What happens if a baseball has the weight...

[kilopi505]

What happens if a baseball is magically fiddled with to have the weight of a mountain behind it when it hits an object after being thrown by...say a Major League pitcher?

Should one expect a sudden explosion? And how big is the explosion? Meteor crater big?

[Napoleon the Clown]

Assuming it's velocity remains the same... Well, we'd need to know the actual mass. The "weight of a mountain" is pretty vague. The definition of mountain isn't tremendously precise so there honestly isn't a lower limit, and if we got beyond terrestrial mountains it can get obscenely big.

[kilopi505]

Assume it's Mt. Washington. Or Rushmore.

[Simon_Jester]

Why would it explode?

Just saying- we should pause to consider this.

[Grumman]

If it suddenly gained the mass of a mountain, it would suddenly be strongly inclined to continue in the same direction it's currently heading. It might just punch a hole through whatever it hits.

[Simon_Jester]

And then, possibly, fall through the ground until it fetches up against something with the compressive strength to hold it up, reaches the center of the Earth, or both...

The only place I can imagine for the "suddenly EXPLOSION!" to come from is that you have in fact made this ball of super-compressed matter, with density that I... strongly suspect would be best described as 'neutronium.' But that only matters if there's no outside force holding the extra mass together as a solid object. If there isn't, then how did all this extra mass appear in the first place?

[madd0ct0r]

right.

we can spilt the vectors. so the ball will fall downwards at the usual rate of g, and thus will have a parabola identical to a normal pitched ball.
It just will not stop for anything on that path.

imagine a rod of iron, with the same cross section as the baseball being fired at the baseball's speed.

Batter hits it? bat breaks
guy catches it? he loses his hand. As Simon Jester reckons, the ball just ends up buried relatively deeply somewhere under the stands.

[kilopi505]

right.

we can spilt the vectors. so the ball will fall downwards at the usual rate of g, and thus will have a parabola identical to a normal pitched ball.
It just will not stop for anything on that path.

imagine a rod of iron, with the same cross section as the baseball being fired at the baseball's speed.

Batter hits it? bat breaks
guy catches it? he loses his hand. As Simon Jester reckons, the ball just ends up buried relatively deeply somewhere under the stands.

If it suddenly gained the mass of a mountain, it would suddenly be strongly inclined to continue in the same direction it's currently heading. It might just punch a hole through whatever it hits.

And then, possibly, fall through the ground until it fetches up against something with the compressive strength to hold it up, reaches the center of the Earth, or both...

The only place I can imagine for the "suddenly EXPLOSION!" to come from is that you have in fact made this ball of super-compressed matter, with density that I... strongly suspect would be best described as 'neutronium.' But that only matters if there's no outside force holding the extra mass together as a solid object. If there isn't, then how did all this extra mass appear in the first place?

Ahh...I see.

I just forgot most of my physics a long time ago.

I just don't have too much of a head for numbers.

Also, this is for my story.

...this was inspired by the description for element zero of Mass Effect.

To quote the wiki:

"Element Zero (Atomic Number 0, Chemical Symbol Ez), also known as 'eezo', is a rare material that, when subjected to an electrical current, releases dark energy which can be manipulated into a mass effect field, raising or lowering the mass of all objects within that field."

If there isn't, then how did all this extra mass appear in the first place?

A mass media loving goddess using magic to turn fiction to her world's reality.

...are PC games and games for game consoles considered mass media?

[madd0ct0r]

yes, and I can't wait to see why Daesun thought a mountain ball would be a good idea

[kilopi505]

yes, and I can't wait to see why Daesun thought a mountain ball would be a good idea

Not Daesun. Annan. She cast this on Connla's sling.

Now Connla has an anti-tank sling.

[fgalkin2]

There is a reason why Mass Effect weapons do the exact opposite of what you described- instead of increasing mass, they instead reduce it and then throw it really hard. So, instead of a mountain- mass baseball moving at baseball speeds, you get a baseball-sized baseball moving at Mach 10.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Ahriman238]

Either way, the catcher is about to have a really bad day. If he's lucky, he'll never regain the use of his arm. If he's slightly less lucky he'll be hit with the wreckage of the bat. If he has average-to-miserable luck and the pitcher didn't know this would happen... pitchers aim for the striking zone, which conveniently puts the ball close to the Catcher's center.

[madd0ct0r]

Now Connla has an anti-tank sling.

erm, check out the kinetic energy vs momentum thread - you've got a high momentum low KE weapon there. different effects to usual.

[Dominarch's Hope]

It kills the catcher by going through the glove and him, then it just keeps going.

And once it hits the ground, it still keeps going. Likely fairly deep into the crust.

[kilopi505]

Now Connla has an anti-tank sling.

erm, check out the kinetic energy vs momentum thread - you've got a high momentum low KE weapon there. different effects to usual.

So instead of penetrating the tank, the baseball deforms the tank into uselessness?

...it sounds like that still qualifies as anti-tank.

So the baseball ball is definitely lethal against anything alive. How about something like a tank or a building?

[Batman]

Since it suddenly gained a lot of kinetic energy and momentum that was never put into it in the first place, shouldn't it slow to the pace a mountain thrown by a baseball pitcher could give it (i.e. none, essentially) and just drop straight down (which would still result in it digging one hell of a deep hole but be a great relief to the batter and the catcher?)

[kilopi505]

Since it suddenly gained a lot of kinetic energy and momentum that was never put into it in the first place, shouldn't it slow to the pace a mountain thrown by a baseball pitcher could give it (i.e. none, essentially) and just drop straight down (which would still result in it digging one hell of a deep hole but be a great relief to the batter and the catcher?)

It gains that KE and momentum at point of impact.

[Batman]

So essentially the batter and the catcher are in the clear (other than the seismic side-effects) as long as they manage to miss the ball?

[kilopi505]

So essentially the batter and the catcher are in the clear (other than the seismic side-effects) as long as they manage to miss the ball?

Yes.

[Grumman]

Since it suddenly gained a lot of kinetic energy and momentum that was never put into it in the first place, shouldn't it slow to the pace a mountain thrown by a baseball pitcher could give it (i.e. none, essentially) and just drop straight down (which would still result in it digging one hell of a deep hole but be a great relief to the batter and the catcher?)

Slow relative to what? The Earth is no more valid a point of reference than any other.

[Batman]

Slow relative to the speed it had when it was still an ordinary baseball seems like a good start. And I happen to think for something that's happening on the surface of the planet, yeah, that's a pretty good reference point.

[Grumman]

Slow relative to the speed it had when it was still an ordinary baseball seems like a good start. And I happen to think for something that's happening on the surface of the planet, yeah, that's a pretty good reference point.

You think wrong. You are suggesting that the experimental results would change themselves to fit your attempt to understand the system. The only reason the baseball would suddenly halt in mid-air is if the increase in mass was caused by adding a mountain-sized lump of the Earth to the baseball that retained the lump's previous momentum.

[madd0ct0r]

i was thinking about this a bit more.


we can take the mass of a mountain as a cone of granite half the height of the tallest mountain in wales,
we then look at the instant of connection
assuming the stone comes down at a 45 degree angle, half the force is hammering the tank into the ground.
Impact time increases based on softness of the ground, deformation of tank and espcially the inital give due to suspension.
the other half is hammering the tank sideays, with the resistant friction force being a function of the coefficient of friction 'tween the tank and ground, and the weight of tank + downwards force.

quite a lot anyway.

[kilopi505]

i was thinking about this a bit more.


we can take the mass of a mountain as a cone of granite half the height of the tallest mountain in wales,
we then look at the instant of connection
assuming the stone comes down at a 45 degree angle, half the force is hammering the tank into the ground.
Impact time increases based on softness of the ground, deformation of tank and espcially the inital give due to suspension.
the other half is hammering the tank sideays, with the resistant friction force being a function of the coefficient of friction 'tween the tank and ground, and the weight of tank + downwards force.

quite a lot anyway.

So dead tank?

How about if the ball come at it in a 180 degree angle? Or anywhere from 160 to 110 degrees? Still a dead tank?

[Crazedwraith]

Slow relative to the speed it had when it was still an ordinary baseball seems like a good start. And I happen to think for something that's happening on the surface of the planet, yeah, that's a pretty good reference point.

You think wrong. You are suggesting that the experimental results would change themselves to fit your attempt to understand the system. The only reason the baseball would suddenly halt in mid-air is if the increase in mass was caused by adding a mountain-sized lump of the Earth to the baseball that retained the lump's previous momentum.

Assuming conservation of momentum, the baseball would have to slow. A lot of added mass and the same momentum leads to decreased velocity in accordance to p=mv.

Of course there's not particular reason that the magic allowing you to add a shit load of extra mass is not going to allow you to ignore conservation of momentum as well.