Yes, I'm one of those people that would cling on to weak arguements even though I know I have been defeated more or less. But what can I do against someone that have just spend the last few days flaming you and generally thinking you are a piece of shit while you devoted your esteem to a mistake, either by mistake or stupidity.
I'm not going to give those fucking arrognent jerks the satisifaction of victory after how much bashing they've done.
So what do I do......
And no, getting them back in battle is sometimes not an option as they might avoid confrontations in issues they don't understand as well or is just plain invulnerable, either by being aloof or capable.
The simplest answer would be don't make stupid arguments in the first place. If at the first instance you start realizing you're wrong, you really should concede.
SWPIGWANG wrote:Life is temporary, pride is forever.
Yes, I'm one of those people that would cling on to weak arguements even though I know I have been defeated more or less. But what can I do against someone that have just spend the last few days flaming you and generally thinking you are a piece of shit while you devoted your esteem to a mistake, either by mistake or stupidity.
Swallow your pride and admit you were wrong. Anything else just makes you look like more of a jack-ass.
I'm not going to give those fucking arrognent jerks the satisifaction of victory after how much bashing they've done.
They've already won; all you're doing is pissing people off by not admitting it. Look at Darkstar, and ask yourself why virtually everyone on both sides despises him.
And no, getting them back in battle is sometimes not an option as they might avoid confrontations in issues they don't understand as well or is just plain invulnerable, either by being aloof or capable.
GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
The only thing worse than surrendering in the face of a superior argument is not surrendering in the face of a superior argument.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
Seriously, what they said. The first step to not having to concede is picking your fights carefully. How do you think certain debaters *cough*Darth Wong*cough* look invincible? They examine the issue logically and thoroughly and put themselves in an unbeatable position because their facts are good and their logic is airtight. Even on issues where both sides are much closer in terms of validity than "Star Wars vs. Star Trek" or "Creationism vs. Science", good research and good logic will ALWAYS make for a better case and will almost always prevent you from having to make a humiliating concession. Trust me. Know your subject before you start shooting your mouth off about it. I've been clobbered in arguments where it turns out my overall position was correct, because I didn't have all the facts, or worse, my facts were good but my logic wasn't.
And if, even with all your research, someone pulls out a fact that upsets your position and you can't argue your way around it, just concede the point, and, if necessary, the argument. This might be easier said than done, especially if you've been shooting your mouth off for days previously and you've got a lot of pride invested in your position, but trust me, throwing up a wall of ignorance and refusing to give up when you're beaten will be remembered longer than an honorable defeat where you graciously conceded as soon as your position became hopeless. Besides, debating, especially in a forum such as this, isn't like a battle or a criminal case. If you discover new facts later on that bolster your position, you can always argue again.
Oh, and one more thing. If you keep the tone of the debate polite, conceeding is usually easier to swallow than in a fight where you and your opponent have been inventing new ways to affix "fuck" to other words and firing them back and forth at each other.
Any city gets what it admires, will pay for, and, ultimately, deserves…We want and deserve tin-can architecture in a tinhorn culture. And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed.--Ada Louise Huxtable, "Farewell to Penn Station", New York Times editorial, 30 October 1963 X-Ray Blues
bah! if you notice that the other person is actually right, just admit it. you´ll just dig yourself a deeper grave if you keep claming somthing, backing it up with weak or without arguments.
being wrong is nothing bad if you admit it when you notice it.
indeed. I have lots of pride, but I generally ignore it when I decide Im wrong.
of course, going from thinking Im right to thinking I'm wrong always makes for amusing reading.
This day is Fantastic!
Myers Briggs: ENTJ
Political Compass: -3/-6 DOOMerWoW
"I really hate it when the guy you were pegging as Mr. Worst Case starts saying, "Oh, I was wrong, it's going to be much worse." " - Adrian Laguna
Sounds like everyone is in agreement. But there are ways to mitigate the humiliation, assuming you're not completely wrong (if you're completely wrong, you should really learn to choose your positions more carefully).
One important thing to remember is that you don't have to win every battle to win the war. In a lot of debates, it is quite possible to concede a minor point with little or no perceived humiliation on your part by simply reminding your opponent and all observers that the MAIN POINT is not significantly affected.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
If there is an arguement that you can tell is GOING to get out of hand, sometimes it's best to send a polite email or PM to the other person, addressing the fact that the arguement, while orignally being an intellectual debate or somesuch, is quickly degrading into a pissing contest. Then ask if it can just be dropped, and let bygones be bygones.
I've done that a few times, and I get along fine with the people I had argued with.
Mayabird is my girlfriend
Justice League:BotM:MM:SDnet City Watch:Cybertron's Finest "Well then, science is bullshit. "
-revprez, with yet another brilliant rebuttal.
isnt concession a GOOD thing? from my perspective, no bad comes from proving an idea wrong, only a better understanding of things. So conceding youre wrong gives you more CORRECT information.
Sì! Abbiamo un' anima! Ma è fatta di tanti piccoli robot.
I looked at the title and I suddenly had a pythonesq flash.
Asking the enemy troops in for tea.....
Oh, we already killed the livestock, and are smoking them, so that they will keep longer, no need to go butchering anything your self.
The scariest folk song lyrics are "My Boy Grew up to be just like me" from cats in the cradle by Harry Chapin
Just accept your wrong and say so, else you'll look like an ass (and after reading some of these threads, if your an ass your in great danger of being fucked). I've only been here 3 days and already been proven wrong twice (first because I wasn't thinking in broader terms and the second because of a dumbass math error).
Asking the enemy troops in for tea.....
Oh, we already killed the livestock, and are smoking them, so that they will keep longer, no need to go butchering anything your self.
Rommel and Monty in North Africa ended the war everyday at 4 for tea. During one Christmas in WWI, a battle was almost decided by a soccer game (the Germans won, the allied enlisted started to pack up, then the allied officers showed up and put a stop to it). Their are many examples of things like this happening (usually on a small scale) between American, British and German troops during both World Wars.
I never....ever will conceed. I always check my posts before I submit and I always take out things that is not needed to be said or things i don't know much of.
But if your in a situation, that begs of you to conceed....do it fast is what I think.
Cyaround,
Jason
I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season."
