StarDestroyer.Net BBS

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Prehaps we should put a list of who is acutal in the top seventy five and see what skills we have to work with

Admittly personaly a large amount of my skills are completly useless in Middle Earth(Last time I check Sauron was not using 256k encryption, nor will we need to maintain any computer networks of any kind or any sort of data security)
But I know my way around pracitly any fire-arm and can get a minium of Sharpshooter with it, given a hundred rounds or so to familirse myself with the weapon

It would be useful to have list of what we bring to the table


As a side note I suggest equiping everyone with the newest in Chinese AK techology, Three reasons, Damn things are easy to fix, They never break to being with, and they have excelent stopping power

Can the gov break 256 bit encryption in a reasonable amount of time (there would be no point in mentioning the skill if it would not break 256 bit encryption, even though Sauron does not use it)? Bean implied he could do this...

Maybe someone should test this and mail an encrypted threating letter. If they disappear, then the gov can decrypt it in a reasonable amount of time.


Oh well, time to daisy chain several algorithims and keys. (in a hypothetical scenario) [/quote]

Depends on the algorithm. No-one's going to brute-force something with that large of a key but if they're a weakness in that particular cipher it could be done.

256 bit encryptions isn't that hard to break.

However according to your quote, it's 256k encryption, which would be VERY difficult.

phongn wrote:Depends on the algorithm. No-one's going to brute-force something with that large of a key but if they're a weakness in that particular cipher it could be done.

No not, you see they had this 18 acre computer, and that was 20 years ago that they use to break... Wait; was that my pervious life or a movie? Damn, can't take any risks.

*Sets building bomb timer for 3 minutes and runs for helicopter*

Maybe there's a weakness built into AES. Then again it was developed in a foreign country.

How much computing power would you need to brute-force it? Maybe the NSA has a QC in their basement (j/k). How much computing power would you need to brute force in in say, a timespan of a 6 months continuously?

Oh 256000 bit encryption. Nevermind, you could never encrypt that in a reasonable amount of time, so if the gov can break it, encryption is futile. Oh well there is always physical transfer of data, one-time pads, and thermite lined computers.

Not sure. First, by "brute force" I presume that you are still trying to use the most intellegent ways. One cannot attempt to try each possible combination, but rather to factor the two keys. I'm not sure how fast one can factor though. The fastest factoring algorithm supposedly runs in "O(exp(1.9223(ln n1/3 (ln ln n2/3))" where n is the number to be factored. Also, someone broke a 56 bit key in less than a day. Using those two figures, one can theoretically calculate how long a 256k bit key would take.

That somsone, would not be me.

Yogi wrote:256 bit encryptions isn't that hard to break.

That really depends on the type of algorithm involved. 256 bit public key (e.g. RSA) is trivial to break but 256 bit symmetric is essentially unbreakable by brute-force means alone. Cracking a cypher key requires testing an average of half the keys in the entire keyspace. Given the key space of a 256 bit cypher, an average of 5.8e76 attempts would be required to brute-force the cypher. If one could test 1,000,000,000 keys a second, searching the keyspace would take 5.8e67 seconds, or about 1.8e60 years. Well constructed 256 bit symmetric cyphers are more than secure for the forseeable future.

Yogi wrote:Also, someone broke a 56 bit key in less than a day. Using those two figures, one can theoretically calculate how long a 256k bit key would take.

You're comparing apples and oranges. RSA can be defeated by factoring. This is why absurdly long keys are required for security. Factoring, however, is not useful against symetric cyphers like DES or AES.

To break a 56 bit key in 24 hours would require 833,999,930,994 key tests a second. Applying the same figure to a 256 bit symmetric cypher equates to a break time of 7e64 seconds, or about 2e57 years.

No the goverment can't break 256k Encrpytion in under a few days(Nor can anyone else, I was just exagerating) but then you can't brute force double layer encypition to begin with


To give a quick how to, Say you want to send somthing secure over computer lines


You can first encypt the information in lets say 256 Bit system so your information is scrampled, Its now secure to be on your computer at least, though it can still be Brute Forced(Might take you 1e80 Years to test them all but it might not take 1e80 years to stumble onto the correct solution)

Now to further secure it for trasmission you simply use the Lock-box method

IE, I take my information, place it in a box(Packets), slap a lock on it(Further Encypition) and send it off to you, You don't do anything besides slap your OWN encypition lock on it and send it back to me, I remove my lock then send it to you
Because in each instance its treated as new-un encypted information this can been done realtivly fast and still keeps the file sizes down

Well there is always the QC. Current ones are too primitive for the purpose though.

http://www.sans.org/rr/encryption/quantum3.php

The problem is once it is built, everything that was ever encrypted will be open.

There's also DNA computing.

Pu-239 wrote:Maybe there's a weakness built into AES. Then again it was developed in a foreign country.

AES is intended as the standard government encryption standard (replacing DES/3DES). The algorithms for all of the contenders is public and subject to attack by the NSA in the testing phase. As such, it is unlikely that any sort of weakness was built in.

How much computing power would you need to brute-force it? Maybe the NSA has a QC in their basement (j/k). How much computing power would you need to brute force in in say, a timespan of a 6 months continuously?

Ludicrous amounts of computing power that borders on the impossible

Pu-239 wrote:The problem is once it is built, everything that was ever encrypted will be open.

There's also DNA computing.

From what I've read, quantum computing will effectively halve the keysize of existing ciphers. It may provide clues into a algorithm weakness, but AFAIK it won't render all current ciphers obsolete.

From the article

Even with this latest advance, the world is still years away from a functional quantum computer. However, this recent development is a strong indication that quantum computing is quickly moving from the realm of science fiction into reality. When these computers become reality even the early versions will be incredibly powerful. A 30-qubit quantum computer would be roughly equivalent to a conventional computer running at 10 teraops, or trillions of operations per second. The fastest supercomputers in the world today have only achieved speeds of about two teraops.

Pu-239 wrote:From the article

Even with this latest advance, the world is still years away from a functional quantum computer. However, this recent development is a strong indication that quantum computing is quickly moving from the realm of science fiction into reality. When these computers become reality even the early versions will be incredibly powerful. A 30-qubit quantum computer would be roughly equivalent to a conventional computer running at 10 teraops, or trillions of operations per second. The fastest supercomputers in the world today have only achieved speeds of about two teraops.

The fastest computer in the world can do ~35 TOP/sec (Japan's Earth Simulator, built by NEC). The next fastest, IBM's ASCI White, can do ~10 TOP/sec (it's used by the US DOD).

IBM's ASCI Purple is slated to hit 100 TOP/sec, and their Blue Gene/L project will hit 360 TOP/sec. Their ultimate goal is Blue Gene (sans/L) which will hit 1 POP/sec.