REF vs. UN Spacy

Antediluvian · Post by **Antediluvian** » 2002-09-30 03:46pm

I don't know if this has been done before yet, but:

The REF before they tried to invade Invid-held Earth, vs. the UN Spacy during the time of Macross 7.

Who can prevail?

Note: I would like to use Palladium stats for both sides, so as to make for a simpler debate, for the purposes of this debate.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2002-09-30 03:49pm

What, exactly, are you talking about?

Antediluvian · Post by **Antediluvian** » 2002-09-30 04:00pm

Cyril wrote:What, exactly, are you talking about?

You don't know anything about Robotech or Macross, I assume?

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2002-09-30 04:01pm

Robomacron? Whaaaa?

Antediluvian · Post by **Antediluvian** » 2002-09-30 04:02pm

Cyril wrote:Robomacron? Whaaaa?

I'll take that as a no.

Evil Jerk · Post by **Evil Jerk** » 2002-09-30 05:24pm

Agh. Don't remind me of the third Robotech series.

Damaramu · Post by **Damaramu** » 2002-10-01 04:00am

Well, the Legioss and Tread fighters, I believe, are a bit underpowered compared to the likes of the VF-19 Excalibur, VF-22 Sturmvogel II and so on.

Antediluvian · Post by **Antediluvian** » 2002-10-01 02:10pm

I think the main reason the UN Spacy could be at a disadvantage is that they seem to rely too much on Variable Fighters, while the REF seems to have a more balanced force, with not just transforming fighters, but Cyclones, Battloids, Destroids, Wheeled vehicles, etc.

VF5SS · Post by **VF5SS** » 2002-10-01 02:59pm

Damaramu wrote:Well, the Legioss and Tread fighters, I believe, are a bit underpowered compared to the likes of the VF-19 Excalibur, VF-22 Sturmvogel II and so on.

Actually it was shown that the Legioss and Tred are inferior to a VF-1.

Antediluvian · Post by **Antediluvian** » 2002-10-01 03:08pm

VF5SS wrote:
Damaramu wrote:Well, the Legioss and Tread fighters, I believe, are a bit underpowered compared to the likes of the VF-19 Excalibur, VF-22 Sturmvogel II and so on.
Actually it was shown that the Legioss and Tred are inferior to a VF-1.

What are the Leigoss and Tread fighters anyway?

Damaramu · Post by **Damaramu** » 2002-10-01 04:22pm

Aka, Alpha and Beta fighters....

Their TRUE names from Genesis Climber Mospeada are Tread and Legioss...

VF5SS · Post by **VF5SS** » 2002-10-01 07:49pm

Oh the utter confusion Robocrap has caused...

Damaramu · Post by **Damaramu** » 2002-10-01 10:28pm

Word!

greenmm · Post by **greenmm** » 2002-10-02 12:44pm

VF5SS wrote:
Damaramu wrote:Well, the Legioss and Tread fighters, I believe, are a bit underpowered compared to the likes of the VF-19 Excalibur, VF-22 Sturmvogel II and so on.
Actually it was shown that the Legioss and Tred are inferior to a VF-1.

Shown where? And does it take into account the different roles they were designed for (VF-1 for long-range air superiority, Alpha/Beta for dogfighting and CAS)?

VF5SS · Post by **VF5SS** » 2002-10-02 02:54pm

Let's see...

VF-1A:

Unit type: all-environment variable fighter and tactical combat battroid Manufacturer: Northrom
Empty mass: 13250 kg
Standard takeoff mass: 18500 kg
Maximum takeoff mass: 37000 kg
Powerplant type: Shinnakasu Heavy Industry/P&W/Roice FF-2001 thermonuclear reaction turbine engine x 2
Powerplant output: 11500 kg each (23000 kg each in overboost) thrust and 650 MW power
Vernier thruster types: Shinnakasu Heavy Industry NBS-1 x 4, P&W LHP04 x 18
Armament: Mauler ROV-20 anti-aircraft laser cannon x 1, Howard GU-11 55 mm 3-barrel Gatling gun pod x 1 (200 rounds ammunition), underwing hardpoint x 4
Optional underwing hardpoint armament (per hardpoint): AMM-1 hybrid guided multi-purpose missile x 3, Mk.82 LDGB conventional bomb x 3, RMS-1 large anti-ship reaction missile x 1 on inboard hardpoint or x 2 on outboard hardpoint, UUM-7 15-tube micro-missile pod x 1 (carrying Bifors HMM-01 micro-missiles)
Optional equipment: Shinnakasu Heavy Industry GBP-1S protector weapon system, atmospheric-escape booster system, Shinnakasu Heavy Industry FAST Pack system
Crew: 1 pilot

Fighter mode:
Wingspan (fully extended): 14.78 meters
Wingspan (swept back 42 degrees): 12.12 meters
Wingspan (swept back 72 degrees): 8.25 meters
Wingspan (stowed position): 4.70 meters
Overall length: 14.23 meters
Overall height: 3.84 meters
Maximum level atmospheric speed at 10000 meters: Mach 2.71
Maximum level atmospheric speed at 30000+ meters: Mach 3.87
Space G-limits: +7 G

GERWALK mode:
Wingspan (fully extended): 14.78 meters
Wingspan (swept back 42 degrees): 12.12 meters
Wingspan (swept back 72 degrees): 8.25 meters
Wingspan (stowed position): 4.70 meters
Overall length: 11.3 meters
Overall height: 8.7 meters
Maximum walking speed: 100 km/h
Maximum level atmospheric flying speed: 500 km/h
Minimum level atmospheric flying speed: 0 km/h (VTOL capable) Maximum hovering time using 13000 kg x 2 thrust: 70 seconds
Maximum hovering time using 11500 kg x 2 thrust: 420 seconds

Battroid mode:
Overall height: 12.68 meters
Overall width: 7.3 meters
Wingspan (fully extended): 14.78 meters
Overall length: 4.0 meters
Maximum walking speed: 160 km/h
Operational underwater depth: 100 meters

Transformation time:
Minimum time fighter-to-GERWALK automated: 1.5 seconds (approximate)
Minimum time GERWALK-to-battroid automated: under 2 seconds Standard time fighter-to-battroid automated: under 5 seconds
Minimum time fighter-to-battroid manual: 0.9 seconds

Battroid mode equipped with GBP-1S protector weapon system:
Unofficial codename: Armored Valkyrie
Overall height: 14.1 meters
Overall width: 9.8 meters
Overall length: 4.8 meters
Standard operational mass: 37100 kg
Additional armament: 28 cm Erlikon GH-32 Grenade Crusher micro-missile x 56 (in 11-tube shoulder launcher x 2, 5-tube chest launcher x 2, 4-tube side leg launcher x 4, 4-tube rear leg launcher x 2), Erlikon GA-100 Crusher high-speed armor-penetrating projectile x 6 (in 3-tube arm launcher x 2), Ramington H-22T large hand grenade x 6 (on 3-slot hip rack x 2)

AFC-01I Legioss Armo-Fighter:
Series one aerospace variable combat mecha.
Dimensions:
Armo-Fighter Armo-Diver Armo-Soldier
Total Length: 10.25m 8.00m 5.25m
Total Height: 4.60m 5.72m 8.75m
Total Width: - 4.84m 4.84m
Total Wingspan: 8.20m - -
Total Dry Weight: 16.70 tons (metric)

Propulsion:
Powerplant: 2 JG-97M liquid hydrogen-cell turbines
Fuel Capacity:
16 standard HBT cells(Four 4-paks)
1 dedicated canister for gun pod

Performance:
Armo-Fighter Mode:
Max level speed : 2465 kph at 18000m (Mach 2.3)
1100 kph at sea level (Mach 1.0)
Stall speed : 182 kph (VTOL rectification possible)
Initial climb rate : over 20000m per minute
Unboosted service ceiling: 26 km
Armo-Diver Mode:
Max level speed : 1200 kph at 12000m
Stall speed : None (VTOL)
Service ceiling : 15000m
Armo-Soldier Mode:
Max running speed : 110 kph
Max flying speed : 482 kph
Service ceiling : 3050m
General:
Combat radius (space) : total delta-v 1.8 kps, with internal reaction mass only.
(Earth) : until exhaustion of fuel, atmosphere or pilot endurance, whichever comes first.
HBT supply : 250 hours(10 days) operational use.

Well...

VF5SS · Post by **VF5SS** » 2002-10-02 02:57pm

Funny thing that the Legioss is faster in Armo-Diver mode than the VF-1 is in GERWALK mode.