Scary fundie quotes

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-11 04:30pm

I wonder if revealing the fact I've been prophecized about is going to change my position as Token Deist Agnostic.

Hobot · Post by **Hobot** » 2003-05-11 04:30pm

EvilGrey wrote:
Hobot wrote:
EvilGrey wrote: Allah is a variation of the God concept, and a most vile one at that. God is love, not blind devotion and senseless ritual.
How is God love if he has no qualms about commiting genocide, infanticide, and other hateful acts?
I've elucidated upon this already. Go back and reread!

You only said that God is above morality and amoral. That doesn't explain how is love. At best, he is cold and heartless.

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 06:53pm

Durran Korr wrote:Have you ever heard of a scientific principle called Occam's Razor? Don't add unnecessary entities to the equation while trying to explain things, it says. God is an unnecessary entity; we do not know that he exists, and we can explain the existence of our universe without appealing to some supernatural being.

Only God can reconcile the problem of infinite regress and the origins of causality. God exists by necessity.

Well, I don't approve of killing babies, violent hatred, and sending anyone who happens to disagree with me to suffer eternally, so I guess I am a lost cause.

God does not kill anyone, condone hatred, or cast anyone into Hell.

You make your own destiny. It's your choice: Live forever or die forever.

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 06:54pm

Hobot wrote:
EvilGrey wrote:
Hobot wrote: How is God love if he has no qualms about commiting genocide, infanticide, and other hateful acts?
I've elucidated upon this already. Go back and reread!
You only said that God is above morality and amoral. That doesn't explain how is love. At best, he is cold and heartless.

That's like saying a pencil is cold and heartless.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-11 06:55pm

EvilGrey wrote:
Durran Korr wrote:Have you ever heard of a scientific principle called Occam's Razor? Don't add unnecessary entities to the equation while trying to explain things, it says. God is an unnecessary entity; we do not know that he exists, and we can explain the existence of our universe without appealing to some supernatural being.
Only God can reconcile the problem of infinite regress and the origins of causality. God exists by necessity.

I can define reality, causality, and all other situations of reality without your God. Sorry.

Well, I don't approve of killing babies, violent hatred, and sending anyone who happens to disagree with me to suffer eternally, so I guess I am a lost cause.
God does not kill anyone, condone hatred, or cast anyone into Hell.

You make your own destiny. It's your choice: Live forever or die forever.

The Great Flood, The Two Cities, do I really need to type the list out again for you, are you that stupid?

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 07:00pm

NapoleonGH wrote:1. Nope been an atheist since i realized i didnt want to worship a mass murderer who has no proof of his existance. I am a logical empiricist, i need empirical evidence of something's existance before i accept it. God has no empirical evidence to prove his existance, thus why the hell should I bother to accept his existance?

His existence can be demonstrated as factual through logic.

By labelling God a "mass murderer" you have already shown that you have no clue who or what God really is. Like the typical atheist, you have conjured up some fallacious conception of God and directed all your anger towards It.

2. So then JESUS lied to us when he said that the OT was all true and that he wasnt going to change the "laws of the prophits"? interesting, so then you selectively follow god's commands but not others?

He said that he came to complete the word of God.

3. It most certainly give you the exact order in which he does, and that order is dead wrong according to evolution, plus if you say god + evolution then you are adding un-necessary complexity. It also says that adam was created from dust, taht is pretty explicit dont you think?

Elaborate.

4. No, because you are still left with god creating everything in 6 days, including adam, which means that he created the Heavens and the earth, 6000 or so years and 6 days ago.

It is within God's power to manifest an ancient universe only a short time ago. You cannot argue against that.

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 07:02pm

SirNitram wrote:I can define reality, causality, and all other situations of reality without your God. Sorry.

You cannot explain the origins of causality without God.

If you can, then go ahead and do it.

The Great Flood, The Two Cities, do I really need to type the list out again for you, are you that stupid?

He stopped doing that a long time ago.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-05-11 07:06pm

Only God can reconcile the problem of infinite regress and the origins of causality. God exists by necessity.

In other words, "I can't figure this out, so God did it." An elaborate leap in logic. And define infinite regress and the origins of causality for me, please.

God does not kill anyone,

God kills the innocent firstborn children of the Egyptians to express his discontent with the Pharoah's treatment of the Hebrews.

condone hatred

God forbids his people to marry with those of other races, condemns an entire race to slavery on account of one man's behavior, and endlessly preaches hatred of non-believers.

cast anyone into Hell

If God is omnipotent and all-loving, there is no reason anyone should have to suffer eternally for earthly sins. No amount of sin warrants eternal punishment. God is responsible for the existence of Hell and the suffering that occurs there (if the Christian religion were in fact true).

You make your own destiny. It's your choice: Live forever or die forever.

That's what all the religions say. As Wong says, the only universal feature in every man's vision of heaven is that he gets in.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-11 07:07pm

EvilGrey wrote:
SirNitram wrote:I can define reality, causality, and all other situations of reality without your God. Sorry.
You cannot explain the origins of causality without God.

If you can, then go ahead and do it.

'Origins Of Casuality'? Well, I can only guess you mean one of two things:

1) The point at which Time begins. Simple, time begins at the Big Bang, the origin of duration and dimension. The trigger of the Big Bang? Current research suggests interaction between two existing universes, though the Oscillating Universe Theory(That each universe's death prompts a new beginning, like a Phoenix), and one obscure one about how a singularity should generate a new universe exist. None of these require a divinity.

2) The reason one cannot move back, though the 'origins' leaves this seeming an odd choice. Well, that's light-cones, a subject several other members will enlighten you about should you wish to ask on a new thread.

See? Neither require God.

The Great Flood, The Two Cities, do I really need to type the list out again for you, are you that stupid?
He stopped doing that a long time ago.

But he still did it, still killed, still slaughtered, so your statement is bullshit.

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-05-11 07:07pm

Evil: havent you learned by now asn anyone who has taken an elementary logic course has, that a false statemetn can be "proven" using logic?Plus i have never seen a proof of god's existance that didnt rely on a priori assumptions, I will never accept any proof of anything using an a priori assumption.

God is a mass murderer, he has KILLED lots of people, en masse, how does that make him anything but a mass murderer?

Jesus also said that the OT was still true and that his teachings didnt negate those in the OT, only added to them

Well look at the order of events as well Evil, in Genesis 1, he creates birds before land animals that goes completely against the documented order of evolution meaning that genesis 1 and evolution CANNOT co-exist.

In genesis 2 adam is said to be made from the dust.

as i said eariler man, the bible gives exact geneologies for people going back to the begining, unless you are willing to say that these people lived a million years, then the bible has the earth's age wrong.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-05-11 07:08pm

By labelling God a "mass murderer" you have already shown that you have no clue who or what God really is. Like the typical atheist, you have conjured up some fallacious conception of God and directed all your anger towards It.

God kills millions of people in the Old Testament. That makes him a mass murderer, period. The fact that you refuse to accept that this is immoral does not change that fact; mass murder is mass murder.

It is within God's power to manifest an ancient universe only a short time ago. You cannot argue against that.

Sure I can. Has this ever been observed?

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 07:14pm

Durran Korr wrote:In other words, "I can't figure this out, so God did it." An elaborate leap in logic. And define infinite regress and the origins of causality for me, please.

No.

God kills the innocent firstborn children of the Egyptians to express his discontent with the Pharoah's treatment of the Hebrews.

He used to kill, not anymore.

God forbids his people to marry with those of other races, condemns an entire race to slavery on account of one man's behavior, and endlessly preaches hatred of non-believers.

Are you talking about Islam?

If God is omnipotent and all-loving, there is no reason anyone should have to suffer eternally for earthly sins. No amount of sin warrants eternal punishment. God is responsible for the existence of Hell and the suffering that occurs there (if the Christian religion were in fact true).

Of all the gifts God gave to man, the most important was one which would enable man to earn eternal abandonment from God: The power to choose or reject God. Hell is a place where men are free to do whatever they wish; whether they suffer there or not is not God's fault, as He is simply letting people do whatever they want there.

That's what all the religions say. As Wong says, the only universal feature in every man's vision of heaven is that he gets in.

My penis does not say that!

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 07:17pm

NapoleonGH wrote:Evil: havent you learned by now asn anyone who has taken an elementary logic course has, that a false statemetn can be "proven" using logic?Plus i have never seen a proof of god's existance that didnt rely on a priori assumptions, I will never accept any proof of anything using an a priori assumption.

If you would be so kind as to accept causality as an axiom, then we can proceed thenceforth using pure reason that God must exist to initiate causality, lest there exist nothing now, which is blatantly false!

as i said eariler man, the bible gives exact geneologies for people going back to the begining, unless you are willing to say that these people lived a million years, then the bible has the earth's age wrong.

Well, I can't correct your inability to read, so, blah.

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 07:19pm

Durran Korr wrote:God kills millions of people in the Old Testament. That makes him a mass murderer, period. The fact that you refuse to accept that this is immoral does not change that fact; mass murder is mass murder.

God is beyond good and evil, thus your description of Him as a mass murderer is meaningless.

Sure I can. Has this ever been observed?

Are you going somewhere with this?

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-05-11 07:21pm

No.

Because you obviously have no idea what the fuck they are.

He used to kill, not anymore.

What do you care, anyway? You've refused to concede that God is bound by any sort of morality. Furthermore, he still sends innocent people to suffer and burn in hell for non-sins.

Are you talking about Islam?

No, I'm talking about stuff from the Old Testament (which Jesus did NOT get rid of).

Of all the gifts God gave to man, the most important was one which would enable man to earn eternal abandonment from God: The power to choose or reject God. Hell is a place where men are free to do whatever they wish; whether they suffer there or not is not God's fault, as He is simply letting people do whatever they want there.

If God was such a great guy there would be no hell, no sin, and no suffering; everyone would be happy. If God is omnipotent and fully capable of rectifying these problems and refuses to do so, he is not loving, he is malevolent.

My penis does not say that!

Mike Wong is the administrator of this site. It's his quote.

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 07:21pm

SirNitram wrote:'Origins Of Casuality'? Well, I can only guess you mean one of two things:

1) The point at which Time begins. Simple, time begins at the Big Bang, the origin of duration and dimension. The trigger of the Big Bang? Current research suggests interaction between two existing universes, though the Oscillating Universe Theory(That each universe's death prompts a new beginning, like a Phoenix), and one obscure one about how a singularity should generate a new universe exist. None of these require a divinity.

You have not removed the problem of infinite regress.

But he still did it, still killed, still slaughtered, so your statement is bullshit.

He can do no evil, so what's your point?

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-05-11 07:22pm

EvilGrey wrote:
Durran Korr wrote:In other words, "I can't figure this out, so God did it." An elaborate leap in logic. And define infinite regress and the origins of causality for me, please.
No.

Funny, that's the shit you are spouting.
God doesnt need explinations is almost the same bullshit as, I cant explain it, it must be God.

God kills the innocent firstborn children of the Egyptians to express his discontent with the Pharoah's treatment of the Hebrews.
He used to kill, not anymore.

Ah, so millions of murders....but he's quit now....doesnt change the fact he did it....gee how nice of 'im.

God forbids his people to marry with those of other races, condemns an entire race to slavery on account of one man's behavior, and endlessly preaches hatred of non-believers.
Are you talking about Islam?

Nope.

If God is omnipotent and all-loving, there is no reason anyone should have to suffer eternally for earthly sins. No amount of sin warrants eternal punishment. God is responsible for the existence of Hell and the suffering that occurs there (if the Christian religion were in fact true).
Of all the gifts God gave to man, the most important was one which would enable man to earn eternal abandonment from God: The power to choose or reject God. Hell is a place where men are free to do whatever they wish; whether they suffer there or not is not God's fault, as He is simply letting people do whatever they want there.

Ah, so hell is the real world minus people like you....great!

That's what all the religions say. As Wong says, the only universal feature in every man's vision of heaven is that he gets in.
My penis does not say that!

Dont be a stupid asshole, Wong is the owner of the board.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-05-11 07:23pm

God is beyond good and evil, thus your description of Him as a mass murderer is meaningless.

A mass murderer is someone who kills a lot of people. God has killed a lot of people, according to his book. Therefore, he is a mass murderer.

Are you going somewhere with this?

You claim that God has the power to create a billions-year old universe on a whim. So back it up, bitch.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-05-11 07:24pm

EvilGrey wrote:
Durran Korr wrote:God kills millions of people in the Old Testament. That makes him a mass murderer, period. The fact that you refuse to accept that this is immoral does not change that fact; mass murder is mass murder.
God is beyond good and evil, thus your description of Him as a mass murderer is meaningless.

Ah excellent....so, if I am declared beyond good and evil I can shoot idiots like you?

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-05-11 07:25pm

EvilGrey wrote:
SirNitram wrote:'Origins Of Casuality'? Well, I can only guess you mean one of two things:

1) The point at which Time begins. Simple, time begins at the Big Bang, the origin of duration and dimension. The trigger of the Big Bang? Current research suggests interaction between two existing universes, though the Oscillating Universe Theory(That each universe's death prompts a new beginning, like a Phoenix), and one obscure one about how a singularity should generate a new universe exist. None of these require a divinity.
You have not removed the problem of infinite regress.

Then define it, and I shall give you an answer without a God. Of course, if you mean 'If we go back far enough, there has to be a starting point', I personally side with Einstein: There simply always has been, and always will be, universes existing and causing new ones. Infinity is a concept that you like to throw around, but apparantly can't handle.

But he still did it, still killed, still slaughtered, so your statement is bullshit.
He can do no evil, so what's your point?

He can, and does, do evil, by any secular humanists code of ethics, so the fact you can't see that means little to me.

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-05-11 07:27pm

EvilGrey wrote:[
Well, I can't correct your inability to read, so, blah.

and I cannot correct your inablity to understand these facts. God makes adam. The bible goes back tracing people to said person through exact geneology. So are you claiming that god made these people live millions of years? or just that adam didnt have kids for the first 3 billion years.

Furhtermore causality DOESNT need to begin with god, see you can just start if off with the big bang and cosmic egg, no god required, Thank you Come again.

God IS a mass murderer regardless of if this act is good or evil, but god ISNT beyond good and evil, it has already been claimed as a primary attribute of god that he is OMNIBENEVOLENT ie all good, that means he most certainly isnt beyond good and evil doesnt it? so then if we say that God is all good, then ALL of his actions and all the actions he has sanctioned over time MUST be good as well according to christians, MEANING that murder, rape, slavery, mysogeny, bigotry, etc are all GOOD things according to christians

quote:
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God forbids his people to marry with those of other races, condemns an entire race to slavery on account of one man's behavior, and endlessly preaches hatred of non-believers.
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Are you talking about Islam?

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No evil grey he is talking about good old fasioned Christianity, why dont you actually READ your own bible sometime, go over the books that Jesus followed as the word of god and the same books that Jesus said were still valid regarldless of his existance as someone adding books. Jesus added to god's word, he strictly said that he NEVER would subtract from god's word, meaning that the Torah is completely valid according to christians, meaning that your god did sanction the slavery of all non-white non-jewish races because of the actions of Ham. In addition to everything else that was done by your god.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-05-11 07:27pm

This has got to be the worst fundie troll this board has ever had.

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 07:27pm

Durran Korr wrote:Because you obviously have no idea what the fuck they are.

You know me too well.

What do you care, anyway? You've refused to concede that God is bound by any sort of morality. Furthermore, he still sends innocent people to suffer and burn in hell for non-sins.

Those who send themselves to Hell are hardly innocent. They rejected God. Even the Taoists say rejecting Tao (God) will earn you the same fate. Why not deride Taoism while you're at it?

No, I'm talking about stuff from the Old Testament (which Jesus did NOT get rid of).

Did you forget about the NT and its profoundly uplifting spiritual teachings?

If God was such a great guy there would be no hell, no sin, and no suffering; everyone would be happy. If God is omnipotent and fully capable of rectifying these problems and refuses to do so, he is not loving, he is malevolent.

You are angry God didn't make you a mindless drone devoid of free will and incapable of sinning?

Mike Wong is the administrator of this site. It's his quote.

Oh.

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-05-11 07:32pm

evil, perhaps you dont understand your own religion well enough to understand that BOTH the OT and NT are perfectly valid, thus we can discuss the OT just as well as someone can discuss the Holy Trillogy (Star Wars episodes IV-VI) without brining up the Phantom Menace.

The NT has an "uplifting spiritual message" UNLESS you are a woman.

Not everyone who is a non-believer "rejects god" there are a perfectly large number of people who never even heard of christianity, if not today, then go back to 1492, all of north america and 99% of south america had never had any contact with a christian, so how pretell are they REJECTING god and sending themselves to hell, is Ignorance as to the existance of your god now an offence punishable by perminant damnation. This is true for parts of africa and asia and australia for a large portion of the history of christianity.

EvilGrey · Post by **EvilGrey** » 2003-05-11 07:32pm

Rather than responding to each of you trolls individually, I would like each of you to try and refute my claim:

God is not bound by the moral edicts He decrees.

Until you refute it, you cannot claim God is evil, insane, mad, angry, wrathful, inconsiderate, heartless, etc.

Not one of you has yet managed to refute it.