USS Missouri Vs Waffle Iron

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-02-13 10:05pm

Darth Utsanomiko wrote:Waffle Iron retails for $63.95. Missouri is worth millions, at the least. Waffle-Iron is more economically feasible. Waffle iron wins.

In the early 40's each one cost over 100 million dollars, today they'd cost billions to replace. There value is far less though.

Brother-Captain Gaius · Post by **Brother-Captain Gaius** » 2003-02-13 10:07pm

I posted a thread like this a few weeks ago. Unfortunately, it was hijacked to high holy hell.

Waffle iron takes it, BTW.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-02-13 10:07pm

[quote="Darth Utsanomiko"]
Displacement: 41,000 tonnes (empty), 53,000 tonnes (full)
Power: 212,000 s.h.p. from four turbines
Maximum speed: 32 knots (with 10,584 gallons of fuel burned per hour)
Armament: 9 of 16" (406 mm) in three turrets; 20 of 5" (127 mm); 80 of 40 mm Bofors; 60 of 20mm Oerlikons, 32 of Tomahawk missile launchers; 16 of Harpoon missile launchers; 4 of CIWS 20 mm turrets.

WARNING, ARMAMENT IMPOSSIBLE! Fitting of missile tubes and associated satcom requires removal of four 5 inch turrets and most light triple A. Fitting of CIWS requires removal of Mk.37 directors.

Post by **Kuja** » 2003-02-13 10:10pm

Beowulf wrote:The waffle iron! You can bean the officers over the head with it!

Ever been shot by an angry navel captain?

Post by **Beowulf** » 2003-02-13 10:13pm

IG-88E wrote:
Beowulf wrote:The waffle iron! You can bean the officers over the head with it!
Ever been shot by an angry navel captain?

No.

Anyway, officers don't usually carry sidearms IIRC...

Kinda confused as to what belly buttons has to do w/ the discussion...

BlkbrryTheGreat · Post by **BlkbrryTheGreat** » 2003-02-14 12:55am

Actually, the 16 inch guns on the Iowa Battleships are both effective and cost effective. During the Korean and Vietnam Wars none of the opposing armies wanted to get anywhere near the coast because of how devestating shell fire from the ships were.

BlkbrryTheGreat · Post by **BlkbrryTheGreat** » 2003-02-14 12:57am

Oh, and add to that the fact that they have MUCH thicker armor belts then any US warship currently in service. Added to that fact is that the armor is made out of STEEL instead of Aluminum, which can actually burn and emits a toxic gas when it does.

Jadeite · Post by **Jadeite** » 2003-02-14 01:09am

Missouri wins. Its just sooo much cooler.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-02-14 01:15am

BlkbrryTheGreat wrote:Actually, the 16 inch guns on the Iowa Battleships are both effective and cost effective. During the Korean and Vietnam Wars none of the opposing armies wanted to get anywhere near the coast because of how devestating shell fire from the ships were.

Unhun. Heard that all before. A few B-52's with JDAM's can delivery more weight of explosives with massively more accuracy and at far lower cost then the whole of an Iowa's shell load. A single 21,000 dollar 2000 pound JDAM carries a 1000 pounds of explosives, more then an Iowa's broadside, and can place it within a 32 foot box anywhere on the earth. The Dispersion of the Iowa's guns at medium to long ranges is in the hundreds of meters.

The guns also have shit for range, we now have 5-inch weapons, which can reach as far. To use its gun an Iowa must steam within LOS of shore-based defenses and into shallow waters ideal for mines. Bad fucking idea. You might shoot down the Silkworms, but you wont be combat effective after a Smerch unit covers a square kilometer with bomblets in 38 seconds.

While a 16 inch shells is fairly cheep, running a battleship would cost hundreds of millions a year. Furthermore each one needs over a 1000 crew even with more upgrades, and the USN is short 8000 personal. You can't pull rare NCO ranks or experiences officers out of thin air, and most jobs on four ships, which have, completely unique systems would require extensive retraining anyway. All that is on top of a 200 million dollar 6-18 month operation just to return one to its obsolete 1991 standards.

As for target effect, cruiser caliber fire has proven highly effective against everything save heavy fortifications, against which 16 inch fire is also near worthless. At Salrno one 6-inch cruise knocked out 13 tanks in 5 minutes with one-turret salvos and drove off another 27. Indeed the German counter attack there was stopped by cruises and destroyers, no battleships where present until after the Germans called a halt. Salrno is the best example of the kind of opposition a modern landing would face, a thin costal screen but with mobile heavy forces inland in some strength.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-02-14 01:23am

BlkbrryTheGreat wrote:Oh, and add to that the fact that they have MUCH thicker armor belts then any US warship currently in service. Added to that fact is that the armor is made out of STEEL instead of Aluminum, which can actually burn and emits a toxic gas when it does.

Armor wont save you from anything. That’s why people stopped using heavy armor 58 years ago.

A 10-pound shaped charge can penetrate any armor on an Iowa, twice over in many cases. The Styx/Silkworm family of missiles, likely the greatest threat missile, has a shaped charge that’s over a quarter ton. In tests against the Russian battleship Sevastopol the warhead blew a massive hole though the armor belt and reached into the engine rooms. It also brings a shit load of burning fuel with it. It also has a pop up option, which brings that warhead to bear aginst the deck.

A modern torpedo or mine will explode under the keel, and snap a BB in half, never touching a piece of armor. A hail of bomb lets for a MLR unit can easily destroy a battleships missiles, sensors, fire control and secondary batteries, leaving it a mass of flames and combat ineffective. A sitting duck for anything.

The USN its self estimated that six 2000 general purpose bomb hits would have a 40% chance of sinking an Iowa and it would be out of action no matter what. Back in 1945 that would have taken many squadrons of bombers to accomplish. Today a single fighter-bomber can haul that warlord, and with a partner with anti radar missiles an Iowa could easily be cripple and hit. Hell even without help a Tornado could do it. And most anything that keeps high and uses a LGB to hit a turret with a penatraitor could knock an Iowa out. So that’s basically everything from an armed trainer on up.

Indeed a single modern attack helicopter could destroy the turrets and air defenses of an Iowa without taking any hits in return and then start fires among the missiles.

Aluminum has never burned on a warship before, and that’s quite impossible unless the rest of the ship was built out of C4 and detonators. It has however melted, which is why no one has built warships out of it beyond funnels since the early 1980's.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-02-14 01:23am

True, the Winnie's new fiver is a real good artillery gun. The sixteen and the BB would only be useful as intimidation tools, and the carriers are better at that anyway.

BlkbrryTheGreat · Post by **BlkbrryTheGreat** » 2003-02-14 01:25am

. A single 21,000 dollar 2000 pound JDAM carries a 1000 pounds of explosives, more then an Iowa's broadside,

A single shell weighs over 2 tons. 2 tons x9 = 18 tons of high explosive.... PER broadside.

Post by **Coyote** » 2003-02-14 01:27am

The waffle iron has an edge. The crew of the Missouri goes to attack when someone says, "Hey, guys! Waffles!"and they all think, "MMmmm...waffles!" Images of melting butter, maple syrup, or strawberry jam, or maybe Nutella... They ignore the call to GQ and head for the mess...

But then someone-- probably a Petty Officer, the brass are too concerned abut their careers for making radical decisions-- gets the idea that they can combine forces and put the waffle iron in the ship's galley and use it anytime they want to!

Thusly empowered, the crew of the Misouri-- with their waffle iron at the ready-- go forth and conquer the seas and rule the coasts.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2003-02-14 01:29am

BlkbrryTheGreat wrote:
. A single 21,000 dollar 2000 pound JDAM carries a 1000 pounds of explosives, more then an Iowa's broadside,
A single shell weighs over 2 tons. 2 tons x9 = 18 tons of high explosive.... PER broadside.

*Ahem*...16" HC shell weighs 1,900 pounds. Of that, 154 pounds is explosive. Thus, we get the equation
154 x 9 = 1,386 pounds. Slightly more than a JDAM, but not 18 tons. This, according to http://www.battleship.org/html/Articles ... s/Main.htm

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2003-02-14 09:21am

[rabid trekkie]
DUH, the Waffle Iron is far more advanced because it's so much smaller and sleeker, and uses clean, modern electricty, while the battleship is big, clunky, dirty, and ugly. Everyone knows the cooler stuff wins in my masturbation fantasy- I mean, in a versus comparison.
[/rabid trekkie]

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2003-02-14 01:49pm

"Urge to Kill, Rising..."

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2003-02-14 02:53pm

Um, Seaskimmer: We're not talking about B-52s or 10lb shaped charges, we're talking about waffle irons, waffle irons, dammit!

[rabid trekkie]
Well, that just shows how easy it will be to penetrate the hull of the Missouri. The Black & Decker Waffle Maker is pretty close to 10 pounds, so it shouls at least be almost as effective as getting through the hull.
[/rabid trekkie]

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-02-14 03:23pm

BlkbrryTheGreat wrote:
. A single 21,000 dollar 2000 pound JDAM carries a 1000 pounds of explosives, more then an Iowa's broadside,
A single shell weighs over 2 tons. 2 tons x9 = 18 tons of high explosive.... PER broadside.

Warning, fucking moron detected. You don't know shit do you? You see a shell is not a giant block of explosives, it needs somthign called steel to keep it from exploding in the barrel and to prevent it from being smashed to peices on impact.

In fact, each 1,900 pound HC shell has only 150 pounds of explosives, but of a type far inferior to current fillers. Each APC round holds only 40 pounds.

Concession accepted fool.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-02-14 03:31pm

The Dark wrote:True, the Winnie's new fiver is a real good artillery gun. The sixteen and the BB would only be useful as intimidation tools, and the carriers are better at that anyway.

The 5/62's is an excellent gun, and every Flight IIA and Flight II vessel is going to get it when built or have it refitted in place of there existing 5/54. The Flight II's may also get the gun. LCS is looking at a 57mm, and DD-X and CG-21 will both carry AGS.

The intimidation value is marginal; a couple bombs make a bigger bang and blow more up. And there's no need to wait weeks for minesweepers to clear out a firing area to start the process, in the Gulf the battleships where steaming in circles in a one square mile area.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-02-14 03:35pm

This thread takes the prize for "most stupid vs topic in the history of SD.net". Not so much for the astounding stupidity of the subject (which was in jest, after all), but for the fact that it's somehow stretched to two pages despite that.

Vertigo1 · Post by **Vertigo1** » 2003-02-14 03:38pm

Darth Wong wrote:You're weird.

Couldn't have said it any better....

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2003-02-14 03:39pm

Darth Wong wrote:This thread takes the prize for "most stupid vs topic in the history of SD.net". Not so much for the astounding stupidity of the subject (which was in jest, after all), but for the fact that it's somehow stretched to two pages despite that.

Don't encourage it. Someone will try to top it.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-02-14 03:39pm

Darth Wong wrote:This thread takes the prize for "most stupid vs topic in the history of SD.net". Not so much for the astounding stupidity of the subject (which was in jest, after all), but for the fact that it's somehow stretched to two pages despite that.

I disagree. Darkstar's Death Star MCR posts easily exceeded 17 pages, and nothing short of pitting Darkstar against the Culture/Xeelee/4th Imperium Alliance can be as stupid as that.

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2003-02-14 03:39pm

By the way, waffles suck ass. Pancakes alla way baby.

Vertigo1 · Post by **Vertigo1** » 2003-02-14 03:42pm

Darth Wong wrote:This thread takes the prize for "most stupid vs topic in the history of SD.net". Not so much for the astounding stupidity of the subject (which was in jest, after all), but for the fact that it's somehow stretched to two pages despite that.

Ohh no Mike, there have been far worse on this board than this.

*cough*CrossoverManiac*cough*

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USS Missouri Vs Waffle Iron

Re: USS Missouri Vs Waffle Iron