WWII without the US

[Sea Skimmer]

What if the Germans didn't even bother with trying to conquer the Russians, but instead decided to just exterminate them altogether? (Or was that what they were already doing?)

German planning called for something like 75% of the people in European Russia to be either exterminated or deported further east. Being even more brutal then they already where will only bring the same response in kind from the Russian people, and the Partisans where bad enough as it was.

[Sea Skimmer]

Just to show that Germany could strike back if necessary.

With a paper design thats highly unlikely to work? I don't think the US has too much to fear from that. As it for the design to have any hopes of succeeding, the Germans need jet engines with about 50% more thrust then there best historical effort and they need to more then triple there jet engines expected life. Those are not easy tasks to accomplish, espically not when they need to occur in the same engine.

Also by 1948 assuming his rocketness Von Braun has been well supplied they could also have the first ICBMS and could also easily develope SAM deterrents to the B-36 assuming their airforces aren't good enough.

The German SAM programs where total jokes. The guidance systems where absolutely horrible designs that US personal later couldn't believe the Germans would even try to develop them. To top it all of, despite having more then forty different proximity fuse programs, the best the Germans ever came up with where near useless acoustical fuses. Hitting anything, even without having to worry about jamming would be a pure luck.

[admiral_danielsben]

What if the Germans didn't even bother with trying to conquer the Russians, but instead decided to just exterminate them altogether? (Or was that what they were already doing?)

That WAS what they were doing - or damn close to it.

I think Germany's problem was the Nazis. If Germany had had a right-wing, fascist, militaristic/nationalistic/expansionist regime, but lacked the Nazi trimmings (think a cross of Imperial Germany (pre-WWI) and Fascist Italy), it could very well have won the war.

Reasons:

1. The Nazis killed off or exiled large numbers of valuable people - including Jews. Many of Germany's Jewish scientists, from Einstein on down, fled Germany when the Nazis took power. A large number of anti-communists (Ukrainian nationalists, Belorussians, kulaks, etc.) would've been good allies of Germany during WWII (and the Ukrainians were, at first), if the Germans had treated them as somewhat better than they did.
2. All those railroad cars and the wasted resources used in the Holocaust - every railroad car used to send Jews to Auschwitz is one less used to send troops and supplies to Brest-Livotsk. Slave labor nowhere near made up for this.
3. Patriotic Germans of non-Aryan stock (again, like Jews) could have been used in the military or factories, doing much more per person than an unwilling slave-laborer would.
4. Nazi leaders (Hitler, Himmler, Goebbels, etc.) mucked things up for the military, making some stupid decisions like declaring war on the US, attacking the USSR before the war with Britain was settled, helping the Italians out when they made messes, overseeing reasons 1,2, and 3, etc.

[admiral_danielsben]

I don't get it...

Read this and you shall understand.

BTW, was that fanfic written by a SDNet and/or ASVS regular? Having an airplane named 'Duchess of Zeon' is a tad suspicious.

[phongn]

It's not actually a "fanfic" since it's original fiction. That said, she was active on that message board and the author used a bunch of names and userids in it.

[Icehawk]

The plane was still at the prototype stage when it was canacled, not production, it wouldn't have been in service before 1945. That assumes it gets built at all and can meet its performance goals. Reaching 49,000 feet with any sort of warload is highly unlikely and the Germans had fuckload of designs which could not work or not met there desinges performance.

Well, my "Warplanes of the Luftwaffe" encyclopedia specifically states "8 Production models of the B5/R2 configuration, not prototypes were completed before they switched over to pure fighter production. The stats for it are the true performance stats. You can play pessimist all you want but it won't convince me.

The Eastern front isn't going to demand a heavy bomber, building enough to make an effective strategic bombing force would be a huge drain on German resources and they where desperately short of tactical airpower as it was. Even without needing to worry too much about daylight raids in Europe there still going to need massively more resources committed to the east. I really doubt the He277 would fly as more then a reconnaissance aircraft.

Doubt as much as you want, but Germany had a decent heavy bomber on their hands and real historical circumstances due to US involvement is the only reason it was cancelled.

[admiral_danielsben]

It's not actually a "fanfic" since it's original fiction. That said, she was active on that message board and the author used a bunch of names and userids in it.

Sorry. My mistake.