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Something I have noted about recent trends in car design:

I read about this year's annual international automobile fair (I think it was in Geneva), and many of the new cars from Asian and European manufacturers appear to be pseudo-minivans.

Even ordinary cars are starting to look like MPVs. (Multi-Purpose Vehicles, which is what we call minivans here in Europe)

I have nothing against this, as the box-like shape usually grants lots of interior space. (Which isn't half bad either, since increasing safety rules have made cars less roomy over the years)

Here are some examples of the Minivanization of regular cars:
(Note: They aren't real minivans, but they surely look a lot like them!)

2003 Toyota Corolla Hatchback (In the US, the Corolla is only available in sedan form, but in Europe we also get stationwagon and hatchback versions):



2003 Hyundai Getz:


2003 Citroën C3:


And finally,

2003 Honda Civic Hatchback:


Meanwhile, in the USA, Off-roaders and SUVs appear to be the trend. The US division of Ford even cancelled the Ford Contour and replaced it with the Excape, a pseudo-SUV which is based upon the Contour's chassis... and the Excape is selling twice as good as the Contour did.

What is the explanation for these different directions?? My personal explanation is that minivans tend to be more compacted than SUVs (which usually look like crossbreeds between stationwagons and pick-up trucks), and therefore appeal more to European and Asian markets. However, SUVs have a "macho" feel that minivans lack, which makes them more fashionable in the USA.

BTW, feel free to correct me.

I don't know anything about the above cars, except that they're ugly. Ack, I'd buy one of those at about the same time I'd buy an Aztec.

Well, from my lacking knowledge, I guess us Americans are going with SUVs to feel even bigger than what's necessarily safe

Shinova wrote:Well, from my lacking knowledge, I guess us Americans are going with SUVs to feel even bigger than what's necessarily safe

In a danish car buying guide, I read that the Americans love SUVS so much because their highways are in very bad shape!! Then again, the danish governments spends way too many money on highway improvement.

Simon H.Johansen wrote:

Shinova wrote:Well, from my lacking knowledge, I guess us Americans are going with SUVs to feel even bigger than what's necessarily safe

In a danish car buying guide, I read that the Americans love SUVS so much because their highways are in very bad shape!! Then again, the danish governments spends way too many money on highway improvement.

Our highways aren't in that bad shape. Most people never use SUVs for sport nor utility. It's a trend. Hence the stereotype of the soccer mom driving an SUV. Uh, you might not get that one.

It's a stupid trend for most. Kind of like the PT Cruiser.

The new Civic hatchback harkens back to various Civic hatchbacks of the past, as well as the CRX. It is not some kind of new fad.

it seems that these minivans aren´t that bad. they don´t waste that much gas but you can still fit a whole bunch of stuff into it such as shopping or kids. i agree with DG that they´re ugly.

SUVs are just a trend. Most people who buy them won't ever use them for offroading (who the hell is going to take a $55,000 Cadillac Escalade through the mud?). And in my experience, people who DO use SUVs in areas where the roads are bad (like up in the mountains), use 20 year old Suburbans and Broncos because if they were rich enough to afford a shiny new Explorer or Durango or Tahoe, they wouldn't live up the in the mountains with the bad roads.

Here is what I think:

All SUV owners should be required to use the 4WD system off road at least once, and should be trained on a trail before being allowed to buy it.

Every 4WD vehicle that me or my family has ever owned has either been off road or has been bought with the intention of actually using the 4WD system.

And you shouldn't under any case be allowed to buy a 4WD Jeep if you have no intention of taking it off road. Jeep owners who don't ever want their rig off road are an insult to Jeep owners like me, IMHO...

Soccer moms should never, in ANY way, form, or fashion be allowed to drive an SUV.

Like i heard on 60 minutes people who buy SUVs used their new toy to intimidate everyone else in the streets or on the roads,its like they`re sending the message get out of my way or i`ll kill you

OT: what is a soccer mom?

salm wrote:OT: what is a soccer mom?

It ususually means a suburbian mother who doesn't necessarilly work outside
the home but is on the road a lot for short errands, like taking the kids to soccer practice. Soccer being a sport that both boys & girls can play which first (in the USA) started gaining widespread popularity in the suburbs.

Soccer Moms = She-yuppies

Simon H.Johansen wrote:In a danish car buying guide, I read that the Americans love SUVS so much because their highways are in very bad shape!! Then again, the danish governments spends way too many money on highway improvement.

That's the fucking truth at least in Detroit. The highways are shit and the ordinary roads aren't much better. They can't close 'em because of the enormous traffic volume until they absolutely have to so you feel like you're offroading by the time they do fix them.

Simon H.Johansen wrote: http://www.toyota.dk/images/Corkap23.jpg


2003 Hyundai Getz:
http://www.discountpartcenter.com/photo ... 20Getz.jpg

2003 Citroën C3:
http://www.holcar.co.uk/images_offers/c3.jpg

And finally,

2003 Honda Civic Hatchback:
http://www.automotive.com/honda/images/ ... chback.jpg

Wow, the Citroën looks a lot better than the old cars by that company (Giles' old car on BTVS). I'm not sure they are readily available in the US. The others probably are though.

Simon H.Johansen wrote: Meanwhile, in the USA, Off-roaders and SUVs appear to be the trend. The US division of Ford even cancelled the Ford Contour and replaced it with the Excape, a pseudo-SUV which is based upon the Contour's chassis... and the Excape is selling twice as good as the Contour did.

What is the explanation for these different directions?? My personal explanation is that minivans tend to be more compacted than SUVs (which usually look like crossbreeds between stationwagons and pick-up trucks), and therefore appeal more to European and Asian markets. However, SUVs have a "macho" feel that minivans lack, which makes them more fashionable in the USA.

BTW, feel free to correct me.

My state probably has even slightly more SUVs than most do but we still have plenty of bandwagon types. I personally drive a light pick-up truck (not 4x4) (aka a guy's version of a station wagon). I don't really hall stuff in it that often but it's nice to be able to carry rock, or my ladder or most anything else when I need to. Even though I could get better fuel economy with a car I am glad for the slightly higher profile my truck has. The roads in Tucson are mostly awful. Plus, a lot of those roads are just paved over washes. We also don't have a lot of drainage sewers in a lot of the area. This means that when it rains there is a lot of standing water around, often too deep for a car. Actually we have some places where its too deep for non-amphibious vehicles too.

I would have to say that if I were to buy a new vehicle now I might consider something like a "minivanized" car because of the versitility and gas mileage. I kind of like some of the Subaru's because of the halling space and the clearance (better than most SUV's) but for what they cost I'd be better off (again) buying a base model light pick-up. I don't see how most of the high mileage vehicles would survive all the dips and potholes around here, and then theres the water.

Ahhh. Minor nitpick, we do get the Corolla station wagon in the US again. Except they call it the "Matrix." About damned time too. The old 4WD Corolla-derivative station wagons were really good vehicles.

And if anybody buys an SUV, it's not because the highways in the US of A are going to shit. Mind you, the highways of the US of A really are going to shit, but the still rather 'primitive' (Meaning leaf springs and solid axles) and stiff suspension setups of most truck-based SUVs would make the ride much worse.

And the reason Americans buy SUVs has nothing to do with highway safety (They're only 'safe' as long as they run into smaller cars that fold up like cheap tents in a stiff breeze.) or cargo hauling or passenger room (for most purposes, a minivan or station wagon provides ample space and towing capacity.) If that were just the case, then we'd still have minivans flying off the lots like hotcakes, and station wagons would be selling nicely.. Instead, they buy SUVs because it's the hot thing to do. The typical American doesn't need the typical full-sized SUV. They don't need to pull a three ton trailer on a cross-country road trip.

NF_Utvol wrote:Here is what I think:

All SUV owners should be required to use the 4WD system off road at least once, and should be trained on a trail before being allowed to buy it.

Every 4WD vehicle that me or my family has ever owned has either been off road or has been bought with the intention of actually using the 4WD system.

And you shouldn't under any case be allowed to buy a 4WD Jeep if you have no intention of taking it off road. Jeep owners who don't ever want their rig off road are an insult to Jeep owners like me, IMHO...

Soccer moms should never, in ANY way, form, or fashion be allowed to drive an SUV.

Most SUVs that people buy wouldn't be able to go offroad. Most of the small ones (RAV4, CRV, Forester) have car-type AWD systems which are designed for poor road conditions and lack the low-range needed to really get one out of a stuck. For that matter, so do most mid-size SUVs. And the big ones are much too big to go offroading. Try it, and you'll bog down to the running boards in fifteen seconds flat.

Yes, people who buy Jeeps and never plan to actually drive them up muddy rocky trails, or more challenging territory, probably should be shot. The typical Jeep is designed for serious off-roading work. They have a proper locking 4WD system with a low-range.

GrandMasterTerwynn wrote:Ahhh. Minor nitpick, we do get the Corolla station wagon in the US again. Except they call it the "Matrix." About damned time too. The old 4WD Corolla-derivative station wagons were really good vehicles.

Why do they call the Corolla wagon "Matrix"??? Hyundai sells a mini-minivan called Matrix, so this is slightly confusing. And why is the Corolla hatchback no longer available in the USA??

I've actually read in another car buying guide that the Corolla sedan actually is of worse assembly quality than the rest of the Corolla line.