WTF? The mind of a fundy exposed

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HyperionX
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WTF? The mind of a fundy exposed

Post by HyperionX »

http://operationsaveamerica.org/streets ... h-bang.htm
The “God is Going Back to School” Campaign Kicks off with a Bang!

By Kristene O'Dell

March 7, 2005

God's Word was proclaimed at North Mecklenburg High School in Huntersville, NC. There are 2800 students at North Mecklenburg. Flip and crew had 1400 pieces of literature to start with and only 200 when it was all said and done. Today, the message was “ Abortion is Murder – Homosexuality is Sin – Islam is a Lie, What do these Three Have in Common” (This is the title of the brochure that was handed out). They had several signs and banners proclaiming that Jesus is Lord. Those were the only signs posted. They went with Jesus in their hearts and smiles on their faces to proclaim the “good news” to the students of North Mecklenburg. The response from the students reached all the way to Dallas, TX.

As most of you know, the administrative offices of Operation Rescue/Operation Save America is still run in Dallas out of my home. Since I am on Central Standard Time, the phone started ringing at 7:30am . The first two calls caught me a little caught off guard. I didn't understand what they were trying to say – I was just being cussed at. By the third phone call I remembered that the national, God is Going Back to School Campaign, was being launched in Charlotte, North Carolina. My third call was actually someone, I felt, wanted to have an honest conversation, although it was a heated one.

This young man said that he was gay and very offended by our literature. I asked him what exactly he was offended about. He seemed dumbfounded by my question and stated that he was gay and we were saying that he was awful. I told him that we all have a sin nature, but that we could find forgiveness through Jesus. He began to tell me that his “lifestyle choice” was not sin and that he did not believe in Jesus. I told him that just because one sincerely believes something, does not make it true. He responded with, “Jesus is not true.”

At that point, I asked him, “Can I just say one thing?” He said, “Yes.” and truly listened. I explained that if what he is saying is true – that we are all okay with whatever “god” we choose, no matter what we believe – then I will have lived my life and in the end, will have lost nothing. On the other hand, if what I say is true – that Jesus is Lord and we must confess our sins and be brought into a right relationship with Him – then he, this young man who said he was gay, has everything to lose. I asked him to please think about that. He then began to tell me that he was Islamic. Nice try. My final comment to him was that Jesus loved him too much for him to be used as a as a sexual toy for grown men - at that point, he hung up.

I then received a call from a young lady who told me that it was morally wrong for us to be at her school, and that she was sure that we were breaking laws. I asked her what she meant by “morally wrong,” and then reminded her that there was something called the First Amendment. She explained, almost correctly, that there were guidelines in the First Amendment such as one not being able to yell, “fire!” in a theater. Actually that was a commentary on the First Amendment, given by Supreme Court Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes. I asked her if anyone was yelling, “fire!”? She then went back to her “morally wrong” statement.

I asked her again to define the word “moral.” She said that we were upsetting people and that Christians needed to be more tolerant of others who didn't believe the same, like homosexuals and Muslims. My response was that Christians had to stand on the Word of God and proclaim that Jesus is Lord so that others could find freedom in Him. She then began to tell me that our team was throwing themselves in front of cars. She said that parents and other students witnessed this. I asked her if she saw it. She paused and then said, “Yes!” I started laughing and responded, “You did not!” She said they were slowing traffic. I told her that I would give her that one.

I have to say, she sounded like a smart girl. But what she said next was very telling. After we went back and forth a little more, and it suited her argument, she then told me that she was a Christian – she just wasn't a “ fundi ” like me. If you have been in the pro-life community for any length of time you know who uses the word “fundi.” That is a word coined by the pro-aborts to mean fundamentalist Christian, which of course is the worst thing to be on the planet. It means, to them, someone judgmental, bigoted, violent, with an IQ of one below plant-life. The truth of it is really that a “fundi” is one who actually believes that Jesus is Lord, and goes to the abortion mill to offer moms a real choice – the saving power of Jesus! Jesus laid His life down so that others might live. There was no violence found in Him and He is our model.

You certainly got that half right!

I didn't have time to get into all that because I had already responded to her that she was not a Christian. She asked how I knew that. I told her that Christians know that everyone has a sin nature that needs to be repented of and that it manifests itself in many ways. It can be through homosexual lusts, or heterosexual sin, or even false ideologies such as Islam. Once again, I heard a click and no one responded. Hmmmm!

I then started praying for God to give me wisdom on how to conduct these phone calls. This situation is just like being at the abortion mill. You know you have a very short time to get something into their hearts and minds to further their thinking towards God's Truth. Often, what is needed is their own sinful nature to be pointed out to them. This is not done out of spite. Our sinful nature is what keeps us separated from God. It was at this point that I received another call…

“I have a lesbian, Muslim friend who had an abortion.” (Remember which brochure was passed out. This hit every one of the subjects.) He then said something about each of these canceling each other out so that she could get to heaven. I said, “Oh come on! I want to have a real conversation with you!” He then asked me if I was making fun of his friend. I asked him to repeat his original question of which he left out the part concerning different aspects canceling each other out. I told him that it did not matter if she was a lesbian, a Muslim, or post-abortive. If she confesses that Jesus is Lord, and that she has sinned and turns from her sin, Jesus will save her. He then reminded me that I had made fun of his friend. I told him if this situation were genuinely true, then I sincerely apologize and the truth is – She can be free! But I also told him, “You know you are the one who is doing the mocking.” Of course, he hung up.

We did have one young man call and say that he agreed 100% and thanked us. I received phone calls all day long. There was one certain group that would call, one right after the other, and say things just to mock. I finally did get agitated with all the mocking. I lost my temper with one of the callers and I do need to apologize for that. The constant mocking angered me, but after I thought it through, it saddened me. The one prevailing thought that I heard throughout the day was how hateful we were and that what we were saying hurt people. Remember, there were no aborted baby pictures. The only thing they thought was “hurtful” was the message of salvation through Christ. Of course most of these students professed to be Christians.

If you want to have an impact in our nation, this is the outreach for you. Jesus will be talked about all day long at this school. Christian students will have opportunities to speak the truth. Lives will be changed. Seeds of Gospel truth will be sown. Yes, there will be plenty of opposition, but that is just an indication that we are plowing up hard ground. The lie and the liar have had their way for too long in our public schools. We have the privilege of bringing Jesus to the very gates of hell, knowing that they cannot prevail against Him.

Our nation's kids have been taught to protect their “personal convictions,” whether or not they are based in truth, at all cost. How they feel about something is their truth. If one comes with THE TRUTH (Jesus is God and apart from Him there is no other) and contradicts these “convictions,” he is instantly branded a judgmental, hate-monger. Our kids are being taught that that those caught in the sin of abortion, homosexuality, or Islam are helpless victims of hate. They are not victims of hate, and they certainly are not helpless. They are victims of their own sin. Jesus is the only answer God has provided for sin – there is NO OTHER.

Brothers and sisters, this truly is a tremendous mission field. We must battle the lies that threaten to overtake the godly principles that this nation was founded upon. We need to rescue the next generation from these lies that will destroy them and the nation that approves of them. You and I can do this! Jesus will help us!
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Re: WTF? The mind of a fundy exposed

Post by Jalinth »

HyperionX wrote:http://operationsaveamerica.org/streets ... h-bang.htm

If you want to have an impact in our nation, this is the outreach for you. Jesus will be talked about all day long at this school. Christian students will have opportunities to speak the truth. Lives will be changed. Seeds of Gospel truth will be sown. Yes, there will be plenty of opposition, but that is just an indication that we are plowing up hard ground. The lie and the liar have had their way for too long in our public schools. We have the privilege of bringing Jesus to the very gates of hell, knowing that they cannot prevail against Him.

Our nation's kids have been taught to protect their “personal convictions,” whether or not they are based in truth, at all cost. How they feel about something is their truth. If one comes with THE TRUTH (Jesus is God and apart from Him there is no other) and contradicts these “convictions,” he is instantly branded a judgmental, hate-monger. Our kids are being taught that that those caught in the sin of abortion, homosexuality, or Islam are helpless victims of hate. They are not victims of hate, and they certainly are not helpless. They are victims of their own sin. Jesus is the only answer God has provided for sin – there is NO OTHER.

Brothers and sisters, this truly is a tremendous mission field. We must battle the lies that threaten to overtake the godly principles that this nation was founded upon. We need to rescue the next generation from these lies that will destroy them and the nation that approves of them. You and I can do this! Jesus will help us!
I like the "godly principles" bit about the founding of the US. He must have missed the point that the US Constitution, especially the 1st amendment, essentially bans at least 4 out of 10 commandments (depending on which version you are using). And the "coveting" bit has been ignored for almost as long (greed is good), so is basically "unamerican".

Scary
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Post by Morilore »

Today, the message was “ Abortion is Murder – Homosexuality is Sin – Islam is a Lie, What do these Three Have in Common” (This is the title of the brochure that was handed out). They had several signs and banners proclaiming that Jesus is Lord. Those were the only signs posted. They went with Jesus in their hearts and smiles on their faces to proclaim the “good news” to the students of North Mecklenburg.
I told him that just because one sincerely believes something, does not make it true.
...
Our nation's kids have been taught to protect their “personal convictions,” whether or not they are based in truth, at all cost. How they feel about something is their truth. If one comes with THE TRUTH (Jesus is God and apart from Him there is no other) and contradicts these “convictions,” he is instantly branded a judgmental, hate-monger.
The one prevailing thought that I heard throughout the day was how hateful we were and that what we were saying hurt people. Remember, there were no aborted baby pictures. The only thing they thought was “hurtful” was the message of salvation through Christ. Of course most of these students professed to be Christians.
...
The lie and the liar have had their way for too long in our public schools. We have the privilege of bringing Jesus to the very gates of hell, knowing that they cannot prevail against Him.
The doublethink...

it

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Post by DPDarkPrimus »

Intellectual osmosis! Losing....intelligence...
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Post by Franc28 »

Yes, I like to point out that NONE of the Ten Commandments are incorporated in any system of law, especially not their American system. That just blows their minds.
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Post by DPDarkPrimus »

Franc28 wrote:Yes, I like to point out that NONE of the Ten Commandments are incorporated in any system of law, especially not their American system. That just blows their minds.
Well, no murdering and no stealing. But that's been present in every single society ever.
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Post by Enforcer Talen »

the spartans, iirc, only punished you cuz you got caught stealing.
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Post by Firefox »

Nothing here I haven't heard as a patient escort screening against fundie idiots, although I enjoyed a parody of the "Jesus is the Standard" logo.
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Post by Nick Lancaster »

Don't forget it was those lying Muslims who preserved knowledge when Christian Europe was going through this little thing called 'The Dark Ages.'

And if Islam was 'wrong,' why has it prospered from its inception of around 632 AD, to the point of reaching Spain and even converting some of the Mongol hordes? If Christianity is 'right,' why did God see fit to foil the Crusades as He did? We certainly didn't 'win,' and, gosh, even in the last century and into this one, places like Afghanistan have defied the British, the Soviets, and the Americans.

It's rather low to use Pascal's Wager as a rationale for preaching salvation, but it seems to be a common trend. However, it becomes meaningless if one can say, "I'm happy with my choice. You can threaten me with damnation, but, ultimately, what if I'm right, and you're wrong? Where do you go?"

Don't get me wrong. I was raised as a Catholic, but I guess I don't meet either contemporary Catholic or Christian standards of behavior, because I refuse to condemn people for certain choices. Did Christ direct us to condemn people? No. He did, on the other hand, point out not to cast stones at those who have sinned unless we are free of sin ourselves. (Not 'forgiven,' not 'saved,' not subscribing to this amazing 'personal savior' program ... He said, '... without sin.')
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Post by mr friendly guy »

I wonder if fundies will actually write about a conversation they had with an opponent who actually makes intelligent arguments. Someone who can actually say straight of the bat what is wrong with using Pascal's wager as an argument, saying that your anti gay messages are offensive because they are inherently bigoted, and rip through their rhetoric with logical thinking.
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Post by Enforcer Talen »

nah, he just lacked faith and needed to be prayed for.

read rr. they meet intelligent debators irl, and completely miss the boat.

their posts can be indentified by the many sad and puking smilies about the poor, damned,atheist.
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Post by VT-16 »

It is clear from the above post that these people are brainwashed into a state from which there is no return. I have discussed with these people before and it is impossible to win an argument due to the fact that they won´t listen to alternative explanations or viewpoints. They are firmly entrenched in their own little world and can not be reasoned with.

In fact, I´d say, to them reason is simply a tool of Satan and must be avoided. Hypocracy and double-think does not exist as this would recquire logic and reasoning to see.

They are human trash and no matter how much they complain about being persecuted, I will not change my views on their beliefs.
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Post by Enforcer Talen »

remember the movie sir walter scott's ivanhoe?

christopher lee as inquisitor. "reason is a tool of the devil in his work against faith."

or, for that matter, martin luther, key figure for protestant religion.

"reason should be destroyed in all men."
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Post by Patrick Degan »

Fundie Imbecile wrote:I told him that just because one sincerely believes something, does not make it true.
Just drips with irony, doesn't it?
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Post by Firefox »

I think a more apt term would be "gushing from an open wound with irony".
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Post by Captain Cyran »

Eh hem...


STOP RUINING MY FUCKING RELIGION YOU CUMSTAINS!!!

That is all.

Degan, I'm glad I'm not the only one that saw that wonderful bit of irony. Before today I didn't know that reading could insight a gag reflex. Today I learned that. God these people make me sick with their Grade A stupidity and hate then have the gaul to throw the guise of "Christian love" over it all.

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Post by Firefox »

Just as long as you start with Kansas. And Georgia. And Alabama. And Texas....
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Re: WTF? The mind of a fundy exposed

Post by Junghalli »

Kristene O'Dell wrote:At that point, I asked him, “Can I just say one thing?” He said, “Yes.” and truly listened. I explained that if what he is saying is true – that we are all okay with whatever “god” we choose, no matter what we believe – then I will have lived my life and in the end, will have lost nothing. On the other hand, if what I say is true – that Jesus is Lord and we must confess our sins and be brought into a right relationship with Him – then he, this young man who said he was gay, has everything to lose. I asked him to please think about that. He then began to tell me that he was Islamic.
I know I'm probably going to get flamed for this, but that isn't really a bad argument. An atheist has nothing to loose by worshipping/obeying God if He doesn't exist, but if God and the afterlife does exist then he does have something to loose by not worshipping Him. I'm just saying this theoretically, I'm not endorsing Ms. O'Dell or her beliefs.
Of course, if the speaker was Muslim then this argument kind of folds, because when you start talking about different religions you risk the wrath of some diety by worshipping the wrong either way you go.
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Re: WTF? The mind of a fundy exposed

Post by Firefox »

Junghalli wrote: I know I'm probably going to get flamed for this, but that isn't really a bad argument. An atheist has nothing to loose by worshipping/obeying God if He doesn't exist, but if God and the afterlife does exist then he does have something to loose by not worshipping Him.
Not much of an argument, really, considering the multitude of religions out there. Pascal's Wager really is nothing but a bunch of bunk.
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Re: WTF? The mind of a fundy exposed

Post by Rye »

Junghalli wrote: I know I'm probably going to get flamed for this, but that isn't really a bad argument. An atheist has nothing to loose by worshipping/obeying God if He doesn't exist
Time, money, self respect, integrity, precious life that they're never going to get back. Hardly nothing.
, but if God and the afterlife does exist then he does have something to loose by not worshipping Him. I'm just saying this theoretically, I'm not endorsing Ms. O'Dell or her beliefs.
Exactly as likely as a god that would send you to hell for worshipping any gods or losing your self respect or integrity. Useless argument.
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Re: WTF? The mind of a fundy exposed

Post by Junghalli »

Rye wrote:Time, money, self respect, integrity, precious life that they're never going to get back. Hardly nothing.

Speaking strictly theoretically I don't see how you'd really loose that much. The basic behavioral guidelines of most religions are things we all have to do anyway if we're to function in human society (i.e. not kill, not lie, not cheat etc.). And how much time and money would you actually loose by having a religion (well, I think being a good Muslim you would have to give a certain amount of your income to the poor, but isn't that a noble act anyway?)? I mean, theoretically would having to go to church for half an hour on sunday or praying five times a day really all that majorly fuck up your schedule?
Rye wrote:Exactly as likely as a god that would send you to hell for worshipping any gods or losing your self respect or integrity. Useless argument.
Speaking theoretically I don't see how worshipping a diety that doesn't exist would harm you, but as far as a free society is concerned you're mostly correct.
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Re: WTF? The mind of a fundy exposed

Post by Chmee »

Junghalli wrote:
Kristene O'Dell wrote:At that point, I asked him, “Can I just say one thing?” He said, “Yes.” and truly listened. I explained that if what he is saying is true – that we are all okay with whatever “god” we choose, no matter what we believe – then I will have lived my life and in the end, will have lost nothing. On the other hand, if what I say is true – that Jesus is Lord and we must confess our sins and be brought into a right relationship with Him – then he, this young man who said he was gay, has everything to lose. I asked him to please think about that. He then began to tell me that he was Islamic.
I know I'm probably going to get flamed for this, but that isn't really a bad argument. An atheist has nothing to loose by worshipping/obeying God if He doesn't exist, but if God and the afterlife does exist then he does have something to loose by not worshipping Him. I'm just saying this theoretically, I'm not endorsing Ms. O'Dell or her beliefs.
I've always found this argument to be paper thin. What you 'lose' following this version of Christianity is little things like the ability to think critically, rational analysis of the world around you, and freedom from constrictive medieval dogma. You lose a LOT by rejecting rationality in favor of blind adherence to canon.
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Pascal's Wager

Post by Nick Lancaster »

So if an Atheist determines it is bad to murder, steal, etc. and more or less complies with laws supposedly 'based upon' the Ten Commandments, yet doesn't believe in God, he goes to Hell?

That is, the only factor is his belief or absence of same, not anything he has done in his life. Yet I believe it is one of the Apostles (James) who later writes, "Faith without works is dead."
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Re: WTF? The mind of a fundy exposed

Post by Junghalli »

Chmee wrote:I've always found this argument to be paper thin. What you 'lose' following this version of Christianity is little things like the ability to think critically, rational analysis of the world around you, and freedom from constrictive medieval dogma. You lose a LOT by rejecting rationality in favor of blind adherence to canon.
Worshipping God =/= abandoning reason and becoming a raving fundie lunatic.
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Post by Firefox »

No, but it does mean you're unwilling to apply logic and reason to your faith.
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