OSAMA BIN LADEN DEAD

[Dalton]

Apparently that chopper's odd, since a Blackhawk only has 4 tailrotor blades, and the picture shows 5 clearly.

They were specially modified, from what I read. Knowing as little as I do about military tech, I guess that allows for greater stability?

[erik_t]

It's very clearly modified for lower radar signature. Probably trying to be quieter, too.

Don't expect that this is the last you've seen of such a decked-out 'hawk.

[weemadando]

Yeah, that is one helluva tricked out blackhawk. Look at how smooth the tail surfaces are compared to a normal one, not to mention five blades (quieter signature) and the stealthy-fied rotor hub

[Dalton]

Damn. I wonder how many Hollywood producers are scrambling for the film rights.

[weemadando]

Damn. I wonder how many Hollywood producers are scrambling for the film rights.

According to what I've seen Katheryn Bigelow had been busy shopping a script around for a few years on the matter. Now that it's gone down and they can do a factual re-write, and given her recent history I'd say she's top of the pile.

[DudeGuyMan]

I don't think there's such a thing as "rights" to scramble for when it comes to real-life events. You just make a movie about a thing that happened.

[Broomstick]

Apparently that chopper's odd, since a Blackhawk only has 4 tailrotor blades, and the picture shows 5 clearly.

They were specially modified, from what I read. Knowing as little as I do about military tech, I guess that allows for greater stability?

The more blades you have on a propeller (and helicopter main and tail rotors are both a form of propeller) the quieter they tend to be. You can't make a helicopter silent, but it might have made it less noisy.

Or there might be some other reason. It's not like I get formal briefings on this sort of thing.

[erik_t]

You're at least removing some of the lower-frequency modes by going to an odd number of blades.

[Alyeska]

Media reported that MH-53s were involved by the Airforce. Except the Pave Low was retired in 2008 and replaced by the Osprey. Maybe they were navy CH-53 Sea Stallions?

[weemadando]

That tail just looks really funky. If it was a Blackhawk it's been massively modified. I can't figure out what else it may have been though - the winglets foreward of the tail, pointed tail and the rotor hub... It's a weird design.

[Big Orange]

The main team itself consisted of the US Navy's specialist infantrymen (the famed SEALs) but other units had likely been involved in support: NSA/CIA black ops men scouting the compound on foot, many hours or even days before the actual strike, then assisting the SEAL team when they arrived?

One of the wives supposedly got shot in the raid, but there's recent report that they all survived and the unfortunate woman used as a human shield got wounded:

Bin Laden's wives are all alive; one may have identified him

Osama bin Laden may be at the bottom of the ocean, but all of his wives are alive, and one of them may have identified him to the SEALs.

Time magazine reports that "a U.S. intelligence official says one of Bin Laden's wives identified her husband by name as the SEALs closed in for the kill."

It would be safe to assume that was a different wife from the one who purportedly was willing to take a bullet for Bin Laden.

It was reported Monday that one of Bin Laden's wives was used as a human shield and died in the raid. According to White House Press Secretary Jay Carney, the woman who was in the room with the Al Qaeda leader was one of Bin Laden's four wives. He said she was shot but not killed, and she was not being used as a shield.

"In the room with Bin Laden, a woman -- Bin Laden’s wife -- rushed the U.S. assaulter and was shot in the leg but not killed. Bin Laden was then shot and killed," Carney read Tuesday from a new account of the dramatic firefight that took place in Pakistan a few days ago.

"Obviously some of the information was, came in piece by piece and is being reviewed and updated and elaborated on," Carney told reporters, explaining that the original account was derived "with great haste."

"We will continue to gather and provide to you details as we get them and we’re able to release them," Carney said at the news briefing.

Bin Laden's wife wasn't the only woman in the compound. Twenty-three children and nine women were in the three-story building at the time of the assault and were turned over to Pakistani authorities, said a U.S. official who requested anonymity to discuss an intelligence matter, the Associated Press reported.

Link

With Bin Laden surrounded by dozens of women and children, he really did come across as a callous, cowardly cunt in his last stand, when he had lots of innocent meat shields in anticipation of a aircraft or drone attack on his hide-away...

[erik_t]

That tail just looks really funky. If it was a Blackhawk it's been massively modified. I can't figure out what else it may have been though - the winglets foreward of the tail, pointed tail and the rotor hub... It's a weird design.

Other views are quite clear in showing H-60.

[Chris OFarrell]

Hang on, wans't this type of mission supposed to be the bread and butter of the Osprey? Long range high speed, then VTOL at the end with hoards of SOF types?

Funny that they fell right back on the trusty Blackhawk for such a long range operation...

[erik_t]

Long range high speed? As Shep posted earlier, the last leg was like 50nm. And speed wasn't particularly necessary either - it's not as if this were insanely time-critical (unlike, say, recovering a downed air crew). Meanwhile, IIRC the thing is pretty damned loud owing to the high disc loading.

There's no reason you'd use V-22 in this scenario.

[Big Orange]

At least the Blackhawk as a design is not as positively prehistoric as the Chinooks that were carrying a lot of the Navy men into action.

[Samuel]

I don't think there's such a thing as "rights" to scramble for when it comes to real-life events. You just make a movie about a thing that happened.

Yeah, but you need the details of the men who conducted the raid, how it happened as well as the planning, etc.

[Lord MJ]

Wondering if there is any truth to this, I hope not.

White House Insider: Obama Hesitated – Panetta Issued Order to Kill Osama Bin Laden

This article is 4 pages, only the first page is quoted.

You are here: Home » Issues » White House Insider: Obama Hesitated – Panetta Issued Order to Kill Osama Bin Laden
White House Insider: Obama Hesitated – Panetta Issued Order to Kill Osama Bin Laden
by Ulsterman in Issues, May 3, 2011

"What Valerie Jarrett, and the president, did not know is that Leon Panetta had already initiated a program that reported to him –and only him, involving a covert on the ground attack against the compound."

Note:This update comes some 24 hours after our longtime Washington D.C. Insider first outlined shocking details of an Obama administration having been “overruled” by senior military and intelligence officials leading up to the successful attack against terrorist Osama Bin Laden. What follows is further clarification of Insider’s insights surrounding that event.

_______

Q: You stated that President Obama was “overruled” by military/intelligence officials regarding the decision to send in military specialists into the Osama Bin Laden compound. Was that accurate?

A: I was told – in these exact terms, “we overruled him.” (Obama) I have since followed up and received further details on exactly what that meant, as well as the specifics of how Leon Panetta worked around the president’s “persistent hesitation to act.” There appears NOT to have been an outright overruling of any specific position by President Obama, simply because there was no specific position from the president to do so. President Obama was, in this case, as in all others, working as an absentee president.
Read more in Issues
« Good Riddance to Osama Bin Laden
President Obama Shouldn’t be Trusted: Osama Bin Laden Might Resurrect »

I was correct in stating there had been a push to invade the compound for several weeks if not months, primarily led by Leon Panetta, Hillary Clinton, Robert Gates, David Petraeus, and Jim Clapper. The primary opposition to this plan originated from Valerie Jarrett, and it was her opposition that was enough to create uncertainty within President Obama. Obama would meet with various components of the pro-invasion faction, almost always with Jarrett present, and then often fail to indicate his position. This situation continued for some time, though the division between Jarrett/Obama and the rest intensified more recently, most notably from Hillary Clinton. She was livid over the president’s failure to act, and her office began a campaign of anonymous leaks to the media indicating such. As for Jarrett, her concern rested on two primary fronts. One, that the military action could fail and harm the president’s already weakened standing with both the American public and the world. Second, that the attack would be viewed as an act of aggression against Muslims, and further destabilize conditions in the Middle East.

Q: What changed the president’s position and enabled the attack against Osama Bin Laden to proceed?

[erik_t]

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

[Darksider]

I'm curious as to exactly how a national security advisor would "overrule" the goddamn President of the United States.

This sounds like the righties first attempt to steal Obama's thunder as it were.

"oh yeah, he's totally to weak-willed to give the order. One of his advisors had to do it."

EDIT: Mind you Shep posted something a few pages back about him vetoing a plan to have a B-2 overfly the compound and level it, and I can totally believe that. Flying an (IIRC) nuclear-capable bomber into foreign airspace without informing them could touch off a whole mess of problems.

[Lonestar]

At least the Blackhawk as a design is not as positively prehistoric as the Chinooks that were carrying a lot of the Navy men into action.

The Chinooks of today are substantially different than the Chinooks of 'Nam.

[The Spartan]

This sounds like the righties first attempt to steal Obama's thunder as it were.

They don't even have to go that far. As someone I know (who is very to the right like many of the people around here) posted to facebook: "Obama didn't kill Bin Laden an American Soldier killed him." Something to that effect.

Because of course that Navy SEAL would have been in the position to do so even if Obama hadn't abandoned Bush's who-give-a-fuck-about-Bin-Laden approach and given the order to kill OBL.

[PainRack]

Regarding Osama's unarmed status, to be honest, I'm a little disappointed by the reports that he died hiding behind his wife or some such. I much prefered the mental image of him dying 'like a man' and shooting back with the AK he posed with so often.

Disappointed but not terribly surprised.

To be honest, if Osama was unarmed, that just means the US team managed to sneak in and catch him entirely by surprise.
That and he wasn't a paranoid freak who weilded an ak-47 on him all the time.

Interesting, considering he was living ten years in hiding in "enemy" territory.

[FSTargetDrone]

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

Especially from a site that features a story on how bin Laden may not actually be dead:

How do you explain the secret burial of a most wanted terrorist at sea without any pictures being taken and within 24 hours of his death? President Obama has either shot himself in the foot or obviously thinks the world is too stupid to accept his lies for the truth. When Osama bin Laden starts bombing us again, will he say the man he buried in the sea has resurrected?

How could they bury him secretly with no pictures taken?

President Obama should not be trusted. Osama bin Laden is actually alive and might resurrect after three days. Not that this will have any spiritual significance, but because it might be the only explanation when all has been said and no body is seen or found. President Obama and the US military he commands know very well what such a high profile death would mean to the US citizenry and indeed the whole world but then decide to bury a most wanted terrorist within 24 hours and with no pictures taken!

There is no tangible proof of the most wanted man’s death

[erik_t]

Ah, so they're just trippin' balls. Kind of what I figured. With naught but a single unnamed source I had already dismissed the claim entirely.

[PainRack]

Well, it looks like the right wing's descent into utter madness has begun. Starting with FoxGOP tossing rocks at Obama for getting done the job their beloved Decider couldn't even be bothered with.

Media Matters link

Called it. Tiny right wing brains just cannot cope with reality even for a second.

Didn't these fuckers start the whole "Clinton made it so we couldn't simply assasinate Osama and we totally could had got him in Sudan" nonsense in the first place?