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So, how practical are they really? Would you prefer to use the highest-end Ferrari instead of a nice $50,000 Toyota or Holden SUV if you had a choice? What are their safety ratings like compared to your average high/mid-end Toyota or Ford? What are their luxury features like? Do they have modern amenities such as bluetooth, USB, radio, etc? Or are they just bare metal frames with engines?

And how much are they really worth? Is a Spider really worth 2-3 million $? Or are people really just paying for the brand, and the car is only worth about $200,000 - $400,000? If a cheap Chinese budget company was to make cars of the same spec as Ferraris, would the minimum good price for the company really be in the millions, or could the company safely sell for for a few hundred grand?

Other than just being a status symbol, what is the real point of buying them? Even if they can go 300 miles per hour, this is utterly useless it is extremely illegal to go those speeds in all countries except for extremely dangerous countries where you don't want to be seen carrying 50 cents around, never mind a $5 million car, or that one highway in Germany where apparently you can go Mach 5 and no one will care...?

Plus they must use loads of fuel, are probably relatively unsafe and are probably quite uncomfortable and loud and somewhat illegal (noise levels) to drive around quiet neighborhoods with, they seem completely inferior to a nice $30,000 SUV you can buy brand-new at the shop down the road right away, whereas with a exotic you'd have to wait 10 years for them to build it and properly implant the machine spirits within it.

It isn't in testing, so you can't testing. Moved the cat to elsewhere.

Archinist, asking questions is not a negative trait but really should be doing your own research. You know, like with Wikipedia.

Would you prefer to use the highest-end Ferrari instead of a nice $50,000 Toyota or Holden SUV if you had a choice?

I can sell the Ferrari (unless getting one automatically includes complicated licenses that prevent me from doing this) and from the money buy a new house with some renewables on top and a new, electric-hybrid car and probably have enough left over earn a degree.

What are their luxury features like? Do they have modern amenities such as bluetooth, USB, radio, etc?

Of course they do and likely have more such stuff than you can name. Cutting-edge high-tech is a hallmark of luxory for quite long time, its just more obvious with computer-related gadgets.

Zixinus wrote:Archinist, asking questions is not a negative trait but really should be doing your own research. You know, like with Wikipedia.

What are their luxury features like? Do they have modern amenities such as bluetooth, USB, radio, etc?

Of course they do and likely have more such stuff than you can name. Cutting-edge high-tech is a hallmark of luxory for quite long time, its just more obvious with computer-related gadgets.

But they're high-performance sports cars, wouldn't they need to be as lightweight as possible in order to get their amazing 2.2 to 60 rating, and all that other jazz?

Also wikipedia deliberately tries to be as robotic and detached as possible, so it won't really give anyone's opinions on the matter, or any "customized" answer. There is a reason why all those sites like ELI5 reddit, reddit ask, Y!A, Quora, straightdope, and the others exist, and why people don't just read pre-scripted static information on wikipedia which sometimes doesn't give the right type of information or uses inaccurate sources.

Wikipedia is not perfect but it is not the worst starting point. Even plain old google is. Odds are that there are several blogs, forums and websites devoted to this topic. Or, you know, a library.

The problem with asking directly general information you can learn from those kind of sources is that somone has to take the time to type it out for you. You are asking other people's times.To be frank, the questions wouldn't be bad but your reputation has eaten away a lot of good will.

But they're high-performance sports cars, wouldn't they need to be as lightweight as possible in order to get their amazing 2.2 to 60 rating, and all that other jazz?

You are confusing "race car" with "luxury car". A race car is meant to go fast and control well, so they are like what you describe. A luxory car is meant to go fast while being as luxorious and flashy as possible.

I grew up in a Ford family, with a Ford mechanic uncle, and I drive Fords for a living. I am too biased to answer this question. But DTP, you spit the word jazz out of your mouth and never speak it again, or I will find you and... you won't like it. Jazz > Ford.

As you would expect (if you employed an iota of common sense), high end sports cars are available in a variety of models and trim levels from 'track only' through 'lightweight but streetable' to 'every conceivable luxury'. And if the manufacturer doesn't have exactly what you want, there are plenty of car customisation shops that will build anything you can specify, for an appropriate fee.

If you actually want to know the answer to 'what are supercars like to daily drive', Jalopnik has done a lot of articles on the subject.

Starglider wrote:As you would expect (if you employed an iota of common sense), high end sports cars are available in a variety of models and trim levels from 'track only' through 'lightweight but streetable' to 'every conceivable luxury'. And if the manufacturer doesn't have exactly what you want, there are plenty of car customisation shops that will build anything you can specify, for an appropriate fee.

If you actually want to know the answer to 'what are supercars like to daily drive', Jalopnik has done a lot of articles on the subject.

Well, could you name some of these comfort features that are both quite significant and that no car in the $30,000 to $100,000 price range has?

One thing worth noting is that spending ten times more money on a thing doesn't normally make the thing ten times "better," in that you are somehow ten times happier because you have it. Having a million dollar car doesn't result in a driving experience 100 times better than having a ten thousand dollar car. Because there is basically no way to ever take a driving experience and make it 100 times more pleasant, because human brains aren't wired like that.

So is it "worth it?" In one sense, no.

In another sense, yes... Because if you are truly, truly rich, you can afford to spend twice as much to enjoy yourself 10% more. Or four times as much to enjoy yourself 20% more, or eight times for 30% more. Or, continuing the logic to its extreme, to spend a thousand times as much money, in order to enjoy yourself twice as much as you otherwise would.

Replacing a traditional steel chassis with a carbon-fiber body will jack up the price significantly just because carbon fiber isn't that cost effective to mass produce yet. You're not going to find it in your sub-$50k consumer model.

Archinist wrote:So, how practical are they really?

Practical meaning, what? Driving down the street for groceries with the kids? They are very impractical. They are built for performance. Full stop. The suspensions are stiff, so you will feel every pebble you drive over. They are low, so you will scrape on leaves. They are loud, so prepare setting off car alarms and scaring kids. And prepare your ass hole when your wallet is ripped though it when maintenance time comes.

Obviously, this is a general statement, but it holds across production super/hyper cars.

Would you prefer to use the highest-end Ferrari instead of a nice $50,000 Toyota or Holden SUV if you had a choice?

Ferrari. 488 GTB. I am single and I would be wallowing in cougar vajay-jay in particular parts of town.

What are their safety ratings like compared to your average high/mid-end Toyota or Ford? What are their luxury features like? Do they have modern amenities such as bluetooth, USB, radio, etc? Or are they just bare metal frames with engines?

The Porsche 911 GT3-RS or 911 R (there are others) that may be ordered without a stereo, AC, or carpet. I know the Mustang GT350R has similar (un)options. The "top top of the line" will skimp on features like bluetooth, radio, etc. for the sole purpose of weight reduction. Why? Because racecar. You can still order the AC and radio options for the GT3-RS if you *really* wanted too.

I am pretty sure that all production cars have to meet specific government safety requirements, but I couldn't tell you how well they stack up safety wise relative to what the plebes drive. (I kid).

And how much are they really worth? Is a Spider really worth 2-3 million $? Or are people really just paying for the brand, and the car is only worth about $200,000 - $400,000? If a cheap Chinese budget company was to make cars of the same spec as Ferraris, would the minimum good price for the company really be in the millions, or could the company safely sell for for a few hundred grand?

Worth? Jack. And. Shit. Honestly though, there is a lot of engineering that goes into the suspension, aerodynamics, and engine to meet performance while maintaining regulations for a production car. It is also true that you are also paying for the brand as well, so to your point that if you had a cheap Chinese knock off of a Ferrari, there still would be people paying the premium. Remember, you are buying into a brand...a racing heritage...you are now part of that heritage. Personally, I don't hold value to that. However, that mindset is there.

"Built or bought" is a well known philosophy in the auto enthusiast world.

Other than just being a status symbol, what is the real point of buying them? Even if they can go 300 miles per hour, this is utterly useless it is extremely illegal to go those speeds in all countries except for extremely dangerous countries where you don't want to be seen carrying 50 cents around, never mind a $5 million car, or that one highway in Germany where apparently you can go Mach 5 and no one will care...?

My penis is 14" long and thick like a soda can. How many women would actually find that pleasing? (not many) Not the point either. My dick is better than yours. And hey, it's just fun to drive fast. Some people go to the drag strip, some autocross, some rally race. It's a hobby like any other, but as I said earlier..."built or bought."
Some people drive their Ferrari, Porsche, or Lambo only around town. Posers, if you will. Others will take them to track days as they were meant to.

I can put a forged short block, forged pistons and connecting rods, forged crankshaft, carbon fiber driveshaft, coil overs, smaller pulley for my supercharger, e85 AND 100% methanol injection into my Mustang and hit 1000HP+. At the end of the day, "it's still a Mustang."

Plus they must use loads of fuel, are probably relatively unsafe and are probably quite uncomfortable and loud and somewhat illegal (noise levels) to drive around quiet neighborhoods with, they seem completely inferior to a nice $30,000 SUV you can buy brand-new at the shop down the road right away, whereas with a exotic you'd have to wait 10 years for them to build it and properly implant the machine spirits within it.

No one cars about this in the enthusiast community. No one. While it is true that some upgrades are "offroad use only" that doesn't stop people from putting them (or taking them off) on street cars. Think no catalytic converters or a front tubular bumper.

And yes, supercharged applications typically run rich; more fuel than air. But then you wouldn't have cool flames shooting our of your exhaust!

This video actually has some helpful information on the drawbacks of a Ferrari 360 Modena as something you just drive around.


There are "exotics" that are decent as a daily driver. Same guy owned an Aston Martin and it was pretty usable as his daily driver. But, for the most part, a basic, run-of-the-mill Toyota, Honda, Chevy, etc. will be a much better choice for driving around town for groceries, getting to work, or what have. This is also ignoring that quite a lot of exotics have strict mileage limits from the insurance companies.

An exotic is more about image than actual usability in daily life. Almost nobody is going to take their Enzo to 200 mph, ever. The full potential of most of these cars will never be seen. They're all about saying "Look at the cool shit I can afford!" They're highly impractical.

That $50k Toyota, on the other hand, will get you where you need to go, routine maintenance is dirt cheap, the ride is better, you can fit more groceries (and people) into it... If all you need is a way to get about, it's objectively better in every metric. If you want to show off your money, or go around a track really fast, then the exotics will be objectively better.

The company pays about $2000-4000 for a Crown Victoria with the highway interceptor package on it at the cop auctions, and I've gotten one up past 140mph (where the speedometer maxes out) one time that I drove a guy to the emergency room. Plus you can drop a Ferrari in the trunk and still have room for luggage.

I confess if I was offered a free ridiculous vehicle, I'd be more likely to pick this than a sports car, as the off-road, cargo and towing are all things I could use without having to go to a racetrack. After all I already have a turbocharged DeLorean for 'retro sports driving experience'.

For Christ's sake, Archinist, go watch some old Top Gear episodes. You're trying to generalise a lot of cars that are wildly different. Some are softer and more luxurious than a sultan's bed, some strap you into a bare carbon-fibre seat; some have so much computer-control it virtually holds your dick for you, others straight-out try to kill you.
The cost is high, and a lot of it's for the name, but there's also got to be the law of diminishing returns there--you reach a point where the smallest improvement costs more and incredibly more.

So is it worth it? If you want the car, and you got the money, why not?

[quote="Korto"

are softer and more luxurious than a sultan's bed

Which you could get by adding some seat covers for less than $100 or change the seats for less than $5,000 (?).

some have so much computer-control it virtually holds your dick for you

You could just get a $2 steel nail and a $3 hammer and get the same result.

More seriously, the most automated registered car is probably one of the Teslas, and they only cost around $150,000. Anything LESS automated is usually just the set of standard features like automatic headlights, sat nav, electric mirrors, auto transmission and the rest you can get in cars around the $25,000 + range.

So is it worth it? If you want the car, and you got the money, why not?

[/quote]

Well I guess so if you've got billions just sitting around as a dead weight, but what if you just have a stable job, your own house, and want to upgrade from your new Honda Civic?

Korto wrote:are softer and more luxurious than a sultan's bed

Which you could get by adding some seat covers for less than $100 or change the seats for less than $5,000 (?).

some have so much computer-control it virtually holds your dick for you

You could just get a $2 steel nail and a $3 hammer and get the same result.

More seriously, the most automated registered car is probably one of the Teslas, and they only cost around $150,000. Anything LESS automated is usually just the set of standard features like automatic headlights, sat nav, electric mirrors, auto transmission and the rest you can get in cars around the $25,000 + range.

So is it worth it? If you want the car, and you got the money, why not?

Well I guess so if you've got billions just sitting around as a dead weight, but what if you just have a stable job, your own house, and want to upgrade from your new Honda Civic?

I mean I guess it must be exciting to drive around in a nice red car, but what do you do when the carbon fiber disintegrates into a fine dust after driving to the shops, dropping the kids off at school, and driving the dog and the wife to the beach over and over again?

What are supposed to be if the cat ripped up all the leather seats that cost half the car, or the kilograms of firewood you are carrying in the carbon fiber ribbed back causes the frame to flex and bend and eventually snap, wrecking the entire car?

EDIT: Sorry, I accidentally clicked reply instead of edit and made a bunch of accidental posts.

Whoops, I clicked reply instead of edit without realizing it and accidentally created more posts. Wow this is literally worse than a train wreck.

...

The fatigue life of (modern) carbon fibre is extremely high; generally better than steel. Literally every other part on the car will fail several times over before a carbon fibre chassis will. Overloading cars will usually cause suspension failure before frame failure, although you're not going to break a sports car by piling firewood into it; you can't fit enough in there to do any serious harm. Why anyone would actually do that I have no idea, if you can afford a Ferrari, you can afford to have someone deliver firewood to you whenever you like. Or if you are a little eccentric (e.g. me) you can fit a towbar to your sports car and pull a one tonne cargo trailer behind it.

I am all for car modifications but one point to bear in mind is that you almost never get the money back on them* at sale. A sports car with factory options will hold value better, although only a few models are collectible enough to actually gain value.

* An example of an exception is LHD to RHD conversions for cars imported into the UK, which generally does increase the resale value of the car; e.g. right hand drive DeLoreans are worth about 10,000 GBP more than left hand drive DeLoreans when sold in the UK. For SUVs at least, autogas (propane) dual-fuel conversion does usually add resale value although it may be less than the cost of doing the conversion.

Archinist wrote: Well I guess so if you've got billions just sitting around as a dead weight, but what if you just have a stable job, your own house, and want to upgrade from your new Honda Civic?

I mean I guess it must be exciting to drive around in a nice red car, but what do you do when the carbon fiber disintegrates into a fine dust after driving to the shops, dropping the kids off at school, and driving the dog and the wife to the beach over and over again?

What are supposed to be if the cat ripped up all the leather seats that cost half the car, or the kilograms of firewood you are carrying in the carbon fiber ribbed back causes the frame to flex and bend and eventually snap, wrecking the entire car?

Tough titties. If you can't afford a luxury car you'll just have to make do with what the rest of the peasants drive.

I think the overlap between 'rich enough to own a ferrarri or three' and 'still does their own shopping and chores' is extremely narrow, Archinist. People with extraordinary wealth tend to do this crazy thing called hiring staff.

If you can afford an exotic sports car, you can afford an exotic sports car plus a normal car for driving around doing normal things.

Simon_Jester wrote:If you can afford an exotic sports car, you can afford an exotic sports car plus a normal car for driving around doing normal things.

Sadly a necessity due to the tragic lack of ISOfix compatable child seat mounts in supercars, despite Ferrari selling a branded child seat.