Continuum premiered on Showcase on May 27, 2012, and is just starting its third season. I repeat: there are humans around who thought it would be a good idea to have this shit renewed for two seasons.I gave Continuum another chance, just for the opportunity to suss out what made me detest the show so much. I think I've finally got it.
For those of you who don't know of the show, Continuum is about a future in which Corporations have bailed out North America's financially failing government (yes, really) and instituted a corporatocracy backed by technologically enhanced supercops. A murderous insurrection, "Liber8", then arises and starts blowing up buildings so as to engender sympathy, killing thousands. After a group of their leaders are caught, they pull a The One at the execution by travelling sixty-five years back in time and the cop, of course, is dragged along.
The premise of the show is ludicrous in many ways. What brings it from asinine to offensive are these things:
You know, I think it's the last two points that piss me off the most, because of the naked disdain it reveals for anyone to the left of Rupert Murdoch. It's a truly odious mix of the tone argument, historical/technological ignorance, obliviousness and general unfamiliarity with extremism. Why do people go to extreme lengths? Answer: when they have a goal that is all-consuming and when all other options toward reaching that goal have been exhausted. Socialist and anarchistic groups are often decried as being unruly and violent -- spuriously so, in many cases, and definitely when it comes to Occupy Wall Street -- and this generally happens because other avenues have been quietly curtailed.
- It attempts to do a spin on the old "security versus freedom" dichotomy, ostensibly in order to ask whether we should sympathize with a non-murdering representative of an oppressive regime or a band of brutal freedom fighters. Yet they immediately poison the well with the cinematic equivalent of Sarin gas. The arguments are strawmen of the highest order: the future society is a peaceful one in which the corporations have wisely shouldered the responsibilities toward non-profit research, education, societal structure, ecology, fair competition, infrastructure and long-term planning -- you know, all the things corporations do so well. Everybody is well-off, the air is clean, the streets are generally unlittered, and everybody seems basically cared for, much as one would expect in a world where the laws are enforced by multinational conglomerates.
- The characterizations of the two camps. Our supercop is afforded lingering attention to her family life and her feelings, while no such humanity is extended toward the freedom fighters, who -- despite having no reason to -- frequently and callously kill the civilians that by rights they should sympathize with.
- The deliberate use of imagery. Our supercop is shown as conventionally attractive (and somber, because we're supposed to sympathize with her plight), perfectly coiffed, attired in gleaming tech, and basically a wholesome pretty white girl. The freedom fighters, in contrast, are ethnic, a motley, grimy lot, dressed in grungy camo slacks and Keffiyehs. So we give them clear socialist/anarchist symbols right at the height of Occupy Wall Street, and then we show them killing people in the most brutal of ways while demonstrating clear enjoyment in the act. Lovely.
- This contempt for both viewer and characters extends to the methods used by the freedom fighters. It's made evident quite early on -- with scant justification -- that present-day society stands helpless in the face of their abilities. They know every important event, have memorized every software exploit, and apparently lug their tech base from the future around in their heads. In short, it's made clear that anything that is online they can get, whether money, access or anonymity. Yet they still choose to live like squatters in a flat they've broken into (having killed the owners, of course), oiling their guns and talking about how fun it would be to do drugs and threatening each other and generally being unruly. Because apparently, that's how dangerous anarchists roll. Oh, and they also want to go back to their own time because this was just a jail break, see? The notion that they might just use their thirty-year Mulligan and prescience to reshape the world is given the short shrift and the one freedom fighter who floats the idea is pictured as just using it as a self-serving excuse.
Now in the show, the "Liber8" movement is shown to have legitimate grievances, and they are now in a position to do something about it on a vast scale, with nonviolent methods being far easier, quicker, low-risk, and effective. But of course they never do so, because the show needs them to be evil and reprehensible, to keep up the identification with them as the evil unruly barbaric socialist militia.
The point is, our supercop can afford to be polite; she can allow the system itself to oppress and maim and murder. It would make at least some amount of sense for the freedom fighters to be brutal and uncompromising during the future scenes because they can't defer their brutality to off-screen lackeys. The instant Liber8 were sent back and we learned that no, this is what they do BY CHOICE... the entire argument is revealed as not just rigged but an outright farce.
God I hate that show. May it burn in the fires of Eragon, and have Brannon Braga gnaw on its liver.
Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Moderator: NecronLord
Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Continuum is a Canadian low-budget SF series reminiscent of TimeCop and Atlas Shrugged. I've watched three episodes now, having had nothing better to do, and found it to be uniquely awful among science fiction series. The reasons for why I felt that way finally became clear to me and I felt I should share. This is what I wrote on Facebook after concluding the third episode.
Björn Paulsen
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Hilariously enough, their leader bitchsmacks them for this and changes how they operate precisely for the reasoning you suggest. But. You have to watch the show. Don't take my word for it.Eleas wrote: [*]This contempt for both viewer and characters extends to the methods used by the freedom fighters. It's made evident quite early on -- with scant justification -- that present-day society stands helpless in the face of their abilities. They know every important event, have memorized every software exploit, and apparently lug their tech base from the future around in their heads. In short, it's made clear that anything that is online they can get, whether money, access or anonymity. Yet they still choose to live like squatters in a flat they've broken into (having killed the owners, of course), oiling their guns and talking about how fun it would be to do drugs and threatening each other and generally being unruly. Because apparently, that's how dangerous anarchists roll. Oh, and they also want to go back to their own time because this was just a jail break, see? The notion that they might just use their thirty-year Mulligan and prescience to reshape the world is given the short shrift and the one freedom fighter who floats the idea is pictured as just using it as a self-serving excuse.[/list]
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Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
The flashbacks to Kiera's time in the future show this isn't the case:Everybody is well-off, the air is clean, the streets are generally unlittered, and everybody seems basically cared for, much as one would expect in a world where the laws are enforced by multinational conglomerates.
There was one episode where the flashback to the future showed some major 'terrorist' operation, that turned out to be stealing a large shipment of food. Because the corporation involved with distribution food was holding the food back.
A recent episode showed a small settlement that just wanted to be left alone outside of corporate oppression. When the megacorps learn that they have a terrorist leader in it, the decision is to blow up the settlement and kill everyone. Without even checking to see if that terrorist leader is even still there or if the settlement even knew about him.
In the future, books are considered contraband with no consideration about the contents.
Burning building. Kiera finds two children and can only take them out one at a time. After taking out the first one, she is ordered to save a 'life fund manager' instead of the other child. The life fund manager does not seem to be a human and, when Kiera chooses to save the child her life debt is increased by the amount the corporation wrote off for its loss.
There were mind control chips being used as punishment.
It's not presented as a nice future. Instead it's presented as Kiera being blind to the injustice she takes part in while being high enough up that life is pretty good for her. Maybe because the corporations know to treat their enforcers well, maybe because her husband has a high management position, maybe because the leader of at least one of the corporations is favoring her because of the things she did/will do due to the time travel.
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Their leader, the one who broke the necks of rent-a-cops, smirking as he did so, when there was perfect reason not to? The man who planned an assault on a police station when he could have simply gotten the dude out on bail, because he prefers killing government employees (i.e. the exact opposite of the corporate cops in his time) to laying low? That guy?Gaidin wrote:Hilariously enough, their leader bitchsmacks them for this and changes how they operate precisely for the reasoning you suggest. But. You have to watch the show. Don't take my word for it.
If that is the extent of your endorsement then you're right, taking your word for it would probably be stupid.
Last edited by Eleas on 2014-05-17 08:01pm, edited 1 time in total.
Björn Paulsen
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Well, if subsequent episodes show a different side to it, then sure. I will maintain that the imagery remains offensive and the depiction of the future as seen in the initial three episodes idiotic, while the attempts at nuancing the entire Liber8 cell so far versus the same for the protagonist may be the most horrible travesty yet shown on TV.bilateralrope wrote:It's not presented as a nice future. Instead it's presented as Kiera being blind to the injustice she takes part in while being high enough up that life is pretty good for her. Maybe because the corporations know to treat their enforcers well, maybe because her husband has a high management position, maybe because the leader of at least one of the corporations is favoring her because of the things she did/will do due to the time travel.
Björn Paulsen
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
SpoilerEleas wrote: Their leader, the one who broke the necks of rent-a-cops, smirking as he did so, when there was perfect reason not to? That guy? The man who planned an assault on a police station when he could have simply gotten the dude out on bail, because he prefers killing government employees (i.e. the exact opposite of the corporate cops in his time) to laying low? That guy?
If that is the extent of your endorsement then you're right, taking your word for it would probably be stupid.
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Point taken. However, I do take issue with this:
When you watch a show for three episodes and everything about it is bad, extrapolating this to apply to the show as a whole is not unreasonable. These people are presented as being geniuses with a plan. They had no reason to go on a rampage other than "meh, anarchists". They did so because the script needed them to be stupid and vicious.Gaidin wrote:But then...you stop watching a show with an over-arching storyline where a group is it's own character with its own development after 3 episodes you kind of miss these things.
Björn Paulsen
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Well, all things being equal, the first three episodes of a show are literally "here are the characters". Continuum's not really unique there. And you have maybe one member of Liber8 that is in any way hilariously unique in his ideas(Kellog), so Liber8 isn't going to impress you if you want something ethical now that they're out of prison and in an environment where they can be ethical. And he's also unique in the sense that not a damn one of them appreciates his abilities as a con man so he's got every damn reason to get the hell out of there. Precisely because they're the kind of fighters they are. They like what the engineer can give them for their missions. They like what the doctor can give them. But the con man? No. So he largely gets the hell out of dodge. He's the only one that adapted. As for Kiera, her development is largely fish out of water at first, when she thinks she can still get home. Fair enough.
Spoiler
Spoiler
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Ok, fair. As my initial impression was stunned disbelief followed by revulsion, I think it'd take a lot of convincing for me to ever watch the show, but I could probably have learned to like the show you're describing.
Björn Paulsen
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
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Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
It took Agents of Shield six episodes to get good, and it really paid off.
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Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Most of Joss Whedon's stuff takes awhile to get into, but generally after the first fourteen episodes or so they start to get pretty good.
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Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
I watched the first season and quite liked it. Also, if you have only watched three episodes then you truly do not know who the leader of Liber8 is. This is not revealed until end of the season, although there is a clue in the pilot episode.
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Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
When Kagami takes over Liber8 is when they actually start acting smart. It's also when we see the anti-corporate side much more clearly. A small spoiler in
Spoiler
Also, when Kiera is talking with her present day cop partner about Occupy Wall Street, he actively takes the side of the Occupiers about the unfairness with the corporations. They also deal with this by having Kagami discuss the irresponsibility of the corporate heads of the present and how it lead to this dark road.
Spoiler
It shows that the system is pretty backwards.
Also, when Kiera is talking with her present day cop partner about Occupy Wall Street, he actively takes the side of the Occupiers about the unfairness with the corporations. They also deal with this by having Kagami discuss the irresponsibility of the corporate heads of the present and how it lead to this dark road.
Did you miss the flashes to the future where huge parts of Toronto are flooded and destroyed?Everybody is well-off, the air is clean, the streets are generally unlittered, and everybody seems basically cared for, much as one would expect in a world where the laws are enforced by multinational conglomerates.
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Watched the all the SyFy aired episodes, but season 3 is hard to stick with, just feels like too many reset buttons and aimless. It went into the worst aspects of time travel shows, bringing characters back after one timeline version has been killed, and shoehorning them into flashbacks seems to be the priority. It's like you can feel the writers and creators finding ways to keep people's jobs instead of telling an overall story.
The modern day corporation spoofs are uncreative too, Sonmanto (really?) and ending each episode with emo alternative music trying to make things more emotional and epic is getting old and not working, they ran out of gimmicks instead of just writing a good show. No consequences for most actions they just get reset using multiverse or time tropes, it was better when it was a quest to return to the future, now they seem just add rules whenever they feel like it.
The modern day corporation spoofs are uncreative too, Sonmanto (really?) and ending each episode with emo alternative music trying to make things more emotional and epic is getting old and not working, they ran out of gimmicks instead of just writing a good show. No consequences for most actions they just get reset using multiverse or time tropes, it was better when it was a quest to return to the future, now they seem just add rules whenever they feel like it.
You mean Vancouver right, don't remember them mentioning other parts of the country, though it seems like North America is it's own region/country.Did you miss the flashes to the future where huge parts of Toronto are flooded and destroyed?
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Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
There's a big difference between "not very good" and "irredeemable". The first three episodes of Continuum fell in the latter category for me. If I may quote myself:CaptainChewbacca wrote:It took Agents of Shield six episodes to get good, and it really paid off.
IOW, Agents of Shield doesn't and cannot compare.When you watch a show for three episodes and everything about it is bad, extrapolating this to apply to the show as a whole is not unreasonable. These people are presented as being geniuses with a plan. They had no reason to go on a rampage other than "meh, anarchists". They did so because the script needed them to be stupid and vicious.
Again, I'm not disputing the idea that it may get better, but the argument as it was shown in episodes 1, 2, and 3 was completely odious and one-sided. As I said:FaxModem1 wrote:When Kagami takes over Liber8 is when they actually start acting smart. It's also when we see the anti-corporate side much more clearly.
An addition of a reasonable figure may be an attempt at taking a current situation and nuancing it. That does not excuse the current situation from being a horrible travesty.I will maintain that the imagery remains offensive and the depiction of the future as seen in the initial three episodes idiotic, while the attempts at nuancing the entire Liber8 cell so far versus the same for the protagonist may be the most horrible travesty yet shown on TV.
In episodes 1, 2 and 3, the society that is shown in the flashbacks is a thriving, orderly one, and frequently polished (even techno chic). In light of that, your question seems out of place.Did you miss the flashes to the future where huge parts of Toronto are flooded and destroyed?
Björn Paulsen
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Well, you're missing a lot of flashbacks for one, as far as not only the condition of the future society as a whole, but her life. They're also her flashbacks, so they may be biased. It's an idea to get used to. But to put some of the negatives on the table that you can catch... Let's just say the food, for one, seems disgusting if you're not a corporate bigwig. That one they'll touch on from both directions. There's still a drug underworld and it's gone off the rails thanks to the pharmacorps. The lifedebt system seems insane now that the corporations run things and it gets touched multiple times. And they also give flashbacks into some of the Liber8 points of view as well later, even though those are rarer. You get an idea why they might have joined.
Spoiler
Spoiler
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
I rather like the show and just finished watching the second season. I do worry that it's going to turn into a big old mess because it's likely that no one behind the show knows where it is going so they are going to keep twisting and turning things for as long as they can no matter how convoluted they get.
I like the future tech that Kira has with her and that most of what she is able to use consistently is used for information gathering/deduction. She has a couple of pretty good weapons but can't use them with her partner around.
Luckily this show is one of those 11-13 episodes a season shows that actually knows how to work that, and they have very good hand to hand fight choreography. Lost Girl, another Canadian production does a terrible job on both of those (it has other issues too).
I like the future tech that Kira has with her and that most of what she is able to use consistently is used for information gathering/deduction. She has a couple of pretty good weapons but can't use them with her partner around.
Luckily this show is one of those 11-13 episodes a season shows that actually knows how to work that, and they have very good hand to hand fight choreography. Lost Girl, another Canadian production does a terrible job on both of those (it has other issues too).
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Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
I originally thought they were supposed to be in Toronto mostly because it seemed to be an unnamed Canadian city, but they do specifically say Vancouver in the second season. They also mention "the main land" a few times.Meest wrote: You mean Vancouver right, don't remember them mentioning other parts of the country, though it seems like North America is it's own region/country.
By the pricking of my thumb,
Something wicked this way comes.
Open, locks,
Whoever knocks.
Something wicked this way comes.
Open, locks,
Whoever knocks.
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
I did get around to actually finishing episode 3 now, and I have to admit the HTH fight was surprisingly well done, comparable to Nikita and the SHIELD season finale.Luckily this show is one of those 11-13 episodes a season shows that actually knows how to work that, and they have very good hand to hand fight choreography.
Björn Paulsen
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
"Travelers with closed minds can tell us little except about themselves."
--Chinua Achebe
Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
I always did wonder why they didn't know enough not to pick up a Protector's gun and try to fire it though.
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Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
To be fair, the first 3 episodes of SG-1 was boobs and "fixing" societies that step on individual rights. I saw the first episode of Continuum but now I'll probably going back to it
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Re: Continuum, the show, and why you should hate it
Eleas, I think you're being way too harsh in regards to Continuum. It's not some right-wing propaganda piece and things aren't nearly as black and white as they initially appear to be. No, if anything this show is all about shades of grey. Does the future of 2077 seem peaceful and orderly initially? Yes, but that's only because what you've seen so far hasn't even scratched the surface. As the world is expanded upon it's revealed that the North American Union of 2077 is a horrible place to live if you aren't well-off. It's very much a corporate-dominated dystopia. A nightmare. This is a future that needs to be averted not fought for.
Are some of the members of Liber8 incredibly brutal in their methods and tactics (Such as Travis Verta and Jasmine Garza)? Yes, they are. Travis, the leader of the Liber8 members stranded in the present at that point in the story, was part of a corporate super-soldier program before he joined the movement. Every revolutionary movement in history has had people like him in it. He and others like him weren't recruited for their ability to be compassionate. They're there to do as much damage as possible for Liber8's cause. But even so, we still get to see their back stories as well. In the hands of other leaders Liber8 is shown to be quite capable of playing the long-game and using non-violent means to accomplish their goals. Are they the heroes? Not by a long-shot. But given the monstrous nature of what they're fighting against I can't help but have a certain degree of empathy for what they've been through.
And Kiera is very far from being the perfect heroine despite her obvious beauty. In fact, I wouldn't call her a heroine at all. She's just the protagonist. She's been shown to be selfish, narrow-minded, short-sighted and secretive. She's even willing to resort to torture and summary execution at one point even if it might not be justified (and may in fact lead to the possibility she was trying to rectify in the first place). It's only now three seasons onward that she seems to be gradually realising that the supposedly ideal system that she swore to serve and protect is in fact less than perfect (to put it mildly). She's a misguided pawn in more ways than one. One member of Liber8 tells her that she's "asleep" and that's a fairly accurate summation of her character.
Having seen the first two seasons and seven episodes of the third I'd say that you've definitely misinterpreted things. I think it's compelling science-fiction with a nice musical score (even if it can be slow-paced at times). I'd recommend that you stick with it and see where it goes.
Are some of the members of Liber8 incredibly brutal in their methods and tactics (Such as Travis Verta and Jasmine Garza)? Yes, they are. Travis, the leader of the Liber8 members stranded in the present at that point in the story, was part of a corporate super-soldier program before he joined the movement. Every revolutionary movement in history has had people like him in it. He and others like him weren't recruited for their ability to be compassionate. They're there to do as much damage as possible for Liber8's cause. But even so, we still get to see their back stories as well. In the hands of other leaders Liber8 is shown to be quite capable of playing the long-game and using non-violent means to accomplish their goals. Are they the heroes? Not by a long-shot. But given the monstrous nature of what they're fighting against I can't help but have a certain degree of empathy for what they've been through.
And Kiera is very far from being the perfect heroine despite her obvious beauty. In fact, I wouldn't call her a heroine at all. She's just the protagonist. She's been shown to be selfish, narrow-minded, short-sighted and secretive. She's even willing to resort to torture and summary execution at one point even if it might not be justified (and may in fact lead to the possibility she was trying to rectify in the first place). It's only now three seasons onward that she seems to be gradually realising that the supposedly ideal system that she swore to serve and protect is in fact less than perfect (to put it mildly). She's a misguided pawn in more ways than one. One member of Liber8 tells her that she's "asleep" and that's a fairly accurate summation of her character.
Having seen the first two seasons and seven episodes of the third I'd say that you've definitely misinterpreted things. I think it's compelling science-fiction with a nice musical score (even if it can be slow-paced at times). I'd recommend that you stick with it and see where it goes.