SD.net's World OOC/Discussion thread?

Post by **RogueIce** » 2008-04-10 01:42pm

My speech, urging peace and harmony, not argument and aggression

I would agree that a Full Conference may be too much. How about then a MESS-OMSK-FA Conference? We are effectively the three major power blocs, and an agreement by the three of us would be of most use, as most of the remaining nations remain isolationist and distant from the growing tensions.

As far as MESS solidarity, I agree we can definately work on this. And that we should certainly try to plan for a time when most can attend together, rather than have agreements hammered out and others playing catch-up.

I would almost say find a way to do something like an IRC or AIM chat if it was possible, too.

For my part, I'll certainly work on bringing the MESS together in reaching international cooperation and lessening the rhetoric. Coyote, could I perhaps count on your support with the MESS towards this end?

Post by **RogueIce** » 2008-04-10 01:58pm

If you look at it, we're a lot like pre-WWI Europe, and in a lot of ways what happened is largely expected and probably realistic.

Syndromia attacks Zoria, which naturally brings to the front the fear we all had: that this world would be little more than massive wars and utter destruction. The war is eventually stopped and, thanks to international action, the tension is somewhat eased. However, what actually transpired (or at least, what was known by those outside the conflict to have happened, which could easily be two seperate things) still left some unease.

Eventually we all settle into, basically, two power blocs: the MESS as one, and given the FUNGAL AXIS and OMSK Pact alliance, they make up the second. A member of the FA, Darth Shady, again acts brashly but this time, his actions target a member of the MESS. This triggers a reponse, and since the Shadow Empire is a member of the FA (and by extension under the protection of OMSK) this generates considerable tension between both powers. A tension which quickly snowballs, thanks to a number of other incidents.

Such was not unexpected, I think, by most. I have said it often: in this scenario, starting a world war is the easy part. Maintaining the peace, that is the challenge. Hopefully we'll be up to it.

Decue · Post by **Decue** » 2008-04-10 02:00pm

I'm sure the good people at Aunt Maria's can come up with a new taste like "salty fish biscuits" or something like that for "The Perfect Drinking Experience (tm)".

On an unrelated note, I will be gone friday to sunday so dont put me into some international incident until I come back, ok?

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2008-04-10 02:03pm

oh, btw there are positions open in the new university.

though right now were building things in labs and constructing very big cool things.

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2008-04-10 02:08pm

This game is a fascinating look into how conflicts are created, dontcha think? I mean, we are all pretty rational and sane people, but all it takes is one seed of distrust, and it snowballs pretty much by its own.

Hell, my first instinct was to create a massive missile shield so that carrier-wielding nations couldn't bomb me to dust. I mean, automatically I foresaw all those huge nations around me bombing me for kicks.

Is this human instincts at work, or what?

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2008-04-10 02:08pm

I'm gonna delegate PeZookia to making up numbers for the expected massive demand as Shroomania opens the MESS market to the ACV and FCS

EDIT:

Totally. And, so far, we've been excellent politicians. This thing is WAY WAY WAY more AWESOME than the Model UN, mang. Seriously, it's better than going "I am Zimbabwe. I beat you with stick, you WHITE MAN!" or some shit like that. The circumstances, the conditions.

It's also realistic that all the shit is stirred because of trigger-happy dudes who're too hot on their heels, while the more cautious dudes do damage control.

EDIT:

In the near future when the ACVs and FCS have been super-successful, we shall deal with environmental problems! Like overfishing! And then we can have people bonding together into a Greenpeace-like organization to PISS US ALL OFF!

Shroomania might pull a France and sink the Rainbow Warrior. Hah!

Post by **Coyote** » 2008-04-10 02:11pm

RogueIce wrote:For my part, I'll certainly work on bringing the MESS together in reaching international cooperation and lessening the rhetoric. Coyote, could I perhaps count on your support with the MESS towards this end?

But of course, m'sieu!

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2008-04-10 02:15pm

We all express agreement on world peace and conference and dialog and talk, and then Shep posts a stealth bomber

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2008-04-10 02:28pm

Shroom Man 777 wrote:We all express agreement on world peace and conference and dialog and talk, and then Shep posts a stealth bomber

Actually no; if you read back; I announced the program a while back; I'm just letting the production contracts now.

Post by **Coyote** » 2008-04-10 02:29pm

That's our Shep!

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2008-04-10 02:35pm

I love you too, Shep

Post by **RogueIce** » 2008-04-10 02:35pm

PeZook wrote:This game is a fascinating look into how conflicts are created, dontcha think? I mean, we are all pretty rational and sane people, but all it takes is one seed of distrust, and it snowballs pretty much by its own.

Hell, my first instinct was to create a massive missile shield so that carrier-wielding nations couldn't bomb me to dust. I mean, automatically I foresaw all those huge nations around me bombing me for kicks.

Is this human instincts at work, or what?

Indeed. Even as a game, we see threats to our lands and act to protect them. But in the course of doing so, this causes others to feel threatened, and they arm themselves. And it continues to escalate.

And it's not even real. If this were real, and it were my life and people on the line, would I have been so brave to generally refrain from massive arms procrument and make this call for peace? Or would I be doing everything I could within the MESS to make a buildup every bit the equal of what Shepnukistan is doing?

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2008-04-10 02:38pm

Seems like Lonestar and Shep are working on the same page

Though, really. Massive props to you, RI, and Coyote. And Stas. And Bean. And I'm gonna give myself a pat on the back too.

Post by **Coyote** » 2008-04-10 02:41pm

This is, indeed, quite fun. It's like one of those writing games, where different people write the next chapter in a book, and we're also playing a game of "Civilisation" while doing it. Kewl.

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2008-04-10 02:44pm

Well, I hope our more trigger-happy members don't go mad and yoink the Monopoly Set off our table, rip it to pieces, and then toss it to a bonfire

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2008-04-10 02:58pm

Arik, you and Rogue are making steps to cooperation, but it seems Lonestar and [hwoops, classified information] are not. And they are now speaking out against you for the JSEZ... well duh; we should have foreseen that.

But we were totally dismayed by the "we shutz down stuff" rethoric and the silly-nilly free for all space proposals (yeah, when Saddamistan could just tell us to GTFO - are you saying Skimmer is beyond such a prank later in the game when he nukes us all from orbit?). The JSEZ is the most sane thing that there is right now and speaking out against it means they just don't want to enter joint initiatives period.

Instead they work towards full militarization so the OMSK is curious why it shouldn't.

Actually even as this is an imaginary state, why would I want my imaginary people threatened?

Now seriously!!!

This is fun.

Post by **Beowulf** » 2008-04-10 03:15pm

The problem I have with JSEZ is that it enforces the broken idea that airspace extends to infinity and beyond, as opposed to when the air runs out. It's backed up by Shep's napkinwaffe ASAT missile, and Soviet-style saber rattling, with a good dose of bombastic propaganda thrown in ("Oh noes! Spy satellites can be orbited, revealing all our secrets!").

Post by **RogueIce** » 2008-04-10 03:21pm

Beowulf wrote:The problem I have with JSEZ is that it enforces the broken idea that airspace extends to infinity and beyond, as opposed to when the air runs out. It's backed up by Shep's napkinwaffe ASAT missile, and Soviet-style saber rattling, with a good dose of bombastic propaganda thrown in ("Oh noes! Spy satellites can be orbited, revealing all our secrets!").

Well strictly speaking it allows anything over 1000 miles to fly. Which, considering the original proposal of "anything over my landmass gets shot down" is better than nothing.

I will grant I am no expert in this field, but I would rather the 1000 mile limit to infinity plus one.

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2008-04-10 03:22pm

The problem I have with JSEZ is that it enforces the broken idea that airspace extends to infinity and beyond

If 1000 miles are infinity and beyond to Huang Di Beowulf, perhaps he should just enjoy his launches off from Tian Xia and make sure that LEO launches don't pass over JSEZ, or Saddamistan.

We see that you're objecting because LEO objects are not allowed; LEO stuff is where most military shit dwells. So, no cookies.

Soviet-style saber rattling

The JSEZ is not eve a god damn military pact

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2008-04-10 03:25pm

Beowulf wrote:It's backed up by Shep's napkinwaffe ASAT missile

Would you rather us stage some successful intercepts?

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2008-04-10 03:27pm

BTW I'm interested in being part of the space exploration group. Mostly for communication sats, so that I can sell cable TV to everyone else....

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2008-04-10 03:27pm

Stas Bush wrote:We see that you're objecting because LEO objects are not allowed; LEO stuff is where most military shit dwells. So, no cookies.

Exactly.

Aerial spies are not well received in Shepnukistan, whether they are high flying aircraft, or spy satellites.

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2008-04-10 03:29pm

PeZook, and other folk, can we talk about the ACVs and FCS? I'm no good with numbers and with countries buying FCS from Shroomania and all... I'm at a total loss

[Everyone! Buy Satellite TV from ME! Me! ME! MEEEEEE!!!!]

[But seriously... I'm clueless. How many FCS have we built? Have I finished building that floating drydock?]

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2008-04-10 03:34pm

Have I finished building that floating drydock?

Floating drydocks take a few months to make; you probably will have it by FY 2009 beginning, which is end of next week - plenty of time to sort things ut.

FCS are only getting built; orders for them are happenign in 2009 (mine is), so that's it.

Post by **RogueIce** » 2008-04-10 03:34pm

MKSheppard wrote:
Beowulf wrote:It's backed up by Shep's napkinwaffe ASAT missile
Would you rather us stage some successful intercepts?

Given we are on the brink of what could be the biggest breakthrough in international cooperation, I would hope we could avoid that.

Beowulf
While I can understand your concerns, consider this. As a non-JSEZ member, from a purely legalistic standpoint, you can shoot down anything at any height. Now I obviously would not recommend it and hope you don't do so, legally you could.

Shep, as a JSEZ signatory, and again froma purely legalistic standpoint, could not so long as you meet the requirements of the JSEZ treaty. This obviously puts him at a disadvantage in any negotions.

Now, as a member of JSEZ, you would then be living under the same guidelines as they do. While this is of course no garuntee that Stas or Shep will reconsider their position, from where do you think you would have the better chance? From the outside making your demands and voicing objections, or from the inside where you can negotiate as a full member to the treaty organization?