StarDestroyer.Net BBS

I care about the natural environment, or at least I think I do. But lately I've begun to realize something: things are getting worse, not better and there's nothing I can do to change that.

I'm not a "leader" in any sense of the word; the very thought of being a leader, or even just a public figure, frightens me.

Just as well considering that most people don't give a rat's ass about the environment (or even take glee in destroying it), I'd just be wasting my time. Maybe humanity deserves to suffocate in its own waste.

Basically, the present feels like a grimdark dead end to me and I'm beginning to wonder if I should even be alive.

Step 1) Go and see your equivalent of a GP
Step 2) Ask to be assessed for depression
Step 3) Ask to be referred to some form of talking therapy
Step 4) Look for local peer support groups
Step 5) Come to the realisation that many people feel this way, and are most assuredly alive
Step6) If all else fails, consider a light dose of antidepressants, healthy living or a mix of all of the above
Step 7) There is no step 7, but I felt a plan such as this probably requires at least seven points.

Welcome to Nihilism.

Sounds like it is either depression or you've got a case of the downers. If it's been going on for more than a couple weeks, see a doctor as has been said. I mean realistically we are fucking up the planet's climate for tons of people and species beyond the point of salvation, but if you personally feel like you have nothing to hope/ live for, then that's unhealthy. I mean welcome to the club and all, but like a long time fan of a band that just made it big, we don't want you here.

Dartzap wrote:Step 1) Go and see your equivalent of a GP
Step 2) Ask to be assessed for depression
Step 3) Ask to be referred to some form of talking therapy
Step 4) Look for local peer support groups
Step 5) Come to the realisation that many people feel this way, and are most assuredly alive
Step6) If all else fails, consider a light dose of antidepressants, healthy living or a mix of all of the above
Step 7) There is no step 7, but I felt a plan such as this probably requires at least seven points.

I know that this is going to sound harsh, maybe even insane but I find that the key to coping with such feelings is to realize you need to say "So fucking what!" And that's with an exclamation and not a question mark.

Things are bad? So fucking what! People are evil and getting worse by the day? So fucking what! The world is burning and I am fucking kindling being drawn toward my inevitable demise by a fucking literal river of blood?* So fucking what!

Bottom line is that even the worst, most depressive nihilist you can find in the worst most depressive place on earth is still really, really optimistic about the true nature of our existence. And whilst you can live your whole life without coming to this realization if you do come about it the only choice you have is to be crushed by it or learn to roll with it. Personally I prefer option #2. For once you learn to do that things get a lot better as you can focus on enjoying the little things in life like a good drink or conversation or finding a coin in the middle of the street. And that coin is going to cheer you up even if it isn't enough to actually get you fed for the day.

And really, over time that's what matters in life. And you'll learn not to even think about the big things. And with time you'll even return to an approximation of the blissful state of ignorance from whence you came.

---

*This statement is metaphorical of course. But the sentiment behind it is genuine. For frankly I find it to be a nice and creative summary of the way civilization, the environment and everything else is going lately.

[Please not Purple is batshit insane and taking his advice is probably unwise]

SolarpunkFan, I would like to point out a few things.

One is that people have been asserting that things will get worse in the near future for a very long time, and seizing on every sort of justification or explanation for how they might get worse. They do not get worse uniformly in any meaningful sense. Anyone can tell a story in which the future is bad. That does not translate into the future actually being bad.

People who are young (say, 20-30) seem particularly vulnerable to thinking the world is getting worse, right now- because we are in an era where there is no obvious thing for youths to do that they have faith will make the world better. We are, perhaps, temporarily on hold- the world may not be getting better this decade. Perhaps something else needs to happen to give us our opening to change things. But that does not mean that the future is a boot stomping on a face forever.

Moreover, as noted, you personally do not need to justify your existence. Your right to exist is independent of you being able to come up with some explanation of what you are for. You can take the time and effort you need to create meaning for yourself, in the true existentialist sense. Perhaps this meaning is grand and glorious, or small and humble. It can define you in terms of a great global movement of ideology or technology. Or it can revolve around your personal meaning to a small group of people you love and cherish.

But if you're going to go as far as you've gone down the road of nihilism, it logically follows that you must complete the path a la Sartre, and recognize that if your existence lacks intrinsic meaning, this is simply an opportunity for you to cretae meaning independently.

Simon_Jester wrote:[Please note Purple is the dumbest troll to ever troll, such a dumb troll in fact, the troll guild kicked him out for being such a fucking stupid troll and taking his advice is probably unwise]

SolarpunkFan, I would like to point out a few things.

One is that people have been asserting that things will get worse in the near future for a very long time, and seizing on every sort of justification or explanation for how they might get worse. They do not get worse uniformly in any meaningful sense. Anyone can tell a story in which the future is bad. That does not translate into the future actually being bad.

People who are young (say, 20-30) seem particularly vulnerable to thinking the world is getting worse, right now- because we are in an era where there is no obvious thing for youths to do that they have faith will make the world better. We are, perhaps, temporarily on hold- the world may not be getting better this decade. Perhaps something else needs to happen to give us our opening to change things. But that does not mean that the future is a boot stomping on a face forever.

Moreover, as noted, you personally do not need to justify your existence. Your right to exist is independent of you being able to come up with some explanation of what you are for. You can take the time and effort you need to create meaning for yourself, in the true existentialist sense. Perhaps this meaning is grand and glorious, or small and humble. It can define you in terms of a great global movement of ideology or technology. Or it can revolve around your personal meaning to a small group of people you love and cherish.

But if you're going to go as far as you've gone down the road of nihilism, it logically follows that you must complete the path a la Sartre, and recognize that if your existence lacks intrinsic meaning, this is simply an opportunity for you to cretae meaning independently.

I tend to agree with Simon (though the bolding/colored text is mine). Also, don't ever listen to Shep. The abyss does, in fact, look back. And it's really annoying.
But really the most important thing is to find out if this is just an existential crisis (likely) or a mental illness (less likely, but it's best to rule it out or on the off chance catch it early) and move on from there. You may just need some coping strategies to focus your mind on short/long term goals. The world may be shit and getting shittier, but since you can't fix it, it's not very healthy to obsess over it.

Something a wise person told me once when I was having a hell of a time trying to effect changes and make things happen - You need to better match your circle of concern to your circle of influence. In other words, you have a certain amount of influence & ability to change things, some people have a lot, some barely have any. Do what you can, change what you can, and don't get caught up in the shit you have no control or influence over.

I've never said this before, and I might never say it again, but Shep wins this thread decisively.

SPF: Leadership is easier than you think. You just lead, and weaker people follow. That's all there is to it.

Ghetto Edit: Even if you lack the will to lead, there are specific things you can do to make the world a better place. Have you ever tried volunteer work? They'll take practically anybody who isn't a danger to themself or others. If you can pick up a piece of trash and put it in a bag, or make a peanut butter and jelly sandwich and hand it to a homeless person, you can volunteer in a way that many would find meaningful.

Or, if you're just barely scraping by financially, what about dedicating yourself to a paying job that helps to conserve the environment or otherwise change the world in a way that you'd like? These are both real things you can show up for, and even get somebody else to tell you what to do at if that's really your comfort zone. I personally spent years working for Clean Water Action, Greenpeace, the Sierra Club, and Defenders of Wildlife, with brief sidelines for the Special Olympics and DNC, in entry-level fundraising and public outreach positions, and I was quite good at it with practically zero training until I got too old to walk around in the rain and snow all day. Are the idealistic people who do these things the majority of society? No, but they are 100% of the crowd you'll be working with while you do them, and they tend to just generally be fun people by a certain definition of fun*, and that can be very encouraging.

* Defenders in particular was a blast. We just rode around singing Dead songs, playing hacky sack, getting really high on pot, hooking up on the sly, and showering each other in positive energy all day. Actual conversation from the job interview: "Do you know how to play hacky sack?" "Can't say that I do, sorry... is that a problem?" "Don't worry - We'll train you."

The fact that environmentalism is taken seriously and has become an issue discussed on every level of governmence shows that we are not completely hopeless. We are trying but the problem is that our polluting ways are so tied to technologies we do not want to do without as well as prosperity.
Making our living less harmful to nature and ourselves is going to cost and many feel still reluctant to change it. But more and more people are.

If the fight were easy, simple and simply archivable then we would have already. Any long fight has moments when they feel hopeless and if you give up, you'll give up. If you don't, you will find out whether there is a light in the end of the tunnel.

As for depression, everyone feels depressed from time to time. Feeling a little depressed over the fate of our species is normal. If the depression persists even when you are no longer thinking about it, then you should worry and maybe see a GP.

But handling everyday depression, I have two methods: either do something about it or distract yourself from it by something that occupies your mind completely so it doesn't have the capacity for dwell on this. Raw Shark already told you how you can do something about this. It's better to fight and lose than allow yourself to be beaten up because you gave up early.

As for the other option, it's important that it occupies you. Playing my flute (or recorder) does that for me. Having nostalgia by playing old favourite games can work too, Startopia is like that to me.

SolarpunkFan wrote:I care about the natural environment, or at least I think I do. But lately I've begun to realize something: things are getting worse, not better and there's nothing I can do to change that.

When I think the environment is circling the drain I recall the days - because I am old enough to remember - when the Cuyahoga River in Ohio used to catch on fire, the skies were often brown in cities even when there were no clouds and sun, there were no more bald eagles south of Canada, and Lake Erie was devoid of life.

The river hasn't caught fire for decades, even Gary, Indiana smells nice and has blue skies in the summer (despite the steel mills and oil refineries), there are more eagles nesting in our area every year, and Lake Erie now has a thriving fishing trade with fish that are safe to eat.

And that's not the complete list.

So yes, some things have gone to shit, but it's not hopeless and some things are improving.

I think in your 20's you wake up to some harsh facts and realities and it's a bit of a gut-punch. Live a couple more decades and you get a different perspective. Things aren't perfect, but they're not grimdark, either.

Thanks all. I sometimes get into these moods, sorry for venting them here.

SolarpunkFan wrote:Thanks all. I sometimes get into these moods, sorry for venting them here.

No problem, sometimes it's good to talk to someone.

SolarpunkFan wrote:Thanks all. I sometimes get into these moods, sorry for venting them here.

Somewhat late here, but as someone who also occasionally wonders such things and is probably in the same age range, I would say that Broomstick is correct. I personally came of age roughly when the financial crisis hit. Eight years later, we are mostly fine. While the underlying inequalities are still present, we have more or less economically recovered. At least until whatever the next such crisis is.

While climate change is a major crisis for humanity, one that is uniquely problematic in terms of the type of problem in that there is no enemy, problems of that magnitude are hardly new. At least you can go to bed without the same level of fear about nuclear Armageddon that someone like Broomstick or someone a couple generations older used to.

Also, worrying about such things extensively can be linked to deeper emotional problems, I personally went through such a phase a few years ago after a major injury and the sense of depression that followed. I still sometimes think this way, but I would also say that improving your personal life is honestly the best solution to such concerns. It makes them fade away.

Adam Reynolds wrote:Somewhat late here, but as someone who also occasionally wonders such things and is probably in the same age range, I would say that Broomstick is correct. I personally came of age roughly when the financial crisis hit. Eight years later, we are mostly fine. While the underlying inequalities are still present, we have more or less economically recovered. At least until whatever the next such crisis is.

While climate change is a major crisis for humanity, one that is uniquely problematic in terms of the type of problem in that there is no enemy, problems of that magnitude are hardly new. At least you can go to bed without the same level of fear about nuclear Armageddon that someone like Broomstick or someone a couple generations older used to.

Also, worrying about such things extensively can be linked to deeper emotional problems, I personally went through such a phase a few years ago after a major injury and the sense of depression that followed. I still sometimes think this way, but I would also say that improving your personal life is honestly the best solution to such concerns. It makes them fade away.

Thank you. Sometimes I feel like I'm alone in thoughts like this. I know I'm not, but sometimes it just feels that way.

SolarpunkFan wrote:Sometimes I feel like I'm alone in thoughts like this. I know I'm not, but sometimes it just feels that way.

Welcome to the club, sweetheart. There's coffee over there.

Even people in complete denial about things that are obviously major world crises (say, the rich-poor divide, global warming, et cetera) manage to invent their own world crises that are obvious fictional. Say, the collapse of morality in our society, the rise of decadence at the expense of humble traditions, and the breaking down of national borders and the pouring in of waves of people who just don't understand what Makes Our Nation Great, et cetera.

[If you detected at least a hint of self-mocking irony in that statement, congratulations, you are not completely dead inside! ]

So it's pretty safe to say that a firm conviction that the world is going to hell is part of the natural birthright of every thinking human, not just the ones who are in their right minds. Like us.