Pacific Rim: SPOILER THREAD

[Cykeisme]

Also, if they thought a wall would work, why build it along the coast instead of simply building it around the Breach? That way, there would (obviously) be much less wall to build.

Because in order for that to work you would have to construct it under water, rising above the water, working against tidal effects and do all this from scratch in the time between one kaiju being killed and the next one coming through. Basically impossible.

Granted, that's completely true.. constructing a wall at those depths can't be easy.

I still believe that it's strategically and tactically obvious that any measures taken should be concentrated around the chokepoint, rather than spread along the eponymous Pacific rim; the coastal areas involved are so large, with so many populated cities along both east and west, that it's essentially indefensible without massive damage to civilian infrastructure even when defense is successful.

For example, one or more of the below measures:
- At the peak of their numbers, all the world's Jaegers should all have been waiting right at the Breach to pound the crap out of the Kaiju in a 20 vs 1 fight (or 20 vs 2 at the first double event).
- Pour tons of concrete directly into the Breach. Since non-Kaiju matter can't get through, it should collect on top of the alien security barrier and harden. Or whatever it is they do to cap oil wells in real life, except pour way more in, and put rebar in as well.
- Nuclear mines, command-detonated upon Kaiju emergence and then replaced afterward.


For that matter, even if Jaeger resistance was effective in the early days (against the Category 1 and Category 2 Kaiju), why did the governments of the world ever send Jaegers to fight monsters in 1 vs 1 battles instead of ganging on them?
If they'd worked out the logistics (and politics, which is no less important) behind mobile deployment and concentration of force, massed Jaegers could have been out-numberering Kaiju, and therefore killing them without losses, even up to Cat3 or Cat4.

Note that I'm referring to in-universe reasons, to maintain suspension of disbelief. Out-of-universe, it's obvious that 1:1 engagements are awesome.

[mr friendly guy]

Oh another question. Is it worth seeing Pacific Rim in 3D or would the 2D movie be adequate?

[Xess]

Oh another question. Is it worth seeing Pacific Rim in 3D or would the 2D movie be adequate?

I saw it 2D and thought it looked great. I think 3D would be better though.

[AniThyng]

I have to say Stacker Pentacost* strikes me as just the kind of name an Anime writer would come up with if he needed to name a westerner.

*OK, so it's a real name. Still...

Anyway, so they blew up the Alien's equivalent to Stargate command - so the basic plan is they are counting on the Alien bean counters to say "the little monkeys on this planet aren't worth the trouble. Let's move on to that other planet over there" right

[Guardsman Bass]

More or less, although if the movie ends up being successful enough to merit a sequel, they'll just have them open up another wormhole.

Also, I've got a question for anyone who was reading the fluff stuff beyond the movie - did cities outside of the Pacific Rim get attacked, or were you sitting pretty if you happened to live in a city on the Atlantic Ocean (for example)? I can't remember whether it happened from the movie.

[Zinegata]

Re: Safe Zones

It seems that anything that was 300km+ way from the Pacific Coast was generally safe. There was an implication (when they were interviewing the US president about the failure of the wall) that not everyone could really evacuate to a "safer" location even if they wanted to - e.g. their livelihood was tied to their current city and they just didn't have the money (and had no government support) to move.

Re: 3D vs 2D

I watched the 3D version and it was pretty well done.

Re: Mining the Breach

My sense is that they didn't want to keep nuking the Pacific Ocean (especially given that Kaiju caracasses were apparently highly toxic) which is why they simply didn't mine the whole area with nukes. In the preview comics some of the earlier Kaijus were apparently killed by nuking, but it was seen as a largely self-defeating measure hence the invention of the Jaegers - which among other things apparently use weaponry that mnimize the toxic spill of the Kaiju carcasses.

Re: Why not fight in the Breach and have 20 Jaegers beating up on one Kaiju?

My suspicion is that Jaegers may not exactly be operating at best efficiency when completely submerged. The Kaiju seemed very capable of outmaneuvering them in full underwater conditions. Their optimal deployment seems to be when the Jaegers are in "waist-deep" water, as seen by the deployment of Gypsy Danger at Anchorage, and the Typhoon and Alpha at Hong Kong.

Finally, personal notes...

I really like the fact that the hero/heroine didn't kiss in the ending, thus breaking that old and sad trope for once.

Also, the moment they turned off the clock was a great cathartic moment, especially when you remember the aftermath of the first battle wherein they had to reset the clock despite losing half of their Jaegers.

[AniThyng]

Well, generally safe for now - once the Kaiju finally wipe out resistance on the Pacific they just have to start swimming further

Which is why I really cannot imagine any situation in which a wall makes any sense even using the in universe logic...how can you meaningfully wall off even the Pacific coast? Some cities and bays, sure, but then all the Kaiju have to do is walk around it.

Nevermind once they figured out how to fly

Also, Trevar, how is Hong Kong not on the Pacific, it totally is

A pity the kaiju are toxic though. I'm totally sure the first question asked by Asians is "can we eat it?"

[Admiral Valdemar]

They didn't eat them, but they sure as hell exploited them, since Hannibal was selling the carcass materials off for various uses.

And, if you stayed for the end of the animated end credits, he survives.

[Knife]

A glorious movie, I got exactly what I wanted and I'm very happy.

That being said, my brain won't let a couple things pass.

1) the Sword should not be the last option. It really should be the option usable before using cargo boxes and ships as baseball bats. This is a common thing for superhero movies where the hero busts out the Batlaser at the end of the movie when it would have been really handy earlier.

2) similar to thing that would be handy earlier in the movie, escape pods might have been used a couple times early on.

3) no way 8 helo's are lifting those huge things.

Other than that, I can SOD the rest and had a great time.

[Guardsman Bass]

That was a little weird. I remember thinking, "They really ought to make a gigantic baseball bat or sword for those Jaegers", and it turns out they did have the latter, but didn't use it until the end of the battle. The only rationale I can think of is that they were trying to minimize splatter from slicing a Kaiju to pieces as opposed to simply beating them to death.

[Admiral Valdemar]

I see swords on several Jaegers too, such as Kaiju Crush (though wrist mounted).

I'm surprised the blades weren't thermal or sonic in action, to at least cut easier if not also cauterise and minimise toxic leakage.

[Cykeisme]

The only rationale I can think of is that they were trying to minimize splatter from slicing a Kaiju to pieces as opposed to simply beating them to death.

Generally I think they try to reduce massive Kaiju bleeding, rather than completely eliminating it. Hits from their arm-mounted energy weapons didn't result in lakes of blood oozing out, but there was still some bleeding.

So maybe they could use a hot sword, so it does some cauterizing as well as cutting?
EDIT: Admiral Valdemaar said it better

Re: Mining the Breach

My sense is that they didn't want to keep nuking the Pacific Ocean (especially given that Kaiju caracasses were apparently highly toxic) which is why they simply didn't mine the whole area with nukes. In the preview comics some of the earlier Kaijus were apparently killed by nuking, but it was seen as a largely self-defeating measure hence the invention of the Jaegers - which among other things apparently use weaponry that mnimize the toxic spill of the Kaiju carcasses.

Re: Why not fight in the Breach and have 20 Jaegers beating up on one Kaiju?

My suspicion is that Jaegers may not exactly be operating at best efficiency when completely submerged. The Kaiju seemed very capable of outmaneuvering them in full underwater conditions. Their optimal deployment seems to be when the Jaegers are in "waist-deep" water, as seen by the deployment of Gypsy Danger at Anchorage, and the Typhoon and Alpha at Hong Kong.

Yeah, I guess repeatedly nuking Kaiju as they exit the Breach does seem like a bad idea, both in terms of radiation from the nuke and that toxic Kaiju blood (though the nuke might reduce or eliminate the chemical toxicity of the blood).

I still disagree that 20 Jaegers waiting right at the Breach itself would have had any trouble beating up Kaiju as they emerge, even if the Jaegers don't work as well completely submerged.
In the movie, two Jaegers barely won against two Cat4s and the first Cat5 emerging simultaneously (the "Triple Event"), but they did win.

20 or 30 Jaegers lying in wait for a single Cat3 or Cat4 to emerge (there were no "Double Events" until the Hong Kong attack shown in the movie) would be a goddamn beatdown so severe that we'd have PETA protesting our inhumane treatment of Kaiju.

Which is why I really cannot imagine any situation in which a wall makes any sense even using the in universe logic...how can you meaningfully wall off even the Pacific coast? Some cities and bays, sure, but then all the Kaiju have to do is walk around it.

Yeah, how long exactly is the Kaiju Wall supposed to be? Even if the Wall worked (it didn't), how far exactly does it extend?
The Pacific doesn't really have a solid "rim" of land in the actual sense, it extends into other oceans. Unless it's built through the sea (which would require an insane height to extend from the seafloor to its ~100-200m height above sea level), how is it going to stop Kaiju from swimming past the south of Chile or into the South China Sea? Or under the Arctic ice cap?
Worse still, they cut funding from the Jaeger program to build the wall, instead of upgrading the Jaegers to deal with the increasing Kaiju sizes.

Generally the idea of an undefended wall keeping out a determined enemy demonstrates downright stupidity on the part of the international council that backed it. Or are they stupid enough to still think of the Kaiju as "animals" rather than "enemy"? If the wall had gun emplacements, or if they launched massive airstrikes on Kaiju as they attempt to breach the wall (Bladehead took an hour to break through to Sydney), it would make a bit of sense.

Speaking of airstrikes, I recall them showing F-22s attacking the Tokyo Kaiju by attacking it with automatic low-caliber cannon fire. It seems they modified the F-22s to have two cannons instead of one M61, for the express purpose of peppering Kaiju with ineffective fire, and proceed to fly straight into it. They're supposed to be swatted out of the air with a limb, but considering how big the sky is, it actually looks like they ram into it deliberately.
We know conventional weaponry (like Strike Eureka's chest missile tubes) can injure and kill Kaiju, so perhaps they could have properly shown us why airstrikes were ineffective.

The general silliness of the F-22 scene seems to serve as a reminder; some flicks are meant to be big, loud and awesome, and not meant to be analyzed.. and this is one of 'em.
I guess I have a lot to say about the movie because I love it, and that's how I treat movies I love, but this really isn't the right way to treat Pacific Rim.

[Admiral Valdemar]

I want these all to be in a prequel.

Incidentally, a sequel script exists since del Toro wants to expand on this universe if the studio considers it successful enough financially.

[Lord Relvenous]

I want these all to be in a prequel.

Incidentally, a sequel script exists since del Toro wants to expand on this universe if the studio considers it successful enough financially.

Which is going to be the rub. The film has been performing well internationally, but domestically it did not have a good opening. I hope the film can maintain good numbers for a few weeks due to repeat showings (I'll be going back, just for this reason), but I wouldn't be surprised if only the international market keeps this film from being a financial dud. I honestly don't know if studios like filming movies expecting them to be internationally successful only or not.

[Scrib]

I see swords on several Jaegers too, such as Kaiju Crush (though wrist mounted).

I'm surprised the blades weren't thermal or sonic in action, to at least cut easier if not also cauterise and minimise toxic leakage.

I'm pretty sure that most Jaegers used some sort of blade. What generally happened was that they got a few hits, the Kaiju grabbed their hand, and beat them like a redheaded stepchild. I think the heroes were just lucky that they had a free hand (and time to shout "For my family!" In Japanese-seriously, I expected one of those anime cuts were everything apart from the hero just blurs into a bunch of lines). It was big and bulky for an already bulky machine and the Kaiju generally aren't going to wait around to be hit.

They went into far more detail on the invaders than I thought they would, such as it was

By giving them the plain in Independence Day. I expected something along those lines really.

Which is going to be the rub. The film has been performing well internationally, but domestically it did not have a good opening. I hope the film can maintain good numbers for a few weeks due to repeat showings (I'll be going back, just for this reason), but I wouldn't be surprised if only the international market keeps this film from being a financial dud. I honestly don't know if studios like filming movies expecting them to be internationally successful only or not.

I really hope that, unlike a few years ago with the Golden Compass, the studio kept the international rights. I don't think that the movie will do that well domestically but maybe it can recoup some money internationally.

Another strange thing is why it's opening on the 9th in Japan. Isn't that like the Holy Land?

To be honest though, I'm not really that optimistic about a sequel.

[CaptainChewbacca]

I think Pacific Rim is going to be profitable, but not a box-office hit. I do, however, think that it is going to do incredibly well on DVD sales and make a large enough mark on geek culture to get a sequel.

[AniThyng]

The general silliness of the F-22 scene seems to serve as a reminder; some flicks are meant to be big, loud and awesome, and not meant to be analyzed.. and this is one of 'em.
I guess I have a lot to say about the movie because I love it, and that's how I treat movies I love, but this really isn't the right way to treat Pacific Rim.

Reading RedImp's quote in your sig just got 10x funnier in this context.

[Majin Gojira]

Which is going to be the rub. The film has been performing well internationally, but domestically it did not have a good opening. I hope the film can maintain good numbers for a few weeks due to repeat showings (I'll be going back, just for this reason), but I wouldn't be surprised if only the international market keeps this film from being a financial dud. I honestly don't know if studios like filming movies expecting them to be internationally successful only or not.

Of the 6 or so people in my social circle who saw the movie, myself and one other want to see it again. Others did express interests in doing so, but cited finaces as the main reason they weren't.

The movie also has some decent merchandizing to go along with it. How that's selling, I don't know, but it may help.

[Admiral Valdemar]

Had a go on the online game and Jaeger designer last night. Seems some of the blades are thermal and laced with CNTs too. Take that fluff as you will.

I am tempted to get the Year Zero comic, but it's
pricey for how long it is, as with all comic books it seems.

[Majin Gojira]

I managed to read it and it's a decent read overall. A few moments jumped out at me, but nothing too big. The whole thing is framed through a reporter doing a bunch of interviews, and we see things like the first Jeager deploy, and the various complications that arise from mind linking.

[LadyTevar]

Ok, I have seen the movie again, and I misunderstood a line Hannibal Chan made to Newt. When Chan removes his glasses, he is NOT talking about having Drifted with the Kaiju when he says "done that before". He was talking about a Public Kaiju Shelter. That is why Hannibal Chan has only one eye and a huge scar.

So, now that I've mea-culpa'd, I want to talk about the role Music plays in the movie. Each Jaeger has a theme that plays when they show up, from the moment they're introduced. While you hear this at first during the Shatterdome introduction, it's the clearest during the Double Event fight, with Martial Arts Oriental for Crimson Typhon slipping over to Russian Gregorian when Cherno Alpha strides over for the elbow drop. As the fight continues, the music keeps switching back and forth, Kaiju to Robot themes, until the huge bass thrum that introduces Gispy Danger's arrival. Then it was a mix of the Kaiju theme and the hard guitar riffs for Gispy.

[Vendetta]

Individual themes for the robits is pretty much expected of super robits.


I mean how are you supposed to beat up monsters if your theme song isn't playing whilst you do it?

[Cykeisme]

Ooh, interesting observation about the music, Lady Tevar.
I hadn't noticed the first time I watched the movie, I think I might catch it a second time (but in regular 2D this time, IMAX 3D burns a hole in my pocket).
Btw, just saying, I think it's Hannibal Chau, not Chan.

Vendetta, would you consider the Jaegers super robots?
Now that I think about it, this movie could possibly the first to blur the line between the categories of real robots and super robots.. but I am not the most well-versed in roboturological matters here.

Had a go on the online game and Jaeger designer last night. Seems some of the blades are thermal and laced with CNTs too. Take that fluff as you will.

Hmm since their whole schtick is stopping toxic bleeding, I guess hot blades to make sense then. Maybe the ones we saw in the movie were hot, but just not to temperatures where they start to glow red hot.

What's a CNT?

[Zinegata]

Re: 20 Jaegers around the rift.

What if the Kaiju (which are shown to be pretty fast underwater) manage to simply evade the Jaegers, especially considering that Jaegers seem to require some boot-up time?. The problem with having all Jaegers at the breach itself is that if the Kaiju manage to evade them, then they can most likely get to the cities first and lay waste to them before the Jaegers can be heli-transported.

[Majin Gojira]

Had a go on the online game and Jaeger designer last night. Seems some of the blades are thermal and laced with CNTs too. Take that fluff as you will.

Hmm since their whole schtick is stopping toxic bleeding, I guess hot blades to make sense then. Maybe the ones we saw in the movie were hot, but just not to temperatures where they start to glow red hot.

What's a CNT?

Carbon Nano-Tubes, I think.