B5tech plagiarized.....

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-02-18 07:49pm

Wait, he's threatening you with legal action? And that's after you've already informed him of persuing legal action?

As someone who has had their own work plagerised, I just have to ask: What the fuck is wrong with some people? What the fucking hell with just admitting you're wrong?

Fuck, this is what I hate about the internet. People think that it gives them the right to do whatever the fuck they want.

God damn it...

Post by **Colonel Olrik** » 2003-02-18 07:50pm

ROFTLMAO!!

The guy is a delusional maniac!

Also, he's giving brits a bad name.

Kill it!

Isil`Zha · Post by **Isil`Zha** » 2003-02-18 07:59pm

BUHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I say you keep the board there as a reminder what happens to plagerists, even after it's all through. Speaking about his site, and have a section on a message board about it is free speech. Plagerizing is not.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-02-18 08:01pm

Also, a reminder that all Babylon 5 information on all websites, in all publications and other media is sourced originally, from the mind and pen of Joe Michael Straczynski, only he has all rights (copyrights and otherwise) over the Babylon 5 universe.

This fucking idiot obviously does not understand the distinction between fair use and plagiarism. I recommend that he be forced to read my Stilgar Hate Mail page, which goes into some detail on the subject.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2003-02-18 08:01pm

Why the fuck should you have to remove all references? As Isil`Zha said, saying how they're a bunch of plagerizing assholes in legal and exercising freedom of speech. Stealing an entire website as your own is not.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-02-18 08:03pm

BrandonBray wrote:What do you all think of that?

I think this guy is a complete tool and a dumbass to boot. No doubt his own stupidity will ruin him sooner or later. I'd simply let him know you'r not fazed because he has no legal leg to stand on and I highly doubt he has a lawyer or any crap like that.

I must say your site was one of the first B5tech sites I've encountered and while I don't eager with every thing on your site I think plagarizing it so blatantly is a slap in the face to the entire B5 community. You put a lot of hard work into that site as well as aa great deal of passion, I'm sure, and it was a shitty thing of him to do. I certainly hope his site is shut down for good.

Isil`Zha · Post by **Isil`Zha** » 2003-02-18 08:03pm

Grand Admiral Thrawn wrote:Why the fuck should you have to remove all references? As Isil`Zha said, saying how they're a bunch of plagerizing assholes in legal and exercising freedom of speech. Stealing an entire website as your own is not.

It's also completely true, and undeniable in any way.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-02-18 08:06pm

I also like the part where he says he's simply deleting all the hate mail unread. I guess that's one way of addressing the criticism

Talloway · Post by **Talloway** » 2003-02-18 08:13pm

Dare him to sue you, and then tell him you will counterclaim. If he really has a solicitor (incidentally, did you know you need two lawyers to sue in Britain? And people gripe about US legal fees) he'll know he can't sue you without giving you the opportunity to claim against him for the copyright infringement. And since he doesn't have a legal leg to stand on (the suit would be pretty frivolous) and all he would be doing was to "force" you to counterclaim rather than lose the claim, he should back down if he has a lick of sense.

As long as you've got the bigger stick, might as well wave it around a little.

BrandonBray · Post by **BrandonBray** » 2003-02-18 08:39pm

Okay guys, here is what I wrote our dear, dear friends at DracoAlliance.

Dear Sir,

>Ok, I have apologised, you cannot accept.

How can/could any apology be accepted when you were still broadcasting the stolen website in question?

>I have passed this matter over to one of our members today
>and they been to my house and removed the problem.

Removed or moved? There are now quite a bit of accusations, given your prior letter, that you have simply moved the stolen material and pass worded access to it. Is this the case?

>I have tried to be diplomatic with you and correct this mistake
>in a polite manner, my mistake was trying to be diplomatic
>with an American, oh boy!

If you had tried to correct the problem, the fake version of my website would not still have been posted as of February 18, 2003. It was. As such, your attempts seemed quite disingenuous. But, thank-you very much for proving yourself to be an intolerant racist and xenophobe.

>am I sorry for that, but hey, you do not request or need
>apologies and you are obviously not decent enough to simply
>accept one.

Considering you are the one who is a liar (the stolen site was still up, despite claims that it was not, and you originally claimed the stolen material to be your own property), and the fact that you stole my entire website to begin with, took no responsibility for your actions in that you passed the blame onto an unknown third party and, then, came to asked for forgiveness while at your website posted a laundry list of reasons to justify your behavior in the first place… does not make for a creditable and genuine apology.

Also, given the fact that I and the other forum owners you have stolen from where the people harmed by your actions, to now bellyache over the fact you do not feel you have been treated well by the people whom you stole from, plays like bad comedy; your attempts to gain sympathy are transparent and imply you wish to be absolved of any responsibility for what has transpired. You will find no sympathy from myself, and I doubt you will find sympathy from the people whom you have wronged, nor those who have been witness to your actions.

>I am sure you are not representant of all Americans,
>I have met some decent ones, but you do seem to fit in
>nicely with the War mongering label given to your
>country by the rest of the world.

Again, you illustrate your racism in the boorish statement above and your misrepresentation of the facts above, callously neglecting the fact that your own nation and Prime Minister is standing shoulder-to-shoulder with the United States, further demonstrates your intellectual dishonesty.

>I am British, from the United Kingdom (see there is a
>world outside the US) and I will now stand down, but
>will instigate the following because of your attitude to
>my diplomacy.

Diplomacy? You steal from others, then expect your victims to be “diplomatic” when dealing with you? Would you be “diplomatic” with someone who burgled your home? Spare me your moral rationalizations. Oh, and given that the B5TECH forum represents people numerous countries, your assertion that I am myopic in my view of the world, is wholly inaccurate.

>You have now had your say, you have made your threats,
>now it is my turn.

I have made no threats against your person – I have simply stated my exact intentions and postulated as to the outcome of any actions taken. Also, the letters I told you I was going to send, were sent. They were not threats, they were statements as to what actions I was going to take, given the your theft and failure to rectify the matter.

>Firstly, I am not a fool, please do not take me for one.

Though you clearly seem to consider me one and acted in such a manner as to support this assertion?

>I have made sure that your demands have been met, you
>will now return the favour, by taking on board the following
>and acting accordingly.

Though compliance came after the required deadline and only after I made clear to you that I would not simply allow you to continue your intellectual rape of my website and work, nor those of the many other websites whom you have robbed.

>1) You will remove all references to Draco Alliance from
>your website, including your forum within one week (that's
>7 days). Failure to do so will result in Legal action being
>taken by my solicitor (that's a Lawyer by the way) against you
>as your site is your responsibility.

Firstly, I will be happy to remove any reference to your website from my own. Secondly, the forum is a public forum and to remove comments from there would violate the freedom of speech rights of others, irrespective of the country they live in, and would also violate the forum rules for posting at the B5TECH message board. Also, comments about your actions can be found on websites all across the Internet now. This being the case, I will not abridge the freedom of speech rights, as provided under the United States Constitution. If you would like to spend your money to begin legal proceedings, please feel free to do so.

>2) All email received from people with reference to your
>site (regardless of there origin) from 19th February 2003
>and including your response, will be filed and then
>forwarded to my solicitor, for him to deal with at the end
>of the one week period. You are responsible for the actions
>of these people, because of the requests you made on your
>website.

By law, I needn’t send you any personal items, effects, or copies of correspondence unless so ordered to do so by a court of law, under subpoena. Should your legal council choose to send me a subpoena, filed through an American court via whatever legal channels exist between our two countries, you may direct said subpoena to be mailed to me at:

ADDRESS REMOVED

>3) As from 00.00GMT on 19th February 2003, all references
>to Draco Alliance on your website will be copied and filed
>and then forwarded to my solicitor, for him to deal with at
>the end of the one week period.

As stated above, I am more than happy to remove any reference to your plagiarized copy of my own website. Given the debates in the B5TECH message board are all part of on-going debates and discussions, protected under the forum’s posting guidelines and is an issue of freedom on speech, they will remain. Also, as I have no power over statements being made at other forums by other persons, I have no power to have any of those posts removed.

>I now suggest that you comply as I did with you. I told you
>that I did not know a lot about the Internet, today I learnt
>what a powerful weapon it can be.

The Internet is not a weapon, but a tool – a public form for the exchange of ideas – which you abused in your outright plagiarism of my site, and several others. Using this tool you inflicted harm upon others and, in response, people demanded you remedy the situation. If, indeed, you have removed any/all of the stolen content from B5TECH and the many other websites you stole from, then this issue may now be laid to rest.

>Thank you for your reply and I am sorry to have wasted
>your time (and mine).

You assume your letter to be waste of my time. Not at all. You did the right thing (after a fashion), and I will let it be known that you did (eventually), do the right thing.

>I thank God for giving us the Atlantic ... you should do
>the same.

I will assume that was not meant as a threat against my physical person. As for the legal issues noted above, you may feel free to take whatever legal actions you feel might be available to you.

Sincerely,
Brandon M. Bray
www.b5tech.com

So, I do good?

Eh Mike - my Master - what do you think about all this legal crap and how I've handled it?

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-02-18 08:46pm

I think you can interptret that last comment as a physical threat, just to let you know.

Isil`Zha · Post by **Isil`Zha** » 2003-02-18 08:52pm

Looks good, you have hundereds of witnesses (if not thousands...) as to his blatnent plagerization (is that a word?) of your site in its entirety. If he does actually pursue legal action, once it commences, reality will come crashing down on him like a giant hammer - or not, and the fool will take a mighty blow to his worth, all over something so simple - just remove all plagerized work with no questions asked.

BrandonBray · Post by **BrandonBray** » 2003-02-18 09:10pm

Dear Friends,

It would seem we now have achieved victory (I hope). As some of you might have noticed, the content of B5TECH.com, the Lurkers Guide, ISN News, and B5TV.com have been removed from the domain, dracoalliance.com.

Is this the end, however?

We know from letters sent to my site by the owners/operators of the DracoAlliance, that they had planned to simply password the site. Is its disappearance temporary? Will it just return, hidden behind a password?

And what of those sites that are still being plagiarized by the DracoAlliance – like Star Trek Australia and their CGI images being offered by the DracoAlliance which are not being credited?

Is this the end? Will they do the right thing and remove all the material they have stolen from others, as they appear to have done for us here at B5TECH? Will they? Or will this simply all happen again?

I hope and pray it does not.

The fact that you all stood up to help me, and all the other websites which were plagiarized, touches me deeply. It didn’t matter if we were 5ers, Lurkers, Trekkies or Warsies; if we frequented Stardestroyer.net, B5Tech.com or SpaceBattles.com… people came together to right an obvious wrong and, for this I cannot thank you all enough. You all have my thanks, and you have my respect.

Isil`Zha · Post by **Isil`Zha** » 2003-02-18 09:11pm

You can be sure plenty of people will keep an eye or two on it to make sure it doesn't just come back at a later date.

BrandonBray · Post by **BrandonBray** » 2003-02-18 09:15pm

Thanks Isil`Zha.

FaxModem1 · Post by **FaxModem1** » 2003-02-18 10:34pm

Brandon Bray
Did I come too late, I wanted to help, and it seems the battle has ended before I hae even arrived, if there is anything more you want me to do, simply email me and I will help to the best of my ability

Ted C · Post by **Ted C** » 2003-02-18 10:34pm

BrandonBray wrote:That is exactly what everyone else thinks - that he has moved the stolen website to a new area and just plans on re-opening it later behind a password.

Here is a copy of what he wrote to me today... wait until you read this...

*snip*

What do you all think of that?

I think he's blowing smoke. Your references to his site are perfectly legal; he plagiarized you and you publicized it. You are not responsible for the actions of people who read your site. You are not required to remove any true information from your site. Let him sue you; you'll clean his clock in the countersuit (if he can find a "solicitor" dumb enough to take the case).

If you want to be nice, thank him for taking down the site, tell him you expect it to stay down, and explain that you hope to never hear any more about it.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-02-18 11:26pm

This person is a complete idiot.

Slander is a public accusation which is demonstrably untrue. For example, accusing someone of stalking you is actually slander unless you can show that it's true. However, PlagiarAlliance seems to think that slander is simply saying something negative about a person (a common misconception among idiots). Pity for him the law disagrees.

Similarly, plagiarism is unlawful duplication. We must keep the definitions of copyright in mind; any form of duplication is unlawful by default unless it can be shown that there was A) written consent or B) fair use. The definitions of fair use as somewhat complex (see my Stilgar Hate Mail page for more details), but suffice to say that duplication without massive alteration of intent and/or content is not fair use. PlagiarAlliance seems to think that "fair use" simply means "it's OK to copy whatever you want". Pity for him the law disagrees.

May he contract genital warts.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2003-02-19 12:13am

Fuck him. I REALLY hope he meets some B5Tech fans at a con this year.

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2003-02-19 01:08am

Darth Wong wrote:This person is a complete idiot.

Slander is a public accusation which is demonstrably untrue. For example, accusing someone of stalking you is actually slander unless you can show that it's true. However, PlagiarAlliance seems to think that slander is simply saying something negative about a person (a common misconception among idiots). Pity for him the law disagrees.

Similarly, plagiarism is unlawful duplication. We must keep the definitions of copyright in mind; any form of duplication is unlawful by default unless it can be shown that there was A) written consent or B) fair use. The definitions of fair use as somewhat complex (see my Stilgar Hate Mail page for more details), but suffice to say that duplication without massive alteration of intent and/or content is not fair use. PlagiarAlliance seems to think that "fair use" simply means "it's OK to copy whatever you want". Pity for him the law disagrees.

May he contract genital warts.

Does this bring any flashbacks of having to deal with Stilgar?

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2003-02-19 01:21am

What an asshole! I can't believe his response was full of personal insults and legal threats to remove the references to his site from YOURS. I would strongly recommend not bothering with that for an instant. This guy deserves what he gets. He's not only a jerk, but also an idiot and a coward. Don't take him seriously.

SpacedTeddyBear · Post by **SpacedTeddyBear** » 2003-02-19 01:49am

As Londo once said, " Arrogance and stupidity all in one package, how efficient of you."

BrandonBray · Post by **BrandonBray** » 2003-02-19 02:38am

This guy is not only still threatening to sue me, but now is appears as if he is threatening to KILL me.

In his last e-mail, he said that he was once in the military, that he knows people in certain places, that he worked for certain organizations he cannot name, and suggested he was going to have me killed.

...

No.

I’m serious.

Killed.

Isn’t that illegal? If not illegal, it is defiantly sounds like the statement of a deranged person.

Oh, and I've taken a look through out the b.board at B5TECH, and I cannot really find anything that would be considered slander. As a matter of fact, nothing said was un-true in the context of what happened.

Yes he still wants me to remove all reference to his website and his recent actions.

Now, I did remove reference from B5TECH - but I was planning on doing that anyway. The last thing I want to do, is have B5TECH advertising for this nut.

As for the b.board... unless there is a case for slander, I just don't see how this guy can force me to remove any content from my own b.board, or force me to stop people from talking about what happened.

If I'm wrong - by all means - let me know, guys.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-02-19 02:57am

You know have more amutition then you need.

He has just made an implied threat on your life.

Post by **Dalton** » 2003-02-19 02:58am

You're not wrong at all. In fact, he seems to be trying to bully you into compliance because he knows how RIGHT you are.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

B5tech plagiarized.....

The Democratic Response...

Victory ???