The Daughters of Kali

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The Daughters of Kali

Post by Korto »

Foreword : The Daughters of Kali, or Kali's Daughters, are a human splinter group who the Accord best know as raiders of ships and outposts. They were inspired largely by a picture of a group of Escher gangers in full fury, and then I tried to think of some way to make it so. So sue me, I also try to make sense out of D&D economics. :lol:

Questions arising in another thread about the medical effects of the chilling forced my hand, but I was meaning to put this stuff here anyway, for a bit of critique. So welcome to Terralthra, and I hope LaCroix, Purple and Zeropoint drop in, too. I will say right here, as I've said on previous threads, I appreciate the input, and while I won't promise to use what you say, I promise to consider it, and quite significant changes have been made due to input of people such as Simon_Jester and Chewbacca (that goes back a bit).

So, with no further ado:

Kali’s Daughters
Long ago, when interstellar travel was still new and the first of the colony ships were going out, there was an extremist militant ultra-feminist group known as the Kali’s Daughters. With their beliefs preaching the evil of maleness, the desirability of a female-only society, and the importance of bringing it about by any means necessary, they were an embarrassment to women everywhere and many believed they were a deliberate strawman to discredit feminists.
They concocted a mad plan to steal a colony ship, and take it to the heavens to start the perfect society. While mad, they were also competent and well resourced, and they managed to pull it off. They achieved space, targeted a likely star system, and Jumped.
Unfortunately, Jumping has never been without risk, and this Jump went wrong, the Kali’s Daughters vanished from knowledge, and feminism in general did not shed a tear.

As astronomers amongst the Kali’s Daughters discovered upon examining the surrounding stars, the bad jump had taken them to the far side of the galaxy, over a thousand years from home at the travel rate at the time. They could never return home.
Fortunately, they found an inhabitable planet within reach and established a new home, ran according to their beliefs. After things did not proceed as smoothly and successfully as the more idealistic amongst them had believed it would, the colony factionalised.
The powerful military faction was led by the charismatic and brutal General Madhuri Saxena, originally of Britannic India and a dominating force in the Daughters from before the exodus. Having already purged their own faction of dissenting voices, they then planned and carried out a savage “Night of the Long Knives”, decapitating the leaderships of the other factions and taking over the entire colony by military coup. It was well planned, fast, and brutal. When the dust settled, the colony was led by a military dictatorship, with scientific advisors.
Over time, this evolved into a leadership system somewhat similar to early 21st century China, with the military having a firm grip upon the leadership. Exactly why the military should be in charge, and what they needed such a powerful military for anyway, were questions it was dangerous to ask.

Then they met the “Others”. The Kali’s Daughters to this day know very little about these “Others”, and there's no "real" communication between them. The Others supplied the Kali’s Daughters with a power generator that even today provides a large proportion of their power. They gave them access to “Jump Portals”, providing instantaneous travel throughout the galaxy. They provided amazing armoured space suits, and, of all the outlandish items, swords. Talwars, to be more precise.
With this assistance, the Kali’s Daughters managed to re-outfit their ship, at which point the leadership had to make a decision. Whether to make open-handed contact with Earth, or be more cautious and secretive. Under the leadership of General Asfrid Freyjadatter, the successor of General Madhuri Saxena, they decided to take the cautious route and seized isolated ships, the prisoners to interrogate, and the ships to refit to their own needs.
These attacks went well, not only in their goal of material and intelligence, but also in a morale boost and sense of purpose to the colony. Seizing the opportunity, the leadership transformed the colony into a raiding society, focused against the evil masculine empire of Earth.
This went quite well as far as the leadership was concerned. They quite liked their isolation from Earth, making them the unquestioned rulers of their own realm, they could steal what they couldn’t make themselves (they later found it necessary to make contact with unscrupulous merchants so they could trade loot for what they actually wanted), it gave a group of outsiders to focus their citizens attention on, and it “explained” the need for such a powerful military. What the citizens were told about those outsiders was coloured and biased to suit the leadership’s needs.
And so things have remained for over a century.

Reproduction
When a woman wants a baby, her and her partner (or donor) go to the clinic where an egg is taken from both women and combined invitro. The viable embryo is then implanted into whichever of the two women is to be the mother. From there the pregnancy proceeds as normal.
The gender of the child is, of course, female.

Kali’s Daughter Battle Suit
In its natural state, a suit is a dull metallic waxy grey colour and feels like plastic. It could be any shape, not necessarily a suit shape; it could be a shapeless blob, a sculpture, but is generally a rectangular block as it’s easier for storage. The suit has to be ‘attuned’ to a wearer, in a technical process that the common raiders are not privy to.
When in body contact with its attuned wearer, the suit responds to the wearer’s thoughts, to assume any shape and colour (including as clear as cleanest glass). It’s used to form a complete body covering, coloured and shaped to create the appearance of an outfit. This outfit could be anything from the most staid to the most outrageous, but when involved in action they typically err on the side of outrageous extremes. They do this partially in the hope that it will throw off their opponents, but also because it’s traditional, a thing of pride and esprit de corps. The suit reshapes and remoulds itself, responding to the subconscious mind of the wearer as she moves so while being at all times one solid piece, it never inhibits the wearer, it even enhances the strength of the wearer somewhat, although only a modest amount, enough to make the average raider as strong as a very strong man. However, fine control is lost over any portion of the suit further then approximately 100mm from functioning nerves of the wearer, and all control at approximately 300mm.
The armour is surprisingly effective. While seeming to not have any kind of protective field, the armour can stop up to light-armour weapons, depending partially upon its thickness where hit, but more upon the wearer’s intention and image of themselves when wearing it. More typically, it’ll stop attacks of battle-rifle intensity. It also filters and purifies air and stores a few litres of same within its sponge-like structure. Incoming radiation, sound, and similar energies above a critical intensity are blocked, with only a safe level allowed through.
Despite the suit being seemingly solid, solid, liquid, and gaseous wastes are in some way absorbed within the material when excreted or exhaled (assuming the suit covers the relevant area). Once absorbed, it is purified in some way and stored as perfectly breathable air and potable water, with the impurities excreted through the surface of the suit in elemental form. The wearer can use the air and water as long as the suit covers the mouth or nose. It is also possible for the wearer to breath, urinate, and shit normally by causing the suit to not cover the relevant areas.
The suit runs off body heat, absorbing heat from all over the body, and then expelling the heat… somewhere. This has a significant chilling effect on the wearer when in a situation where the suit is doing a lot of work (for instance, under heavy fire). While this has a useful effect of making the overheating endemic to most complete suits a non-issue, it does mean that almost all Daughters rendered a casualty in combat fall to hypothermia. It also makes a daughter in a bodysuit almost impossible to pick up with standard infrared, unless the suit is in its most quiescent state and ‘hot spots’ such as the face uncovered.
There have been attempts to get around the strange drawbacks of the suit. It has been found that when encapsulated by a suit, electrical devices become unreliable, and any suit area not in contact with skin loses its protective ability.

Many believe that a battlesuit completely disintegrates when kept away from its wearer for too long, and the duration that this happens at varies by story. It is known that a suit will not respond to anyone but its particular owner. Daughters questioned have denied knowing any way to change the owner.
When captured suits have been examined, they have been found to be a homogenous solid, in fact a single macromolecule. The molecule is, however, to the best of current science, impossible. There are structures there that shouldn’t be stable without other structures, which aren’t present, and couldn’t be present because it would render other structures in the molecule unstable. There are gaps where atoms should be, electron concentrations where there shouldn’t be, and some have speculated that what they are seeing here is a trans-universal solid, that is, a solid that exists in multiple universes at the same time. Where atoms should be, but aren’t, they claim, the atoms actually are there, but in another, overlapping, universe.

Technical Notes
A suit’s battle protection could, for simplicity, be considered to come in three strengths. Light, medium, and heavy, comparable to normal militia, infantry, and elite assault. Heat is drawn from the wearer to protect against any hit, with the kJ drawn dependant upon the ‘level’ of protection.
For calculations of effects, assume heat is drained evenly throughout the body, but it would make for better descriptions if frosting can happen.
Frostbite only happens if the area is lowered to freezing.
The heavier the protection, the more it costs to move and otherwise act, and the less it costs to resist a hit. (in watts or kJ, as applicable)

Agility
Very Agile - That movie combat gymnastics where they're cartwheeling about, backflipping, etc
Normal - Like a person in battle kit
Stolid - Like deep-sea diving through treacle. (maybe not that bad, but movements sluggish)

Power (watts) required
Protection Level.......Very Agile.......Normal........Stolid........Reasonable protection from
Light......................200................100............50............Needle pistols, instant death from Heavy Needler
Medium...................1500..............500............100..........Needle Rifles, take 1 or 2 Heavy hits
Heavy.....................9000..............1500..........500..........Heavy Needler

The heat a person produces depends upon their activity level
Exertion Level........Light...........Medium........Heavy.......Extreme
Watts produced.....100.............200.............500..........1000
Sustained for.........Indefinite.....4 hours........1 hour.......10 minutes

If the person can't generate enough heat, then it's drained from their body. An 80kg person can lose 550kJ to mild hypothermia, 830 to moderate, 1100 to severe, and 1400 to unconscious. These numbers, of course, are never to be in the story, but as something for me to keep in mind to keep consistency. Yes, she can do this, but it will cost this.

Kali Talwar
The Kali Talwar has a bulge forward, thickening the blade overall at the best chopping point. The blade is activated by mental command, and appears to absorb heat through the handle, which is then channelled along an exceedingly fine edge. It reaches temperatures approaching 5000 K, but how this works is unknown. Anything contacting this edge is typically reduced to a gaseous state faster than the heat can be dispersed, and so a super fine cut is created, which is then capitalised upon by the weight and force of the swinging blade.
The talwar is used in combination with the battlesuit, and when used in such a way the user will notice a chill across her entire body when the blade is in heavy. The blade can be used bare-handed, but the hand will rapidly chill, stiffen, and eventually become frostbitten and freeze solid, although it can be used with special gloves and heating units to provide the necessary heat. It is experimentally verified that heat transfer happens within the blade at the speed of light.
The blades have an extraordinary resistance to heat, requiring over 10,000 C to affect them.
The molecules in the edge of the blade vibrate linearly, along the edge of the blade, not chaotically in all directions, meaning it can penetrate a field with very little loss when chopping. At the extreme tip, the direction of vibration is perfectly in line with a straight thrust, causing a total interaction with a field, which, when combined with the tiny contact area of the tip and the extreme temperature, causes a distressingly high rate of brittle-fail for fields (distressing for the Daughter’s opponent, that is).

Technical Notes
When activated, the blade has a 200mm heated edge, the leading edge being a tenth of a millimetre thick. It’s at 4500 C, radiating (and drawing) 500 W from the user. There’s also an energy cache within the blade of 100 kJ. The amount of energy drawn from the user is proportional to how depleted this cache is, up to a maximum of 5000W when the cache is fully depleted.
When inactive, the blade isn’t heated, and a maximum of 200W is drawn (down to zero if the cache is fully charged)
Composite* struck absorbs approximately 1kJ per millimetre armour depth, causing a 1mm thickness to disassociate, the steel to melt, and the decomposing ceramic typically can’t survive the weight of the blow.
If used in the bare hand, the average hand is 0.567kg, so the hand will be chilled ¼ degree per second when active (500W), but up to 2.5 degrees per second at full draw (5000W). As the body considers the hand expendable, the blood supply will be cut when the fingers and hand gets too cold, frostbite and then freezing solid can and will happen if allowed to continue.


*Composite is a composite (tricky!) of sintered ceramic and steel alloy. It has amazing strength, excellent heat resistance (until it disassociates at 2260 C), and is the king of the structural and armour materials.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by Grumman »

I think you're trying to have the suit do too much. Both the sword and the suit seem to violate the laws of thermodynamics based on how they use of heat as an energy source, but making the suit a psychosensitive, shapeshifting ooze that also acts as a life support system?
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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Hey, some criticism! I was starting to think everyone thought my suit was so perfect there was nothing they could say (or more likely, it was such a wall of text no-one could be bothered).

It does do a lot, and I was thinking about it today. It needs to keep the ability to recycle air, as it's used as a space suit, and a major thing I've done to rein in its power is to make it very difficult to use in combination with anything else, so no radio, no thermal vests, etc. If decent breathing apparatus was an exception to that, it could create a loophole letting other things through.
However, the water recycling lacks that argument, and the odd way it processes wastes could be viewed as unnecessary. It could have no special ability with waste, except training in how to encapsulate and expel, and still work just as well as a vacuum battle suit. I had a reason for putting the water thing in, but I don't know if it was good enough. I am seriously thinking of dumpling that part of the suit.

As for the laws of thermodynamics (I view them more as a guideline, really :wink: ), the suit definitely uses energy, even if the best known-galaxy scientists can't work out what it does with it. I feel that's following them close enough for SF
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by cadbrowser »

Doesn't this:
As astronomers amongst the Kali’s Daughters discovered upon examining the surrounding stars, the bad jump had taken them to the far side of the galaxy, over a thousand years from home at the travel rate at the time. They could never return home.
contradict this:
They gave them access to “Jump Portals”, providing instantaneous travel throughout the galaxy.
If KD was given access to these jump portals by the "Others" then couldn't they go home? Also, it is a little confusing that they are on the "far side of the galaxy, which is 1,000 years away". The Milky Way is 100,000 to 120,000 ly in diameter which would indicate a hyperspace jump speed of at least 100c?
When a woman wants a baby, her and her partner (or donor) go to the clinic where an egg is taken from both women and combined invitro.
By genetic splicing? How is it then fertilized?
The viable embryo is then implanted into whichever of the two women is to be the mother. From there the pregnancy proceeds as normal.
:wtf: Uhm, not without sperm it doesn't. Biology 101. I don't think anyone is going to buy this. An idea possibly; these extreme femnist were in fact Hermaphrodites, thereby allowing then to recombinate genetic material which is screened and then combined...bla bla bla. But for whatever reason they considered themselves ultra-femenist due to their close resemblance of the female form.
Another idea might be the irony of their "species". They have in their possession a bacteria was designed to copy their version of the perfect sperm specimen. They all possess (from the first generation onward since arriving at the new planet) this one set of chromosomes from the male. So in fact they cannot continue survival without man. Could be that what they teach their female children is what you put.
You know, you could use this as an underlying plot hook towhere under the guise of military expansion they need to come back to earth to obtain a new specimen, or a few more because they are contracting some wierd disease and they will all go extinct soon or whatever.
The suit has to be ‘attuned’ to a wearer, in a technical process that the common raiders are not privy to.
So, do the "Others" tune it specifically, or a specialized trained cadre of Daughters scientist?
Also, are these suits required to be on all the time? It seems as if KD is the main antagonist here, IOW not able to be a PC. Am I right?
Do you intend for this suit to be worn by a PC? How, if no one knows how to "reprogram it" for a new user? (Ooooh, a thought just occured...nice little side arc; maybe a decendent of one or more of the "original" founders can reprogram the suit. Maybe have the suit passed down from generation to generation. This would limit the needed contact by the "Others" thus preserving that aspect of the storyline.
I don't have any issues with what the suit can/cannot do. However, it needs to be known what it can/can't due so that if you plan on allowing PC interaction it can fit the adventure or whatever. It does remind me a bit of the biological/cybernetic suit in the movie Star Kid.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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cadbrowser wrote:
When a woman wants a baby, her and her partner (or donor) go to the clinic where an egg is taken from both women and combined invitro.
By genetic splicing? How is it then fertilized?
The viable embryo is then implanted into whichever of the two women is to be the mother. From there the pregnancy proceeds as normal.
:wtf: Uhm, not without sperm it doesn't. Biology 101. I don't think anyone is going to buy this.
Scientists have already done it, back in 2004.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by krakonfour »

I have a question:

What is this suit designed to fight?
Why isn't the thermal energy used more productively... I mean, you could use that lightspeed thermal transfer to flash-vaporize the back of a bullet and make a gun with limitless ammunition supply.

Grumman: Indeed. If the process has been perfected, then they might derive from it the genetic recovery process that removes the errors that accumulate in an adult's chromosomes, and thus an anti-aging technique?
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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Incidentally, on the topic of all-female societies, one I came up with was a dynasty of natural clones. The progenitor of the line was a woman born with a mutation that caused her to have a daughter by parthenogenesis. That daughter naturally had the same mutation and so had her own clone-daughters, and so on. They did not shun outsiders - many had married over the years - but control of the family shipping business remained with those who shared its founder's blood.
Last edited by Grumman on 2013-10-11 09:36am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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Grumman wrote:
cadbrowser wrote:
When a woman wants a baby, her and her partner (or donor) go to the clinic where an egg is taken from both women and combined invitro.
By genetic splicing? How is it then fertilized?
The viable embryo is then implanted into whichever of the two women is to be the mother. From there the pregnancy proceeds as normal.
:wtf: Uhm, not without sperm it doesn't. Biology 101. I don't think anyone is going to buy this.
Scientists have already done it, back in 2004.
Oh well shit. That is badass. Gladly conceeded then!
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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krakonfour wrote:I have a question:

What is this suit designed to fight?
I would say everyone else. If these suites are only available to the DoK by the "Others" on a planet located appx 1,000 years away from Earth; and these suited up Xena warrior princesses are comming back to conquer wherein no-one can use these suits other than the original bound femme, then they, I assume, are the "Dragons" in this universe.

Those are just my thoughts.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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cadbrowser wrote:
krakonfour wrote:I have a question:

What is this suit designed to fight?
I would say everyone else. If these suites are only available to the DoK by the "Others" on a planet located appx 1,000 years away from Earth; and these suited up Xena warrior princesses are comming back to conquer wherein no-one can use these suits other than the original bound femme, then they, I assume, are the "Dragons" in this universe.

Those are just my thoughts.
Well, that's the wrong way to go about doing things.

You designate a target. You identify how to kill it. only then do you design a weapon around doing just that.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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cadbrowser wrote:
krakonfour wrote:I have a question:

What is this suit designed to fight?
I would say everyone else. If these suites are only available to the DoK by the "Others" on a planet located appx 1,000 years away from Earth; and these suited up Xena warrior princesses are comming back to conquer wherein no-one can use these suits other than the original bound femme, then they, I assume, are the "Dragons" in this universe.

Those are just my thoughts.
Well, that's the wrong way to go about doing things.

You designate a target. You identify how to kill it. only then do you design a weapon around doing just that.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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Uhm, I did the exact same thing for the RPG that I am writing. Only a certain group of trusted people know who and what my "dragon" is. I had to flesh it out, and this is what is happening here. "In game" the PCs won't know this info. They will have to learn it.

Do YOU know what MY "dragon" is? Do you know where it came from? Do you know how to kill it?

Understand yet?
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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Ah, I see. They have no idea what the enemy is, but need to defend themselves from it anyways.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by Simon_Jester »

Clearly, someone designed the suits for SOME purpose.

So if we want the suits to have maximum coolness, and plot relevance, it is desirable that we know what they were for. This may suggest interesting technical features a sensible person would design into the suit, and it may suggest plotlines based on that threat emerging.
Grumman wrote:Incidentally, on the topic of all-female societies, one I came up with was a dynasty of natural clones. The progenitor of the line was a woman born with a mutation that caused her to have a daughter by parthenogenesis. That daughter naturally had the same mutation and so had her own clone-daughters, and so on. They did not shun outsiders - many had married over the years - but control of the family shipping business remained with those who shared its founder's blood.
There's a bacterium that does this, among other things: M. wolbachia.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

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Right. Unfortunately we do not know what purpose the "Others" would just give away this technology. It will be interresting as more information comes to light.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by krakonfour »

If they are giving away such technology, then maybe they are pretty confident that those that they giving it to have no way of reverse-engineering it.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by cadbrowser »

So far, that has been stated. There has been analysis, but no consensus from the top scientist/engineers as to how it actually works. I have a lot of ideas as to why, but I don't want to seed the author. It'll be interresting to see how this develops.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by Korto »

OK, lets go through this:
Cadbrowser wrote:Doesn't this:
Quote:
As astronomers amongst the Kali’s Daughters discovered upon examining the surrounding stars, the bad jump had taken them to the far side of the galaxy, over a thousand years from home at the travel rate at the time. They could never return home.

contradict this:
Quote:
They gave them access to “Jump Portals”, providing instantaneous travel throughout the galaxy.
TABNo. The "Others" only made contact a long time later, after the colony had become viable, and those in charge had become quite accustomed to being in charge. (The amount of time is not really decided. It's more than 50 years, may be more than 100, with the alteration of the line "Under the leadership of General Asfrid Freyjadatter, the successor of General Madhuri Saxena".) The military council at this point decided that they would keep the status quo.

TABThese Portals are one of the things I'm not entirely happy with. Daughters have been captured before, some have talked under interrogation. If these portals exist as I'm currently thinking of them, they would surely have been located, and either used, or if they can't be (for some cunning alien reason) guarded and trapped. But apparently they haven't. It's acceptable for me to say weird aliens act in weird alien ways, but humans act in human ways.

TABThe doubt on the reproduction has been dealt with. I will just say that considering what we're doing today, with cloning, building organs, growing ears on the backs of mice, etc, if I heard tomorrow that someone had managed to combine two eggs and successfully implant (probably with mice), I wouldn't blink.

TABThe suits are attuned in a technical process back home, by trained technicians. It may require alien tech that they're trained in the use of (and may not, just thought of it). These technicians are not allowed off the planet.

TABI notice you talk like a role-player (PC, adventure). I also noticed in my work how concerned I am with the mechanics of how things work. I blame my decades as a DM. I frequently wondered while creating this stuff whether I was creating it for literature, or a role-playing game. It could end up both. At the moment, however, it's literature, in the Ship of Cards story in the User Fiction section.
krakonfour wrote:What is this suit designed to fight?
The suit is designed as a raiders battle-suit. Imagine the Daughters as sort of like space Vikings, in fact they were even originally called the Valkryies until I decided that name really didn't work. The Valkryies would take the souls of brave warriors to Valhalla, which means they're serving men. Really didn't work. And also a bit too obvious and cliché.
TABAnyway, so they're meant to fight Known Galaxy infantry and light forces, the sort of forces you may expect to be defending ships, starbases, and small colonies, and then get the hell out. These opponents would be expected to be carrying the analogous* equivalents of assault rifles and modern combat armour with limited heavy weapon support, at most.
TAB*OK, it's actually rail-gun rifles firing metal needles, with future-tech armour and forcefields, but it all levels out**
TAB** NOT QUITE TRUE. Armour (when combined with the forcefield) has become much more significant v ranged weapons. A charge into hand-to-hand combat over clear ground in the face of fire is now a viable tactic, assuming it's over short distances, as your armour can take a few hits.
Why isn't the thermal energy used more productively
TABI'm viewing this from 3rd person perspective, on the human side. They don't know. There may be technical reasons why different things wont work or aren't practical, like why we don't have flying cars when we have the technology, or it may be that it doesn't fit into the Other's plans, whatever they are.
TABHowever, due to the way the forcefield the known galaxy uses works, the Daughters sword is a highly effective weapon. Used in a chopping motion, it almost entirely bypasses the field, used in a stabbing motion it entirely interacts with it in a very tiny area (which the forcefield hates), dumping possibly its full energy, into a space a fraction of a square millimetre.
TABI'm going to have to work out what happens when you dump 100kJ of energy into a volume of 2mm^3 (a good portion of that air), and how the field will interact with it. I may have invented the Laser Lance by accident
TABAnother thing about the swords. They trouble the more imaginative Kali higher-up's more than the armour. It's not that they're swords, which was weird enough, it's that they're Talwars. There's never been what we would call actual communication between Daughter and Other, and the suits and swords appearing were the entirety of First Contact (these items have continued to be supplied since).
If they are giving away such technology, then maybe they are pretty confident that those that they giving it to have no way of reverse-engineering it.
TABVery confident. In my mind, it's like presenting Archimedes with an iPod.
The technical science behind the toys isn't important in plot terms, as opposed to why they're doing this. Do these "Others" need a military force and they felt this was the best way about it? Is it some kind of experiment, like rats in a maze (the "communication" between them could be characterised as being of that level)? Is it all for their amusement? Some other reason? The Daughters don't know.

TABFinally, there's speculation in some dissident quarters that the suits may exert some kind of subtle mental control over its wearer, causing the wearer to think in a manner more to the Others plans. All the ruling council have suits.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by cadbrowser »

I guess I'm still a little confused. Your story states "they can never return home." Yet the portals obviously allow them to return to Earth; or am I misreading/miscomprhending perhaps your intention of what it means to return home. I think that is where I'm seeing the contradiction.

The Portals are indeed a mind-bender in this. Basically you have an enemy pretty defined and now you are trying to work the story around it.

So, I assume then the technitians are first trained by "the Others"? If it is their tech, then that would make the most sense, based on what you are saying.

I indeed play, but I've also DM'd and have written (and still working on) my own 'verse for an RPG and recently began writing fiction to flesh out my 'verse as it relates to the RPG. More/less doing the latter to raise awareness and hopefully some donations so I can persue getting artwork done to release the RPG in the near future.

Just the way you approached this piece of fiction, you went for the BBB (Big Bad Boss) first and then are building around that. That's just what I saw is all.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by Korto »

cadbrowser wrote:I guess I'm still a little confused. Your story states "they can never return home." Yet the portals obviously allow them to return to Earth; or am I misreading/miscomprhending perhaps your intention of what it means to return home. I think that is where I'm seeing the contradiction.
What I meant was I was speaking from what the Kali knew at that time, in 3rd person, not omniscient. When, much later on, they learnt about the portals, it turned out they were wrong and they could return home if they wanted to. At that point, however, they (or at least the leadership) had no desire to. It obviously would have been better if I had phrased it differently.
...the bad jump had taken them to the far side of the galaxy, over a thousand years from home at the travel rate at the time. They could never had no way to return home.
So, I assume then the technitians are first trained by "the Others"? If it is their tech, then that would make the most sense, based on what you are saying.
Yes, although not conventionally. Perhaps it's implanted; or it requires special equipment the aliens supplied which was made so simple the Kali could figure it out themselves; or it may be that it's a lie, the suits are provided by the aliens 'primed' in some way for the first person meaning to bond with it, and the leadership is perpetuating this "technicians" story for an as-yet unknown reason. (Flashbacks of McCaffrey and Imprinting)
Just the way you approached this piece of fiction, you went for the BBB (Big Bad Boss) first and then are building around that. That's just what I saw is all.
While this thread made the Kali seem important, as it was about them, really they're no more significant to the known galaxy than Somali pirates to the modern world. They're one colony on one world. Compare them to the explosively poisonous relations between the USA and the Britannic Empire (only two of the four major Earth powers in the Terran Accord, the other two being the Asian League and Deutsch Europa), the Anite race on an apparent crusade to enslave or exterminate all non-Anite, and the Tai!Qu clanholds who control more than a thousand times more of the galaxy than all the other known races combined, and it puts the Kali in their place.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by cadbrowser »

Korto wrote:
cadbrowser wrote:I guess I'm still a little confused. Your story states "they can never return home." Yet the portals obviously allow them to return to Earth; or am I misreading/miscomprhending perhaps your intention of what it means to return home. I think that is where I'm seeing the contradiction.
What I meant was I was speaking from what the Kali knew at that time, in 3rd person, not omniscient. When, much later on, they learnt about the portals, it turned out they were wrong and they could return home if they wanted to. At that point, however, they (or at least the leadership) had no desire to. It obviously would have been better if I had phrased it differently.
...the bad jump had taken them to the far side of the galaxy, over a thousand years from home at the travel rate at the time. They could never had no way to return home.
So, I assume then the technitians are first trained by "the Others"? If it is their tech, then that would make the most sense, based on what you are saying.
Yes, although not conventionally. Perhaps it's implanted; or it requires special equipment the aliens supplied which was made so simple the Kali could figure it out themselves; or it may be that it's a lie, the suits are provided by the aliens 'primed' in some way for the first person meaning to bond with it, and the leadership is perpetuating this "technicians" story for an as-yet unknown reason. (Flashbacks of McCaffrey and Imprinting)
Just the way you approached this piece of fiction, you went for the BBB (Big Bad Boss) first and then are building around that. That's just what I saw is all.
While this thread made the Kali seem important, as it was about them, really they're no more significant to the known galaxy than Somali pirates to the modern world. They're one colony on one world. Compare them to the explosively poisonous relations between the USA and the Britannic Empire (only two of the four major Earth powers in the Terran Accord, the other two being the Asian League and Deutsch Europa), the Anite race on an apparent crusade to enslave or exterminate all non-Anite, and the Tai!Qu clanholds who control more than a thousand times more of the galaxy than all the other known races combined, and it puts the Kali in their place.
Right on, I get it; makes sense. Sorry for the confusion.

With regards to the training...That would almost make a nice chapter in itself, if done right. I kind of like it that you are still undecided yet; makes for very interresting conversation.

Ah, ok. I guess I was relating it too much in the same respects as to how I developed the RPG I'm working on. Fair enough. Still a very nice work in the making you have here.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by bilateralrope »

Korto wrote:TABThese Portals are one of the things I'm not entirely happy with. Daughters have been captured before, some have talked under interrogation. If these portals exist as I'm currently thinking of them, they would surely have been located, and either used, or if they can't be (for some cunning alien reason) guarded and trapped. But apparently they haven't. It's acceptable for me to say weird aliens act in weird alien ways, but humans act in human ways.
I'm assuming that after using the portals, the Daughters use the same FTL as everyone else.

How precise is this FTL ?
How long does it take to go from exiting the portal to entering FTL ?
How about the reverse ?
Can ships be intercepted in FTL ?

If ships can't be intercepted in FTL, can go from the portal to FTL or FTL to portal too quickly to take significant damage and the portals only works for Daughters ships then guarding them becomes pointless as guarding the portal doesn't stop ships going through. So the resources to guard them are moved to where they will be more effective.

Or maybe the portals move, and only the Daughters know how to find them, which makes guarding them impossible.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by Korto »

SPJust for that, I'll describe how my interstellar travel works. I like it, because I came up with it myself. Not that I'm saying there's not something just the same elsewhere, but I don't currently know about it, so this is my baby. That another thing that bugs me about the jump gates, just straight lifted from the Eldar, Bab 5, Stargate...

SPAnyway, to explain the system, first I'll have to explain a little about Specularum physics, a much cursed and bewildering field that seems to be playing a great big game of Calvinball with the universe. No-one yet has managed to come up with any theory explaining any of it that wasn't experimentally contradicted , in some cases almost immediately.
SPIn poetic terms (akin to describing an atom as being like a little solar system), imagine that existence is all mirrors, reflecting what's around them. Of course, what's around them is mirrors casting reflections, so they're reflecting reflections. And that's all existence is, reflections of reflections. However, those reflections create patterns, and those patterns are reality, are electrons and photons, quarks, etc. There's infinite patterns to represent everything, that is, there's infinite different patterns to represent an electron, infinite different to represent a photon, and so on. These patterns also contain information about gravity, and everything else.
SPThese patterns are continuously changing. When the patterns change in one place, this change is instantly (lightspeed is no barrier) reflected elsewhere, everywhere. The amount an area changes, however, depends upon the concentration of matter and energy in the area. For instance, the deeper you enter into a solar system, the faster and more significant the changing.
SPThe lower the energy concentration, the more featureless the patterns are, the harder it is to differentiate. Out past 60 au, the patterns become too indistinguishable for safety (for the Terran system. This actually depends upon the nature of the system)

SPJump-drive
SP1) Scan the specularum pattern immediately around the ship. This takes a few minutes.
SP2) This information is then worked upon by the "Leapfrog"1 computer, which iteratively calculates the patterns caused by the patterns scanned, and then the patterns caused by the patterns it caused by the patterns scanned, and the patterns caused by the patterns caused by the... well, you get the idea. This takes a day per lightyear calculated.2
SP3) The ship then "Jumps" or "Twists" (due to the way it makes your guts feel), somewhere, ummm, else. This somewhere else seems to not have any fixed correspondence with the "real" universe (it doesn't write, doesn't call...), and doesn't seem to actually exist, in any real sense. And neither do you. The Jump takes a fraction of a second.
SP4) The Leapfrog computer then imposes the calculated pattern onto the ship (this has to be done out-of-universe, as reality is too powerful to do it in-universe). This takes about half a day.
SP5) The ship Jumps back, popping back into place where its specularum pattern says it should be (presumably while casually whistling and saying "Move along, nothing to see here"). Note - net energy differences, eg from GPE, are balanced at this point. Your coils had better be able to handle the debt or credit.
SP6) The ship must then not perform another jump for eleven days. It's found that if you Jump earlier, there's a much higher rate of "adverse events".
SPIt's important to note that the pattern you're using was calculated from a scan done at one point of time, and by the time it's used, it's out of date. The solution to this is to jump to a distance from a system such that the amount of change is insignificant. However, the further out you jump, the harder it is to be accurate. If you end up in interstellar space, you could end up anywhere, it's that undifferentiated. A compromise has to be found.
SPThe Sweet Spot for long-distance travel is a distance out where the pattern takes (usually) 8 days to change too much (<> 50 au), and with the calc speed of 1 day per light year, that makes a maximum safe jump of 6 days (safety margin), and therefore a long distance speed (hopefully) of 100c
SPAs the calculation time is much reduced, this can also be used for short one or two jumps in-system, but not deep (perhaps to 20 au).

SPDangers: The pattern can change faster, sometimes change completely. There're fluctuations sometimes. This normally just puts you further off-target, but there gets a point where some other completely separate point is a better match, and that doesn't have to be within our galaxy.
SPEven without that, by targeting where it's slow-changing, you've targeted where accuracy sucks. Being less then 30 light-minutes out of your target is considered good.

SPMany ships have vanished without trace.

Notes
SP1) The Leapfrog computer is believed to have been invented by the Tai!Qu (who've been in space far longer than any other of the known races), likely by a clan that was destroyed in one of their frequent wars of conquest. The working of it has been reverse-engineered, the design copied faithfully, but the principles never understood. It seems the secrets died with its inventor. Some suggest that the Tai!Qu were given it by someone else, but that's probably just bigotry.
SP2) Everyone feels that they should be able to do fantastic things with this ability. Scan the stars, instant communication, look at girls underwear. But the patterns are just so much gibberish, never repeat, and no theory survives testing. They're working on it, and they always hold out hope.



SPSo, bilateralrope, to answer your questions
SPHow precise? Not very.
SPHow long from Portal to Jump? Up to days, but a short Jump could be rushed. You then have the 11 day wait, though.
SPHow about the reverse? Never considered it, to be honest, therefore it could be only moments.
SPCan ships be intercepted (in Twistspace)? Not as far as anyone knows, no.

SPThe moving around idea is interesting, or a related idea that maybe the ships appear in a general area a few lightyears across, and therefore too large to guard.
SPI would prefer to come up with something more original than stargates, though.

****************************************************************************

SPDifferent matter. The skills of the "common" Kali Raider. I see these girls as an elite raider special forces unit, filling a role like Space Vikings, if you will. So I was trying to think of what skills they would probably have. They would be aggressively boarding ships3, defending their ship against boarders, raiding colonies and starbases, and repairing damage to the ship sustained from exchange of fire, during the battle.
SPI've got an ex-Kali girl in a story, and I've described her as being trained in:
SP* hand-to-hand
SP* small arms
SP* infantry heavy weapons (their version of manpads, heavy machine guns, etc)
SP* small-unit tactics
SP* first aid
SP* spaceship damage control (concentrating on fast and effective, not worried about long-term)
SP* And a basic grounding in all distinct ship roles (gunner, pilot, communications, etc), enabling her to take over anyone's role, and not make a complete hash of it. (Actually, she's a pretty decent gunner).

SPWhat should a Special Forces in such a role be taught? Can anyone think of anything I missed that should be there, or something that's there that shouldn't be? That's perhaps too over the top?

SP3) Yes, I know. No, I don't know how I'm going to have spaceships boarding each other without the battle already being over, either. I'm working on it.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by bilateralrope »

Korto wrote:SPSo, bilateralrope, to answer your questions
SPHow precise? Not very.
SPHow long from Portal to Jump? Up to days, but a short Jump could be rushed. You then have the 11 day wait, though.
SPHow about the reverse? Never considered it, to be honest, therefore it could be only moments.
SPCan ships be intercepted (in Twistspace)? Not as far as anyone knows, no.

SPThe moving around idea is interesting, or a related idea that maybe the ships appear in a general area a few lightyears across, and therefore too large to guard.
SPI would prefer to come up with something more original than stargates, though.
So if a portal is small and stationary enough to guard, a ship coming out is going to be in trouble if it wants to jump. But what about a ship which pops out of a portal, decides the portal is too hot, so it heads back inside the safety of the portal with the intent to come out of a different portal ?

If that is problematic, another option comes to mind. The Daughters first send a probe out of the portal, it checks the local area for hostiles, then heads back in to tell them that it's all clear. If the probe doesn't come back, or comes back with evidence of hostiles, they decide to use a different portal.

If the portals are sufficiently numerous, guarding them won't be viable:
- Concentrate the guards on a small number of portals and the Daughters just won't use those portals.
- Spread the guards over a large number of portals and they will be spread so thin that the guards will just become the first victims of the Daughters raids. Or maybe there is a fleet dedicated to making an example of anyone who tries to block a portal.

As for ships jumping to a portal to use it, it sounds like they can exit the jump far enough from the portal that if it's guarded, they have enough time to jump to an unguarded portal.
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Re: The Daughters of Kali

Post by Korto »

CCI reckon you've cracked it (other than the "I've lifted this straight from Stargate, showing less imagination than a rock" thing. Yes, I'm still dwelling on that). There is a whole network of these things. Now, if they have some way of observing the area from the other side (perhaps they can observe directly through the gates, perhaps they send a probe), they could see when an area is too hot, and use another exit. If they see anyone leaving some kind of traps or observing devices, they could just go out and destroy them. Travelling through may require cooperation from the Kali side, so only a ship they're expecting would be allowed through (maybe combine this with some kind of unique alien device on the ship, keeping the number of ships that can use it firmly under alien control). This could still mean the ship was captured and the pass codes taken, but only that ship would come through, not the Super DoomStar Stellar Destroyer Mk VII (with silver racing stripes).
CCThat'll work.
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