F/A-22 Info, anyone?

[Sea Skimmer]

Except, that Tankers, AEW aircraft and bases would be defended by the same F/A-22's, along with a myriad of F-teen's.

If only you can force them to have a supply line as long as target to contiental US, it could work by spreading them thin.

Spread the Raptors thin might work however. Almost no one could interdict the US supply line back to the states, and even fewer could do it with fighters. That what gives the US such a huge advantage, it can shift and base stuff outside of a theater, while its enemies are limited to in theater movements and attacks

[phongn]

This fighter is a thing of beauty. We need a carrier variant for our nimitz class, and up the order from its measly 350 to 2000. Just some numbr to terrorize the shit out the of the rest of the "civilized" world.

Not even the United States military can afford to purcahse 2000 F/A-22s. And there isn't enough money for a navalized one, either.

[phongn]

*insane mode*
GAHHHHH MASS AIRBUST NUKESSSSS with long wave lengh radar

/insane mode

Hey! Only Sea Skimmer and I are allowed to break out the nukes!

[Azeron]

ohh please thats the liberal in you. We can pay for it, off the backs of the poor!!

lol. just buy 200 a year for 10 years. that should do it. It should cost a good deal less per unit since we would be buing in a huge quantity. Considering what we would probably waste it on, on say inner city developement, farm subsidies, it would be money well spent.

[phongn]

ohh please thats the liberal in you. We can pay for it, off the backs of the poor!!

lol. just buy 200 a year for 10 years. that should do it. It should cost a good deal less per unit since we would be buing in a huge quantity. Considering what we would probably waste it on, on say inner city developement, farm subsidies, it would be money well spent.

Even if you kill farm subsidies and welfare I doubt that we could buy 2000 F/A-22s and their support assets. Plus, we don't need that many fighters. More than 350, but not 2000.

[Sea Skimmer]

ohh please thats the liberal in you. We can pay for it, off the backs of the poor!!

lol. just buy 200 a year for 10 years. that should do it. It should cost a good deal less per unit since we would be buing in a huge quantity. Considering what we would probably waste it on, on say inner city developement, farm subsidies, it would be money well spent.

You are correct, buying 2000 would greatly drive down the unit cost. However the cost would still be far to great for the USAF to afford that many, we'd still be looking at an extramly expsnive aircraft. Even in the peak of cold war deficit spending no more then 1200 F-22's where ever projected. Anyway, what would 2000 F/A-22's fight? There would be perhaps 5 military air targets in the world for each of them, assuming every potential enemy declared war and we didn't blow anything up on the ground

Better to invest in 400 or so F/A-22's, and spend the money on aircraft will better A2G capacity then just two JDAM's or six-eight SDB's. Another run of B-2's, investing in FB-22, bringing Comanche finally online after we already spent 46 billion on it and a couple other projects like Crusader and LASM could all use funding.

Doing of all that would provide a much more useful capacity while still being cheeper.

If the USAF had bought 4000 B-2's, each would have cost about 90 million, for a total of about 360 billion dollars, about 1 years defence budget. That doesn’t make it a good idea to buy as many B-2's as the B-29's..

Though I'm sure you will soon start arguing for 4000 B-2s and I will regret bring this up.

[Sea Skimmer]

*insane mode*
GAHHHHH MASS AIRBUST NUKESSSSS with long wave lengh radar

/insane mode

Hey! Only Sea Skimmer and I are allowed to break out the nukes!

Yes, and my latest weapon, a WIG aircraft which launches FB-22's equipped with JDAM B-61-11's is just itching for a target to nuke. And of course the Snark utterly random thermonuclear destruction weapon of Doom is always ready.

I dare a defender to figure out what its target is!

[phongn]

*insane mode*
GAHHHHH MASS AIRBUST NUKESSSSS with long wave lengh radar

/insane mode

Hey! Only Sea Skimmer and I are allowed to break out the nukes!

Yes, and my latest weapon, a WIG aircraft which launches FB-22's equipped with JDAM B-61-11's is just itching for a target to nuke. And of course the Snark utterly random thermonuclear destruction weapon of Doom is always ready.

I dare a defender to figure out what its target is!

What, the Snark? Brazil, of course, though you aimed it at Greenland.

[Azeron]

Nah, I could find use in a potential deterent to anyone else upgrading thier airforce to counter. Its like MAD except they just get destroyed. I am thinking I would like to forward to deploy about 600 - 800 of them in and around the china-russia area. Not just the f/a, mixed in with the b variant. put 400 around the middle east area, and the rest base at home just in case we need to go invade europe or something. I think about 400-500 b2 would be a good number.

afford is a relative term. you say 360 billion is one years budget, but if you spread out percument out over a decade the number is more like 4.5 trillion budget with a $360 billion dollar expediture I think that sprucing up the carriers with a plane like this, will only cause china and other rouge nations to think twice about fighting a carrier battle gorup.

[Sea Skimmer]

Hey! Only Sea Skimmer and I are allowed to break out the nukes!

Yes, and my latest weapon, a WIG aircraft which launches FB-22's equipped with JDAM B-61-11's is just itching for a target to nuke. And of course the Snark utterly random thermonuclear destruction weapon of Doom is always ready.

I dare a defender to figure out what its target is!

What, the Snark? Brazil, of course, though you aimed it at Greenland.

I see my secret production run of 5000 slipped past your spies. Every last one is targeted on one spot, Warsaw actually, to ensure a nice dispersion across half the globe..

[phongn]

afford is a relative term. you say 360 billion is one years budget, but if you spread out percument out over a decade the number is more like 4.5 trillion budget with a $360 billion dollar expediture I think that sprucing up the carriers with a plane like this, will only cause china and other rouge nations to think twice about fighting a carrier battle gorup.

$4.5 trillion budget? Are you mad, Azeron? The US GDP is only $10 trillion.

[phongn]

Yes, and my latest weapon, a WIG aircraft which launches FB-22's equipped with JDAM B-61-11's is just itching for a target to nuke. And of course the Snark utterly random thermonuclear destruction weapon of Doom is always ready.

I dare a defender to figure out what its target is!

What, the Snark? Brazil, of course, though you aimed it at Greenland.

I see my secret production run of 5000 slipped past your spies. Every last one is targeted on one spot, Warsaw actually, to ensure a nice dispersion across half the globe..

No, I saw the production run. The Snark is too easily intercepted to pose much of a threat to me, even if it's the most unreliable cruise missile ever built.

My Pluto nuclear cruise missiles await, however.

[Guest]

[quote]Yeah, it's been delayed for a ridiculously long time, but that doesn't change the fact that the USAF pretty much needs the F-22 and is fighting tooth and nail to keep it.[\quote]

Do we really want to give this power to Dubya or some other probably fundie head of state? Ack! a christian fundie jihad. Look at how Dubya is already bypassing the senate and granting himself all these powers. Imagine the damage. What if the US becomes a Fundie police state and eyes, say Canada or Europe. When I get out of college I plan on moving there before the US becomes a police state. OK maybe I'm a little paranoid and pessimistic. Oh lets just hope the chances of that asteroid hitting earth in 2015 increases from 1:1e6 to 1:1.

[phongn]

Yeah, it's been delayed for a ridiculously long time, but that doesn't change the fact that the USAF pretty much needs the F-22 and is fighting tooth and nail to keep it.[\quote]

Do we really want to give this power to Dubya or some other probably fundie head of state? Ack! a christian fundie jihad.

While GWB is overly religous, I don't see him turning the US into a fundamentalist state. Furthermore, he would likely be stopped first (using the military if neccessary, for he would be a threat to the US Constitution).

Look at how Dubya is already bypassing the senate and granting himself all these powers.

Examples?

Imagine the damage. What if the US becomes a Fundie police state and eyes, say Canada or Europe. When I get out of college I plan on moving there before the US becomes a police state.

Go for it, but I don't see the US becoming a police state anytime soon.

OK maybe I'm a little paranoid and pessimistic. Oh lets just hope the chances of that asteroid hitting earth in 2015 increases from 1:1e6 to 1:1.

I think not.

[Sea Skimmer]

What, the Snark? Brazil, of course, though you aimed it at Greenland.

I see my secret production run of 5000 slipped past your spies. Every last one is targeted on one spot, Warsaw actually, to ensure a nice dispersion across half the globe..

No, I saw the production run. The Snark is too easily intercepted to pose much of a threat to me, even if it's the most unreliable cruise missile ever built.

My Pluto nuclear cruise missiles await, however.

The point of Snark is to make you expend ammo and fuel, and also to just be annoying by cluttering you your defenses radar screens. Each also now has a jammer to further the annoyance. And with its new 3-megaton payload, you can't afford to ignore them.

I have a declared PLUTO stock as well you know.

[Sea Skimmer]

afford is a relative term. you say 360 billion is one years budget, but if you spread out percument out over a decade the number is more like 4.5 trillion budget with a $360 billion dollar expediture I think that sprucing up the carriers with a plane like this, will only cause china and other rouge nations to think twice about fighting a carrier battle gorup.

$4.5 trillion budget? Are you mad, Azeron? The US GDP is only $10 trillion.

He doesnt mean a 4.5 trillion per year budget, but rather per decade. 360 billion per year over 10 years would be 3.6 trillion. He's off by a trillion in his math, unless he expects a 100 billion increase in the defence budget.

[phongn]

The point of Snark is to make you expend ammo and fuel, and also to just be annoying by cluttering you your defenses radar screens. Each also now has a jammer to further the annoyance. And with its new 3-megaton payload, you can't afford to ignore them.

I have a declared PLUTO stock as well you know.

Well, yes, I know that. We both have large enough arsenals, why not use them against the armies of Sanchez & Sheppard?

[phongn]

afford is a relative term. you say 360 billion is one years budget, but if you spread out percument out over a decade the number is more like 4.5 trillion budget with a $360 billion dollar expediture I think that sprucing up the carriers with a plane like this, will only cause china and other rouge nations to think twice about fighting a carrier battle gorup.

$4.5 trillion budget? Are you mad, Azeron? The US GDP is only $10 trillion.

He doesnt mean a 4.5 trillion per year budget, but rather per decade. 360 billion per year over 10 years would be 3.6 trillion. He's off by a trillion in his math, unless he expects a 100 billion increase in the defence budget.

I think he does.

[Sea Skimmer]

The point of Snark is to make you expend ammo and fuel, and also to just be annoying by cluttering you your defenses radar screens. Each also now has a jammer to further the annoyance. And with its new 3-megaton payload, you can't afford to ignore them.

I have a declared PLUTO stock as well you know.

Well, yes, I know that. We both have large enough arsenals, why not use them against the armies of Sanchez & Sheppard?

That would be a better option. The balance of lunacy doest really work between us since we both have insane defences and are far too willing to fire.

However They don't seem to want to come out and play very often. Course I think my combination of super hardened bunkers that can hold whole Corps, 140mm gunned M1A3, 203 and 240mm Enhanced Crusaders, HEMTTRAM and shit loads of tac air could take one of them on without nukes . But they make things so much more fun, I like MRBM's and IRBM's..

[RayCav of ASVS]

Hmmm, methinks this thread is getting a bit out of hand

[MKSheppard]

It's already in fleet service.......which is more than we can say
for that expensive boondoggle called the F-22 or F/A-22 or WTF
they're calling it this week.

http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/mil ... stones.htm

April 4, 2000 - Three Super Hornet squadrons - VFA-122, VX-9 and the ITT - begin sea trials aboard USS Lincoln.

....

Sept. 26, 2001 - Boeing delivers first full-rate production Super Hornet to U.S. Navy.

Under Ten Years from prototype to fleet service!

Hell, the B-2 started at around the same time as the F-22 and we
have it in service!

Axe both it and the V-22 (yet another hideously delayed program) and use the saved money to buy more fast
RO-RO ships so we can send MECHANIZED DEATH anywhere in the
world within 1 week.

[Sea Skimmer]

It's already in fleet service.......which is more than we can say
for that expensive boondoggle.

http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/mil ... stones.htm

April 4, 2000 - Three Super Hornet squadrons - VFA-122, VX-9 and the ITT - begin sea trials aboard USS Lincoln.

....

Sept. 26, 2001 - Boeing delivers first full-rate production Super Hornet to U.S. Navy.

Under Ten Years from prototype to fleet service!

Hell, the B-2 started at around the same time as the F-22 and we
have it in service!

Axe both it and the V-22 (yet another hideously delayed program) and use the saved money to buy more fast
RO-RO ships so we can send MECHANIZED DEATH anywhere in the
world within 1 week.

How exactly do you intend to bring armor ashore from a RO-RO without a secure beachhead?

Given that all they really had to do was add bigger fuel tanks and another pair of hard points, is pretty pitiful that F/A-18E took a decade, if its bad that the F-22 has taken so long. The F/A-18E is not an all-new aircraft, just a big upgrade of the existing F/A-18C, which had been in service from nearly 20 years. The F-22 is something all knew with technology that will put it ahead over everything else in the world for a couple decades, just like the F-15 did back in 1980.

Anyway the F-22 could have been in service five years ago if Congress had not cut it's funding and constantly interfered, same for the RAH-66 and V-22.

Everyone said AIM-120 wouldn't work/cost too much, along with the M1, the M2, E-3 and AH-64, yet all have proved extremely effective in combat.

[MKSheppard]

Anyway the F-22 could have been in service five years ago if Congress had not cut it's funding and constantly interfered, same for the RAH-66 and V-22.

Everyone said AIM-120 wouldn't work/cost too much, along with the M1, the M2, E-3 and AH-64, yet all have proved extremely effective in combat.

Was this the same congress that let the B-2 get in squadron service,
despite it's hideous Cost? Doesn't fly man.....literally. Sort of like how
the V-22 is a hideous deathtrap that seems to have one purpose: Kill
Marines.

Screw the F-22, I want a massive fleet of RO RO ships supported by
CVNs capable of landing several Armored divisions anywhere in the
world, and capable of annihilating any opposing army in less than
100 hours.

As for securing the Beach head, that's what the USMC is for, along with
the Supercarriers.

Our planes are already better than anything in the world, except for
some Russian Experimental whackjobs...and when someone buys
those, they never train their pilots....

Reminds me of a quote by an Iraqi Commander:

"After six weeks of bombardment from the air, I had sixty tanks.
After Six minutes of combat with M1s, I had none left"

[phongn]

The point of Snark is to make you expend ammo and fuel, and also to just be annoying by cluttering you your defenses radar screens. Each also now has a jammer to further the annoyance. And with its new 3-megaton payload, you can't afford to ignore them.

I have a declared PLUTO stock as well you know.

Well, yes, I know that. We both have large enough arsenals, why not use them against the armies of Sanchez & Sheppard?

That would be a better option. The balance of lunacy doest really work between us since we both have insane defences and are far too willing to fire.

Indeed. We're far too trigger-happy (the thought of us in charge probably would give Mr. Slade an ulcer).

However They don't seem to want to come out and play very often. Course I think my combination of super hardened bunkers that can hold whole Corps, 140mm gunned M1A3, 203 and 240mm Enhanced Crusaders, HEMTTRAM and shit loads of tac air could take one of them on without nukes . But they make things so much more fun, I like MRBM's and IRBM's..

Well, I tried hitting their formations with old SAC bombers, but noooo, you had to shoot at my aircraft!

[Sea Skimmer]

Well, yes, I know that. We both have large enough arsenals, why not use them against the armies of Sanchez & Sheppard?

That would be a better option. The balance of lunacy doest really work between us since we both have insane defences and are far too willing to fire.

Indeed. We're far too trigger-happy (the thought of us in charge probably would give Mr. Slade an ulcer).

"Mr. President, Sudanese demonstrators burned down our abandon embassy again." "Nuke em." "Umm, I not sure that it's a wise policy move sir, over somthing so minor.." "Nuke em damnit, I want that embassy and everything within forty blocks glassed in a half hour, hit Iran again while you're at it."

"Right sir, flatten downtown Khartoum and nuke Iran for the fifth time, Ill see that's it done." "Good, and bring me the latest issue of Crazy Ivan's Discounted Cold war Surplus."

Slade wouldn't have time for an ulcer; he'd be too busy moving to the Galapagos Islands along with 2/3s of the board.

However They don't seem to want to come out and play very often. Course I think my combination of super hardened bunkers that can hold whole Corps, 140mm gunned M1A3, 203 and 240mm Enhanced Crusaders, HEMTTRAM and shit loads of tac air could take one of them on without nukes . But they make things so much more fun, I like MRBM's and IRBM's..

Well, I tried hitting their formations with old SAC bombers, but noooo, you had to shoot at my aircraft!

What else where the F-108's going to shoot at? Anyway I did make up for it by crushing his forces later, course then you had the pull out the nuclear artillery battery so I threw a whole artillery division at them and then the thread got locked.