Women with double uteruses

[dragon]

wow didn't even realizt this was possible.

A woman who has been pregnant for more than 20 weeks is due to give birth to two babies. But they're not twins, because they’re growing inside separate uteruses and one is four days older.

Angie Cromar, a Murray, Utah, woman, was born with two uteruses, according to CNN affiliate KSL. The condition is known as uterus didelphys.

Read and watch her video here.

CNN.com spoke with Dr. Peter Greenspan, an associate chairman in the department of obstetrics and gynecology at the University of Missouri-Kansas City School of Medicine, about the condition. He is not involved with Cromar's care.

Usually women aren’t even aware they have double uteruses, he said.

This condition occurs during fetal development, when the two small tubes that would normally fuse together to create the uterus fail to join. This creates two separate uteruses.

Greenspan said he has seen several pregnancies in women with this condition and most of them conceive in one of the organs.

“I’ve a patient who had a baby on her right uterus, then come back pregnant years later in the left side and have a baby out of that side. It’s kind of interesting,” he said.

While it's rare to conceive in both at the same time, it has happened, he said. Doctors usually don’t remove an extra uterus unless it creates complications such as repeated miscarriages.

“The issue is preterm labor, because it is a smaller cavity. It’s half the uterus,” said Greenspan. “There are premature contractions. The other issue is they have trouble and can’t remain pregnant when they get to a certain point because the uterus is too small or too tight.”

Cromar, a labor and delivery nurse told KSL that she knew that risk of miscarriage or premature birth is slightly higher in double uterine pregnancies.

"I'm a little nervous, just because I know what can happen, but I'm really excited," she said

link

[Shroom Man 777]

Wow. Incredible. If they perform a c-section, they'd have to cut into two uteruses. I'd love to scrub into that, man.

[CaptainChewbacca]

Wow. Incredible. If they perform a c-section, they'd have to cut into two uteruses. I'd love to scrub into that, man.

Someone's going to be publishing a paper, that's for dang sure.

[LadyTevar]

The paper's been done before, I'm sure. I had a set of twins come through the office with the mother listed as uterus didelphys.

[Mayabird]

Isn't it amazing how many things can get borked up in human development that many people wouldn't even know about?

For instance, the women on my dad's side of the family often have three kidneys. One kidney (either side, and I have no idea why not both) develops into two, similarly to the double-uteruses here; they're separated by a thin membrane. The only reason they know this is because a few of them had kidney stones and it was discovered when they were getting whatever routine scans done then. They would've never known otherwise because it doesn't affect them at all.

[Shroom Man 777]

Does it adversely affect them at all? Or is the triple kidney actually a good thing? Because that is really useful, as kidney complications suck.

[Broomstick]

Does it adversely affect them at all? Or is the triple kidney actually a good thing? Because that is really useful, as kidney complications suck.

I would think it depends in part on how large the doubled kidneys are. If they're roughly the same volume as a normal single kidney it probably makes no difference at all. Have additional kidney mass is probably not a problem (unless you have some inherited disorder that leads to tumors). Doubled adrenal glands might cause problems, but it depends on how well the body regulates adrenal function, which depends on things like the hypothalamus and not the size of the adrenals.

There's a fairly common kidney malformation (about 1 in every 400 people) called "horseshoe kidney where instead of two kidneys you have one large, long one that is, basically, shaped like a horseshoe. Another one of those anatomical quirks that one can live a long life with and never know one has. Horseshoe kidneys usually function just as well as paired kidneys, and unless you look inside the person you'd just never know about it. The only time I think it would be a problem is if something happens where you need to remove a kidney, or the person tries to be a kidney donor. There is slightly higher risk of dysfunction but really bad lifestyle would increase your chances of kidney problems more, in most cases. If you want a famous person with this quirk Mel Gibson has it - the bigotry and angry drunken outbursts are, I assure you, completely unrelated to the state of his monokidney.

There are a LOT of "disorders" (I put it in quotes, because in most cases it doesn't even inconvenience the person in question) that seem remarkable or odd but really aren't that unusual. Double uteri being one of them. Remember, before modern medicine and things like x-rays and somewhat safe surgery people had no way of knowing they had these oddities, and even today most such instances are found at autopsy, not because of patient complaints.

Oh, and when I was in college one of the gals on my floor found out she had two uteri. Whoever told her didn't handle it well and it wound up scaring the living shit out of her for months. It wasn't until she and her mother talked to a gynecological surgeon about removal of one or both that they were assured that, absent symptoms, there was absolutely no reason to worry. Good to know before her first pregnancy, of course, but it wasn't an emergency and likely would never be a problem for her.

[Shroom Man 777]

Doubled adrenal glands might cause problems, but it depends on how well the body regulates adrenal function, which depends on things like the hypothalamus and not the size of the adrenals.

I wonder if some adrenal disorders are similar to some thyroid disorders (they're both endocrine glands). There are some kinds of hyperthyroidisms where the goiters have hormone-producing cells that don't follow the orders of the hypothalamus/pituitary gland. Like, even when the thyroid stimulating hormone levels are low, the thyroid gland is still overproducing thyroid hormones. Maybe some adrenal disorders could be like that?

But anyway that's not here or now. Man, Broomy, how on Earth did you accrue this much knowhow anyway? You should be a teacher or something!

[Kanastrous]

When I was being vetted as a prospective kidney donor, one of the odd things they found is that I have a doubling of the abdominal aorta, above the iliac branch. They told me that it's a congenital anomaly; during development the two blood vessels usually fuse into a single descending aorta (or maybe one develops and the other atrophies, I forget) and for some reason I retained both through gestation and, well, forever after.

Weird. But apparently not medically significant.

[Broomstick]

But anyway that's not here or now. Man, Broomy, how on Earth did you accrue this much knowhow anyway? You should be a teacher or something!

I have a mind like a lint trap, it retains all sorts of useless fluff

More seriously - good memory and nearly a half century of curiosity about the world.

[Slacker]

The wife of a buddy of mine has it. They discovered it while they were trying to have a baby a couple of years back.

[ShadowDragon8685]

Um...

How in the blazing solar hell does that work, mechanically speaking? Does such a woman also have two cervixes (cervixi? What the smeg is the plural of "cervix", anyway?), and both are attached to the vagina, are they arranged in-line somehow?

My mind is boggling here, but I'm too chicken to image Google it.

[Shroom Man 777]

If the tubing is all intact and complete, yes? Imagine her vaginal canal like a road that forks in two directions when it reaches the two uteruses. At least that's how I'd imagine it.

[Broomstick]

Um...

How in the blazing solar hell does that work, mechanically speaking? Does such a woman also have two cervixes (cervixi? What the smeg is the plural of "cervix", anyway?), and both are attached to the vagina, are they arranged in-line somehow?

My mind is boggling here, but I'm too chicken to image Google it.

Yes, it usually, but does not always, involve two cervices (there's your correct plural, by the way). There have been cases where a woman with this condition also has two vaginas. Typically, each of the two uteri only connect to one fallopian tube.

[ShadowDragon8685]

Um...

How in the blazing solar hell does that work, mechanically speaking? Does such a woman also have two cervixes (cervixi? What the smeg is the plural of "cervix", anyway?), and both are attached to the vagina, are they arranged in-line somehow?

My mind is boggling here, but I'm too chicken to image Google it.

Yes, it usually, but does not always, involve two cervices (there's your correct plural, by the way). There have been cases where a woman with this condition also has two vaginas. Typically, each of the two uteri only connect to one fallopian tube.

So, like, side-by-side then, each one getting one supply of eggs and forking into one vaginal canal?

Okay. A bit creepy, but...

Hang on, two whole vaginas? Like, a full duplication of the reproductive plumbing below the ovaries?

Was that side-by-side too, or in-line front-to-back, or...

[LadyTevar]

Side-to-side or front-to-back would depend on the woman, I'd say.

I recall reading about a case where a woman had back-to-front double uteri; they found this out when one uterus would keep a normal cycle while the other was pregnant. The one in back never had enough room, so pregnancies there would miscarry, while the one in front would develop as normal.

[Lief]

Some of these modern (last 2000 years) 'mutations' that humans are experiencing are very interesting.

Has our modenisation inhibated our evolution? A double uterus makes perfect sense in a pre-modern medicine world, ie:

Humans have sex alot (no research but I assume because of the pleasure we have pretty much always had lots of sex)
Baby deaths are rampant (in a pre-modern medicine world)
Survival of the fittest (darwin, theory of evolution)

So I guess, in a non-modernised world, a double uterus would likely of become more prevalent? Or does it cause more problems than it solves?

[Shroom Man 777]

Article:

While it's rare to conceive in both at the same time, it has happened, he said. Doctors usually don’t remove an extra uterus unless it creates complications such as repeated miscarriages.

“The issue is preterm labor, because it is a smaller cavity. It’s half the uterus,” said Greenspan. “There are premature contractions. The other issue is they have trouble and can’t remain pregnant when they get to a certain point because the uterus is too small or too tight.”

Cromar, a labor and delivery nurse told KSL that she knew that risk of miscarriage or premature birth is slightly higher in double uterine pregnancies.

"I'm a little nervous, just because I know what can happen, but I'm really excited," she said

It can possibly cause complications. Without modern medicine, pregnancy complications suck.

[Simon_Jester]

Some of these modern (last 2000 years) 'mutations' that humans are experiencing are very interesting.

Has our modenisation inhibated our evolution?

If it has, should we care?

A double uterus makes perfect sense in a pre-modern medicine world, ie:

Humans have sex alot (no research but I assume because of the pleasure we have pretty much always had lots of sex)
Baby deaths are rampant (in a pre-modern medicine world)
Survival of the fittest (darwin, theory of evolution)

So I guess, in a non-modernised world, a double uterus would likely of become more prevalent? Or does it cause more problems than it solves?

Since practically no animals have double uteri, the answer almost has to be "yes." Thus contradicting "A double uterus makes perfect sense in a pre-modern medicine world." Otherwise you'd expect to see it having evolved to be normal, rather than being a one-in-a-thousand genetic defect.

[LadyTevar]

I will point out that the only animal in the US with a double uterus is the oppossum, a marsupial. The babies are born and crawl into the pouch to finish maturing.

[Gil Hamilton]

Huh, don't that just beat all. Looking that up, not only do they have two uteri, they have two cervices and even can have two vaginas which meet. And they work.

I believe the words of one Special Agent Dale Cooper are in order. "In the grand design, women were definitely drawn from a different set of blueprints."

Very cool.

[Iosef Cross]

That was one of the coolest things I ever heard.

If the tubing is all intact and complete, yes? Imagine her vaginal canal like a road that forks in two directions when it reaches the two uteruses. At least that's how I'd imagine it.

The spermatozoa will have do decide for themselves with road to take.

[Kanastrous]

When you come to a fork in the road - take it.

[Marcus Aurelius]

Since practically no animals have double uteri, the answer almost has to be "yes." Thus contradicting "A double uterus makes perfect sense in a pre-modern medicine world." Otherwise you'd expect to see it having evolved to be normal, rather than being a one-in-a-thousand genetic defect.

Of course you do not need multiple uteruses to have a multiple pregnancy, so there is no evolutionary advantage to be had from more than one uterus even if multiple pregnancies are an advantage for the species in question. For humans with our large heads double uteruses probably increase the possibility of pregnancy complications, which are already higher than with most other mammals due to the upright position and tight birth canal.

That said: Shroom, you need to watch Dead Ringers. The love interest of the brothers in that movie has a rather peculiar arrangement down there...

[LadyTevar]

Huh, don't that just beat all. Looking that up, not only do they have two uteri, they have two cervices and even can have two vaginas which meet. And they work.
...
Very cool.

Male Opposum have a forked penis as well. The first WhiteMen in America to discover this joked that it was because the male fucked the female up the nose.