The Inquisition (Spoilers)

[Lone_Prodigy]

And, it appears I've forgotten details of the Shadowlight. The Faith and Fire machine, on the other hand, it was claimed by the guy researching it, was able to turn normals into the equals of Malcador the Sigillite. He was probably nuts, but it did seem to be working when he tried it.

For the uninformed, who was Malcador the Sigillite? Was it ever detailed how powerful he was on the psyker scale?

[Imperial Overlord]

For the uninformed, who was Malcador the Sigillite? Was it ever detailed how powerful he was on the psyker scale?

The Emperor's Seneshal and possibly second only to the Emperor in psychic ability.

[Lone_Prodigy]

The Emperor's Seneshal and possibly second only to the Emperor in psychic ability.

Well, that certainly provides a good explaination for who the mystery observed Gamma+ could've been, aside from Magnus.

On a side note, is Grey Knight psychic strength ever fit to a specific psyker power level? It seems as though they should be fairly weak since it takes a full Terminator squad to enact a Holocaust, but being able to hold up to Ghargatuloth's gaze certainly takes ludicrous amounts of psychic strength. It would provide a good benchmark for Librarian psychic power, since Librarians perform such more impressive feats (Vortex of Doom, anyone?).

[white_rabbit]

The Emperor's Seneshal and possibly second only to the Emperor in psychic ability.

Well, that certainly provides a good explaination for who the mystery observed Gamma+ could've been, aside from Magnus.

On a side note, is Grey Knight psychic strength ever fit to a specific psyker power level? It seems as though they should be fairly weak since it takes a full Terminator squad to enact a Holocaust, but being able to hold up to Ghargatuloth's gaze certainly takes ludicrous amounts of psychic strength. It would provide a good benchmark for Librarian psychic power, since Librarians perform such more impressive feats (Vortex of Doom, anyone?).

The Grey Knights are selected from the highest tier of psykers intake, which combines power with significant willpower and mental ability.

This has been fudged slightly with GK's internalising their powers for the various psychic abilities, i.e. the Shroud, their wards, physical affects, their weaponry etc.

[Lone_Prodigy]

The Grey Knights are selected from the highest tier of psykers intake, which combines power with significant willpower and mental ability.

This has been fudged slightly with GK's internalising their powers for the various psychic abilities, i.e. the Shroud, their wards, physical affects, their weaponry etc.

I see. So probably in the Beta-Delta range since those are the most powerful while remaining stable? With Librarians at roughly the same levels or lower?

[Stormbringer]

I see. So probably in the Beta-Delta range since those are the most powerful while remaining stable?

That would be the most likely thing.

With Librarians at roughly the same levels or lower?

Probably not much lower, at least for most Chapters, just different.

[Setzer]

I recall reading from one of the HH artbooks, saying that Malcador the Sigillite was the only person besides the Emperor powerful enough to hold a daemon infested webway gate closed. So if he isn't gamma+, he's close.

[NecronLord]

I recall reading from one of the HH artbooks, saying that Malcador the Sigillite was the only person besides the Emperor powerful enough to hold a daemon infested webway gate closed. So if he isn't gamma+, he's close.

Correct. Malcador held the warp gate at the Golden Throne shut, allowing the Emperor to teleport up into orbit and fight Horus. However, doing so, even for a relatively short time - a few hours or so at most - exhausted and killed Malcador.

[White Haven]

You know, that raises the question of what the 40k universe would look like now if the Emp'd tossed a vortex torpedo or fifty up to Horus's unshielded ship instead.

[NecronLord]

You know, that raises the question of what the 40k universe would look like now if the Emp'd tossed a vortex torpedo or fifty up to Horus's unshielded ship instead.

He could already barely leave the Throne, and only with Malcador martyring himself to do so. Without the personal element, it's questionable if the Chaos Legions would have been so demoralised. Which means it comes down to 'do the Dark Angels and Space Wolves arrive in time to stop the Palace falling.'

[Imperial Overlord]

Shields don't stop torpedoes. If they had any torpedoes left, they would have to survive the weapons fire and point defence of Horus's ships. Considering the shape Earth's defences were in, not likely to have happened.

[Dark Hellion]

It also assumes that the Chaos Gods won't pull Horus and the other important chaos marines off of the Battlebarge, whereas the Emperor can use his power to prevent that.

[Lone_Prodigy]

It also assumes that the Chaos Gods won't pull Horus and the other important chaos marines off of the Battlebarge, whereas the Emperor can use his power to prevent that.

Could he? It was my impression that Horus, empowered by all four Chaos Gods, was too powerful for the Emperor to prevent him from using his powers. After all, it took the Emperor striking with all his strength to defeat Horus, which implies that they were of similar strengths when they fought.

[Connor MacLeod]

Shields don't stop torpedoes. If they had any torpedoes left, they would have to survive the weapons fire and point defence of Horus's ships. Considering the shape Earth's defences were in, not likely to have happened.

Not quite true. There are instances in some novels (I know there are more than one, but unfortunately ATM only Sabbat Martyr comes to mind immediately - Soul Drinkers novels might be another one...) where torpedoes do NOT penetrate shields, at least not effortlessly.

[Dark Hellion]

Direct and indirect psychic power use seem to have different levels of disruptability. I was just posing a hypothetical, but given some previous canon this seems to be a general conclusion. Bequin could stop Cherubael and Prophaniti from attack them indirectly with psychic powers, but could still use those powers to enhance their physical attributes, making themselves very strong and providing extreme regeneration etc.

[White Haven]

I was more referring to the fact that if you can teleport a grab-bag of Primarchs and the Emperor to a ship, you can teleport a grab-bag worth of big goddamn bombs to the same place.

[NecronLord]

I was more referring to the fact that if you can teleport a grab-bag of Primarchs and the Emperor to a ship, you can teleport a grab-bag worth of big goddamn bombs to the same place.

And Horus was able to decide where they landed. He brought Sanguinius directly to him for torture and death, and let the Emperor land somewhere where he could fight his way to him.

With warheads, he might very well just be able to send them back.

[white_rabbit]

Shields don't stop torpedoes. If they had any torpedoes left, they would have to survive the weapons fire and point defence of Horus's ships. Considering the shape Earth's defences were in, not likely to have happened.

Not quite true. There are instances in some novels (I know there are more than one, but unfortunately ATM only Sabbat Martyr comes to mind immediately - Soul Drinkers novels might be another one...) where torpedoes do NOT penetrate shields, at least not effortlessly.

Grey Knights is another as I recall. Although the Rubicon is one of the more advanced examples of Imperial space technology around.

[SylasGaunt]

Could he? It was my impression that Horus, empowered by all four Chaos Gods, was too powerful for the Emperor to prevent him from using his powers. After all, it took the Emperor striking with all his strength to defeat Horus, which implies that they were of similar strengths when they fought.

No, Horus was able to mangle him up good when he was holding back because he didn't want to really hurt Horus due to their father/son relationship. Even with all four chaos gods backing him and the Emperor severely mangled the second he quit holding back he utterly destroyed him.

[Annatar Giftbringer]

Grey Knights is another as I recall. Although the Rubicon is one of the more advanced examples of Imperial space technology around.

In what ways? Granted, it's been a while since i read Grey Knights, but I don't remember anything marking it as extremely advanced... Of course, I have read very few 40k books, and none that deals with spaceships in any detail...

[white_rabbit]

Grey Knights is another as I recall. Although the Rubicon is one of the more advanced examples of Imperial space technology around.

In what ways? Granted, it's been a while since i read Grey Knights, but I don't remember anything marking it as extremely advanced... Of course, I have read very few 40k books, and none that deals with spaceships in any detail...

In the novel itself it does to my recollection make reference to the advanced materials and tech that gave the Rubicon such resiliance to enemy fire, as well as its degree of automation and general attributes.

The BFG textbox on GK strike cruisers basically says the same thing.

[Lone_Prodigy]

What is the soul binding process? I've heard references to it, and so far I've gathered that: it has something to do with the Emperor, it is done with Astropaths, Sanctioned Psykers, and possibly Grey Knights, and that it's a rather unpleasant procedure with long-term consequences. What, do they basically funnel some of the Emperor's power into the psyker?

In the novel itself it does to my recollection make reference to the advanced materials and tech that gave the Rubicon such resiliance to enemy fire, as well as its degree of automation and general attributes.

The BFG textbox on GK strike cruisers basically says the same thing.

With all of those modifications, do you think that it could've defeated the fleet that destroyed it if it had fought instead of running through?

[Imperial Overlord]

Soul bonding is done only with Astropaths. They are brought together in large numbers and the Emperor reshapes their minds. This kills a few of the applicants.

The survivors are blinded by the experience, which burns out their optic nerves. They also gain a strong measure of protection from the dangers of the warp, making them relatively safe psykers.

Sanctioned Psykers are psykers strong and stable enough to defend themselves from the dangers of the warp. The Grey Knights tend to be powerful pyskers as well as Marines, but their powers are focused on defence and combating daemonic entities.

[White Haven]

In the novel itself it does to my recollection make reference to the advanced materials and tech that gave the Rubicon such resiliance to enemy fire, as well as its degree of automation and general attributes.

The BFG textbox on GK strike cruisers basically says the same thing.

With all of those modifications, do you think that it could've defeated the fleet that destroyed it if it had fought instead of running through?

It's stated in the book that the Rubicon is relatively lightly-armed, and is designed more to deliver the GKs against all opposition than it is to engage and destroy warships. While it'd be capable of taking out light opposition at need, there was a carrier, a full battleship, and an escort group that I can recall just off the top of my head in place, way more firepower than the Rubicon can withstand for long enough for its lighter weaponry to do any good.

[Rye]

How is the soul bonding done "now" i.e. in the year 40,000? Do they just expose people to the corpse-emperor who just radiates it, or is he lucid enough at least in spirit to recognise their existences and forcibly imparts the process on to the gathered masses?