alliances

[starcraft]

1) What are the alliances that form between powers?

2) What alliance wins?

Each power is in there own separate galaxy(s)and forst meetings happen by various means. Ex. Wormholes, slipstream drive, and etc.

B5: After formation of Instellar Alliance.
Star Wars: Empire at its peak.
Federation: Ditto
Commonwealth: Pre-Thud
starcraft:beggining

[Renewed_Valour1]

Well you have two main Empires here and I know nothing of StarCraft

One is a very large fairly content capitalistic constitutional monarchy in the form of the Commonwealth. The other the Empire is a large dictatorship where you have an Empire that believes the proper way to put down a rebellion is to blow up the entire planet. I think you'll find the end result is most of the powers will polarize to one or the other. The Commonwealth and Empire can have a nice Cold War but can't really carry out a large scale war against the other. They both have the strategic weapons to assure that neither of them is going to be standing after it.

[His Divine Shadow]

A note, the Empire is also capitalistic in nature and it's citizens can life a decent life if they behave.

I believe the Empire might move on both galaxies, B5 and ST and probably take them totally over or take large chunks, I am not sure what the commonwealths response would be to that, I doubt they'd like to go to war anyhow, I believe thats the one power they will not move against.

Ofcourse the Commonwealth might get to anyone of these sooner too, it depends on who is quicker to seize the initaitive, but I'm pretty sure that the Emperor with his farseeing powers will mobilize against the two weakest universes, or most usefull ones the first, the two most usefull and weak ones being B5 and ST for their respective technologies like B5 hyperspace and such.

The Commonwealth might ally with the StarCraft universe though.

After this the two camps will probably polarize into two extremes and the wormholes connecting SW, B5 and ST to the CW and StarCraft universes will probably be blockaded as hard as possible as to ensure zero technology or any information from leaking through to either side.

After that I believe it's up to internal conflicts again to decide the outcome.
The Empire will most likely stand as it's demise was brought on by such an incredible string of dumb luck and arrogance that in a few years when it has increased it's millitary forces by several times it'll stabilize.

I am not sure about the Commonwealth, these events could stop the long night from occuring, it depends on how much influence a blockaded wormhole that nothing ever enters or exits through will matter, and by the time of the magog invasion it could have gone centuries.

If it's close to the big "thud" the CW is more likely to pull together, if not and things work out as I expect, we'd pretty much be left with the same CW unierse plus the Starcraft one in it(wich is probably rather uneventfull after the CW exterminate the Zerg).

[Renewed_Valour1]

it's citizens can life a decent life if they behave.

Behaving in the Commonwealth and "behaving" in the Empire are two very different things.

I believe the Empire might move on both galaxies, B5 and ST and probably take them totally over or take large chunks, I am not sure what the commonwealths response would be to that, I doubt they'd like to go to war anyhow, I believe thats the one power they will not move against.

I think the Commonwealth's use of slipstream and knowledge of the galaxy offset the advantage the Emperor has with his Force Powers. Sure it might not be same exact galaxy the Commonwealth is used to but they all have a common frame of reference in Earth. Considering Earth, San-Ska-Re and Tarn Vedra are the cornerstones of the Commonwealth they'll investigate those locations as soon as they arrive and discover the similarity. The Empire in addition is limited by having to map out the galaxy; whereas the Commonwealth has the advantages that the two respective Earth's present them.

I don't think the Commonwealth can afford to not move against the Empire in this case. They can have a rough parity with the Empire because the two can really level each other with strategic weaponry. Letting the Empire size two galaxies worth of resources; however will have repercussions. I think they'll have to put the High Guard in between of the Empire and the still unoccupied territories. Then it comes down to a case of whether the Empire is willing to attempt to blast through the High Guard thus risking the territory they've gained and perhaps even MAD.

I suspect what we will see is both the Empire and Commonwealth fortify their ends of the wormholes so heavily that neither side has a chance of punching through. Then you'll see then pour into the two galaxies with the Empire taking the areas around the wormhole and the Commonwealth those around Earth and the surrounding area. If the Empire does try to push the Commonwealth back the Commonwealth would probably try to launch an attack on the Empire's wormhole using nova bombs.

[His Divine Shadow]

This all depends on the situation, if just a few wormholes pop up connecting the main CW galaxy and the SW, ST and B5 galaxiess in a ring formation or something, then it would go the Empire since the Emperors foresight and forcepowers are the only things that could accurately find a closed wormhole and the potentials they gain.

For the others they only have dumb luck to rely on and in a whole galaxy it's not likely.

[Renewed_Valour1]

For the others they only have dumb luck to rely on and in a whole galaxy it's not likely.

I think a potential hostile invasion on the part of the Empire shifting the balance from the Commonwealth would bring Trance or her people into play to alert/manipulate the Commonwealth to find where the wormholes are.

Though for both sides it does depend to a high degree where the wormholes are. I'd be cuirious where the thread started ends to have wormholes be discovered or what methods, and when they discover each other.

[His Divine Shadow]

I think a potential hostile invasion on the part of the Empire shifting the balance from the Commonwealth would bring Trance or her people into play to alert/manipulate the Commonwealth to find where the wormholes are.

Though for both sides it does depend to a high degree where the wormholes are. I'd be cuirious where the thread started ends to have wormholes be discovered or what methods, and when they discover each other.

I don't believe Trance or her people are known to any of the CW species as of "pre-thud" time, and since the Empire does not want to invade the CW, just blockade the inroads in and out of the CW, or atleast they would not want to if I where the Emperor.
Prefferably destroy the wormholes if possible.

[Setzer]

1) What are the alliances that form between powers?

2) What alliance wins?

Each power is in there own separate galaxy(s)and forst meetings happen by various means. Ex. Wormholes, slipstream drive, and etc.

B5: After formation of Instellar Alliance.
Star Wars: Empire at its peak.
Federation: Ditto
Commonwealth: Pre-Thud
starcraft:beggining

I know nothing of the Commonwealth, but Starcraft is far weaker than the Empire, or even the Federation. In the manual it says the Terran Confederacy spanned about 12 Planets. 'Nuff said.

[Renewed_Valour1]

I don't believe Trance or her people are known to any of the CW species as of "pre-thud" time,

The Vedrans had fragmentary records on the activities of Trance's people according to the data Harper had from the All Systems University. They also had their language translated to sufficient degree that Harper was able to sign a hymn of it to her.

I know nothing of the Commonwealth,

Over a million member worlds and spanned six galaxies at the peak of it.

[Enlightenment]

I know nothing of the Commonwealth,

Over a million member worlds and spanned six galaxies at the peak of it.

"Was that the Galactic Empire we just ran over or was it just a speedbump?"

[His Divine Shadow]

"Was that the Galactic Empire we just ran over or was it just a speedbump?"

No, thats the other way around, the galactic Empire has 1 million full-member worlds, and from there another 49-50 million worlds, colonies and protectorates.

[His Divine Shadow]

The Vedrans had fragmentary records on the activities of Trance's people according to the data Harper had from the All Systems University. They also had their language translated to sufficient degree that Harper was able to sign a hymn of it to her.

Ok, but the Empire is still no threat to the CW or their galaxies.

[Renewed_Valour1]

No, thats the other way around, the galactic Empire has 1 million full-member worlds, and from there another 49-50 million worlds, colonies and protectorates.

Neither way around is the correct way to put it. The Empire has an advantage when it comes to firepower and industry. The Commonwealth has a superior FTL speed and strategic weaponry. The Empire has a handful of fair to powerful strategic weapons compared to the Commonwealth having an extremely extensive stock of nova bombs. In short both powers will end up blasting the other into submission with strategic weapons.

Ok, but the Empire is still no threat to the CW or their galaxies.

Having a very large Empire intent on expanding at their doorstep isn't a threat?

The other factor is just how good is the Emperors ability to randomly spot objects and deal with them. Why didn't he just spot and eliminate Luke, Obi-Wan, or Yoda well prior to the events in ANH? Why did Vader bother with Bounty Hunters rather than the Emperor just finding their location? There's other times in the trilogy where the Emperor could have just said go here, you'll find this, and deal with it this way. He can do it but I wouldn't exactly say he has an ability that is even close to foolproof.

[His Divine Shadow]

Having a very large Empire intent on expanding at their doorstep isn't a threat?

As I said, the Empire doesn't want that, atleast not if the Emperor would do as I say he would, it's not worth it due to the strategic weapons, what they would want to do is to take over the ST and B5 civilizations and then blockade or destroy the wormholes to the commonwealth.

The other factor is just how good is the Emperors ability to randomly spot objects and deal with them. Why didn't he just spot and eliminate Luke, Obi-Wan, or Yoda well prior to the events in ANH?

Obi-Wan and Yoda went into active hiding using their powers, this is possible.
As for luke, he hardly used the force outside Dagobah and near Obi-wan, and not using the force is one way to cloak oneself.

Why did Vader bother with Bounty Hunters rather than the Emperor just finding their location?

It doesn't work that way, the Emperor sees the future, or it's possibilities, he can see many possible futures, he could see when the CW and EMpire where at war and what caused it, he could see his Empire take over the B5 and/or ST galaxies, he could see how this possible, he could scout out that area of space in the present and possibly find a wormhole.
Major events like that is what the Emperor can forsee, not these small localized things.
And it also depends on what one chooses to do with this information.

As I said, it's unlikely the CW will ever know of the wormholes, if the Emperor plays it smart.

[Renewed_Valour1]

As I said, the Empire doesn't want that, atleast not if the Emperor would do as I say he would, it's not worth it due to the strategic weapons, what they would want to do is to take over the ST and B5 civilizations and then blockade or

There is still a direct hindrance to the future of the Commonwealth. By holding those extra territories and the technology in them the Commonwealth has an upper hand against stopping the Magog and preventing the Long Night. That alone should be enough to interest Trance's people into manipulating events in favor of the Commonwealth.

The other thing is a wormhole mysteriously appearing will most likely cause a disruption or change in the slipstream. This of course depends on the exact nature of the wormhole but both mass and gravity affect slipstream in a manner that you can detect at "FTL speeds" across the slipstream. The crew of the Andromeda use a similar method to track down Jeger and his ship in Harper 2.0.

destroy the wormholes to the commonwealth.

With what? The Commonwealth can do it by opening a slipstream portal or tossing in nova bombs. Even deploying and charging the slipstream runners might have enough of a disruptive effect. The Empire on the other hand has nothing quite like that.

The other factor is just how good is the Emperors ability to randomly spot objects and deal with them. Why didn't he just spot and eliminate Luke, Obi-Wan, or Yoda well prior to the events in ANH?

Major events like that is what the Emperor can forsee, not these small localized things.
And it also depends on what one chooses to do with this information.

Major events he can see? So the fact that he gets killed and the Empire gets squashed at Endor due to a large part because of the work of Leia, Hans, and Luke can be called a "small localized event". He should have been able to track back from a major event like Endor plus all the fallout from it for years and see who caused it. Then deal with them before they ever began a threat to him in any form. Last time I checked wormholes aren't exactly great users of the Force; so it should be cloaked in a similar manner to Luke.

[Mr Bean]

Yes the Hinderance for the CW

The Empire can rip through fleets of thier ships just as fast as the CW can rip through thier worlds with Nova bombs

And intresting situation

The Empire and CW fair equaly well aginst B5 and Federation
The Empire because its weapons are 500 Times more than Nessary and can each ISD can take a pounding from over a hundred ST or B5 ships and still win easily

The CW because ITS weapons are exactly the size nessary to kill those 100 ships
Though they can't soak anything vaugly close to what an ISD can they can kill the ST and B5 Ships MUCH faster(320 a Sec for the AD? Need maybe 4 missles tops to kill any ST or B5 Ship? yeah thats quick)

However while the CW will loose and loose baddly in a strait up fight with SW the Nova bombs realy make the siuation very odd


Hmmm

Kinda like if we modleded it after today

The Empire is USA except we only have ten Nuke, But four Hundred Iowa's and Fifty Fully Manned Carrier's and 100 Seawolfs with a 10 million standing Army

Meanwhile the CW(Russia) has a 20 Million army and 5 million nukes... But no Navy, meaning they have to Nuke or not fight at all

Meanwhile ST is France
And B5 is Germany

Both countrys have a... five person army


And then off to the side, Star-craft, The odd-ball
Lets call it China and delcar its Army TBA

[His Divine Shadow]

There is still a direct hindrance to the future of the Commonwealth. By holding those extra territories and the technology in them the Commonwealth has an upper hand against stopping the Magog and preventing the Long Night. That alone should be enough to interest Trance's people into manipulating events in favor of the Commonwealth.

I don't see it that way, if that really where true they would have warned about the magog earlier so the Nietszheans wouldn't hate them so much.
The commonwealth has 6 galaxies, if it can't survive on that it's going to die anyway.

Sofar any intervention on behalf of Trances people sound unlikely given that they didn't warn the nietscheans about the Magog, had they done that the nietzscheans would not have had the same hatred that caused them to break up the CW.
Trances people could easily have prevented the long night that way.
No, I am now seriously doubting this.

The other thing is a wormhole mysteriously appearing will most likely cause a disruption or change in the slipstream.

Sounds like a load of assumptions to me, there is nothing that says wormholes has to be connected to slipstream.
I could say it's the same with hyperspace and SW would detect it too.

With what? The Commonwealth can do it by opening a slipstream portal or tossing in nova bombs. Even deploying and charging the slipstream runners might have enough of a disruptive effect. The Empire on the other hand has nothing quite like that.

I don't see why the Commonwealth can do it that way either, you just assume that, I don't see any reason why more conventional methods wont work either.

Major events he can see?

Is there an echo in here?

So the fact that he gets killed and the Empire gets squashed at Endor due to a large part because of the work of Leia, Hans, and Luke can be called a "small localized event". He should have been able to track back from a major event like Endor plus all the fallout from it for years and see who caused it. Then deal with them before they ever began a threat to him in any form. Last time I checked wormholes aren't exactly great users of the Force; so it should be cloaked in a similar manner to Luke

Do you have any idea what I just said or did you decide to act like this on purpose just to try and anger me?
I've already said how it works and even Yoda said it "the future is always in motion" and that one can see many futures not all which are not going to happen, DID YOU NOT GET THIS!?! The Emperor could not have seen more than the timelines where he won and lost.

Are you instead just going to nitpick on the fact that the Emperor was too arrogant to believe any of the instances where he lost were going to happen?
You're attempting to define certain events as being something the Emperor could see or not, I don't see why in any objective sense of the word, I do see why in the vs. related sense of the word, and it's not pleasing to watch.

Please stop treating this as some versus where you have to jump on every last piece of evidence and yank at it until it does what you want it to for your "side" to "win" somehow, I thought we where having a rational discussion on what would happen here instead and under my scenario(wormholes pop into existence noone knows about them anywwhere), mine is the more likely one, I don't see why you have to make the CW get it's share of galaxies too or something, frankly it already has a good share of galaxies.

Because:
A) The Emperors powers are known to be within the scope of this
B) Trances people are not known to be capable of this, certain events confirm it, like the Magog and Nietzscheans.
C) No other sci-fi empire is likely to find them
D) Empire is not likely to want to go to war with the CW and therefore leaves them alone or destroys the wormholes

E) Everyone lives happily ever after.

Seems like the perfect arrangement to me.

[Renewed_Valour1]

Sounds like a load of assumptions to me, there is nothing that says wormholes has to be connected to slipstream. I could say it's the same with hyperspace and SW would detect it too. .

If a wormhole exists in realspace it is "connected" to the slipstream. I imagine that in a similar case a wormhole is liable to have an effect on hyperspace navigation if it has any mass or gravity to it.

Objects in real space affect slipstream; which is a canon fact in the show. The mass or gravity of objects both have an effect on how slipstream operates. The dimensional tunnel or wormhole in "Wheel" apparently prevented the Andromeda from simply slipstreaming away. The Andromeda was able to detect and track Jeger because of the unique effect that either his PSP or tesseracting equipment had on slipstream. Having a wormhole pop up into real space is going to have some effect of varying degrees of severity on slipstream. From just influencing the flow of the stream like Jeger's equipment or totally disrupting travel to the immediate area.

I don't see why the Commonwealth can do it that way either, you just assume that, I don't see any reason why more conventional methods wont work either.

The Andromeda collapsed the dimensional wormhole in "Tunnel at the End of the Light" using Rosey. Rosey was basically just a severely ramped up and more powerful version of a nova bomb. It is something that was well within the capabilities of the Commonwealth to build. Now care to show some proof that Star Wars can collapse wormholes?

The Empire is USA except we only have ten Nuke, But four Hundred Iowa's and Fifty Fully Manned Carrier's and 100 Seawolfs with a 10 million standing Army

Meanwhile the CW(Russia) has a 20 Million army and 5 million nukes... But no Navy, meaning they have to Nuke or not fight at all

I wouldn't totally count out the High Guard. In a defensive situation with time to prepare they can give a Star Wars fleet an extremely bloody nose. Jumping into a system defended by a couple million deployed smart and offensive missiles supported by drones can ruin anyone's day. Once the Star Wars vessels hyperspace in they could be held in normal space by the defensive fleet opening slipstream portals. Think of it as a interdiction field but on the order of magnitude several times stronger and more effective.

The strategic weapon statement is just about right on. The High Guard isn't going to resort to strategic weapons unless they see it as crucial to their continued existence. The Empire might not have the capability to take out the entire Commonwealth but they can lob off a few limbs very effectively. In contrast for the Empire it means having all of their major systems and a healthy amount of the minor ones being nova bombed.

[Mr Bean]

I wouldn't totally count out the High Guard. In a defensive situation with time to prepare they can give a Star Wars fleet an extremely bloody nose. Jumping into a system defended by a couple million deployed smart and offensive missiles supported by drones can ruin anyone's day.

Yes but they suffer from the FTL disantage basicly meaning the ISD can sit back and yell the equivlant of PULL as those Missles vector in towards thier last know position
Remeber Light Mintue Weapons and Light Hour Sensors means that any Droid or other stationary defenses are the Height of Stupidity

Once the Star Wars vessels hyperspace in they could be held in normal space by the defensive fleet opening slipstream portals. Think of it as a interdiction field but on the order of magnitude several times stronger and more effective.

When have Slip-stream portals acted as Gravitaonal sources?
Or a better question when have Slip-stream Portals demosrated Large Masses?

Large Masses extend large gravitys which normaly prevent SW ships from Entering Hyperspace

Whata I mean?
Well you see Large Gravitonal Sources don't Completly Prevent ships from Entering Hyperspace, Rather they cause overheating and catsorophic faliure within the Hyperdrive

IE-A Ship can still jump to Hyperspace even on the surface of a planet, However the fact is that large amount of Gravity causes the Hyperdrives to overheat(From the strain of keeping the ship in Hyperspace) annd... Exploded

Its not that they can't its the fact the Hyperdrive motviators can't staned the strane
Small nitpick but worth mentiong

[Renewed_Valour1]

When have Slip-stream portals acted as Gravitaonal sources?

"All Too Human": Hunt used the tactic of opening a slipstream portal near several PSPs to redirect them away from Mobius. The portals actually slightly redirected the patch and hauled into it several PSPs with the mass of a planet traveling at around .5 c. The same portal in turn inflicted heavy damage to Mobius due to the portal being too close.

"Bunker Hill": The portals formed by the detonating slipstream cores pulled in the Andromeda and along with a good portion of the rest of the Commonwealth fleet.

In bother cases you are dealing with a very powerful gravity field. The entire concept of a slipstream portal is that it is a massive and concentrated utilization of artificial gravity from the slipstream runners that rips a portal into slipstream.

If could gather a handle full of slipstream capable vessels together they could lay down enough portals to keep a vessel trapped in the system. Having your hyperdrive fail or worse in Commonwealth space isn't a great way to insure your continued survival. IIRC Interdictors are successful in that they trigger safety systems in the hyperdrive that prevent them from jumping away? If Interdictors are successful for trapping a fleet in a location then slipstream portals should work too.

Yes but they suffer from the FTL disantage basicly meaning the ISD can sit back and yell the equivalent of PULL as those Missles vector in towards their last know position Remeber Light Minute Weapons and Light Hour Sensors means that any Droid or other stationary defenses are the Height of Stupidity.

Your last know position will be where you'll still be sitting if you are interdicted by slipportals. These drone defenses and missile fields are far from stationary. All Systems describes them as roving packs of hunter killers led by Oracle drones

[His Divine Shadow]

Having a wormhole pop up into real space is going to have some effect of varying degrees of severity on slipstream. From just influencing the flow of the stream like Jeger's equipment or totally disrupting travel to the immediate area.

It might not have any effect, it might be in deep space it might be in a system noone knows about it, it might require a black hole

The Andromeda collapsed the dimensional wormhole in "Tunnel at the End of the Light" using Rosey. Rosey was basically just a severely ramped up and more powerful version of a nova bomb. It is something that was well within the capabilities of the Commonwealth to build. Now care to show some proof that Star Wars can collapse wormholes?

Since that dimensional tunnel is not an actual wormhole as I believe we would classify it but something else, I don't see how it correlates.
But since your essentially saying extreme gravitational stress is the key a shit load of ramped Gravity-shock devices or just one big one coupled to the deathstar or Ecplise should do it, unless a superlaser by itself could be hazardous to it.

In contrast for the Empire it means having all of their major systems and a healthy amount of the minor ones being nova bombed

I've always wondered about that point, since SW forces could scramble quickly to intercept any entering system, especially something that produces a gravitational influence like a slipstream rift, and after a few nova-bombed systems it would loose efficency as guarding important systems becomes important, but thats another issue.

I'm sure they could get a few major system but they could not get them all, they'd probably get alot of the smaller ones though.

As for the results of this, the Empires Armed Forces nearly doubled in power during ANH and TESB, they where expecting 10 trillion members within 5 years to a rather limited group for youth-indoctrination.

That and they can start building those automated droids that build war factories that exponentially expand.
Infact just one such droid set loose somewhere in a galaxy could wihthin a decade have a huge warfleet and ship-yards ready while pumping out more droids and ships at the same time.

Couple that with upping the intelligence level for the droids to human level(perfectly possible but not done anymore for millitary droids, too unsafe) and you could have a exponentially growing self-sufficient enemy building in your galaxy that has no needs of regular resources except more resources, it would be like leaving a plague in someones backyard.

[Mr Bean]

Your last know position will be where you'll still be sitting if you are interdicted by slipportals

They still have a Regular drive that can get them to fractions of C

And anything under 50k Missles(50,000x100MT= 5,000,000 MT or 5 Teratons) will be a laugh for the ISD, Even minium figures have it at 15.8 Teratons and Most likey slaps it at 27.8 Petatons or nothing short of 50 MILLION missles will grap an ISDs attention

[kojikun]

Systems Commonwealth versus Empire:

To be honest, this is a difficult fight. The Commonwealth has approximately 150,000 dedicated combat and/or exploration vessels, and 210,000 long-range logistics support ships but extremely large quantities of star-destroying bombs can be manufactured by standard ship machine shops (the andromeda ascendant is presently manufacturing a large quantity of them in one of her many machine ships. The total number a ship can hold is unknown, but it appears to be quite large considering that even fighters can carry nova bombs (total shrike and phoenix type fighters onboard is 112). This would suggest a lower limit on nova bombs to be 112 (since the ship holds 112 fighters which are numerous times the size of novabombs). Therefore, a single XMC class can obliterate 112 starsystems and their planets.

However, and this is a very very large however, no Commonwealth starship is known to have shield technology rendering them insanely vulnerable to any sort of intership combat.

Also, the lack of FTL communications, and thus the dependence on couriers, makes a wide spread war difficult.

I suspect that any SCvGE war will be waged using guerilla tactics. The Commonwealth simply cannot fight a ship-to-ship war with the Galactic Empire. However, the Empire will be extremely vulnerable to novabomb attacks.

Overall, I'd say that if a war were to be fought, it would be offensive for the Empire. They simply have too big of a ship-to-ship advantage. They could crush any offensive force sent by the Commonwealth, and thus prevent incursion into home territory, while at the same time making a push into the Commonwealth without taking any damage except where the SC is willing to destroy their own systems. The Systems Commonwealth is most likely to destroy the wormhole long before any war begins. If they do not, they will be forced to pull back to the furthest galaxy from the wormhole and wait the thousand or so years for the Empire to reach them, however by this time the Empire will have fallen, hopefully. If not, the Commonwealth better have developed shields (possibly reverse engineered from captured ships) or it will be destroyed totally and utterly.

Any alliances between powers will result in the same. The Federation and ISA would ally with the commonwealth, I'm not sure about the StarCraft stuff. Assuming that the Commonwealth could back engineer Federation shield technology, they MIGHT have a fighting chance but if not, the thing plays out as stated above.

[Mr Bean]

wait the thousand or so years for the Empire to reach them

They have a Speed Advantage but its not THAT Big

Second as I pointed out eariler 100-1 Fights and the ISD stands a good chance of winning(Unlike Feddy fights where 1000-1 and still the ISD can't lose ) mean the Commonweath is at a huge disatvanatage espcilly if the Empire does the Smart thing, Blocaked the Woreholes(Very easy for them to do IMO 12 ISD per hole can hold of the cube of thier number easily)(12^3 for the slow people here)

And simply let loose the World Devsatators and Harrasers in CW systems. The avarage Star-system Containts a Large *Ort Cloud that can be mined and tons of unhabated systems that can be mined and easily escaped from if Nova Bombed(Even if they where mining as close as Venus they still have a full mintues warning to escape, more than sufficent for some of the assests to get away, Certinaly the WD though much of the mining ships/extras would be lost
Plus any Gas Gant Ring systems or somtimes like Osen in SW which is basicly a large astroid field

All of them contain large amounts of rocks for the WD to mine and Considering how WD fair(The literly EAT ISD for Lunch) they should be fine by themselves

[Renewed_Valour1]

It might not have any effect, it might be in deep space it might be in a system no one knows about it, it might require a black hole.

The point you're missing is that you don't need to be in the system to know the effect an object has on the slipstream. Jeger could have been in any one of thousands of systems yet they were able to detect him through slipstream. We have all ready seen that wormholes like the one from Tunnel affect slipstream.

Since that dimensional tunnel is not an actual wormhole as I believe we would classify it but something else, I don't see how it correlates.

The tunnel pretty much fits the definition and popular description of a wormhole. It managed to connect two points in space together and allow passage between them. Unless you want to place Star Wars in the same universe as the Commonwealth; which case the Commonwealth can ignore wormholes in favor of just slipstreaming. Mentioning the thread starter has listed slipstream as a valid way to reach the other powers.

But since your essentially saying extreme gravitational stress is the key a shit load of ramped Gravity-shock devices or just one big one coupled to the deathstar or Ecplise should do it, unless a superlaser by itself could be hazardous to it. .

Now prove Star Wars has anything on the order of the power of a nova bomb cubed like Roseanne and I'll agree with you.

I've always wondered about that point, since SW forces could scramble quickly to intercept any entering system, especially something that produces a gravitational influence like a slipstream rift, and after a few nova-bombed systems it would loose efficency as guarding important systems becomes important, but thats another issue.

1) You really think the Commonwealth will nova bomb a few systems and then stop? Then five the Empire time to plan before hitting more. The High Guard alone has over 60,000 of one variant of Shrike fighter and All Systems says several variants were made. That would be 60,000+ fighters, each of which can be carrying a nova bomb to an Imperial system. Then you have 150,000 capital ships in the High Guard DSXs, DSA, XMCs, or GDFs all capable of carrying nova bombs. Since nova bombs can be fitted to a small two man fighter most patrol craft can probably be armed with them. The Empire could easily lose on the extreme low end 100,000+ systems in a first strike.

2) Ships can drop out of slipstream much closer to stars than they can slip back out. The Andromeda at Hephatoios dropped out of slipstream at a distance where it only took her a few minutes at perhaps 45 PSL to reach the blackhole. She was within nova bomb range from Rhade's statement when the Nietzschean fleet moved to engage her. If she can pop out of slipstream near a blackhole within a few minutes at cruising speed from being in nova bomb range then a star isn't a big deal. The fighters in "To Loose the Faithful Lightning" might have at most taken 4 or 5 minutes to reach the star and they used kamikaze tactics rather than firing with a missile. So any ships guarding will have at most only 5 minutes to respond to an attack that might be anywhere. It takes time to detect someone, maneuver to intercept, and then plot a jump. If you have multiple attackers coming in from a few different directions you are screwed.

3) Furthermore by opening slipstream portals the nova bomb carrying vessels can prevent anyone from using hyperspace. Without microjumps a SW vessel has no chance of catching and intercepting a HG vessel when they only have a few minutes.