The DREAD Gun

Zor · Post by **Zor** » 2005-05-11 08:28pm

http://www.military.com/soldiertech/0,1 ... D,,00.html

Intresting, shoots at roughly 2600 M/S and is sighlent. But could it be pratical?

Zor

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2005-05-11 08:34pm

How can it be silent and supersonic?

D'oh, Zor, it's 2,500 FEET/s. It THROWS bullets.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2005-05-11 08:48pm

According to Leader, this new development program will result in a family of weapons that will utilize, according to the company, a "revolutionary" and proprietary recoil attenuation/mitigation system."

DefRev is not at liberty to publish exactly why the DREAD can't jam, since Mr. St. George hasn't given us permission to describe the gun's operating and feeding mechanisms in any detail.

Even if it becomes necessary to increase the DREAD's magazine capacity to upwards of 100,000 rounds (.308 Cal.) or 20,0000 rounds (.50 Cal.), and run the weapon all day and all night for weeks on end, this will have absolutely no effect whatsoever (positive or negative) on the reliability or durability of the weapon system. The DREAD is both heatless and frictionless,

This whole thing is one big steaming load of bullshit. That you can be sure of. I'm not wasting any more time on it.

Ra · Post by Ra » 2005-05-11 08:49pm

This is too good to be true. It's about as revolutionary as Cold Fusion.
- Ra

wolveraptor · Post by **wolveraptor** » 2005-05-11 09:10pm

Quote:
Even if it becomes necessary to increase the DREAD's magazine capacity to upwards of 100,000 rounds (.308 Cal.) or 20,0000 rounds (.50 Cal.), and run the weapon all day and all night for weeks on end, this will have absolutely no effect whatsoever (positive or negative) on the reliability or durability of the weapon system. The DREAD is both heatless and frictionless

I don't know a god damn thing about weaponry, and it still smells like a bovine behind (oh yeah, alliteration).

PrinceofLowLight · Post by **PrinceofLowLight** » 2005-05-11 09:19pm

Isn't "completely recoilless" in violation of a law of physics or two? And how does it produce no heat signature? Wouldn't lobbing an object at those speeds cause some major friction with the air?

Morilore · Post by **Morilore** » 2005-05-11 09:21pm

The DREAD is both heatless and frictionless

AARRGHHH!!! Call in the Science Marines!

Isn't "completely recoilless" in violation of a law of physics or two?

I think there are ways around Conservation of Momentum. Could centrifuges eliminate recoil? Coz that's basically what I read.

Chardok · Post by **Chardok** » 2005-05-11 09:30pm

mmm....sounds like some kind of whacked out coilgun

Kuroneko · Post by **Kuroneko** » 2005-05-11 09:59pm

There are no ways around the conservation of momentum, but for a centrifuge setup, it's the angular momentum that matters. The exiting bullet puts a torque against spinning internal disk, slowing it down. This does not eliminate momentum; it just means that he operator won't experience the typical sharp backward jerk. The claims about the gun is undoubtedly exagerrated (this cannot be frictionless or heatless, but the heat signature would be substantially lower, etc.), although a gun of this kind can work in principle. It would be easy to turn left and right, but for up and down... think of a big gyroscope. Maneuverability of such a gun would be poor, especially for contexts that require a lot of it, such as helicopters (despite the sales pitch). Futhermore, what if the gun is hit and ruptures while the internal disk is spinning?

Post by **weemadando** » 2005-05-12 12:48am

Just buy MetalStorm products...

Winston Blake · Post by **Winston Blake** » 2005-05-12 01:21am

Here's some other stuff on it and this page has a links to a 3-page pamphlet and a video of a prototype.

"I think this explanation will describe how the DREAD works:

Get any regular 3 speed fan and switch it on. You'll be able to rotate, twist and in fact do any movement with the fan. Now attach a 1/2 inch dia ball to the end of each fan blade with some masking tape and swith the fan on. At the high speed RPM. the G-Forces will tear away the balls from the masking tape and sling the balls in any direction. There will be NO RECOIL generated by the departuring balls.

The only drawback is the balls will fly in any un-controlled 360 degreee direction. The DREAD system controls the balls departure and ensures their release in a straight line, one hehind the other as per the video.

Regards,

Charles."

This is the bit that knocks this one into the 'unforgivable' category of pseudoscientific bullshit for me:

The DREAD's complete lack of recoil will allow it to be fired from space-based platforms, i.e. satellites, without knocking them off of their respective orbital paths.

Sure, and i bet it squirts out premium coffee as a waste product.

Kuroneko · Post by **Kuroneko** » 2005-05-12 01:35am

This rapidly delving into insanity. One can indeed launch projectiles in this way (whether or not the contraption will actually be competetive with modern guns is another matter, however), but the angular momentum still has to go somewhere. On a satellite, it will mean that the satellite itself will start spinning. That's not a good thing.

Crossroads Inc. · Post by **Crossroads Inc.** » 2005-05-12 01:40am

Hasn't anyone mentioned the BIGGESR tipoff to this being PsudoScience Bunk? The fact that on the main page, theres only a cheap Drawing of the Device and NO actualy physical proof of this or that its been tested?

Ra · Post by Ra » 2005-05-12 02:03am

Kudos to CR. He's right on the bullseye.
Anyway, this "OMG N0 r3coilzor" shit is pathetic. The torque from such a device would be intolerable. Without a device to counter the rotation, you get uncontrolled spinning properties, the same thing that requires a helicopter to use a tailrotor (or in the case of the CH-47 and Kamov designs, counterrotation). We're talking about enough RPM's to compete with conventional kinetic arms. Very high RPM's = lotsa torque.
- Ra

Kuroneko · Post by **Kuroneko** » 2005-05-12 02:31am

No. Even at high RPMs, the configuration by itself would have very little torque, since the angular momentum is constant for constant rotation speeds. The only torque would be due to friction (and the motor to counteract it), which wouldn't be excessive, since this is a disk and not a fan. The real problem is the torque due to the exiting bullet and the torque at the spin-up phase. The former is much more tolerable, and the latter depends on the timeframe. Obviously, if this is to be a usable gun, it cannot be too long, although power consuption be of concern as well. The rotation by itself is fairly stable as is, but rotating to aim up or down will be nigh-impossible because the disk behaves like a gyro. This is still a rather unimpressive gun, but not quite for the reasons you describe.

Ra · Post by Ra » 2005-05-12 02:47am

Ah, I see. Rant conceded.
- Ra

Faram · Post by **Faram** » 2005-05-12 03:06am

Have anyone looked at the Video?

Damn that one puts the PowerPoint rangers to shame.

Luckely its short but the BS made my head hurt.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2005-05-12 03:27am

How accurate could this thing be, though? Rather complicated to aim, isn't it?

Winston Blake · Post by **Winston Blake** » 2005-05-12 03:42am

CaptainChewbacca wrote:How accurate could this thing be, though? Rather complicated to aim, isn't it?

Shooting spherical bullets with no barrel sounds pretty freakin inaccurate to me. I think (can't be bothered to read that crap again) they say something about the 'no recoil' making it somehow uber easy to aim and therefore accurate, as if recoil is the only factor.

Wait a sec, i've got it! Zero recoil is completely realistic. See it's got an amazing incredible 360 degree field of fire which is so incredibly useful! Well hell, all you gotta do is release another bullet in the opposite direction at the same time you fire and presto, recoil (and world hunger) solved! I think i'll test it right now... *bang!splat*

Sir Sirius · Post by **Sir Sirius** » 2005-05-12 06:53am

DREAD WEAPON SYSTEM: Devastating, Jam-Proof, and Silent wrote:Even if the DREAD-equipped vehicle does get identified and fired upon by the enemy, the risk of a catastrophic explosion from a bullet strike on the ammunition supply is zero, because the DREAD's ammunition doesn't contain any propellant. There's no gunpowder onboard to blow up.

What about the RKE of a the disc at 120 000 rpm?

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2005-05-12 08:53am

Gee, I wish I could design a gun that evades the laws of physics.

That NOS Guy · Post by **That NOS Guy** » 2005-05-12 11:09am

Admiral Valdemar wrote:Gee, I wish I could design a gun that evades the laws of physics.

After you eat your soup.

Mind if I use that as a sig quote?

Haminal10 · Post by **Haminal10** » 2005-05-12 11:51am

David Crane wrote:Now imagine that this gun could fire .308 caliber and .50 caliber metal projectiles accurately at up to 8,000 fps (feet-per-second), featured an infinitely variable/programmable cyclic rate-of-fire (as high as 120,000 rounds-per-minute), and were capable of laying down a 360-degree field of fire.

Winston touched on this, but I love how the drawing at the top of the article insinuates that this would be a hand-held device. Who in their right mind would design a gun that could easily blow the user away?!! Not only that, but I wouldn't want to stand within line of sight of this gun when its fired. A malfunction could lead to someone fragging his own squad. Oops!

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2005-05-12 12:14pm

CaptainChewbacca wrote:How accurate could this thing be, though? Rather complicated to aim, isn't it?

That's the real trick. Centrifugal weapons have been tried before, and in principle, it does indeed eliminate recoil. The problem is controlling the release. Think of the analogy of a discus thrower. He doesn't experience the kind of kick that he would if he somehow launched that discus straight forward at that velocity, but he has to precisely control the release or the projectile could go anywhere.

This DREAD guy claims that he has some absolutely foolproof way of controlling the release, unlike every other person who has ever tried to develop a centrifugal gun. I'll believe it when I see it, but it would certainly open up a lot of interesting possibilities. If the rotating mass is kept low, then gyro effects would be minimized.

Of course, it should be noted that the gun would be useless until it spools up. And as mentioned previously, the idea of a perfect release system is rather far-fetched.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2005-05-12 12:26pm

I looked at their "white paper" and it contains absolutely no information whatsoever or even vague hinting about this ballyhooed revolutionary release system that suddenly makes centrifugal weapons effective. Instead, it's basically just another advertisement. Not a good sign.