Master Chief vs Commander Shepard (Mass Effect)

[Norade]

You're serious? Wow. That is just... silly. So Halo is one of the few instances where game play actually can be used? Really though, that's just silly. It makes Grunts ridiculously durable and Marines laughably weak. Nevermind then. Master Chief gets his ass handed to him.

I think it might actually be slightly better than that, I think that is only used for the enemy where as easiest is used for MC and friends but it's 2am and I'm too lazy to google-fu up the quotes I need.

[Star Wars 888]

Dude, the pistol is probably the most powerful gun in ME1, and it handily defeats the armour on Armatures. With the right mods it's even cheesier.

Well, I rarely used pistols, but gameplay mechanics aren't canon.

[CaptHawkeye]

Then what are we supposed to use? The useless novelizations that no one read?

Game play mechanics are not face-value accurate but they can generally be used to imply certain aspects of a universe when other sources are absent.

[Stargazer]

The codex and the novels are the best sources for technical info on Mass Effect.

[adam_grif]

The codex and the novels are the best sources for technical info on Mass Effect.

Neither of which gives us much/any useful information about this scenario, unless you know something we don't.

[Star Wars 888]

In cutscenes kinetic barriers on personal armor fall to a single close range pistol shot, implying that they can take long range shots, glancing blows and shrapnel but not direct close range hits.

[CaptHawkeye]

Long range shots from what? Pistols again or other weapons?

[adam_grif]

In cutscenes kinetic barriers on personal armor fall to a single close range pistol shot, implying that they can take long range shots, glancing blows and shrapnel but not direct close range hits.

When was this? I can remember Saren getting blasted several times in cutscenes without shields failing, and I can remember Nihilus dying with one shot.But we have no idea if he had his barriers up or not since we didn't see anything.

Even using cutscenes in ME is suspect at best, especially after the Battle of the Citadel incident.

[DPDarkPrimus]

Even if we assume that it only takes one heavy pistol shot to drop kinetic barriers in ME, the force behind a single heavy pistol shot is going to be a lot more than the bullets that the MC is firing.

[adam_grif]

Even if we assume that it only takes one heavy pistol shot to drop kinetic barriers in ME, the force behind a single heavy pistol shot is going to be a lot more than the bullets that the MC is firing.

Quantifying this how exactly?

[Ritterin Sophia]

The codex and the novels are the best sources for technical info on Mass Effect.

Neither of which gives us much/any useful information about this scenario, unless you know something we don't.

I had heard that one of the novels describes a Krogan Battlemaster picking up and hurling a ~60-ton tank, with his mind.

[DPDarkPrimus]

Even if we assume that it only takes one heavy pistol shot to drop kinetic barriers in ME, the force behind a single heavy pistol shot is going to be a lot more than the bullets that the MC is firing.

Quantifying this how exactly?

Looking over codex entries, nothing explicit actually (thought there was a more detailed description), so nevermind.

[Highlord Laan]

Even if we assume that it only takes one heavy pistol shot to drop kinetic barriers in ME, the force behind a single heavy pistol shot is going to be a lot more than the bullets that the MC is firing.

Quantifying this how exactly?

Looking over codex entries, nothing explicit actually (thought there was a more detailed description), so nevermind.

So "handheld railguns" doesn't count as a qualifier?

[adam_grif]

So "handheld railguns" doesn't count as a qualifier?

No, because they tell us the mode of operation, not the actual energy imparted. This is exactly like the "which is heavier, a feather or a rock?" thing. You don't know, because you don't know the mass of either object. You can't just say "well gee, rocks are heavy, so the rock must be heavier", since you might be dealing with a feather made of iron or a rock that is 1mm in diameter.

I had heard that one of the novels describes a Krogan Battlemaster picking up and hurling a ~60-ton tank, with his mind.

Does the tank have operational shields? Is the Krogan more or less powerful than Shepard? Was the force great enough to smear MC across the sidewalk? etc etc etc...

The biggest problem we're going to run into is the total absence of a cannon policy for MEverse.

Also, I'm pretty sure MC can lift a 60 tonne tank with his mind in the games too, but he has to get pretty close

[Ritterin Sophia]

Does the tank have operational shields? Is the Krogan more or less powerful than Shepard? Was the force great enough to smear MC across the sidewalk? etc etc etc...

Can you at least attempt to apply reading comprehension when you read my posts? I never presented it as an argument, I presented it as what I had heard and waiting for someone to confirm or deny whether it was true. I was also misinformed, which is why I presented it as 'what I had heard' and not an authoritative opinion, it was a four-ton APC that he picked up and hurled in the prequel novel Mass Effect: Revelation. Said Krogan was a powerful biotic, but not exceptionally so since apparently in the mission where Anderson was paired with Saren for SPECTER selection he shot the Krogan point-blank in the head.

[adam_grif]

I never presented it as an argument,

Yep, and I was asking you for additional information, without which, this thing you just told us was basically irrelevant to the discussion.

Said Krogan was a powerful biotic, but not exceptionally so since apparently in the mission where Anderson was paired with Saren for SPECTER selection he shot the Krogan point-blank in the head.

Are you saying that if he was really powerful, Saren wouldn't have been able to shoot him in the head (because of barriers or w/e), or that if he was really powerful, Saren wouldn't have wanted to? The latter is a pretty weak inference, honestly.

[Ritterin Sophia]

or that if he was really powerful, Saren wouldn't have wanted to? The latter is a pretty weak inference, honestly.

Seriously, grif, fuck off. Where the fuck you come up with this bullshit I'll never know.

[adam_grif]

or that if he was really powerful, Saren wouldn't have wanted to? The latter is a pretty weak inference, honestly.

Seriously, grif, fuck off. Where the fuck you come up with this bullshit I'll never know.

What the shit are you talking about? You've given me absolutely no context. Who is the Krogan? Is he working with Saren? Is he working with Anderson? What's happening in the story? Which character did the shooting?

[Losonti Tokash]

I think it's fair to assume that when you have small arms that can shatter the bones in the arms of an ordinary human being, even after mass effect fields have dampened the recoil, those weapons might just have a bit more energy behind them than space-Vietnam assault rifles. Or at least comparable, which is enough for this scenario anyway.

[Star Wars 888]

In Thane's loyalty mission Thane's son dropped a krogan bodyguard in one pistol shot. Note that krogans were known to be heavy shock troopers with lots of armor and kinetic barriers.

[Ritterin Sophia]

or that if he was really powerful, Saren wouldn't have wanted to? The latter is a pretty weak inference, honestly.

Seriously, grif, fuck off. Where the fuck you come up with this bullshit I'll never know.

What the shit are you talking about? You've given me absolutely no context. Who is the Krogan? Is he working with Saren? Is he working with Anderson? What's happening in the story? Which character did the shooting?

No, I'm telling you to fuck off because I have no desire to converse with you because you're a moronic tryhard. This is what happened:

Me- I had heard rumors that the ME novels have some crazy shit like Krogan Battlemasters throwing tanks, can anyone confirm deny?
You- Well Schatten even though you've admitted you don't know the specifics I'm going to challenge them as if you're asserting it to be fact.
Me- Except I'm not presenting it as evidence, now back off.
You- Oh I knew you didn't weren't, but I asked you anyway. By the way I'm going to strawman what you said by insinuating you believe the Krogan should be able to mindfuck a SPECTER candidate.

All of your contentions were irrelevant anyhow. If a Krogan Battlemaster of not exceptional note could pick up a 60-ton tank and throw it (again I was misinformed which is why I didn't present it as a fact), his biotics have enough force to toss the >1-ton Master Chief around like a ragdoll all day. Whether it had a shield on or not is also irrelavent since Chief's shields have never shown the ability to block a physical attack that wasn't fired at supersonic velocities.

As it stands it remains irrelevant since 4-tons is still just under four times Master Chief's own mass in Mjolnir armor.

[DPDarkPrimus]

In Thane's loyalty mission Thane's son dropped a krogan bodyguard in one pistol shot. Note that krogans were known to be heavy shock troopers with lots of armor and kinetic barriers.

The krogen isn't necessarily dead, just incapacitated. I'm almost sure he's struggling a bit during the scene after he gets shot.

[Ford Prefect]

As it stands it remains irrelevant since 4-tons is still just under four times Master Chief's own mass in Mjolnir armor.

On the other hand, krogan are noted to be powerful biotics, whereas by implication most human biotics are pretty wimpy in comparison. On the other hand, a maxed out Lift skill can lift Colossi, but we don't really know how much Colossi mass, or how accurate that is outside of gameplay. Comparitively, a maxed out Throw is 1.25 kilonewtons going by the description, which is pretty significant.

[Black Admiral]

As it stands it remains irrelevant since 4-tons is still just under four times Master Chief's own mass in Mjolnir armor.

Actually, it's from 2 to 8 times John's mass; fully armoured SPARTAN-IIs have been tagged anywhere from 1/2 to 2 tons mass depending on where you look.

[Ritterin Sophia]

As it stands it remains irrelevant since 4-tons is still just under four times Master Chief's own mass in Mjolnir armor.

Actually, it's from 2 to 8 times John's mass; fully armoured SPARTAN-IIs have been tagged anywhere from 1/2 to 2 tons mass depending on where you look.

Which is why I went with the 1-ton Mjolnir that is most often used.