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We've discussed and spit-balled survival bunkers here at SD.net before. As reference, some previous threads:

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=148421]Building the ... nker (RAR)
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=159536]It's Another ... DN Bunker)
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=168255]Survival of ... Us Behind

(Not meant to be an all-inclusive list)

As I was cruising YouTube today I came across this:
https://youtu.be/QW6DIchOpnc

I found it interesting in that this is an example of people who are not only building bunkers, but are doing so in a community setting, unlike the rugged-individualist-going-it-alone stereotype. There are lots of plans for this sort of things, but this is one where people are actually living in the place.

This is the website of community referred to in the YouTube video:
https://www.terravivos.com/secure/vivos ... vos Xpoint

https://www.terravivos.com/]This is the ... for Vivos

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vivos_%28 ... them, too.

Now, let me be clear - Vivos has a product to sell. I take everything they say with a grain of salt. That said, unlike many of these bunker/survivalist schemes they actually do have something up and working in South Dakota. Would it be sufficient to survive a genuine apocalypse? Damn if I know - I do suspect that some of these bunker projects wouldn't be up to the task because it is really hard to anticipate everything, and nowhere is completely safe from everything. As the YouTube video shows, when talking to people who actually are living in Xpoint, SD full time there is a learning curve and some skills needed that you don't pick up living in a city. It's not just for the rich - they have some "turn key" build-outs that will cost you some money, but you can get a 99 year lease on a very solid bunker for $35,000. I doubt you could build one of those bunkers these days for that price. Of course, that's all you get for $35k - a bare bunker. You'll need to add some sweat-equity to make it livable although if you aren't capable of that I'm not sure you'll survive The End of the World As We Know It anyway. They provide some interesting suggestions for making the place livable at bargain-basement prices, including inviting a few of your buddies to contribute to the project. Still too much? You can buy-in to a group bunker at $16,000 but I'm not sure if any of those are up/running/livable at the moment.

I find it interesting that some of their future plans for the place and some of our ideas for bunker living somewhat dovetailed, from a restaurant/communal kitchen to hydro/aquaponics to medical clinics to community meeting area. I dont' know if they've actually starting building any of that out. Even just as a bunch of people living in off-the-grid housing it actually seems like it might be viable. I also noticed (from their website) that they do screen people before selling to them. That is probably good on one level, but could be problematic depending on the screening criteria and how it's done.

Anyhow, I don't have more time to go into this now, so consider this food for thought.

Some of those links got a bit messed up.

But I'm six minutes in and I'm already seeing one long-term problem: What are they planning to do in the longer term, once the crfisis passes and they're thinking about rebuilding? I'm not terribly familiar with the geography of South Dakota but I'm not seeing any obvious sources of timber in the vicinity, and the place being a ranch could be an indication that the local soil's not great for growing crops.

Also, now I'm a few more minutes in... Why the fuck is every guy they talk to walking around with a gun on his hip?

Zaune wrote: ↑2021-05-17 03:40pm Some of those links got a bit messed up.

Sorry - I'm out of practice.

Also, now I'm a few more minutes in... Why the fuck is every guy they talk to walking around with a gun on his hip?

It's South Dakota.

More specifically, it's in Western South Dakota, just south of the Black Hills National Forest, in a very sparsely inhabited part of the US with fewer than 4 people per square mile (<1.5 per square km), bordering on genuine wilderness where wildlife can be an actual threat to people, along with the possibility of encountering problematic people, with law enforcement even more sparse on the ground. It's the sort of area where it would be quite normal for adults to be walking around equipped with guns.

But I'm six minutes in and I'm already seeing one long-term problem: What are they planning to do in the longer term, once the crfisis passes and they're thinking about rebuilding? I'm not terribly familiar with the geography of South Dakota but I'm not seeing any obvious sources of timber in the vicinity, and the place being a ranch could be an indication that the local soil's not great for growing crops.

Xpoint very much is located in grasslands, but it's not that far from the Black Hills National Forest which, unsurprisingly given the name, is a large forest. The limitation on crops probably has more to do with rainfall than soil quality, as prairie soil is generally fertile (until you fuck it up with too much agriculture).

It's interesting to ponder just what sort of apocalypse this place is capable of riding out. Pandemic? Sure, I could see that. Zombie apocalypse? Lots of potential. Yellowstone blows? Although it's out of the immediate-death range (so far as we can calculate) of the supervolcano it's definitely in the heavy ashfall zone - hunker down for a year you might not be able to get out of your bunker. Those things are as tornado-proof as anything is likely to be. Nuclear war? Who the fuck knows? Maybe - depends on how that would actually play out. Collapse of urban civilization? Probably. You'd still have to deal with refugees resourceful enough to get that far out into the wilderness (at which point you might consider recruiting such resourceful survivors) but what the hell - you're in a bunker, right?

Probably most useful for a way of living off-grid, but I question just how independent, long term, these folks are from current civilization. Could they transition from being able to, as an example, buy petroleum based fuel to living entirely off the local environment? Maybe, maybe not.

I showed the video to a friend of mine with similar interests as I have in this regard and he brought up some pertinent questions:

How do you manage moisture inside these bunkers?

Can you put up outbuildings on your plot? - he pointed out that in a South Dakota winter most people want engine block heaters, can you put up a little garage with heat to keep your vehicles running all winter?

What about toxic contamination leftover from military use? Has anything been tested or are you on your own for that?

What about gardening? Is there soil contamination? What water rights do you have for even small scale watering/irrigation?