A Religious Debate at MT.com

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-06-08 09:27pm

Someone, obviously not wary of religious flamewars, made a thread on the MegaTokyo.com forum asking why Christians believe in God. This is one response later on in the discussion.

Thread Link.

OK, I skipped all the bickering because, well, I've read it all before.

You cannot put all Christians into a single group. If you could then I wouldn't be a Christian because of a lot of the things I do, say and believe. And if you find it fair to generalize people, then I do, to.

All Athiests are Athiests because:

1 - They wanna rebel against their parents/guardians and be a typical teenager.

2 - They can't stand the idea of something being beyond them and find whatever they can to argue the non-existence of God. This can be viewed by many scientific types, claiming that they can't believe in a being that is perfect. What I read is they can't believe in a being that they can't understand or explain, therefore discomforting their existence. Of course, if human thought is flawed, then how can flawed thought understand a perfect being?

3 - They are afraid of the idea of an eternal afterlife. This is not surprising because we are mortals. We understand a beginning and an end. The idea of something not ending is a creepy thought (I can't stand bringing this point up because it just creeps ME out). We are born with an idea of mortality, and immortality frightens us.

4 - Life didn't go their way so they decide God can't exist. Of course, they Bible didn't say God would do everything for you, and it definitely didn't say the Christian's life would be easy.

Now, does that kind towards all Athiests? No, though it does count towards a large percentage. So claiming all Christians believe in God because of faith and nothing more is an insult to me.

Oh, by the way, every Beginning theory that scientists have come up with is flawed beyond the wazoo, from the Big Bang to the Primordial Soup theory (which contradicts itself). I could explain it, but I don't feel like it. It would just create another religion thread that does nothing but hit brick wall after brick wall.

To which I replied:

No, I am an atheist because God nor any other type of deity doesn't exist, if he does, he's the Universe's best recluse and also someone that, given the Bible, is not worthy of my praise anyway.

But that's my opinion.

Take it and run.

Anyone want to rip his arguments or lack thereof apart?

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-06-08 09:52pm

well i would love to see the reasoning behind ambiogenesis/the big bang being flawed "up the wazoo" as he so eloquently puts it.

About his numbered points about atheism, you'll notice he intentionally listed them and stated that it was an inaccurate generalization, but still says that it applies to most people, which in my experience is bullshit and that most atheists are atheists becasue they have a general desire to have something proven to them/able to be proven before they believe in it, basically that they refuse to believe in something that doesnt have any evidence to back it up.

That is my reasoning, no evidence supports the existance of any god, so why the hell should i believe in any of them?

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-06-08 10:00pm

NapoleonGH wrote:well i would love to see the reasoning behind ambiogenesis/the big bang being flawed "up the wazoo" as he so eloquently puts it.

About his numbered points about atheism, you'll notice he intentionally listed them and stated that it was an inaccurate generalization, but still says that it applies to most people, which in my experience is bullshit and that most atheists are atheists becasue they have a general desire to have something proven to them/able to be proven before they believe in it, basically that they refuse to believe in something that doesnt have any evidence to back it up.

That is my reasoning, no evidence supports the existance of any god, so why the hell should i believe in any of them?

He actually answered that last one himself there, why should I believe in something that doesn't seem plausible to exist?

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-06-08 10:00pm

Oh my!

All Athiests are Athiests because:

1 - They wanna rebel against their parents/guardians and be a typical teenager.

I didn't even begin to court agnosticism 'til my early twenties, not even close, dude.

2 - They can't stand the idea of something being beyond them and find whatever they can to argue the non-existence of God.

So many tempting choices, but onward!

This can be viewed by many scientific types, claiming that they can't believe in a being that is perfect.

Since when does science require belief, brainiac?

What I read is they can't believe in a being that they can't understand or explain, therefore discomforting their existence.

He claims an atheist can't understand god, but:

Of course, if human thought is flawed, then how can flawed thought understand a perfect being?

He needs to provide examples of how "human thought is flawed", and what his basis for comparison is. Is he trying to provide the example of an "unexplainable" god as one? How can you not be able to explain something but then hold it up as your model of perfection?

3 - They are afraid of the idea of an eternal afterlife. This is not surprising because we are mortals. We understand a beginning and an end. The idea of something not ending is a creepy thought (I can't stand bringing this point up because it just creeps ME out). We are born with an idea of mortality, and immortality frightens us.

Here, he's getting it completely backwards, it's the fear of death that brings about a belief of eternal life.

4 - Life didn't go their way so they decide God can't exist. Of course, they Bible didn't say God would do everything for you, and it definitely didn't say the Christian's life would be easy.

Again with the "rebellion against Daddy skyman" argument.

Oh, by the way, every Beginning theory that scientists have come up with is flawed beyond the wazoo, from the Big Bang to the Primordial Soup theory (which contradicts itself). I could explain it, but I don't feel like it.

I daresay that he CANNOT explain it, or he would have. And happily!

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-06-09 11:19am

Just wondered if anyone was going to read the thread again, I've just had to defend atheism from people thinking it is a belief system.

That and they dislike the Big Rock theory which I only used to show how illogical God was.

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2003-06-09 03:05pm

Could you please inform him as to the correct way to spell Atheist.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-06-09 03:08pm

Wicked Pilot wrote:Could you please inform him as to the correct way to spell Atheist.

I was going to do that... but he may have seen it as a red herring attack or something.

He's obviously a philosophy major whereas I'm a science. I'd have thought out better arguments had I not also tried to revise the cell cycle for my exam tomorrow.