SD.Net World Redux Comment Thread II

[Sea Skimmer]

P.S. Also, let it be known that I'm eagerly awaiting Marina's ideas on the ICBM/rocketry situation. Are ICBMs banned? If nations are known to have standoffs (me vs. Shroomania and other Empires (Japanistan, Tian Xia), Shepistan vs. Old Dominion), can they have at least up to 1980s ICBM tech? 1960s?

I thought we were banning long range ballistic missiles and the technology for them as starting assets. They make no sense at all without nuclear warheads, no one is going to fire off a 30 million dollar missile to deliver maybe 2-3 tons of HE. Also if anyone has starting ICBM technology, by default they already have a large space booster that can loft significant sized satellites, which would mean space should already be heavily developed. MRBMs are more reasonable, small enough to have conventional-chemical weapons applications and while they can place very small payloads in orbit, they can’t support a proper space program, just basic research.

And could one please clarify on SSBN ban - there are precise BNs for subs after all, arent there? Wasn't one of SSBN main purpose to be more precise than ICBM? If ICBMs are unlikely but not banned, SSBN are likewise possible as an attempt to make standoff weapons at least somewhat useful in tactical sense.

No the point of SSBNs is to be highly survivable in the event of an enemy first strike with nuclear weapons. For any given level of missile technology SLBMs will be less accurate then ICBMs. In real life SLBMs are now so accurate that the difference doesn’t matter (say 150 meter vs. 100 meter CEP), but that’s only because of super advanced features like a radar mapping system on Trident II warheads.

Japanistan has a couple diesel SSBs, but each one only carries 2-3 SCUD type missiles which are cost effective for conventional and chemical weapons strikes. SSBNs are far too expensive to make any real sense for conventional/chemical strikes, an SSGN with cruise missiles would be much more useful.

Question for those who are more knowledgeable about military gear: would it be possible to convert the RIM-161 Standard Missile 3 that I employ on my destroyers etc. into an anti-shipping missile, preferably one carried by aircraft? Or is that a preposterous idea that I should be ridiculed for even proposing?

SM-3 is hit to kill with a tiny detaching infrared guided interceptor, it is worthless against anything but a ballistic missile at high altitude. By the time you’re done changing it you’d have a whole new missile.

SM-2 is a way more logical basis for development (Standard SM-1 was converted to function as ARM in Vietnam), but it still wouldn’t be that great because the warhead is small and the flight profile would have to be suboptimal (neither very high nor very low). In real life SM-2 can in used as an anti ship weapon, but only out to the horizon because its semi active guided. An anti ship weapon would need active radar guidance.

[Raj Ahten]

Uhm why exactly do you want to use the Japanistani launch areas in the first place? Just curious mind you, but they don't seem to be right on the equator.

San Dorado was apparently 'too unstable', and Tonkin 'not reliable enough' .

PS: insofar as I can tell now, the FTO Joint Navy and Air Command currently has the following resources contributed to it:

Baerne: 2 CG, 5 DDG, 2 FFG, 2 SSN
Indhopal: 2 DDG, 3 FFG, 1 SSK
San Dorado: 2 DDG, 1 FFG, 1 Mirage 2000-5 Mk 2 fighters.

For a total of 2 CG, 9 DDG, 6 FFG, 2 SSN, 1 SSK and 20 Mirage aircraft. If I missed anything please tell me.

It seems we have a pretty good commitment here, so time to decide what the mission for the force should be. Basically I see it as an armada that we have available to use in a crisis situation that has already trained together extensively. So lets get started with the training, it can run a neutrality patrol or something in the southern waters of Frequesue.

Edit: for bases and such, I'd say let's just use existing facilities but upgrade them to handle other people’s vessels where necessary.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

Stas can't have ICBMs, sorry, Stas. MRBMs you can modify into space launch boosters by clustering is where we're at right now.

[Master_Baerne]

I'm adding the PRSF MiGs to my forces assigned the FTO, by the way.

[Siege]

It seems we have a pretty good commitment here, so time to decide what the mission for the force should be. Basically I see it as an armada that we have available to use in a crisis situation that has already trained together extensively. So lets get started with the training, it can run a neutrality patrol or something in the southern waters of Frequesue.

Right; sounds like a good plan to me. Run a patrol through the southern seas -- but let Stas' oncoming uber fleet of doom know well in advance where we are and what we're doing there, and stay at least 50 nautical miles from the nearest territorial waters. I haven't contributed those DDGs just for some commie cock-up to send 'em down to Davy Jones' locker .

Edit: for bases and such, I'd say let's just use existing facilities but upgrade them to handle other people’s vessels where necessary.

Alright, sure, but we still need a centralized HQ, and I think Indhopal is still the best place to host it.

[Master_Baerne]

It seems we have a pretty good commitment here, so time to decide what the mission for the force should be. Basically I see it as an armada that we have available to use in a crisis situation that has already trained together extensively. So lets get started with the training, it can run a neutrality patrol or something in the southern waters of Frequesue.

Right; sounds like a good plan to me. Run a patrol through the southern seas -- but let Stas' oncoming uber fleet of doom know well in advance where we are and what we're doing there, and stay at least 50 nautical miles from the nearest territorial waters. I haven't contributed those DDGs just for some commie cock-up to send 'em down to Davy Jones' locker .

Excellent idea. Let's do it.

Edit: for bases and such, I'd say let's just use existing facilities but upgrade them to handle other people’s vessels where necessary.

Alright, sure, but we still need a centralized HQ, and I think Indhopal is still the best place to host it.

I concur. Indhopal is the guiding light of the FTO; it is only fitting that they host our CC.

[Raj Ahten]

Alright I'll set up the HQ for the combined fleet off on one of my islands then. Should I post something about the combined fleet deployment, or does someone else want to do it?

Something else of interest is when Skimmer was talking about how he has some diesel boats that have a couple of SCUDS on them, that sounds like a decent idea to me. Though we might want to put cruise missiles on our versions rather than ballistic ones. Might make for a fairly cheap and nasty little package for our purposes.

[Coyote]

I wasn't trying to pee in your Cheerios, Skimmer; I know the original backstory on al-Akharabat was flimsy. I thought I'd made it obvious they wer easking for "mediation" primarily so they could suck off our foreign aid teat while smiling and begging and nodding their heads.

That was why I didn't really get too wrapped up about the Zunpuntra, I just didn't want the thing to perpetuate. And let's face it, Japanistan's initial landing at Lungga was hundreds of miles away, and they just claimed everything up to the border of al-Akharabat even though they intially had a very, very minimal prescence at the time.

As for Japanistan having a history there-- they have a history there all right-- just like RL Japan had a 'history' of a sphere of influence in Korea. That doesn't mean the Koreans will welcome a Japanese landing with open arms, though.

[DarthShady]

Vampires?!?!?!?

This should be fun.

Now...where did I leave my Stakes and Crucifix.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

Vampires?!?!?!?

This should be fun.

Now...where did I leave my Stakes and Crucifix. :lol:

Neither one will work--these aren't true vampires but a fascimile (well, silver is toxic, but not immediately fatal, and a stake through the heart will immoblize them for decapitation, which will kill them as sapients, though the body will continue to spasmodically twitch for several weeks as it starves to death). More details will be coming out later, regardless. This is actually part of a rather cunning plot intended to reflect the fact you've all been sent here by Q.

[Master_Baerne]

Alright I'll set up the HQ for the combined fleet off on one of my islands then. Should I post something about the combined fleet deployment, or does someone else want to do it?

Something else of interest is when Skimmer was talking about how he has some diesel boats that have a couple of SCUDS on them, that sounds like a decent idea to me. Though we might want to put cruise missiles on our versions rather than ballistic ones. Might make for a fairly cheap and nasty little package for our purposes.

Makes sense, and I agree - cruise missiles are much better suited to our purposes.

Please note: The word purposes will be muttered in an ominous tone, implying a "nefarious" directly before.

[DarthShady]

Vampires?!?!?!?

This should be fun.

Now...where did I leave my Stakes and Crucifix.

Neither one will work--these aren't true vampires but a fascimile (well, silver is toxic, but not immediately fatal, and a stake through the heart will immoblize them for decapitation, which will kill them as sapients, though the body will continue to spasmodically twitch for several weeks as it starves to death). More details will be coming out later, regardless. This is actually part of a rather cunning plot intended to reflect the fact you've all been sent here by Q.

So a head shot should work?

Anyway awesome plot, can't wait to see what you guys have planned.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

So a head shot should work?

Anyway awesome plot, can't wait to see what you guys have planned.

In a few cases the brain has partially regenerated but with severe memory loss in all cases, and in most of those cases leaving behind a drooling idiot, basically a zombie. If the level of destruction to the brain is enough it's an instant kill. Blowing out the heart will however prevent them from doing more than limping along (since they have to rely on diffusion and muscle movement to force blood and thus energy to where it's needed), which makes decapitation much easier. Anyhow, more later.

[Shinn Langley Soryu]

In a few cases the brain has partially regenerated but with severe memory loss in all cases, and in most of those cases leaving behind a drooling idiot, basically a zombie. If the level of destruction to the brain is enough it's an instant kill. Blowing out the heart will however prevent them from doing more than limping along (since they have to rely on diffusion and muscle movement to force blood and thus energy to where it's needed), which makes decapitation much easier. Anyhow, more later.

For these vampires, is death from sheer bodily trauma (an entire thirty-round clip from an HK416 or a sustained burst from an MAG, for instance) possible? Surely the vamp can't operate properly (or at all) if it's had most or all of its torso blown away, right?

Zoria's scientific expedition into Velaria has begun, foreign Biologists, Geologists and such are welcome.

Zor

I'll volunteer some scientists to accompany this expedition, along with some soldiers to act as security. As long as I have something to do...

Alright, But just to remind you that Zoria does have a full Cohort (640 personnel) of Royal Zorian Marines there for defense. Arming Scientists is fine, Each Zorian Scientist is trained in the usage of sidearms and PDWs and is generally carries a pistol when going outside the base.

Zor

This didn't occur to me at first, but since both of our forces will be there in Velaria, could joint exercises be possible?

[Sea Skimmer]

I wasn't trying to pee in your Cheerios, Skimmer; I know the original backstory on al-Akharabat was flimsy. I thought I'd made it obvious they wer easking for "mediation" primarily so they could suck off our foreign aid teat while smiling and begging and nodding their heads.

That’s still pretty damn unlikely, but its past history now.

[quote[
That was why I didn't really get too wrapped up about the Zunpuntra, I just didn't want the thing to perpetuate. And let's face it, Japanistan's initial landing at Lungga was hundreds of miles away, and they just claimed everything up to the border of al-Akharabat even though they intially had a very, very minimal prescence at the time.[/quote]

Look at it this way, with so much of the continents sea coast already claimed by nations its near impossible that the entire coast wasn’t already claimed by someone at some point. My assumption was that the handful of gaps represent areas which were claimed but had the colony fail or in Japanistanis case, it was abandon was part of the end of the second great. My eastern civilian colony is probably in the middle of someone else’s 100-200 year old claim, but that’s why it’s overtly civilian, less likely to provoke a reaction. In the west I didn’t claim just quite all the way up to At Itani for the same reason Briitan and Russia gave Afghanistan that little strip of land between what’s now Pakistani and Tajikistan, it avoids sharing a boarder that’s bound to spark some incident that will cause a war. Probably some outpost of a minor nation was in the area or something, and was allowed to exist for this purpose.

In any case, while I’ve been much delayed in posting their arrival, my next two convoys are about to greatly cement my claim to the area. If you hadn’t gone into al-Akharabat and threatened my strategic flank I would have had eight bases along my old/new colony by now.

As for Japanistan having a history there-- they have a history there all right-- just like RL Japan had a 'history' of a sphere of influence in Korea. That doesn't mean the Koreans will welcome a Japanese landing with open arms, though.

New Sumatra is my Korea. For the Velaria colony and the Zunpuntra I am thinking more in terms of the German Tanganyika, with the Zunpuntra having previously fulfill the role of the warrior tribes the Germans recruited as Schutztruppe. Once Japanistan left the Zunpuntra lost prestige and power and sank back down into irrelevance, being slowly force to move into and nearer al-Akharabat to have any access to modern material. So they have reason to welcome back Japanistan, just as the former Schutztruppe remained fond of the Germans even after the surrender (helped by the fact that several German officers returned around 1920 to pay off the accumulate wage debt owed to said Schutztruppe).


Edit: By the Way Japanistan has now proposed a new plan thats sort of in line with what Cassinia wanted... except that the Zunpuntra will be upgrading from mere Co Prosperty Sphere membership and Imperial subjects to a formal part of Japanistani Empire. The map would look somthing like this afterwards, blue line is my guess at the north-south seperation. black lines mark the ports Japanistan would abandon.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

In a few cases the brain has partially regenerated but with severe memory loss in all cases, and in most of those cases leaving behind a drooling idiot, basically a zombie. If the level of destruction to the brain is enough it's an instant kill. Blowing out the heart will however prevent them from doing more than limping along (since they have to rely on diffusion and muscle movement to force blood and thus energy to where it's needed), which makes decapitation much easier. Anyhow, more later.

Can I send in the Inquisition?

[Master_Baerne]

Remember, the vampires run the world now. Best to accept our nocturnal brethren as the people they once were, rather than the creatures of darkness they are now.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Remember, the vampires run the world now. Best to accept our nocturnal brethren as the people they once were, rather than the creatures of darkness they are now.

"In the name of Jesus Christ, the son of God, I declare thee Diabolus, and deliver thy sentence."

*proceeds to fire a grenade round, blessed with holy water, and incribed with holy runes*

[Coyote]

The Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch? It's one of the relics Brother Maynard carries!

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

The Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch? It's one of the relics Brother Maynard carries!

Maybe the Ultra-Ulber Grenade has a shard from the Holy Cross?

[K. A. Pital]

Well, it looks like I'll so far cope without a base in Shepistan after all.

Around 9000 men have landed in the PRSF, and my CarriereNavy groups are both in vinicity of PRSF Livorno bay (say, the Group witht he LSTs left the carrier and guard ships around 500 km away, while the second group that has left Livorno earlier is around 1000 km away). The reservist formations they had around the city were surrounded and the PRSF will very soon be annexed by the CSR.

Landing party ships are protected by a few frigates and Sovremennys.

It's a shame I didn't do that earlier, would've saved them from Beowulf and his little colonial pawn who took much joy in massacring their Navy.

[Czechmate]

Loads of joy. Truckloads. TRAINLOADS. Perhaps we could ship some of this joy to your frozen Russian heart?

[Beowulf]

I killed it because it was a nearly fully armed surface strike group, and therefore posed a threat, not for the fun of killing it. Either the juntists ordered it to sortie, or they no longer had control of it. Until my forces could take control of the ships, I had to assume the worst was possible: that the navy would sortie in another attempt to strike one of the task forces.

[K. A. Pital]

Sure, I'm not blaming you for that.

I'm blaming myself. I had a carrier battlegroup in Livorno and I could have simply remained there, which would have resulted in a far more balanced negotiation than "you can't have a Navy no more".

Marina allowed even forcing them to annexation, which would've yielded me substantial military assets already.

I fucked up. I should've never listened to the FTO whiners who asked me "to remove my fleet" due to 'tensions'.

[phongn]

I fucked up. I should've never listened to the FTO whiners who asked me "to remove my fleet" due to 'tensions'.

Man, you're a great power, you say "jump" and the FTO asks "when can we come down?"