She Only LOOKS Harmless...

[Broomstick]

Most of the machinery in the shop is in poor condition. I don't have the skills to restore it, so for me they would largely have only scrap value. I'd much prefer the money.

Now, I am aware of another person they owe money to who IS interested in the machinery for exactly that purpose.

[Zaune]

This is going to end so badly for your ex-boss that you're probably going to feel a little bit guilty afterwards.

Not saying you shouldn't have done it, mind you, just pointing out something you ought to be prepared for.

[Broomstick]

I think you underestimate just how ruthless and unrepentant I can be when someone threatens my family, and taking my income away is most certainly a threat. All I will do to her is take what I am due. What other people may do could be far worse, but it's not on my conscience.

[Lord Revan]

Tbh it seems that your employer did everything within her power to make herself seem as unworthy of any mercy as humanly possible.

[Eleas]

By definition, one can't make oneself "unworthy" of mercy.

That said, while I am glad that the situation seems to resolve itself, the mere fact that her scam had worked for so long and on so many people is a despicable state of affairs.

[Eleas]

(double post)

[Broomstick]

Somebody has to be the first to step forward and say "This is wrong".

People don't like to admit they've been conned or taken advantage of - nevermind that a person like TLTC is a pro at such things, it being how she made her living to a large extent. She was successful in part because she is good at exploiting, cheating, conning, fooling, and so forth. So a part of the population won't step forward because they're ashamed.

Some people have legal issues that make them reluctant to step forward, fearing the attention of the legal system. One of our past employees had as solid a case as I did, but she was also dealing drugs, which TLTC was aware of. So TLTC said that if said person tried anything to reclaim her lost wages TLTC would bring her to the attention of the police. This will often quickly put the brakes on bringing someone to court.

Some people look at the amount of money involved and don't want to bother - too much hassle, stress, inconvenience. In fact, a certain number of people did tell me to just walk away. There certainly was considerable stress and bother to do this. There were also a lot of threats on her part. She called me a liar, a thief, untrustworthy, incompetent, and probably some even more unpleasant things that never got back to me. When I went to the Labor Board she told me they'd never believe my side of the story, that my hand-written log of work hours had no legal validity, and so forth. After the Labor Board decided in my favor she threatened to punish me (although not really specified) for embarrassing her in that manner. She claimed to have proof that I owed her money. She said she had hired a big deal lawyer who had dirt on my lawyer. She said that if I dared to take her to court she would humiliate me, punish me, break me financially, take everything of value that I own (granted, that's not a whole lot at this point) and teach me a lesson about standing up to my betters. Clearly, she was trying to frighten me off, and likely for other people who are less educated, more easily intimidated, who don't keep good records, and don't know their rights this did work in the past.

But I have an overdeveloped sense of justice, I loathe bullies (which TLTC is, among other things), and I am squeaky clean legally. Every threat just made me more angry and more determined to get my due. It appears I was the first to step forward and drag TLTC into court. Well somebody had to be first.

[LadyTevar]

I am hoping that the money gets moved forward quickly.

[Broomstick]

I heard through a mutual acquaintance that after the debacle in the courtroom TLTC and the Store Manager went back to the shop whereupon TLTC proceeded to sob buckets. Store Manager got pissed at her for fairly obvious reasons and threw her out of the shop (figuratively, as doing so physically would have required several people).

The smartest thing TLTC could do at this point is write a check and be done with it. I dropped it into the grapevine that if she didn't have the whole amount she could write a check for some of it and contact my lawyer about a payment plan, which would save us having to chase her down.

But I don't expect her to suddenly start acting smart given her track record.

[Kuja]

She looked like the county fair's grand-prize pumpkin floating down the goddamned aisle. Her face was flushed red and she was panting from hauling her bulk as fast as she could into that room. “That's TLTC” I said, and everyone in my group turned around and said who? I said the large woman in the orange t-shirt. At least one of the party blinked a couple of times and said “oh.” It's a little hard to convey the sight, it was a really poor choice of color for someone with more girth than height. It was a poor choice for anything other than a traffic safety cone warning of a road hazard.

Oh god my sides. Thank you so much for sharing this, Broomstick.

[Korto]

I wonder if TLTC is medically a sociopath?

[Broomstick]

All I know for sure is that she's medically obese... it wouldn't surprise me to find out she's a sociopath.

[Borgholio]

it wouldn't surprise me to find out she's a sociopath.

Probably a hoarder with a constant victim mentality. I know a few people like that, unfortunately. They treat other people like dirt to make themselves feel better, but then act hurt and surprised when the tables are turned.

That said, congrats on your win. With my unemployment court case it was much the same thing. I had a binder full of crap that I never needed, but brought it just in case. The Loss Prevention manager had exactly jack and shit. I didn't need a single piece of evidence I brought, since the actions of the LP manager were all that was needed to win me the case.

Would you be possibly considering recommending your lawyer to represent the Store Manager?

[Broomstick]

Possibly. There is the problem of a potential conflict of interest (probably resolved to "no") and the matter of payment. My lawyer also has a "protege" who is looking for work. In any case, many people are urging Store Manager to get a lawyer to get herself extracted from the situation and deal with her fucked up finances.

There is also someone else discussing employing her, and she'll be needing a job so that's a good sign for her. Not a sure thing yet, but it's a good sign.

[Simon_Jester]

That's an impressive case of "I'm a fucking idiot" on the TLTC's part. It's weird, I read abotu people like that in books and think "no way anyone can be that stupid and that cruel." Then I read this and think "Hmmm...damn. Bitch."

Here's my take on it. If you take an ignorant, irresponsible, but sneaky person, and let them grow up, they will just spend the rest of their lives marinating in ignorance, irresponsibility, and sneakiness. Until they get the habit of living that way at all times. They will never think their actions through, they will always try to avoid the consequences of their actions through cunning and treachery. And this will work out for them... right up until the moment when it fails catastrophically.

The court system is literally designed to make such people fail catastrophically; everything about it is oriented toward this goal of making life hard for unsavory people who refuse to take the rules seriously. And I submit that that is exactly the way it should be.

[Borgholio]

And I submit that that is exactly the way it should be.

This.

Ideally, a court is a place where the objective truth of a conflict comes out and a decision is made on how to end the conflict fairly. If someone is a lying, cheating piece of shit, then that truth will come out...assuming they even show up, that is.

[PKRudeBoy]

That's an impressive case of "I'm a fucking idiot" on the TLTC's part. It's weird, I read abotu people like that in books and think "no way anyone can be that stupid and that cruel." Then I read this and think "Hmmm...damn. Bitch."

Here's my take on it. If you take an ignorant, irresponsible, but sneaky person, and let them grow up, they will just spend the rest of their lives marinating in ignorance, irresponsibility, and sneakiness. Until they get the habit of living that way at all times. They will never think their actions through, they will always try to avoid the consequences of their actions through cunning and treachery. And this will work out for them... right up until the moment when it fails catastrophically.

The court system is literally designed to make such people fail catastrophically; everything about it is oriented toward this goal of making life hard for unsavory people who refuse to take the rules seriously. And I submit that that is exactly the way it should be.

Or they grow up and go into the financial industry and make their catastrophic failures everyone else's problem.

[Simon_Jester]

That... usually isn't the ignorant or irresponsible people who do that, at least not irresponsible in the sense of irresponsible in their daily lives.

The people who go into the financial sector and cause meltdowns are a higher class of sociopath,* and much more dangerous, because they're smart enough to cover their tracks, think things through, and avoid getting nailed on easily enforced laws against things like "refuses to pay workers" or "forgot to pay taxes." They invest in competent lawyers and accountants, and reserve their chiseling and disregard for consequences for the larger scale.

Again, this makes them a bigger threat. Unfortunately the courts are not well set up to deal with that.

*For a very vague definition of 'sociopath.'

[Broomstick]

Well, after a couple months of hearing second-hand about how TLTC says the court decision doesn't matter, it's only small claims, she'll win in the end, etc.... TLTC woke up yesterday to find her bank accounts frozen. Not just the company one, her personal one as well (damn, my lawyer is good!).

She called my lawyer, crying hysterically, said she had proof, PROOF, DAMMIT! that she didn't owe me money and they only thing she ever did wrong was step on my ego and have such a hectic schedule she was late to court (funny... when she was adopting her grandkid she managed to show up on time every time...) Apparently, I'm some sort of evil, sadistic mastermind. Oh, the poor employees couldn't cash their paychecks! (Bullshit - she hasn't paid them in weeks, and when she does throw them a pittance it's always been in cash). Oh, her poor son! We froze the money that was for his special needs! (if he's a special needs kid it's because he's been emotionally neglected by her, but that's another story). Oh, her poor landlord, the rent check will bounce! (She hasn't paid her rent for at least two months.) Oh, that Broomstick is so evil!!!

I don't know if she believes her own lies or not. At this point I don't really care. The only people I feel bad for here are the customers who are going to go volcanic when they discover the shop is closed for good and they can't get their stuff.

The bank hasn't gotten back to my lawyer so I have no idea how much, if anything, we got.

TLTC claims she has a meeting with a bankruptcy attorney at 11 am today. Wonder if she knows you have to pay their fee in advance because, guess what, they don't work for free either!

[Borgholio]

First thought that came to my mind, "MUWAHAHAHAHAHAHA™"

[Jub]

Broomstick, having found myself in your same position out here in Australia I now know some of what you're going through. Thankfully I was able to get the person to settle for a fair amount and it seems likely that he will pay me in a timely fashion. Best of luck in recovering what you're owed and may your finances improve greatly in the near future.

[LadyTevar]

I'm sorry, I just had to smirk at the report of hysterics. I am sure your Lawyer was polite and civil when addressing her concerns. Me, I'd be too busy purring evilly and saying "Oh.. oh dear, so sorry... perhaps we can talk about getting the money now?"

[Wing Commander MAD]

I don't know if she believes her own lies or not. At this point I don't really care. The only people I feel bad for here are the customers who are going to go volcanic when they discover the shop is closed for good and they can't get their stuff.

How does that work anyways? I've fortunately never run into that particular situation, but would think there should be some way for the customer to either get their property back or at least be compensated for its value.

[Solauren]

I don't know if she believes her own lies or not. At this point I don't really care. The only people I feel bad for here are the customers who are going to go volcanic when they discover the shop is closed for good and they can't get their stuff.

How does that work anyways? I've fortunately never run into that particular situation, but would think there should be some way for the customer to either get their property back or at least be compensated for its value.

Depends on who and how the business in question was closed.

If it's the landlord, he might be obligated to confirm the ownership of anything in the shop before he liquidates it.
Anyone else, at least here in Ontario, they are obligated to confirm the ownership. i.e If the local Sheriff were to close down a car repair shop at the behest of the Federal government for non-payment of taxes, any vehicles undergoing repairs the Sheriff would have to contact the owners to let them know the situation and where/when to get their vehicles.

[Broomstick]

The last time this shop closed up there were enough legal issues to leave things in limbo for about 4 years. When the new shop opened as the new owners we made an effort to reunite the left-behind shoes, which were still in the basement, with their rightful owners. Names and phone numbers are on the job tickets so in most cases determining ownership was possible.

What happens this time? Damifino. It could wind up with a few years of legal limbo again.

Anyhow, my lawyer says that due to legal requirements and due process we won't get anything until after February 21, which is the next court hearing in regards to this matter. This time around I don't have to appear as it's now a collections hearing. If she doesn't show up for that one a warrant will be issued for her arrest.