in China and use them to bolster his positions elsewhere. As the Race evacuates China, five nuclear bombs are dropped on advancing PLA forces, killing nearly ten million Chinese troops.

Do you think the PLA would be stupid enough to cluster together to allow ten million of their forces to be killed by a mere five weapons?

In East Germany, however, the situation is dire. With most of the Soviet Army occupied with the Lizard presence in Poland, Race forces in East Germany are contested only by local forces and a few tattered remnants of a few Russian divisions. In a secret pact between the two republics, West German troops are allowed to enter East Germany to aid in that nations defense, although American units are not allowed over the border. The Russian response is near-apoplectic, threatening war with East Germany and breaking the alliance with the West if West German forces are allowed into East Germany. East Germany, in a show of defiance, proclaims that if the Soviet Union was able to defend them from the Race's aggression, or even to punish Germany, that they would be contempt to adhere to the USSR's demands, but since they could do neither, they would be forced to allow West German forces to help defeat the Race. Ultimately, diplomatic effort assuage the USSR enough to allow the Bundeswehr access to East Germany.

As SJ asked, why are they acting like morons?

In South East Asia, various rebel groups, equipped by the Chinese, launch a massive uprising coinciding with the Tet new year. Most cities in Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia are taken over in brutal fighting. Unable to maintain their positions, the Race destroys several cities as they pull their remaining forces into more stable territory in Thailand and Burma.

The result is more likely that the Race will put down the insurrection and take enormous losses. For that matter, are you aware that Thailand is actually quite well equipped by the West?

At the same instant, 300 ICBMs are launched from across the globe at the orbiting fleet. Although anti-missile systems on the ground are able to destroy half of these missiles, the fleet itself possesses no anti-missile capabilities. 14 ships are destroyed, including the 56th Emperor Jossano, which housed most of the Races nuclear arsenal.

You know, all the fleet has to do is maneuver and the ICBMs will miss.

In Europe, all Race forces evacuate from the continent. Soviet troops begin to re-occupy Poland, meeting resistance from local partisan band who had been fighting against the Race but whom are quickly crushed. When Soviet soldiers reach the border with East Germany, however, they are told that they are not needed. Fearing that the country may intend to turn itself over the West, Soviet command orders several divisions to invade the republic. However, the troops on the ground are in no shape to mount an invasion, having been continuously assaulting the Race for over a year, and the general plea with High Command to give them time to recuperate. Despite these pleas, Soviet Command orders the invasion, quickly overrunning border defenses. When Soviet troops begin to encounter elements of the West German Bundeswehr however, the United States threatens to enter the conflict. In response, the Soviet Union orders all units in Europe on standby to implement a nuclear strike against the U.S and NATO.

Why are they acting like idiots?

-When Soviet troops resume their attack on East Germany, the United States declares war on the Soviet Union. Implementing MAD, the USSR fires their nuclear arsenal against the United States and the Race simultaneously. The missiles directed against the Race are destroyed by their anti-missiles. As the missiles directed against the United States begin to exit the atmosphere, the U.S fires off their own missiles. However, instead of targeting the USSR, these missiles target the incoming warheads, destroying all but eleven of them, those of which are quickly intercepted by several squadrons of F4-105As. Their nuclear option nulled, the Soviet Union immediately sues for peace, removing it's troops from East Germany and agreeing to aid in the efforts to drive the Race off of the planet.

ICBMs can't act like ABMs (though in this altered timeline the US probably has extensive missile defense batteries). You don't understand MAD at all. Also, why are they acting like idiots?

[spartasman]

-Why did the Lizards land there in the first place?
-Why on Earth would the Eastern Bloc invade NATO at a time like this, when the freaking reptile-monsters from Tau Ceti are landing and nuking the Earth? That's the worst time for any such thing. It is infinitely more reasonable for President Johnson to call Kruschchev on the White House hotline and say "OK, we're both going to have to fight these alien bastards with everything we've got, so let's try and be... understanding, all right?"

-Well, there were large concentrations of Soviet troops stationed along the Iron Curtain, which would lead me to believe that like the original book, the Races plan is to cut them off from a large part of their military, like they did with the Germans.
-Like I said, it would be amidst the confusion and high-altitude nuclear blasts that the Soviet forces would react.

Umm... check a map. Look at the distance from "the mouth of the Potomac" to the actual city; a bomb powerful enough to level DC from a ground zero at the mouth of the Potomac would have to be up in the Tsar Bomba range. Just how big are these bombs, anyway? The ones the Lizards used in the novels didn't feel like they were much above one megaton; am I missing something?

I would not expect the Races nuclear arsenal to be more powerful than 5 megatons, but you are right, that would not be enough to level D.C from the Potomac, I will change it accordingly.

Just how much lizardpower are they using down there? I mean, we couldn't "overrun all of southeast Asia" with half a million men; what have they got?

The books never really gave an estimate of the size of the invasion fleet, only the number of ships. I believe the number of ships was 114, but I could be wrong. If you could say that each of these ships carried 250,000 infantrymales, that comes to around 28.5 million soldiers. That seems to be an adequate number for the job they thought they would be doing, basicly just glorified occupation, but it is also enough to have a force of 2-3 million for South East Asia.

I'd advise a very careful review here of what US plans for high altitude high velocity interception looked like: what the air defenses and especially the SAMs were capable of. At this point the US had extensive high altitude SAM batteries.

The Nike-Hercules Missile had a 90 mile range, which would probably be able to intercept the fighter. But then, you have to remember that they had just been subjected to EMP pulses, which would have made most of the Nike missiles ineffective, this of course could mean that the aircraft were inoperative as well, but there could be some horribly convenient reason for this, not in the least that any missile sent to intercept the killercraft could be shot down by the Races anti-missile systems.

Why are they reacting this way?

Its is my reckoning that the Soviet Union would be against NATO forces entering territory they are supposed to control, especially Germany.

The missiles directed against the Race are destroyed by their anti-missiles. As the missiles directed against the United States begin to exit the atmosphere, the U.S fires off their own missiles. However, instead of targeting the USSR, these missiles target the incoming warheads, destroying all but eleven of them, those of which are quickly intercepted by several squadrons of F4-105As.

Are you seriously proposing the use of ICBMs and jet fighters as ABM defenses!?
[/quote]

Further in the story line I do state that most of the anti-missiles fired are those captured from the Race, plus it is not altogether implausible that the U.S could be able to modify their own missiles based on captured Race technology.

[Samuel]

Its is my reckoning that the Soviet Union would be against NATO forces entering territory they are supposed to control, especially Germany.

The USSR developed the Warsaw Pact as a buffer- they might be against NATO going in, but there are even more against space aliens invading the Motherland. It has only been 21 years since the German invasion- the leadership is composed of people who lived through that war and will do anything to prevent anything like it from happening to Russia again.

I know that their strategy was to launch a massive first strike to eliminate any nuclear response from NATO, and that they did not adhere to the MAD doctrine, so I might have messed up a bit there, my bad.

No. If that was true, the Russians wouldn't have invested in mobile launchers, which are used to retaliate for MAD.

Further in the story line I do state that most of the anti-missiles fired are those captured from the Race, plus it is not altogether implausible that the U.S could be able to modify their own missiles based on captured Race technology.

I doubt their gear is remotely compatible with ours. Although you can use missiles for ABM- just not ICBMs.

[phongn]

-Well, there were large concentrations of Soviet troops stationed along the Iron Curtain, which would lead me to believe that like the original book, the Races plan is to cut them off from a large part of their military, like they did with the Germans.
-Like I said, it would be amidst the confusion and high-altitude nuclear blasts that the Soviet forces would react.

There will be some disruption but unlikely to be enough to start such a major war. And while yes, much of the Red Army is deployed to Group of Soviet Forces in Germany (GSFG), I don't think it's going to quite try and cut them off. You'll have to check the record.

The books never really gave an estimate of the size of the invasion fleet, only the number of ships. I believe the number of ships was 114, but I could be wrong. If you could say that each of these ships carried 250,000 infantrymales, that comes to around 28.5 million soldiers. That seems to be an adequate number for the job they thought they would be doing, basicly just glorified occupation, but it is also enough to have a force of 2-3 million for South East Asia.

That's a really, really dangerous estimate. 114 ships might be carrying only 10K troops each. Remember, they are expecting to thwap some knights-on-horse, not fight an industrialized world.

The Nike-Hercules Missile had a 90 mile range, which would probably be able to intercept the fighter. But then, you have to remember that they had just been subjected to EMP pulses, which would have made most of the Nike missiles ineffective, this of course could mean that the aircraft were inoperative as well, but there could be some horribly convenient reason for this, not in the least that any missile sent to intercept the killercraft could be shot down by the Races anti-missile systems.

You're confusing range with ceiling; Nike Hercules can reach 150000 ft (though it'll have issues maneuvering) up. Said missiles are also designed to fight in a nuclear war environment (for that matter, most of the Nike installations were equipped with nuclear warheads) and neither EMP nor SREE is not going to worry them. Furthermore, there won't be much time for the Race warships to react to a surface missile launch and engage the ascending weapons.

Its is my reckoning that the Soviet Union would be against NATO forces entering territory they are supposed to control, especially Germany.

Your reckoning is wrong. They might not be particularly happy about it, but there is a major war going on here.

Further in the story line I do state that most of the anti-missiles fired are those captured from the Race, plus it is not altogether implausible that the U.S could be able to modify their own missiles based on captured Race technology.

You made it sound like you were firing ICBMs as ABMs; for that matter the US could have operational ABMs at this point (Nike Zeus). Capturing antimissile systems is unlikely to do anything.

[lord Martiya]

-Well, there were large concentrations of Soviet troops stationed along the Iron Curtain, which would lead me to believe that like the original book, the Races plan is to cut them off from a large part of their military, like they did with the Germans.

The problem then would be the Polish and East Germany armies. Not the Red Army, but definitely not pushovers.
Also, in the European fight you forgot some players: France, United Kingdom, Italy and Jugoslavia. While UK forces would probably be busy in Australia and South-East Asia (to help India and Pakistan), Italy and France would remain to deal with the Race in France and West Germany (and maybe in Spain), while Jugoslavian forces would help East Germany and Poland. Again, not the Red Army or the US armed forces, just the ones who were expected to fight them head-on in case of WWIII.

[PeZook]

My two cents:

-While the fleet awaits the message, most of the fleet personnel are put back into cold sleep. In order to keep constant surveillance on the planet, a skeleton crew is left awake to observe the planet. This crew includes Straha and several of his allies, who had previously demanded that the entire planet be sterilized immediately, and is being punished for his vehement opposition to the Fleetlord's decision.

So, uh, you punish Straha by leaving him in sole control of the fleet for 24 years?

-The infantrymales are readied and the fleet takes up orbit around Tosev 3. However, this does not go unnoticed by those on earth, who had previously known of alien existence due to intercepted messages and a few probes which had been shot down. All observatories and other installations capable of detecting the fleet are silenced by various governments around Earth, and the U.N. secretly attempts to communicate with the Race.

Are you seriously saying Earth governments have been keeping this under wraps for 24 years? How did they manage to do that, when in real life even conspiracies that could spark a nuclear war were inevitably revealed?

-After brief diplomatic contact with the Tosevites, mostly involving the Fleetlord stalling for time, the Race begins their invasion. Setting off over a dozen nuclear weapons in high-orbit, with communications severely disrupted or destroyed, civilian electronics and power structures disabled, and several military installations rendered useless by the attack.

A dozen EMP pulses is nothing in 1976, where both current world superpowers were planning on fighting massive nuclear wars. As was previously noted, such a tactic wouldn't affect military capability very much.

-Landing sites are as follows; In Europe: 3 separate sites on the Iberian Peninsula, 1 large site stretching from France and into West Germany, another large landing site in Eastern Poland, a medium-sized site between the two larger ones that runs between West and East Germany.

This is ridiculous ; Why the hell are they landing straight in the best defended regions of the planet? Eastern Poland is right between two utterly massive formations of WARPAC troops, while West Germany is crawling with NATO forces. Incidentally, the ragion has some of the highest concentration of airspace defences on Earth at the time, as well as massive stockpiles of tactical nuclear weapons. They're essentially trying to force a landing against an extremely well prepared enemy.

-Immediately, the landing operations in New York are destroyed, the transports destroyed by still-operational Air Force units as well as several anti-aircraft batteries. The landings in France are called off after the transports suffer 45% casualties in the first 2 hours. In Poland, immediate reaction by Soviet troops nearly overruns the initial landing sites, but the local Polish and Russian units are soon pushed back.

So freakin' New York is well-defended enough to stop the landings cold, but the enormous air defence network of the Warsaw Pact isn't? It's the 70s ; The Soviet Union has been building a truly fearsome air defence network for twenty years now.

In Germany, the landings area under heavy attack by NATO forces, but their efforts are somewhat hampered when East Germany invades West Germany in the confusion.

How are they hampered? Why would East Germany invade West Germany when aliens from space are coming to kill everybody?

Russia and China immediately begin massive attacks on Race territory, leading to mass casualties on both sides.

Why would they do that instead of blasting the lizards with battlefield nuclear weapons?

Prompted by Straha, Atvar uses his nuclear arsenal in an attempt to batter the nations of Earth into submission. The capitols of the USSR, the Peoples Republic of China, and the U.S.A are all targeted. In order to destroy these cities, however, the Race's killercraft must deliver the bombs. This is hampered due to the fact that the Race's air superiority is only held tenuously in either their own territory, where it is supplemented by their anti-aircraft arsenal, or in areas of Earth that are bereft of any modern air force. In order to destroy the targeted cities, the Race must deploy their killercraft in high-atmosphere in order to avoid allied air forces or anti-aircraft countermeasures. As a result, the bombings are inaccurate, with the bomb aimed at Washington D.C dropping into the mouth of the Potomac River; this of course destroys the city regardless, but a great deal of the radiation is carried out to sea, sparing several inland communities.

If New York could defend itself from the landings, it's practically certain Washington D.C. and Moscow would be able to shoot down either the killercraft or the bombs. Moscow especially, since it has an ABM system in place.

-In the American Midwest, the Race's forces are contained by national guard forces and civilian resistance, destroying the national highway system in their continual retreat. After three weeks, all of the remaining landing sites in the U.S are joined, and begin to expand outward. American Army units are immediately recalled from Vietnam, and the shrinking forces allow the Race to eventually overrun all of southeast Asia. In Europe, non-stop assaults by Soviet armies begin to drive back the Race, who are simply not able to destroy the endless hordes of tanks that are directed against them. In response, Atvar orders additional Soviet cities to be destroyed; Kiev, Kaliningrad, Minsk, and Riga are all destroyed. Despite the losses, the Soviet government continues the assualt.

So...the National Guard is able to "contain" the Race, but all the Soviets can do is throw waves of men and tanks at them in a futile effort?

And again, why wouldn't the USSR just use nuclear and chemical weapons the moment the lizards start murdering millions of civilians? Or even way before that?

-nonstop attacks in Europe and China lead Atvar to the conclusion that nuclear weapons must be used on a tactical scale to defeat Tosevite resistance. In China, the cities of Hong Kong, Harbin, Shanghai, Fuzhou, Hangzhou, Wuhan, and Xian are destroyed, with three other nuclear bombs dropped on military targets assaulting Race positions inland. In Europe, two nuclear bombs are used against advancing Russian forces. However, since Russian tech is designed to operate on a nuclear battlefield, the attacks continue, although severely hampered.

As Phong noted, both the US and the USSR would've been using their own nukes tactically for a long time now. Two bombs are nothing compared to what they expected to fight during WWIII.

-In Europe, German and American units drive all Race forces from West Germany. In East Germany, however, the situation is dire. With most of the Soviet Army occupied with the Lizard presence in Poland, Race forces in East Germany are contested only by local forces and a few tattered remnants of a few Russian divisions.

Question for you: which Soviet units were stationed in East Germany? Why do you think they'd get mangled while the remainder of the Soviet army would be able to fight on in Poland?

In a secret pact between the two republics, West German troops are allowed to enter East Germany to aid in that nations defense, although American units are not allowed over the border. The Russian response is near-apoplectic, threatening war with East Germany and breaking the alliance with the West if West German forces are allowed into East Germany.

Jesus christ, do you really think Russians are such complete and utter morons that they'd react this way? There's a freakin' space invasion going on ; Realities have changed. Soviets are not idiots, they'd happily let American units go into Soviet republics in order to fight the homocidal space lizards.

East Germany, in a show of defiance, proclaims that if the Soviet Union was able to defend them from the Race's aggression, or even to punish Germany, that they would be contempt to adhere to the USSR's demands, but since they could do neither, they would be forced to allow West German forces to help defeat the Race. Ultimately, diplomatic effort assuage the USSR enough to allow the Bundeswehr access to East Germany.

Yeah, it's so wise to tell a nuclear superpower to shove it, especially when it behaves with what would inevitably be considered complete and utter insanity

-In response to this defeat and the poor condition of the invasion, Shiplord Straha calls for a vote of no confidence against Atvar. with 89% of the Fleetlords against him, Atvar concedes his position to Straha. Immediately, he orders all Race forces in Europe to evacuate, dropping three nuclear bombs to buy time for them to do so. Unable to destroy the entire planet with his limited nuclear arsenal, Straha begins preparing the fleet for the possibility of fleeing.

How are three nukes going to stop any serious offensive?

-In Europe, all Race forces evacuate from the continent. Soviet troops begin to re-occupy Poland, meeting resistance from local partisan band who had been fighting against the Race but whom are quickly crushed.

Ok, what the fuck? Why would local partisans be resisting the Soviets?

When Soviet soldiers reach the border with East Germany, however, they are told that they are not needed. Fearing that the country may intend to turn itself over the West, Soviet command orders several divisions to invade the republic. However, the troops on the ground are in no shape to mount an invasion, having been continuously assaulting the Race for over a year, and the general plea with High Command to give them time to recuperate.

This is completely insane. Why do you think Russians are irrational morons who'd react this way? They're not stupid and never were ; They don't need a war with NATO when fucking space aliens are trying to seize the planet!

Communism doesn't make people behave like cartoon villains.

Despite these pleas, Soviet Command orders the invasion, quickly overrunning border defenses. When Soviet troops begin to encounter elements of the West German Bundeswehr however, the United States threatens to enter the conflict. In response, the Soviet Union orders all units in Europe on standby to implement a nuclear strike against the U.S and NATO.

Oh, yeah, more Soviet insanity. Hey, we've lost several cities already, millions of people are dead and the space aliens are not defeated yet, let's blow up civilization!

-When Soviet troops resume their attack on East Germany, the United States declares war on the Soviet Union. Implementing MAD, the USSR fires their nuclear arsenal against the United States and the Race simultaneously. The missiles directed against the Race are destroyed by their anti-missiles. As the missiles directed against the United States begin to exit the atmosphere, the U.S fires off their own missiles. However, instead of targeting the USSR, these missiles target the incoming warheads, destroying all but eleven of them, those of which are quickly intercepted by several squadrons of F4-105As. Their nuclear option nulled, the Soviet Union immediately sues for peace, removing it's troops from East Germany and agreeing to aid in the efforts to drive the Race off of the planet.

More ridiculousness. "Hey guys we're sorry we tried to nuke you, let's truce, okay?"

-With the Race attacks petering out, the allied nations launch a major strike. nearly half of all ICBMs from both the United States and Soviet union are fired at once. Many of the missiles are destroyed by anti-missile stations in South America, but the missiles from the USSR reach the upper atmosphere relatively unhindered. The strike devastates the fleet, with 7 ships destroyed with a further 21 heavily damaged. Realizing that his cause may be lost, Straha asks for peace talks aboard his flagship.

And they didn't do that the first time round because...? Why did they need to wait for the Race's presence on Earth to "peter out"? If they have the capability to devastate the fleet, they should just do it.

[phongn]

So, uh, you punish Straha by leaving him in sole control of the fleet for 24 years?

Minor nit - Race years, which are half that of Earth years. The invasion begins 1966, not 1976.

[spartasman]

Why? This is completely and totally absurd. You can't just handwave this away because This Is The Way You Want It. Someone in their backyard could see the fleet and get a message out to the press.

How many "UFO" siting were made during the 1960's? How many do you think actually made it to the press? Even if you could see a hundred lights in the sky during the daytime, the government could simply say that it is a weather anomaly, and with all the observatories and reputable astronomers being kept quiet, who other than the tabloids are going to say they are wrong?

Quote:
After brief diplomatic contact with the Tosevites, mostly involving the Fleetlord stalling for time, the Race begins their invasion. Setting off over a dozen nuclear weapons in high-orbit, with communications severely disrupted or destroyed, civilian electronics and power structures disabled, and several military installations rendered useless by the attack.

As noted before, this is untrue.

I will admit that I am most likely wrong on this. It was my understanding that civilian electronics and military gear were coming out of the vacuum tube stage in the mid 1960s.

Why are they landing in those places? What are the objectives? Can the invasion sites hope to link up before they are defeated in detail? And, as always: logistics, logistics, logistics.

The Race are supplying themselves from space, logistics are not dependent on control of roads or cities, at least at first. The Races objectives are to destroy any military threat to their dominance and then assert their control over the planet.

[Srelex]

How many "UFO" siting were made during the 1960's? How many do you think actually made it to the press? Even if you could see a hundred lights in the sky during the daytime, the government could simply say that it is a weather anomaly, and with all the observatories and reputable astronomers being kept quiet, who other than the tabloids are going to say they are wrong?.

Er, people aren't totally retarded. If dozens of lights were to appear in the sky or stay there, people would ask questions. It's like saying that the government could cover up flying saucers appearing over the White House ID4-style by dismissing it as weather balloons.