Matrix Reloaded Discussion [Spoilers, Matrix Reloaded]

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-05-21 12:06am

Hobot wrote:It's not my theory and it's not the only possibility. Again, this is a fucking sci-fi movie, they can invent just about any kind of technology they want. You might as well ask me to explain how the hover ships work or why humans can really be used as batteries, it doesn't fucking matter, get that through your thick skull.

Suspension of Disbelief.

Enricko · Post by **Enricko** » 2003-05-21 12:14am

Sir Nitram: I humbly point to you that both movies mention and produce evidences of real fortelling... Neo "see" Trinity being killed by the Agent, when he's out of the Matrix.

So magical transceivers should not being rulled out...

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-21 12:19am

Enricko wrote:Sir Nitram: I humbly point to you that both movies mention and produce evidences of real fortelling... Neo "see" Trinity being killed by the Agent, when he's out of the Matrix.

So magical transceivers should not being rulled out...

I will admit, I'm not sure how to approach this. However, it's entirely possible such things get dumped into his subconscious while in the Matrix, and he only realizes them when asleep. Given the speeches we get RAMMED DOWN OUR FUCKING THROATS, free will might not be that much of a factor.

Still, this whole 'wireless plug metaphysical crap connection with machines outside the Matrix' reeks of far too many unknowns. Occam's Razor eternal.

Seggybop · Post by **Seggybop** » 2003-05-21 12:22am

A second matrix of the real world would invalidate everthing that we know about the world of the matrix and require a totally new history. Isn't that a lot more complex than Neo simply having wifi?

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-05-21 12:28am

Seggybop wrote:A second matrix of the real world would invalidate everthing that we know about the world of the matrix and require a totally new history. Isn't that a lot more complex than Neo simply having wifi?

I find it strange also, but at this point that's the best theory given the evidence, I hate to admit.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-21 12:30am

Durran Korr wrote:
Seggybop wrote:A second matrix of the real world would invalidate everthing that we know about the world of the matrix and require a totally new history. Isn't that a lot more complex than Neo simply having wifi?
I find it strange also, but at this point that's the best theory given the evidence, I hate to admit.

By logic, it is the best theory. Whether it makes the best story..

Well, that's a different kettle of fish, ain't it?

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-05-21 12:33am

It makes horrible storytelling, quite frankly. If the theory does pan out than there is going to be an awful lot of exposition going on in Revolutions, which would just be overkill given the massive amounts of it found in Reloaded.

Enricko · Post by **Enricko** » 2003-05-21 12:43am

Well, we must take care not to overuse Occam Razor. In this case, the theory of matrix in a matrix IS the theory with to many terms, compared to the theory of what-we-been-told-is-what-we-get.

It's true Neo premonitions can be explain by a second matrix, but don't forget that Neo is special. He's brain physionomy could be so special that it act like a radio.

Or better, imagine you have an I/O device that normally needs a wire connection, but for some reasons there's so much power in the device that receiver cannot help but pick up the signal! I don't know if Zion ships use radio to broadcast, but if so it could mean receivers pick up Neo's super brain.

Shadow WarChief · Post by **Shadow WarChief** » 2003-05-21 03:58am

Well for a slight subject change, does anyone know what Frenchie "Wipe my ass with silk" actually said in french?

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2003-05-21 04:09am

Shadow WarChief wrote:Well for a slight subject change, does anyone know what Frenchie "Wipe my ass with silk" actually said in french?

Babelfish gives me "Essuyez mon âne avec la soie."

Enricko · Post by **Enricko** » 2003-05-21 08:35am

The Merovengian said things like:
"Enculé de ta mère": motherfucker
"Putain de Bordel de Merde": Holyshit! (equivalent)

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-21 12:19pm

Enricko wrote:Well, we must take care not to overuse Occam Razor. In this case, the theory of matrix in a matrix IS the theory with to many terms, compared to the theory of what-we-been-told-is-what-we-get.

It's true Neo premonitions can be explain by a second matrix, but don't forget that Neo is special. He's brain physionomy could be so special that it act like a radio.

Or better, imagine you have an I/O device that normally needs a wire connection, but for some reasons there's so much power in the device that receiver cannot help but pick up the signal! I don't know if Zion ships use radio to broadcast, but if so it could mean receivers pick up Neo's super brain.

I cannot believe you honestly think you believe this contains less unknowns than a multilayered prison.

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2003-05-21 12:35pm

Shadow WarChief wrote:Well for a slight subject change, does anyone know what Frenchie "Wipe my ass with silk" actually said in french?

Opps. I thought you mean what Wipe my ass with silk was in French.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-05-21 01:11pm

Enricko wrote:Sir Nitram: I humbly point to you that both movies mention and produce evidences of real fortelling...

Bzzt.

The whole point is it also explains how they can forsee things in the Matrix in real life, and to boot, a computer program inside the Matrix, like the Oracle, knows about it.

Rightous Fist Of Heaven · Post by **Rightous Fist Of Heaven** » 2003-05-21 01:37pm

Altough i really hate the possiblity that the "Real World" is just another Matrix, there is something that makes me feel that it may be so. But i wont say yay or nay before i see Revolutions because thats when everything is revealed. The second matrix thing just feels so worn and old (existenz, 14th floor), its hard to believe that the Wachowski's would fall into using something that lame and plainly obvious at the moment.
I have a feeling that both sides in the "Real World" argument will be supprised by what Revolutions tells us.

Mad · Post by **Mad** » 2003-05-21 02:09pm

SirNitram wrote:I disagree. It's got the trademark 'Throw out logic and go with the unknown mechanism to give me the answer I want' of Darkstar's superlaser theory. No WoI, though.

So your only complaint is that you don't know how Neo communicated with the machines. That's the entire basis of your argument for an exterior Matrix?

You're ignoring the fac that the Architect said he couldn't design a Matrix that could keep certain people from waking up in. The 1% that wake up from the interior Matrix would likewise have the same problem in the exterior Matrix. Living a mundane life doesn't feel right, yet living in a completely strange sci-fi universe with machines out to kill you does feel right?!? I'd be more inclined to wake up from that nightmare than from the boring Matrix life, based on my reactions to my own dreams. (I wake up when things get scary, stay dreaming when things are boring.)

You think the imaginitive kids that woke up from the Matrix won't try to wake up from this second, fantastic world, just in case?

Circumstantial evidence for a transmitter: the red pill. It contained a tracing program to determine Neo's location in the real world. Perhaps it triggered a low-bandwidth transmitter the machines install into humans. (Yes, there could be other methods; lots of database lookups and correlation to known points in the real world, for instance.)

Also, Neo only felt the presence of the machines. If he was in a Matrix, he'd feel the presence of everything around him, not just the machines. It wouldn't be "something's different," it'd be "everything's different." His connection is with the machines, and just the machines.

What evidence is there for a second Matrix? Clearly, the scene with Neo at the end is controversial enough to go either way, when used alone. I can just as easily use it as proof of a transmitter as you can use it as proof for a second Matrix.

The exterior Matrix keeps people busy? Why not just make the interior Matrix more busy and lose all the weird Agents and crazy junk that happens. Then nobody would wake up! Oh, wait, the Architect can't design a Matrix that keeps people from waking up. And yet you claim nobody has woken up from the exterior Matrix. That, obviously, is a huge hole in the second Matrix theory.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-21 02:22pm

Mad wrote:
SirNitram wrote:I disagree. It's got the trademark 'Throw out logic and go with the unknown mechanism to give me the answer I want' of Darkstar's superlaser theory. No WoI, though.
So your only complaint is that you don't know how Neo communicated with the machines. That's the entire basis of your argument for an exterior Matrix?

Yea, pretty much. Everything else requires a Mysterious Unknown Mechanism, my theory runs entirely on demonstrated abilities. Oh, and the possibility for people to lie. It's called obeying Occam's Razor.

You're ignoring the fac that the Architect said he couldn't design a Matrix that could keep certain people from waking up in. The 1% that wake up from the interior Matrix would likewise have the same problem in the exterior Matrix. Living a mundane life doesn't feel right, yet living in a completely strange sci-fi universe with machines out to kill you does feel right?!? I'd be more inclined to wake up from that nightmare than from the boring Matrix life, based on my reactions to my own dreams. (I wake up when things get scary, stay dreaming when things are boring.)

It isn't the same as dreaming, as I pointed out. If we take Neo as average(And we have no other in depth knowledge to work from), people get suspicious when they're bored, living subpar lives that aren't satisfying. Even then, they live in the Matrix without questioning it, until the Pariahs(The Zionists) find them.

The key, of course, is Zion-World is too busy for such questions. Even if such arrived, there are no Pariahs, no one to draw them out. They will sit there, trapped in DeCartes Nightmare, probably condemned as insane.

You think the imaginitive kids that woke up from the Matrix won't try to wake up from this second, fantastic world, just in case?

They may try, but without the Zionists to give them an exit, they will simply drift in the program, dissatisfied but too busy to dwell upon it overmuch.

Circumstantial evidence for a transmitter: the red pill. It contained a tracing program to determine Neo's location in the real world. Perhaps it triggered a low-bandwidth transmitter the machines install into humans. (Yes, there could be other methods; lots of database lookups and correlation to known points in the real world, for instance.)

Or the pill interacts with what he was plugged into at the time. If such a transmittor existed, why not use it instead of the hardline in the skull?

Also, Neo only felt the presence of the machines. If he was in a Matrix, he'd feel the presence of everything around him, not just the machines. It wouldn't be "something's different," it'd be "everything's different." His connection is with the machines, and just the machines.

The process is most likely gradual. He didn't see lines of code in the end of the first one that we know of, nor did he immediately fly. Or maybe he did see everything as code in that instant, but obviously he can't tell us, he's in a coma.

What evidence is there for a second Matrix? Clearly, the scene with Neo at the end is controversial enough to go either way, when used alone. I can just as easily use it as proof of a transmitter as you can use it as proof for a second Matrix.

Except yours requires a Mysterious Unknown Mechanism. Sorry; that's always been invalid in a logical debate. A guy called William Of Occam figured that one out.

The exterior Matrix keeps people busy? Why not just make the interior Matrix more busy and lose all the weird Agents and crazy junk that happens. Then nobody would wake up! Oh, wait, the Architect can't design a Matrix that keeps people from waking up. And yet you claim nobody has woken up from the exterior Matrix. That, obviously, is a huge hole in the second Matrix theory.

Of course, we'll ignore the possibility the Architect could lie. That being so much more unbelievable than a magic unknown mechanism in the plug...

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2003-05-21 02:32pm

anyone else think some of the kids know its fake? thats my take on the spoon scene - the kid gives neo a spoon, because there isnt one in this world either.

admittedly, that can be taken as a reminder of how to work in the inner matrix, but with the ending of him stopping sentinels like bullets, I think the spoon ties in well.

also, I dont think most of the machines know its fake. smith was certainly confused when he was brought to the new reality, and I find it easier to believe that hes a program operating in a new image then a patch of electricity somehow brought into the real world and possessing someone.

Mad · Post by **Mad** » 2003-05-21 02:53pm

SirNitram wrote:Yea, pretty much. Everything else requires a Mysterious Unknown Mechanism, my theory runs entirely on demonstrated abilities. Oh, and the possibility for people to lie. It's called obeying Occam's Razor.

A "transmitter" is hardly an unknown mechanism. At best, there's no direct evidence that can't be interpreted some other way.

It isn't the same as dreaming, as I pointed out. If we take Neo as average(And we have no other in depth knowledge to work from), people get suspicious when they're bored, living subpar lives that aren't satisfying. Even then, they live in the Matrix without questioning it, until the Pariahs(The Zionists) find them.

The key, of course, is Zion-World is too busy for such questions. Even if such arrived, there are no Pariahs, no one to draw them out. They will sit there, trapped in DeCartes Nightmare, probably condemned as insane.

So why not just make the interior Matrix more busy? By your theory, that'd mean nobody would wake up. That'd be much, much easier to do than setting up an elaborate false prophecy, Agents of the system, and all the other junk.

Please, try to think of the implications of your theory... if yours was true, then everything would be simplier for the machines. Just make the Matrix a busier place. Alas, doing that wouldn't work, duh...

They may try, but without the Zionists to give them an exit, they will simply drift in the program, dissatisfied but too busy to dwell upon it overmuch.

If they can't wake up on their own, then why bother allowing any to wake up at all? No second Matrix, no war, nobody wakes up. According to your theory, anyway...

Or the pill interacts with what he was plugged into at the time. If such a transmittor existed, why not use it instead of the hardline in the skull?

Because wireless would present too many problems. It's much, much lower bandwidth than cables (can't send enough information to simulate a world). Managing all those connections and frequencies would be a nightmare, as well. Basically, the technical limitations of wireless transmitters make that one an impossibility.

The process is most likely gradual. He didn't see lines of code in the end of the first one that we know of, nor did he immediately fly. Or maybe he did see everything as code in that instant, but obviously he can't tell us, he's in a coma.

Doesn't explain why it's just the sentinels, though. Surely he'd notice things closer to him first.

What evidence is there for a second Matrix? Clearly, the scene with Neo at the end is controversial enough to go either way, when used alone. I can just as easily use it as proof of a transmitter as you can use it as proof for a second Matrix.
Except yours requires a Mysterious Unknown Mechanism. Sorry; that's always been invalid in a logical debate. A guy called William Of Occam figured that one out.

You ignored the question. What evidence is there for a second Matrix?

And a wireless transmitter isn't an unknown. It exists in real life and so we can make comparisons, determining its capabilities and limits. There's simply no direct proof for it on the level your requesting. At the same time, you've neglected to provide proof for a second Matrix, as well.

Of course, we'll ignore the possibility the Architect could lie. That being so much more unbelievable than a magic unknown mechanism in the plug...

Why would he lie? If he was just gonna lie, then he could do a better job of not giving Neo a choice by simply not being there. Neo would continue through to the Source and reboot the system. The selection of those to make the new Zion could be forced in another way. It'd be much easier on the Architect that way, instead of creating this complicated speech that allows Neo to make the "wrong" choice.

I doubt he'd spend that much effort on lying instead of making a simplier lie, if your theory were true.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-21 03:02pm

Mad wrote:
SirNitram wrote:Yea, pretty much. Everything else requires a Mysterious Unknown Mechanism, my theory runs entirely on demonstrated abilities. Oh, and the possibility for people to lie. It's called obeying Occam's Razor.
A "transmitter" is hardly an unknown mechanism. At best, there's no direct evidence that can't be interpreted some other way.

An inert plug becoming a transmittor is.

It isn't the same as dreaming, as I pointed out. If we take Neo as average(And we have no other in depth knowledge to work from), people get suspicious when they're bored, living subpar lives that aren't satisfying. Even then, they live in the Matrix without questioning it, until the Pariahs(The Zionists) find them.

The key, of course, is Zion-World is too busy for such questions. Even if such arrived, there are no Pariahs, no one to draw them out. They will sit there, trapped in DeCartes Nightmare, probably condemned as insane.
So why not just make the interior Matrix more busy? By your theory, that'd mean nobody would wake up. That'd be much, much easier to do than setting up an elaborate false prophecy, Agents of the system, and all the other junk.

Please, try to think of the implications of your theory... if yours was true, then everything would be simplier for the machines. Just make the Matrix a busier place. Alas, doing that wouldn't work, duh...

Sorry, moron, doesn't deliver The One to The Source. THAT is why the Prophecy is there, after all.. I'm sorry you're too stupid to realize that.

They may try, but without the Zionists to give them an exit, they will simply drift in the program, dissatisfied but too busy to dwell upon it overmuch.
If they can't wake up on their own, then why bother allowing any to wake up at all? No second Matrix, no war, nobody wakes up. According to your theory, anyway...

And no getting The One to The Source. Sorry, you still lose.

Or the pill interacts with what he was plugged into at the time. If such a transmittor existed, why not use it instead of the hardline in the skull?
Because wireless would present too many problems. It's much, much lower bandwidth than cables (can't send enough information to simulate a world). Managing all those connections and frequencies would be a nightmare, as well. Basically, the technical limitations of wireless transmitters make that one an impossibility.

And there's still no proof it's a wireless uplink, and still no proof he would be able to hack the command structure to be able to shut down three Sentinels in an eyeblink.

The process is most likely gradual. He didn't see lines of code in the end of the first one that we know of, nor did he immediately fly. Or maybe he did see everything as code in that instant, but obviously he can't tell us, he's in a coma.
Doesn't explain why it's just the sentinels, though. Surely he'd notice things closer to him first.

Or he did, and didn't say anything. He just said 'Them', after all, and Them might well have been every person in Zion.

What evidence is there for a second Matrix? Clearly, the scene with Neo at the end is controversial enough to go either way, when used alone. I can just as easily use it as proof of a transmitter as you can use it as proof for a second Matrix.
Except yours requires a Mysterious Unknown Mechanism. Sorry; that's always been invalid in a logical debate. A guy called William Of Occam figured that one out.
You ignored the question. What evidence is there for a second Matrix?

The One using his powers in the so-called Real World.

And a wireless transmitter isn't an unknown. It exists in real life and so we can make comparisons, determining its capabilities and limits. There's simply no direct proof for it on the level your requesting. At the same time, you've neglected to provide proof for a second Matrix, as well.

Blatantly obvious Strawman. The unknown is Inert Plug magically becoming Wireless Transmittor.

Of course, we'll ignore the possibility the Architect could lie. That being so much more unbelievable than a magic unknown mechanism in the plug...
Why would he lie? If he was just gonna lie, then he could do a better job of not giving Neo a choice by simply not being there. Neo would continue through to the Source and reboot the system. The selection of those to make the new Zion could be forced in another way. It'd be much easier on the Architect that way, instead of creating this complicated speech that allows Neo to make the "wrong" choice.

I doubt he'd spend that much effort on lying instead of making a simplier lie, if your theory were true.

Well, his lie certainly convinced you.

I've explained why mine works. Every try to disprove it ignores something I've posted(Either on the importance of the One's return, or the fact that there's no one to unplug people in a second layer, or..), or just flat out insults Parsimony. Please try not to be a moron. I realize you might not want it to be so, but if it's just an emotional reaction, have the decency to admit it.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-21 03:04pm

Enforcer Talen wrote:anyone else think some of the kids know its fake? thats my take on the spoon scene - the kid gives neo a spoon, because there isnt one in this world either.

admittedly, that can be taken as a reminder of how to work in the inner matrix, but with the ending of him stopping sentinels like bullets, I think the spoon ties in well.

Quite. Some of the kids realized the second layer was also a Matrix, and gave a hint to the one person they thought could do something about it. And, despite the Architect's speech, when he returned to the real world, he used his powers.

also, I dont think most of the machines know its fake. smith was certainly confused when he was brought to the new reality, and I find it easier to believe that hes a program operating in a new image then a patch of electricity somehow brought into the real world and possessing someone.

I'm not sure about the validity of the idea programs shouldn't possess humans, but it may link to Smith cutting his human body's hand. He seemed almost contemplative("I should be feeling pain.. Hrm.. Something is most irregular here.."). Of course, it may be that he hates his body.

Mad · Post by **Mad** » 2003-05-21 03:38pm

SirNitram wrote:An inert plug becoming a transmittor is.

And where did I make that claim?!? He'd have to always have a transmitter inside him, just that he never had the ability to invoke it before.

Sorry, moron, doesn't deliver The One to The Source. THAT is why the Prophecy is there, after all.. I'm sorry you're too stupid to realize that.

The One wouldn't have to go to the Source if there's no rebellion and no Zion.

Instead, they'd just have a nice busy Matrix that nobody has time to wake up from. When they find the One, some people "find" him and tell him he can learn more about his powers by going through this door...

Again, the implications to your theory make the machines look stupid for not having such a complicated method to dealing with a simple problem.

And no getting The One to The Source. Sorry, you still lose.

No, the One would still exist. Well, assuming the Architect wasn't lying about that, too.

The One would just be told to go here by a couple of friendly FBI agents... he wouldn't even have a reason to fight them because they wouldn't have to be hostile. The FBI agents or whatever could even be other people ordered by a real Agent.

And there's still no proof it's a wireless uplink, and still no proof he would be able to hack the command structure to be able to shut down three Sentinels in an eyeblink.

We don't know what kind of commands he'd have sent. His connection to Smith would have given him bit of information on the code of the AIs, though, giving him a good idea of what to do.

What do you mean by "command structure," exactly?

The One using his powers in the so-called Real World.

No, that was a transmitter. What? I don't have proof of that? Then where's your proof that he was using his powers in the real world there?

As I said before (weren't you reading? or did you just forget about it since it wasn't quoted right there?), that scene can go both ways. So it doesn't work for evidence. So, again, where is your evidence for a second Matrix?

Blatantly obvious Strawman. The unknown is Inert Plug magically becoming Wireless Transmittor.

No, what you just said is a strawman, where you're putting words into my mouth. I never said an inert plug became a transmitter. I'm saying it was always a transmitter, installed but never used by the machines. At least try to keep your definitions to debating fallacies straight.

Well, his lie certainly convinced you.

Too bad it didn't convince Neo to go to the Source, which was the whole point of it. A simplier lie would've forced Neo to go to the Source.

I've explained why mine works.

By having an overcomplicated scheme and lies when something much simplier -- a single busy Matrix with the One being found by a government agency and nicely has him walk through a door to "discover his powers" -- would suffice???

Every try to disprove it ignores something I've posted(Either on the importance of the One's return, or the fact that there's no one to unplug people in a second layer, or..), or just flat out insults Parsimony. Please try not to be a moron. I realize you might not want it to be so, but if it's just an emotional reaction, have the decency to admit it.

By your theory, the entire second layer is unneccessary in order to have the One reach the Source.

Post by **LadyTevar** » 2003-05-21 04:23pm

SirNitram wrote:
Enforcer Talen wrote:anyone else think some of the kids know its fake? thats my take on the spoon scene - the kid gives neo a spoon, because there isnt one in this world either.

admittedly, that can be taken as a reminder of how to work in the inner matrix, but with the ending of him stopping sentinels like bullets, I think the spoon ties in well.
Quite. Some of the kids realized the second layer was also a Matrix, and gave a hint to the one person they thought could do something about it. And, despite the Architect's speech, when he returned to the real world, he used his powers.

also, I dont think most of the machines know its fake. smith was certainly confused when he was brought to the new reality, and I find it easier to believe that hes a program operating in a new image then a patch of electricity somehow brought into the real world and possessing someone.
I'm not sure about the validity of the idea programs shouldn't possess humans, but it may link to Smith cutting his human body's hand. He seemed almost contemplative("I should be feeling pain.. Hrm.. Something is most irregular here.."). Of course, it may be that he hates his body.

Nitram? This is the same arguement we're having at home. Just because you can't convince me doesn't mean you have to take it out on everyone else

SIT BOY!

Drooling Iguana · Post by **Drooling Iguana** » 2003-05-21 07:38pm

I find it ironic that we seem to be putting far more thought into this movie than its writers did...

Hobot · Post by **Hobot** » 2003-05-21 07:45pm

SirNitram wrote:
Hobot wrote:
SirNitram wrote: No, completely accurate. He wants us to suppose magic transmittor plugs with no evidence.
No, it's not completely accurate. How Neo is able to communicate with the machines is not important at this point. It's a freaking sci-fi movie, they can invent all sorts of ways to make is possible
Fine. Show me anything from the movie which explicitly shows it's a wireless connection. Come on. Don't give me this 'it is one, that's how the scene works', because it's BS circular logic.

His argument is not on how it works, that's a complete unknown. You can't give explicit evidence to prove that Neo was using Matrix powers against the Sentinels. Arguing how it works is useless, we're arguing which is more likely based on the story.

You're a moron. Nothing there demands that Zion be real, except the Architect's speech. And, hey, moronboy, the Architect is capable of lying. That's the point of the Matrix.
Oh yes, calling me a moron really helps your argument. There are a whole bunch of reaons to suggest that Zion is real, and zombie pointed them out several times. The burden of proof lies on you to prove that it is a Second Matrix. You have to explain why the machines have to exert so much effort to kill the Zionists and why they even have to kill them at all if they're still in the Matrix. They obviously represent a real threat, otherwise the machines wouldn't be so concerned about killing them all. If it was just a Second Matrix, they could let the Zionists rebel to their hearts content and it would all be meaningless because they'd all still be in the Matrix.
And they still need the freakin' One to return to the Source, so they frighten the Zionists to get the One to go to the Source. There, your little theory meshes perfectly with mine.

You ignored my argument! [size=large]Why would they even need the One if the Zionists are still in the Matrix?[/size]

Seriously. Do you expect your 'wireless access plug' theory to actually hold up against ten seconds of logical thought? Just because you can invent reasons to believe it doesn't make it valid. It's going about things ass-backwards. Which is exactly why I compare this to RSA's shennanigans.

It's not my theory and it's not the only possibility. Again, this is a fucking sci-fi movie, they can invent just about any kind of technology they want. You might as well ask me to explain how the hover ships work or why humans can really be used as batteries, it doesn't fucking matter, get that through your thick skull.
You have to show the plug is capable of wireless transmission before assuming that. It's called logical debate. You might want to read up on it.

I do not have to argue about the technology, we can't do that since it's sci-fi. What we can argue is which is more likely based on events and dialogue in the movie. If there was a Second Matrix, there would be no fucking point for the prophecy or the one. There wouldn't even be a need for a Second Matrix if the machines can convince the humans that they live in reality.

I suggest that you go back and read how to logically debate without using Strawmem.