(WWII) History What if...Midway

[Isolder74]

One little known detail about the Battle of Midway was that the American Carrier, Yorktown though heavily damage did not sink. It was being towed back to Pearl when it was spotted and sunk by a Japanese Submarine.

The Yorktown, if that sub hadn't sunk it could very well have been repaired and gotten back into action.

The question: What if that submarine was out of place and missed the Yorktown passing? Would one extra American Carrier in the Pacific in 1942 have had an impact on the the length of the Pacific Campaign?

[CaptainChewbacca]

One little known detail about the Battle of Midway was that the American Carrier, Yorktown though heavily damage did not sink. It was being towed back to Pearl when it was spotted and sunk by a Japanese Submarine.

The Yorktown, if that sub hadn't sunk it could very well have been repaired and gotten back into action.

The question: What if that submarine was out of place and missed the Yorktown passing? Would one extra American Carrier in the Pacific in 1942 have had an impact on the the length of the Pacific Campaign?

After Midway, the naval battles were pretty much over. I don't think an additional carrier would have made much difference in all of the island-hopping we had to do to get to the Home Islands.

[Isolder74]

After Midway, the naval battles were pretty much over. I don't think an additional carrier would have made much difference in all of the island-hopping we had to do to get to the Home Islands.

What about Guadalcanal? At that point only the Enterprise was really available to support the campaign. I think an extra carrier there might have made a difference.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Yorktown was due for some serious overhaul and whether it could participate anymore is questionable. Already at Midway, it was operating below optimum capabilities, such as one or two shafts weren't running.

[Knife]

What about Guadalcanal? At that point only the Enterprise was really available to support the campaign. I think an extra carrier there might have made a difference.

Honestly a couple more BB's and destroyers would have been probably better at Guadalcannal. What was there? Washington and ....can't remember. Anyway, more firepower to take out the enemy troop ships would have been nice.

[Sea Skimmer]

Keep in mind USS Yorktown was being towed at 1 knot by a minesweeper when she was finally put under, she wasn’t getting away anytime soon. The Japanese dispatched seven of the several dozen I boats they had deployed for operation MI to sink Yorktown, I-168 was just the first to arrive, and found Yorktown almost exactly at her last known position. Its pretty damn unlikely she could have evaded all seven of those fast submarines.

The question: What if that submarine was out of place and missed the Yorktown passing? Would one extra American Carrier in the Pacific in 1942 have had an impact on the the length of the Pacific Campaign?

One extra carrier might have been able to slightly shorten the Guadalcanal campaign, but the fact is that entire Solomon’s axis of advance was really a waste of time and contrary to all previous US planning for a war with Japan. The fastest way to Tokyo was across the tiny isolated and vulnerable islands of the central Pacific, but that required build up amphibious resources and overall air power the US doesn’t gain from a single extra carrier deck. Once its 1943 though, the US could just stream roll across those isles, and could have bypassed even more islands then it already did in hindsight.

The extra carrier deck might make a carrier battle go more in Americas favor as well, but sinking another Jap carrier or two wont shorten the war. Japan historically nearly wiped out its carrier air groups flying from land bases in the Solomans in 1943 TWICE. This is also why Japanese carriers failed to respond to the invasion of Tarawa for example.

[CmdrWilkens]

What about Guadalcanal? At that point only the Enterprise was really available to support the campaign. I think an extra carrier there might have made a difference.

Honestly a couple more BB's and destroyers would have been probably better at Guadalcannal. What was there? Washington and ....can't remember. Anyway, more firepower to take out the enemy troop ships would have been nice.

Pretty sure it was the South Dakota but yeah a few more ships of the line may have stiffened the Navy up a little to provide better support to the Marines.

[Stormbringer]

What about Guadalcanal? At that point only the Enterprise was really available to support the campaign. I think an extra carrier there might have made a difference.

Honestly a couple more BB's and destroyers would have been probably better at Guadalcannal. What was there? Washington and ....can't remember. Anyway, more firepower to take out the enemy troop ships would have been nice.

Pretty sure it was the South Dakota but yeah a few more ships of the line may have stiffened the Navy up a little to provide better support to the Marines.

The Navy was pretty determined, they just got mauled in the night engagements. They lost a lot of cruisers and destroyers trying to hold up their end. Putting a battleship or two more into the pot risks the Japanese trying, fuel crunch or no, to put Yamato into the action with potentially worse results.

[Knife]

The Navy was pretty determined, they just got mauled in the night engagements. They lost a lot of cruisers and destroyers trying to hold up their end. Putting a battleship or two more into the pot risks the Japanese trying, fuel crunch or no, to put Yamato into the action with potentially worse results.

Except the Washington pretty much mauled the Japanese at night using radar. The other BB (I think Greg is right it was the South Dakota) was damaged but not badly also smacked the enemy fleet around. Another BB with radar capability would have helped wipe the troop ships out, damn the Yamato, it was the troop ships that needed to be exterminated.

[CaptHawkeye]

The Navy was pretty determined, they just got mauled in the night engagements. They lost a lot of cruisers and destroyers trying to hold up their end. Putting a battleship or two more into the pot risks the Japanese trying, fuel crunch or no, to put Yamato into the action with potentially worse results.

The Navy had a lot of trouble during the night at Guadalcanal almost entirely because they had to screen the transports and landing zone on the island. This forced them to take predictable patrol routes and limited their offensive options. Once screening was no longer needed, Navy DDs and cruisers had no problem at all wrecking the Japanese at night.

The Battle of Guadalcanal was indeed the fight that involved Washington and the malfunctioning South Dakota. A maintenance error left the poor thing's electronic system on the fritz all night, and it didn't notice the Japanese task force (including a Kongo class) sneaking up on it and its escorts. Sodak really just had some incredibly nasty luck that night. Opening fire set a destroyer on fire which Sodak ended up in front of, silhouetting it against a background. Washington happened to be in the area and had no problem at all turning Kirishima into a burning wreck.

[tim31]

Keep in mind USS Yorktown was being towed at 1 knot by a minesweeper when she was finally put under, she wasn’t getting away anytime soon. The Japanese dispatched seven of the several dozen I boats they had deployed for operation MI to sink Yorktown, I-168 was just the first to arrive, and found Yorktown almost exactly at her last known position. Its pretty damn unlikely she could have evaded all seven of those fast submarines.

I read in a National Geo feature on Midway that as I-168 closed on the Yorktown, the skipper ordered periscope up and was surprised to find they were too close to fire tubes; she had to back off in order to get a solution.