nBSG ep 4.19: "Daybreak" pt 1 Talkback (SPOILERS)

[Spanky The Dolphin]

Yeah, but my first thought was where the frak did they get all those cardboard boxes, is there a cardboard box factory ship in the fleet or what? Then again, I guess they were stored right next to the Admiral's everlasting booze supplies.

How big were they? Because the first thing that comes to mind is they had a bunch in storage to put the effects of dead crew members in. It is a warship after all.

They were about the size of regular file boxes, maybe a little smaller. There are probably lots of boxes folded up in some sort of deep storage, considering just how big a ship like Galactica is.

[Manus Celer Dei]

It's a small thing, but I liked how the black hole was just depicted as a stable, regular gravity source that things can be in orbit of rather than the magical pull-everything-in device they usually are in sci-fi.

Also, a time-travel end? Seriously? That'd be so out-of-the-fucking-blue I doubt it's even occured to the writers. It's that horrid an idea.

[Traveller]

-The CGI of Caprica City was nicely done

-Baltars flashback was supriseingly, not badly done.

-Roslins flashblack, does RDM not grasp the idea of excess angst? Out of the entire cast of dysfunctional incompetents that make up the BattleStar America Galactica, she is one of the few redeeming characters still alive. She has, cancer, is litterally on deaths door, has more or less single-handedly carried the weight of civillian gov't for four years, saw her govt and civilization nuked into dust, and has been one of the few decisive and consistent characters in a cast that spends the bulk of its energy fighting each other more than say, the enemy or actually careing about the predicment there in, and..RDM comes up with this. Just a little overkill there, nothing but a manipulative tear-jerker piece that serves little purpose.

-One of the Main cast FINALLY gets it. Balter cant be trusted, couple years late figureing that out. However, the scene with Lee was basically a throw-away since Baltars request was of no consequence and neither Lee or whats left of the story-line will suffer for it one way or another.

-I dont know if the irony was intentional, but, if your looking for volunteers for a rescue mission, would'nt it be prudent to NOT mention that it is probably a suicide mission? I mean, is it not the whole point of a rescue mission to you know, rescue someone? and by implication, bring them back. I know, its supposed to be a moment of gravis, dark, edgey all that, but if it was me, that speech would have me on the port side in no time flat. Also, given that there in the military(which by default involves danger) and there current situation, declaring a particular mission as 'suicidal'(ie dangerous) strikes me as being a little redundant. Of course, take everyone that matters with you. Loyalists, the president, ex-president? Roslin. Dont leave behind anyone with actual command authority witht the fleet. sigh

-Since the train-wreck is almost over, it may be of little value to point out continued Adama's lack of consistency to the very end. He declares there will be no rescue mission, then of course, does a complete 180 and decides there will be. An entire episode of fluff and filler when the only relevant plot movement is the set up for the big 'rescue'. Would it kill the writers just once to have them make a decision and actually stick to it, rather than this endless , No we Wont, Oh Ok, Yes we Will schtick?

[Agent Fisher]

Traveller, is your sole purpose here to rip on BSG for the most nitpicky things?

[JLTucker]

Just a little overkill there, nothing but a manipulative tear-jerker piece that serves little purpose.

How the fuck do you know it serves no purpose? We haven't seen the final episode. Her flashback scene could be important for that episode.

Edit: Also, Traveller, would it hurt you to actually use the english language properly when you make posts?

[Veramocor]

It's a small thing, but I liked how the black hole was just depicted as a stable, regular gravity source that things can be in orbit of rather than the magical pull-everything-in device they usually are in sci-fi.

Also, a time-travel end? Seriously? That'd be so out-of-the-fucking-blue I doubt it's even occured to the writers. It's that horrid an idea.

They referred to it as a naked singularity, so it is a little different than a black hole. It lacks an event horizon. Scientific American had an article on them a few months ago. One has never been observed and there is disagreement whether they can actually exist.

[CaptJodan]

-The CGI of Caprica City was nicely done

-Baltars flashback was supriseingly, not badly done.

Something good to say? Not much, though, really. Must just be trying to quell the voices who thought you voted 1 before the show was even 5 minutes into it.

Just a little overkill there, nothing but a manipulative tear-jerker piece that serves little purpose.

Already dealt with. It might, we don't know yet.

-One of the Main cast FINALLY gets it. Balter cant be trusted, couple years late figureing that out. However, the scene with Lee was basically a throw-away since Baltars request was of no consequence and neither Lee or whats left of the story-line will suffer for it one way or another.

That's right. Roslyn has trusted him all this...no...wait...there was that whole Hub thing. Well, I know that surely the Admiral has trust...no...no I'm pretty sure the Admiral has little trust for him either.

About the only thing different from their feelings and Lee's was that Lee said out loud what should have been said long ago. That's it. And it already brought a little pay dirt. First, Baltar realizes that Lee's right. Second, even though part of him wanted to go (looks like because of Caprica, really), he couldn't move his feet across the line, proving Lee's point (and again, even if he did I would wonder if it wasn't for just himself). But hey, you decided from the start that it had no effect on the story, so I guess we shouldn't expect you to notice the obvious.

-I dont know if the irony was intentional, but, if your looking for volunteers for a rescue mission, would'nt it be prudent to NOT mention that it is probably a suicide mission? I mean, is it not the whole point of a rescue mission to you know, rescue someone? and by implication, bring them back. I know, its supposed to be a moment of gravis, dark, edgey all that, but if it was me, that speech would have me on the port side in no time flat.

Adama was being straightforward with his crew, and with potential volunteers. You think he'd get more people by saying "this will be a difficult mission, but I believe it is attainable"? Why? The people in that hanger deck KNOW how fucked Galactica is. She's falling apart just gliding through space. The scuttlebutt about where Hera is wouldn't likely be contained for long. So you'd have an Admiral who was flat out LYING to his crew about their chances, and that sure as hell doesn't help you get volunteers.

It's beyond a shot in the dark, and the recon mission shows it to be almost more insane a task to complete. He wants the people who go to know what they are up against. They're going to try to get this girl back, it doesn't mean Adama really expects to succeed.

Also, given that there in the military(which by default involves danger) and there current situation, declaring a particular mission as 'suicidal'(ie dangerous) strikes me as being a little redundant.

No, it carries more weight. Suicidal in the context of their normal situation, which means "royally fucked".

Of course, take everyone that matters with you. Loyalists, the president, ex-president? Roslin. Dont leave behind anyone with actual command authority witht the fleet. sigh

Fucking download Firefox or preview your posts. This lack of proper spelling is getting old. As for your point, it's fair to a degree. I think its more in context with what I've said in the past. They trained new Viper pilots. They didn't seem to train anybody else. Doc Coddle is still indispensable to the fleet. There's no really reliable command staff that can take over fleet ops. But then, who cares? The Cylons said they'd follow Adama's orders, they didn't say anything about following anyone anyone lower on the totem pole.
-Tigh. Ain't staying even if Adama ordered him to. He wants nothing to do with the basestar. He's a given. He's also the only real replacement for Adama.
-Agathon. This is obvious. That leaves out the on-duty replacements. The next in line is Captain Kelly, who I didn't see on the starboard side, so he's probably senior, if he gets his ass out of the brig. But what can Captain Kelly do? Has he (or indeed anyone) any experience with fighting with a Basestar? He certainly doesn't have the gravitas to do it. Tigh's about the only real choice for that job, and that's been covered.

The government is a little iffy. Taking Roslyn is really neither here or there. She's not really governing anymore, so it doesn't matter whether she stays or goes. Lee should probably be staying, or otherwise appointing someone to run the government if they don't make it back. Maybe we'll see this in the next ep, I don't know.

-Since the train-wreck is almost over, it may be of little value to point out continued Adama's lack of consistency to the very end.

Little value to your points is probably my sentiments exactly, though you manage to make them anyway.

[tim31]

I enjoyed the flashbacks, but it goes without saying: this episode it not over yet.

Traveller, wander my friend... And stay there.

[Deathstalker]

5. Is it just too fanboyish of me to hope that Bulldog makes a comeback here as well?

The Deathstalker is with you.

I want to see Ty walking the flight deck, and seeing Bulldog strapping into a Viper.
"Bulldog! You up for this?"

"Hell yes Colonel! I owe them some payback!"

"Good Hunting."

"Thankyou sir."

Then I want Starbuck to bust his chops.
"You up for this old man?"


"I'll out fly your resurrected ass any day of the week, blondie."

[Phantasee]

Out of the entire cast of dysfunctional incompetents that make up the BattleStar America Galactica, she is one of the few redeeming characters still alive.

Everything else is covered already, but this is one thing that stuck out to me. What the hell does that mean? With the Battlestar America thing.

[Kane Starkiller]

A boring episode. I have to agree with Traveler that Roslin flashback was lame. Just how many times do we need to see something terrible happen to them, not only throughout the series but now even in flashbacks? It's like hearing a 100 miners in China died every few weeks, after a time you simply get desensitized and when you couple that with shoddy directing (honestly that scene with Roslin in the lake spreading her arms was just silly) it doesn't work out quite well.
Again nothing really happened, just the usual characters struggling with their usual demons, too much melodrama not enough sci-fi. I gave it 1 and if you don't like it feel free not to put it up as an option next time.


P.S. And the hybrid ranting? Jesus fucking Chirst that is some of the most annoying shit I have ever heard on TV. "The shape of dreams....remeber....end...face of the perfection...earth...bonds...." What the fuck? I honestly have to mute the fucking sound until the hybrid shit passes it's fucking embarrassing.

[CaptJodan]

Out of the entire cast of dysfunctional incompetents that make up the BattleStar America Galactica, she is one of the few redeeming characters still alive.

Everything else is covered already, but this is one thing that stuck out to me. What the hell does that mean? With the Battlestar America thing.

All I've got is that he thinks America is made up of dysfunctional incompetents. Otherwise, I have no idea.

[Skylon]

5. Is it just too fanboyish of me to hope that Bulldog makes a comeback here as well?

The Deathstalker is with you.

I want to see Ty walking the flight deck, and seeing Bulldog strapping into a Viper.
"Bulldog! You up for this?"

"Hell yes Colonel! I owe them some payback!"

"Good Hunting."

"Thankyou sir."

Then I want Starbuck to bust his chops.
"You up for this old man?"


"I'll out fly your resurrected ass any day of the week, blondie."

I sorta expected Bulldog to come back during the mutiny arc. But agreed, he should get to come back.

[Anguirus]

Is it immoral to rate an episode a 5 just because some dumbasses who haven't liked the show for five years if ever voted 1s?

It's about two years too late for me to care that you don't like the Hybrids, of all things.

[Kane Starkiller]

LOL if it bothers you that much PM the board and ask them to come in and vote "5". I thought the point of the thread with the poll was to rate the show and tell what you did or didn't like. As it happens this episode had nothing I liked.
I liked the first episodes, back when it was about running away from a superior enemy, the stress that was creating and a hope that various questions raised will have a logical, rational explanation.
When it started to be about metaphysical bullshit, cylon-human children and the dreams about them I started to loose interest. What's interesting is how the ever greater percentage of metaphysical bullshit in the story is accompanied by ever greater biological nature of the Cylons. All of the sudden Basestars are built out of Voyager's bio neural gel.
And yes I think that hybrids and their meaningless ranting is so fucking annoying I need to listen to a 10 minute compilation of Star Trek technobabble to get that shit out of my head.

What exactly happened in this episode? Kara is still struggling to find "the meaning" of the song, she plugs in Anders who spouts gibberish. Why is this song even relevant anymore? Wasn't it already revealed this was simply a switch to turn them on? What's important is who switched them on, how and where is the emitter located and how did they pick it up.
I know you will now say that we must wait till the final episode but that's too late. It will be rushed and it will fail. Just like this entire Cylon colony deal. So they were jumping for 5 years, running away from the Cylons and the Colonies, going "beyond the red line" but now after all that time they are apparently one Raptor jump away from the Cylon headquarters? This was of course necessary in order for them to manage to wrap shit up in two episodes. And I'll bet good money this is exactly how rushed the entire finale will feel like: 90% of the screen time taken up by angst, 5% by rushed and disappointing explanations, 5% by killing off the threads they couldn't be bothered to explain.
Look at the explanation for one of the more intriguing puzzles: how did the 13th tribe know the supernova will go off at the right moment in "Eye of Jupiter". Apparently Ellen Tigh was just lucky. Lame.

[weemadando]

This episode gets a 2 from me. There was not much worth watching in it. Gauis getting bawled out by Lee, Bill turning Doc Cottle away and Gauis showing his "mettle". That was really about it. Maybe as part of the larger arc it will be more, but it just felt like another episode where they were adding more and more and failing to answer anything existing so that when the time comes to wrap it up we'll have even more things for them to cram into that episode.

[Manus Celer Dei]

Look at the explanation for one of the more intriguing puzzles: how did the 13th tribe know the supernova will go off at the right moment in "Eye of Jupiter". Apparently Ellen Tigh was just lucky. Lame.

The 13th tribe didn't. Ellen already said that they had nothing to do with it and it must be the work of "God" or whatever the mysterious outside entity turns out to be.

[Anguirus]

Oh, it doesn't bother me, it was just a moral quandary. I didn't vote on this episode at all because I'm not sure where it's going, but I feel like rating the episode a 1 means you probably just don't like the show at all. Only the fact that it's the finale and there are still so many questions unanswered made me hesitate...the show was packed to the gills with great character beats.

Rating the ep a 1 before it's even over is just spam, of course.

[Stark]

Rating it 5 before it's over is spam, too.

I think you can rate an ep 1 without hating the whole show (even I wouldn't rate most of the nBSG I've seen as 1-bad). Finales have higher expecations and people can easily hate the way something ends.

[Gandalf]

^yep, gaius said fucking.

When?

Mum and I have watched it through a few times, and haven't heard it.

[JLTucker]

^yep, gaius said fucking.

When?

Mum and I have watched it through a few times, and haven't heard it.

He says "I need this... I need this like a fucking hole in the head".

[apocolypse]

-Since the train-wreck is almost over, it may be of little value to point out continued Adama's lack of consistency to the very end. He declares there will be no rescue mission, then of course, does a complete 180 and decides there will be. An entire episode of fluff and filler when the only relevant plot movement is the set up for the big 'rescue'. Would it kill the writers just once to have them make a decision and actually stick to it, rather than this endless , No we Wont, Oh Ok, Yes we Will schtick?

Adama addressed this in the episode. Since they previously had no idea where the colony/Hera was, sending ships out to look for her is rather pointless with space being, you know, big and all. But now they do have the coordinates for the colony, so a rescue op is now actually feasible.

[JME2]

Like others, I'm going to hold off commenting/judging the episode until next week when the second half airs, but it looks to be a hell of a finale.

[Stark]

He says "I need this... I need this like a fucking hole in the head".

Oh no; how will nerds look cool by using made-up, childish faux-swear words to advertise their brand loyalty NOW?

[charlemagne]

Oh no; how will nerds look cool by using made-up, childish faux-swear words to advertise their brand loyalty NOW?

Yeah well, it's really not that spectacular, there were a couple of instances where actors slipped into a "fuck" before. But besides that, I still think it's a nice idea to circumvent the stupid "oh noes no swearing on TV think of the children" mindset by just using a word that is clearly not "fuck", but sounds like it and is used just like it (which is of course not NeoBSGs "achievement", but it's still nice)

Regarding the flashbacks, I only really liked Baltar's and Caprica's flashback. That was the only one adding something really new to the characters. Kara and Lee - well, so they were happy and all before the holocaust or rather before Lee's brother died, who would have figured. Adama - no idea where that might be going, he was just sitting there in a suit and tie and protesting against doing something. Anders - will surely play directly into the two-parter, let's see where that is going. And Roslyn - that was just unnecessary. As if "you have cancer and will die soon" wasn't bad enough, there was really no need to add another layer of "oh the poor woman", and as someone else mentioned, the scene in the pool was just awful.

If you really have to go for pre-nuking flashbacks, you could've thought of something more interesting, maybe show how they smuggled Boomer into the colonial forces or something like that.

But the CGI of Caprica City was nice.