Terra Nova

[Kingmaker]

The Good: Miles Quaritch returns to fight more spectacularly dangerous megafauna.

The Bad: Teen age drama bullshit (this is a show about dinosaurs. I don't wan't awkward teens doing stupid shit because hormones or some shit). All around drooling stupidity on the part of the characters. Cost catastrophe atmosphere. Gaping plot holes.

I want to like this show, but so far it seems headed for shit. I give it a 4 out of 10, but with vast room for improvement.

[Lord Insanity]

I got the impression that most of the outer perimeter of the colony was blocked by natural terrain. The only avenue of approach was in range of the main gate guard towers. I thought that when the kids sneaked out they waited till they had a window of no one looking their way. I did not think it was odd they let those giant plant eaters past the choke point and wander around the fence because they are plant eaters helping to "weed" the jungle. I didn't see any dinosaurs small enough to fit through the gaps in the fence either. (Obviously "everyone" knows dinosaurs are "big".) I mean really it sounds like some of you are looking for a level of realism that "normal" shows like cop dramas don't even adhere too.

Frankly I thought them screwing up the fact that the CO2 levels during the time of the dinosaurs were 5-10 times higher than today was far more serious an oversight. It is especially funny when you look at their "global warming doomsday" future setting. (Yes I know that there are lots of other pollutants that wouldn't be present but they were making a big deal about adjusting to lower CO2 levels)

[Meest]

That's what the convenient alternate timeline is for, even makes centipedes tame, and allows them to think of wind power but not chain link fence or ordinance that can handle big animals. Oh yeah and screening criminals and simple security measures like restricted areas and vehicle access.

[Lord Insanity]

Hmm about that alternate timeline... Spoiler

What if the big conspiracy that is going on with the "sixers" and those calculations carved on the rocks is that there isn't an alternate timeline and they actually are affecting the future. Certain factions may be trying to do this toward specific end goals. The whole "alternate timeline" is just the PR spin for the masses. That would be interesting and provide for more "future setting" material too. Of course that would likely only further insult the intelligence of certain members of the board whose areas of expertise was... crapped upon.

[bilateralrope]

Hmm about that alternate timeline... Spoiler

What if the big conspiracy that is going on with the "sixers" and those calculations carved on the rocks is that there isn't an alternate timeline and they actually are affecting the future. Certain factions may be trying to do this toward specific end goals. The whole "alternate timeline" is just the PR spin for the masses. That would be interesting and provide for more "future setting" material too. Of course that would likely only further insult the intelligence of certain members of the board whose areas of expertise was... crapped upon.

I don't think speculation needs spoiler tags. But since I'm replying to something in spoiler tags, my post gets them.
Spoiler

Their only proof for the alternate timeline is a probe they sent back but couldn't find in the future. A tiny object that would be very hard to find, since it had enough time to travel the world. An object made of metal in a settlement where metal is in short supply. An object kept out in the open so it takes maximum damage from the weather.

Short of sticking it in orbit (and hoping the orbit is stable enough to survive collisions), is there any way to make an object that would last that long ?

[Moby Halcyon]

I don't think speculation needs spoiler tags. But since I'm replying to something in spoiler tags, my post gets them.
Spoiler

Their only proof for the alternate timeline is a probe they sent back but couldn't find in the future. A tiny object that would be very hard to find, since it had enough time to travel the world. An object made of metal in a settlement where metal is in short supply. An object kept out in the open so it takes maximum damage from the weather.

Short of sticking it in orbit (and hoping the orbit is stable enough to survive collisions), is there any way to make an object that would last that long ?

Spoiler

I thought the Sixer leader covered that at the end of the episode when she was expositing about the carvings and Taylor's son. She said something to the effect of 'you control the past, you control the future'. I think it's pretty obvious they'll set up an eventual plot of the Sixers being relative good guys and Quaritch ending up being in a conspiracy with the future government, using Jason O'Mara's character to root out the Sixers.

[FaxModem1]

Here's a question. Is hooch banned on Terra Nova? If yes, why not just hide the still in the teen house, seeing as how they all live together and don't have anyone else who might come upon it?

If no, why risk your lives every day for something that could be stepped on by dinosaurs?

Seriously, they could just hide the thing in their house's equivalent of a closet. I seriously doubt every house is getting weekly inspections to make sure no one is holding contraband.

[Skgoa]

Frankly I thought them screwing up the fact that the CO2 levels during the time of the dinosaurs were 5-10 times higher than today was far more serious an oversight. It is especially funny when you look at their "global warming doomsday" future setting. (Yes I know that there are lots of other pollutants that wouldn't be present but they were making a big deal about adjusting to lower CO2 levels)

How did you manage to miss the whole "earth is a poluted wasteland" angle? CO2 is higher in the future; the polution is so bad you can't even see the moon.

[bilateralrope]

I don't think speculation needs spoiler tags. But since I'm replying to something in spoiler tags, my post gets them.
Spoiler

Their only proof for the alternate timeline is a probe they sent back but couldn't find in the future. A tiny object that would be very hard to find, since it had enough time to travel the world. An object made of metal in a settlement where metal is in short supply. An object kept out in the open so it takes maximum damage from the weather.

Short of sticking it in orbit (and hoping the orbit is stable enough to survive collisions), is there any way to make an object that would last that long ?

Spoiler

I thought the Sixer leader covered that at the end of the episode when she was expositing about the carvings and Taylor's son. She said something to the effect of 'you control the past, you control the future'. I think it's pretty obvious they'll set up an eventual plot of the Sixers being relative good guys and Quaritch ending up being in a conspiracy with the future government, using Jason O'Mara's character to root out the Sixers.

I don't think we have proof either way. The closest we have for proof of an alternative timeline is a probe which I can't see surviving long enough to be useful. For it being the same timeline, we only have one sixer saying what she believes someone living alone in a jungle is doing.

[Themightytom]

why risk your lives every day for something that could be stepped on by dinosaurs?

I think the whole thrust of this sub plot was to show that teenagers don't understand how dangerous it is Outside The Gates. They also really didn't need to jump down a sixty foot water fall, and steal a car, but they did it anyway. it was like a complete cliche of Americana, as a matter of fact, I was waiting for them to bash Fred Flinstone's mailbox, and leave flaming poo at Arther Dent's door.

By the way the teenagers were pretty proficient with those firearms, I was thinking the whole time, if they effed up once, and bullets ricocheted INSIDE the car it would get really messy fast. I was curious as to why the Sixers weren't packing ammunition that would be effective against even relatively small dinosaurs.

[Lord Insanity]

Frankly I thought them screwing up the fact that the CO2 levels during the time of the dinosaurs were 5-10 times higher than today was far more serious an oversight. It is especially funny when you look at their "global warming doomsday" future setting. (Yes I know that there are lots of other pollutants that wouldn't be present but they were making a big deal about adjusting to lower CO2 levels)

How did you manage to miss the whole "earth is a poluted wasteland" angle? CO2 is higher in the future; the polution is so bad you can't even see the moon.

Let's fix this shall we.

Frankly I thought them screwing up the fact that the CO2 levels during the time of the dinosaurs were 5-10 times higher than today was far more serious an oversight. It is especially funny when you look at their "global warming doomsday" future setting. (Yes I know that there are lots of other pollutants that wouldn't be present but they were making a big deal about adjusting to lower CO2 levels)

How did you manage to miss the whole "earth is a polluted wasteland" angle? CO2 is higher in the future; the pollution is so bad you can't even see the moon.

[Ahriman238]

Saw it.

Overall I liked it. After reading the posts here I was expecting something like a waist-high white picket fence around the base. What they have is...acceptable. It'll stop most things of a dangerous size (i.e. bigger than a squirrel) and seems sturdy enough to stand up to all but the really big dinos. Plus there are regular towers with some sort of sonic cannon. My only true complaint is that there's a hole the kids can crawl through under the fence, shouldn't there be regular patrols against that sort of thing? That and the lack of defense-in-depth. And they let the brachiosaurs just wander up to the fence. I know they're herbivores, but they could probably take out most of a section with one flick of their tails. It's fine for a facility that's been there a year or less, but after seven years this is what base security looks like? Man, Quartch, you've really let yourself go. You used to be such a fanatic about keeping your people safe.

And yes, the base commander is played by the same actor who was Quartch in Avatar. +1 awesomeness. I thought he was when I heard the voice and saw him from behind, said no when I saw his face, then looked it up because it bugged me so much.

It worked pretty well as a pilot. It introduced the family and main characters, the situation, the enemies, and had a couple of plot hooks. Quartch's son is living on his own in the jungle, doing maths and leaving them as writing on the wall, that apparently contains the secrets of the universe? My mind is blown, not in a particularly good way.

Also, am I the only one who thought it a little odd that Quartch takes Shannon into his confidence, just because he tackled the shooter? When he knows there's a conspiracy in the future? Granted, the conspiracy that sent an entire pilgramage of their own probably wouldn't need to send a barely-made-it stowaway, but still. It's like watching every bad undercover cop movie all over again.

Stupid teenagers are stupid and have no impulse control. I'm suprised. Is anyone else suprised?

How they pick the people who go to Terra Nova anyway? Quartch said the bottom-line was useful skills, but when he tells Shannon about the Sixers he says 'Someone found a way to rig the lottery.' One implies careful selection of candidates, ideally those with families, one implies random chance.

I am seriously unimpressed by the 'max security' time machine. There are a lot more guards sort of milling about, but I've seen more secure airports.

And yes, they way they know Terra Nova is an alternate timeline is that they sent back a beacon with a super-powerful locating beacon that would positively, absolutely survive the ensuing millions of years, geologic instability, elements, war etc. Right. Does anyone else htink it will eventually be a major plot point that this super-powerful, global-range location beacon is in the center of their town?

I like that they actually have to cope with diseases that aren't around in the modern era.

[CaptainChewbacca]

It seemed like there were 2 kinds of colonists; Skilled workers and healthy laborers. I imagine the laborers are the lotto-winners. It makes sense, too. Giving off resettlement prizes placates the population, because people keep believing they might win. If it was only certain people, those who were never going to go to TN might riot.

[Ahriman238]

It seemed like there were 2 kinds of colonists; Skilled workers and healthy laborers. I imagine the laborers are the lotto-winners. It makes sense, too. Giving off resettlement prizes placates the population, because people keep believing they might win. If it was only certain people, those who were never going to go to TN might riot.

Right, that makes sense.

So, unless the sixth wave of colonists was much bigger, or Terra Nova has been killing the colonists off really quickly, TN should have a huge numerical advantage over the Sixers. They may or may not know where the Sixer camp is, but they say the Sixers have occupied the quarry, why not bring some of the vehicles and security guys and dig them out?

[Meest]

Saw it.

Overall I liked it.

Applaud you for still liking it after all you listed, your tolerance levels are much higher than mine.

[Wing Commander MAD]

It seemed like there were 2 kinds of colonists; Skilled workers and healthy laborers. I imagine the laborers are the lotto-winners. It makes sense, too. Giving off resettlement prizes placates the population, because people keep believing they might win. If it was only certain people, those who were never going to go to TN might riot.

Right, that makes sense.

So, unless the sixth wave of colonists was much bigger, or Terra Nova has been killing the colonists off really quickly, TN should have a huge numerical advantage over the Sixers. They may or may not know where the Sixer camp is, but they say the Sixers have occupied the quarry, why not bring some of the vehicles and security guys and dig them out?

It could be that they lack the manpower to garrison the quarry. Chasing away the Sixers doesn't do any real good unless you can maintain a pressence at the quarry. They may also lack the manpower to assault the quarry and maintain normal operations at Terra Nova. The Carnotaurus attack showed they have workers outside the facility at least some of the times. We also don't know the ratio of laborers/skilled workers to security personnel. It may very well be that colony is in precarious enough straits that any kind of sustained interruption to normal operations may cause major problems outweighing any gain from dealing a blow to the Sixers and acquring a source of iron.

[Kingmaker]

One thing that would make sense for them to have that they don't is drones. They're not nearly as a large as any manned aircraft, so you could plausibly get them through the stargate, and it would give the colony some aerial surveillance capabilities. Granted, with how dense the jungle is, they'll only be useful in limited ways, but there are still plenty of wide open areas that it would be useful to observe without needing to climb a mountain to do so.

Stupid teenagers are stupid and have no impulse control. I'm suprised. Is anyone else suprised?

Frankly, yes. I get the impression that Terra Nova does not exactly have a lot of slack carrying capacity or spare labor. I would expect that all able-bodied individuals would have Shit To Do that would preclude them from faffing about in the jungle all day (and some of them allegedly do).

As far as guns go: during the planning stage back on Earth, did nobody go "Hey! Fucking dinosaurs! Maybe we ought to pack some Really Big Guns. Ya know, just in case." Granted, the murderaptors or whatever seemed to be arbitrarily resistant to bullets. I'm pretty sure if you hosed down a creature that size with a few dozen 5.56mm it would probably die. Or at least fuck off to find something less belligerent to eat.

[NecronLord]

Overall I liked it. After reading the posts here I was expecting something like a waist-high white picket fence around the base. What they have is...acceptable. It'll stop most things of a dangerous size (i.e. bigger than a squirrel) and seems sturdy enough to stand up to all but the really big dinos.

We have literally solid evidence that Velociraptors took (attempted to?) prey up to the size of human children.

Something like this would probably provide superior defence against dinosaurs of all sizes.

[lordofchange13]

Has any one determined the nature of the weird glowie geonosian like canons they used on the large dinosaur, or the green "plasma" guns used to save the stupid teenagers?

[Ahriman238]

One thing that would make sense for them to have that they don't is drones. They're not nearly as a large as any manned aircraft, so you could plausibly get them through the stargate, and it would give the colony some aerial surveillance capabilities. Granted, with how dense the jungle is, they'll only be useful in limited ways, but there are still plenty of wide open areas that it would be useful to observe without needing to climb a mountain to do so.

Stupid teenagers are stupid and have no impulse control. I'm suprised. Is anyone else suprised?

Frankly, yes. I get the impression that Terra Nova does not exactly have a lot of slack carrying capacity or spare labor. I would expect that all able-bodied individuals would have Shit To Do that would preclude them from faffing about in the jungle all day (and some of them allegedly do).

As far as guns go: during the planning stage back on Earth, did nobody go "Hey! Fucking dinosaurs! Maybe we ought to pack some Really Big Guns. Ya know, just in case." Granted, the murderaptors or whatever seemed to be arbitrarily resistant to bullets. I'm pretty sure if you hosed down a creature that size with a few dozen 5.56mm it would probably die. Or at least fuck off to find something less belligerent to eat.

They do have jobs, but they seem to be working on the modern-day eight hour shifts. You'd think, having been robbed by Sixers at least twice, the authorities would have noticed a missing vehicle before nightfall.

The Sixer trucks had a pintle-mount heavy machine gun of some type. It's hard to say, since it looked like the same prop as the 'sonic cannon' of the towers. That's going to drive me slightly nuts.

What they said is 'aim for the soft underbellies, otherwise our tranqs can't penetrate their hides.' Which raises its own questions. Why are they bringing tranquilizers on this rescue mission? Do they expect the kids to bolt? Why did they bring tranqs through the portal in the first place? I can't imagine them being much use against T-Rex or other megafauna, and they'd probably kill the smallest dinos, unless you have a wide variety of dosages on hand, and why go to so much trouble to preserve the lives of the dinosaurs?

[lordofchange13]

It seemed like there were 2 kinds of colonists; Skilled workers and healthy laborers. I imagine the laborers are the lotto-winners. It makes sense, too. Giving off resettlement prizes placates the population, because people keep believing they might win. If it was only certain people, those who were never going to go to TN might riot.

Right, that makes sense.

So, unless the sixth wave of colonists was much bigger, or Terra Nova has been killing the colonists off really quickly, TN should have a huge numerical advantage over the Sixers. They may or may not know where the Sixer camp is, but they say the Sixers have occupied the quarry, why not bring some of the vehicles and security guys and dig them out?

the TN'ers don't seem to have any heavy vehicle-mounted weapons. Plus the Sixers probably have desihned their base to actually be effectively defended by a small number of troops, and the quarry is the Sixers only real known assets so they probably want make it easy o them.

[Ahriman238]

Overall I liked it. After reading the posts here I was expecting something like a waist-high white picket fence around the base. What they have is...acceptable. It'll stop most things of a dangerous size (i.e. bigger than a squirrel) and seems sturdy enough to stand up to all but the really big dinos.

We have literally solid evidence that Velociraptors took (attempted to?) prey up to the size of human children.

Something like this would probably provide superior defence against dinosaurs of all sizes.

I could see that possibly forcing its head between the logs, or reaching an arm inside, but what good would that do it? I agree, that would be a lot more secure, I'm a bit disappointed, as I mentioned, that they'd been here seven years and don't have a lot more defense in depth.

Has any one determined the nature of the weird glowie geonosian like canons they used on the large dinosaur, or the green "plasma" guns used to save the stupid teenagers?

They call the tower guns sonic cannon (and mention a sonic mine earlier) the guns were just guns, or maybe tranqs which is what they were called once but makes no sense. The green beams were just targeting lasers.

[weemadando]

Overall I liked it. After reading the posts here I was expecting something like a waist-high white picket fence around the base. What they have is...acceptable. It'll stop most things of a dangerous size (i.e. bigger than a squirrel) and seems sturdy enough to stand up to all but the really big dinos.

We have literally solid evidence that Velociraptors took (attempted to?) prey up to the size of human children.

Something like this would probably provide superior defence against dinosaurs of all sizes.

I could see that possibly forcing its head between the logs, or reaching an arm inside, but what good would that do it? I agree, that would be a lot more secure, I'm a bit disappointed, as I mentioned, that they'd been here seven years and don't have a lot more defense in depth.

Are you kidding? Look at how porous that fence is.

Not to mention shit like this where they could CLEARLY climb the tree next to the fence and drop straight in.

[Flagg]

Velociraptors weren't even in that part of the world 85 million years ago (they weren't even around 85 million years ago) assuming the portal takes them to roughly the same geographical area (Chicago). This is supported by mention of North American species such as Allosaurus being mentioned.

[Wing Commander MAD]

Velociraptors weren't even in that part of the world 85 million years ago (they weren't even around 85 million years ago) assuming the portal takes them to roughly the same geographical area (Chicago). This is supported by mention of North American species such as Allosaurus being mentioned.

They seem to be playing fast and loose with the dinosaurs. Allosaurus and Brachiasaurus are both native to N. America and from the Late Jurassic period, while Carnotaurus is native to S. America and from the Late Cretaceous. I imagine we'll see whatever the writers think are cool, with only inhibitor to that being them trying to avoid cliches.