EU Fic: RotJ-NJO Era

[Czechmate]

As a note, I suggested a page or so back that we gently nudge-retcon the Eclipse to being nineteen (or twenty, for confirmed 'biggest ever' status) kilometers in length while keeping its' massive bulk. this will certainly make the Eclipse the 'biggest' -ship- ever constructed; certainly many times the visible bulk and calculable volume of the Executor, the Empire's next-largest SSD design. This also, with a tiny bit of fudging, lets it fit into the 'ten miles long' (well, in this case it's now just shy of 12mi :V) category as well.

Also, I would just like to reaffirm my belief (shared, for the most part, with IP) that the 2.2km escort Star Destroyer seen in Dark Empire should be either the 'Allegiance' or (taken straight from Publius' work and possibly more appropriate) the 'Autokrator' class. Having any vessel other than the mile-long ISD called 'Imperial-class' will too easily cause confusion.

WRT the ISD itself being called Imperial-class, I am ambivalent as to whether it is 'Imperator' or 'Imperial'; as long as the acronym remains ISD for notation and common reference purposes, it could be the 'Illuminatus' (:P) class for all I care, but I'd prefer 'Imperial'. It suits a vessel that is, regardless of its' role as a multirole cruiser and not an enormous multimile deathship, possibly THE iconic vessel of the Imperial Navy.

Lastly, I was not aware that the DSes were meant to be Oversector command ships; I'm sure I've read that somewhere, but it has been quite some time since I recomitted the Technical Commentaries to memory. I should be about doing that, now I think of it.

[Czechmate]

a very early categorization of common Imperial vessels in the old EU that we'll still be using, along with some ships that IP and I believe would make fine 'battleship' and 'superbattleship'-equivalent ships (let it be known now that i am discarding Saxton's largely inaccurate naming scheme of Star This and Star That for rough earth-equivalents until such time as a more accurate scheme is presented).

each type is grouped by its' place in a layered Imperial battlefleet heading into combat. apart from the Third Line vessels, which can either be put outside of, next to, or inside of Second Line formations, each layer is generally surrounded by more of the one below and is surrounding a group of the layer above.

'Fleet Flag' and/or Sector and/or Prestige Command Ships:
-Eclipse SSD (~20-38km; undecided)
-Executor SSD (19km)

'Task Force Flag' or 'Task Group Flag' Command Superbattleships:
-Sovereign SSD (15km)
-Vengeance SSD (10km)
-Giel's battleship (~6-7km)

'First Line' Battleships:
-anon "star cruiser" #5 (6.2km)
-anon "star cruiser" #2 (4.6km)
-anon "star cruiser" #3 (3.9km)
-anon "star cruiser" #1 (3.1km)

'Second Line' or 'Screen' Heavy Cruisers
-Allegiance/Autokrator HSD (2.2km)
-anon SD #3 (2.14km)

'Third Line' or 'Support' Cruisers
-Tector communications SD? (?km)
-Dominator heavy interdictor SD? (1.6km)
-Imperial-class multirole SD (1.6km)
-Updated Venator carrier SD? (1.13km)

'Fourth Line' or 'Picket' Destroyers and Frigates
-Harrow SD (.9km)
-Updated Victory SD? (.9km)
-Immobilizer interdictor? (.6km)
-Immobilizer-derivative vessels (Vindicator and Enforcer)? (.6km)

I welcome any suggestions for additions to the sections of this list. by no means is it final.

[Darth Raptor]

The problem with "Imperial-class" is that everyone and their dog uses it, not just the Empire; some of which, the New Republic especially, might eschew the name, if not the ship itself. If those Rendili corvettes can call themselves "Dreadnaughts", then Imperator is well within reason. I'd like to maintain the High Galactic naming convention where possible.

[Darth Hoth]

I thought we were throwing out the Katana-style Dreadnaughts?

What is the High Galactic naming convention? A Saxton invention?

[Czechmate]

'high galactic' is, I would hazard to guess (i don't know either), the 'latinized' names. Imperator, Tector, Venator, Executor, etc.

[Illuminatus Primus]

I thought we were throwing out the Katana-style Dreadnaughts?

What is the High Galactic naming convention? A Saxton invention?

High Galactic seems to be the standing code for use of Latin in SW; the Jedi liturgical language is Ecclesiastical High Galactic, while the legal and ancient ruling class language of the galaxy traditionally is Classical High Galactic (cf. the liturgical language of the Roman Catholic Church is Ecclesiastical Latin, while the European Continental civil law is based on Flavius Petrus Sabbatius Iustinianus' Corpus Juris Civilis written in Late Classical Latin). Contrariwise, Galactic Standard seems to be code for their "English", with Old Galactic Standard being their "Middle or Shakespearean English" with Basic (or Modern Galactic Standard), being their "modern English."

[Agent Sorchus]

Possible Identity for the Chimera http://www.theforce.net/swtc/dagger.html#commship
An appropriate vessel for a Grand Admiral to command from, large and capable enough for Strategic command to take place. Disadvantage is that RotJ novel depicts it's destruction, However one could adjust that to massively disabled and escaping under emergency power to the edge of the system until the other retreating vessels assist in its escape. This saves some face for Pellaeon, allows the Chimera to be at the battle of Endor, and gives Thrawn a better command vessel.

[Illuminatus Primus]

Why can't it just be a different one of the same model?

[Agent Sorchus]

While it does not have to be the same vessel, there is a simplicity in it being that vessel from Endor. The Chimera and Captain Pellaeon's back story would be retained if one made that ship the Chimera. It could also help show off Pellaeon's Strength's in Organization as something other than a regular line captain.

Otherwise there are no other reasons it couldn't be of the same model and a different ship.

[Illuminatus Primus]

Well the communications ship was destroyed, I think that unequivocally canon. Its an entire plot device of the battle.

[Darth Hoth]

I thought we were throwing out the Katana-style Dreadnaughts?

What is the High Galactic naming convention? A Saxton invention?

High Galactic seems to be the standing code for use of Latin in SW; the Jedi liturgical language is Ecclesiastical High Galactic, while the legal and ancient ruling class language of the galaxy traditionally is Classical High Galactic (cf. the liturgical language of the Roman Catholic Church is Ecclesiastical Latin, while the European Continental civil law is based on Flavius Petrus Sabbatius Iustinianus' Corpus Juris Civilis written in Late Classical Latin). Contrariwise, Galactic Standard seems to be code for their "English", with Old Galactic Standard being their "Middle or Shakespearean English" with Basic (or Modern Galactic Standard), being their "modern English."

So, the model for ship-naming that you propose was created by Saxton when he remained the Super- and Imperial-class Star Destroyers Executor and Imperator-class?

[Illuminatus Primus]

I thought we were throwing out the Katana-style Dreadnaughts?

What is the High Galactic naming convention? A Saxton invention?

High Galactic seems to be the standing code for use of Latin in SW; the Jedi liturgical language is Ecclesiastical High Galactic, while the legal and ancient ruling class language of the galaxy traditionally is Classical High Galactic (cf. the liturgical language of the Roman Catholic Church is Ecclesiastical Latin, while the European Continental civil law is based on Flavius Petrus Sabbatius Iustinianus' Corpus Juris Civilis written in Late Classical Latin). Contrariwise, Galactic Standard seems to be code for their "English", with Old Galactic Standard being their "Middle or Shakespearean English" with Basic (or Modern Galactic Standard), being their "modern English."

So, the model for ship-naming that you propose was created by Saxton when he remained the Super- and Imperial-class Star Destroyers Executor and Imperator-class?

I'd like to keep the KDY Star Destroyer line with High Galactic (Latin) names, yes. Although it may be hard to come by enough suitable "-or" names.

[Pelranius]

We could go dig into Hebrew or Arabic when necessary. Persian and Sanskrit wouldn't be terribly bad options either.

I'm also in favor of upgrading the Chimaera to be a communications ship. As for Pellaeon's CO, I suggest that we have him killed on the second Death Star (it's sort of hard to think of a scenario where the commander of a ship gets killed but his second in command and enough of the bridge crew remain to coordinate a retreat).

[Coiler]

(it's sort of hard to think of a scenario where the commander of a ship gets killed but his second in command and enough of the bridge crew remain to coordinate a retreat).

It actually has both RL and in-universe historical precedent. In the naval battle of Guadalcanal, Rear Admiral Norman Scott was killed, but the captain of his flagship, the Atlanta survived. In Wraith Squadron, Trigit has to desperately scramble for the blast door after the bridge loses pressure, barely making it out.

You can imagine a similar scenario, where the bridge is smashed up and Pellaeon makes it to the backup bridge, but the CO doesn't.

[Pelranius]

(it's sort of hard to think of a scenario where the commander of a ship gets killed but his second in command and enough of the bridge crew remain to coordinate a retreat).

It actually has both RL and in-universe historical precedent. In the naval battle of Guadalcanal, Rear Admiral Norman Scott was killed, but the captain of his flagship, the Atlanta survived. In Wraith Squadron, Trigit has to desperately scramble for the blast door after the bridge loses pressure, barely making it out.

You can imagine a similar scenario, where the bridge is smashed up and Pellaeon makes it to the backup bridge, but the CO doesn't.

That would provide impetus for Pellaeon to retreat, I guess.

[Illuminatus Primus]

Anyone got something they really want to see? I have an idea for a story involving the liberation by the New Republic of a former TradeFed world (assuming they still exist in timeline) with a surprise character. I have an idea for Luke on leave from duty with the military doing some detective work and fighting a few left over darksiders. I have an idea for a story of Incom's defection to the Rebellion.

What would people be interested in seeing?

[Darth Hoth]

Anyone got something they really want to see? I have an idea for a story involving the liberation by the New Republic of a former TradeFed world (assuming they still exist in timeline) with a surprise character. I have an idea for Luke on leave from duty with the military doing some detective work and fighting a few left over darksiders. I have an idea for a story of Incom's defection to the Rebellion.

What would people be interested in seeing?

Could all be fun. I would find the Incom idea most compelling myself, but that is just me.

Personally, I am still working (in earnest) on a novelisation of "In the Empire's Service", but I found a few other tangents. One involved a slightly retconned Vima-da-Boda story about the part she played in the Great Jedi Purge (specifically, the throwaway line that she "betrayed her own"), but I shall wait with that one till we have decided on a Clone Wars/Old Republic/Jedi vision. Another included a few "Nameless McJedi flees the Purge" stories (a bit of Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader) and a little more on Jerec and the Inquisitorius (if I ever get ahold of the DESB).

Generally, right now I am thinking of a unified timeline for the EUFic altverse up till our NJO analogue; it need not be detailed, but address some of the strange Bantam things and give more attention to politics and the progress of the Civil War over time. It would be easier to get into the particular once we have such a thing. What do you think, everyone?

[Crayz9000]

Generally, right now I am thinking of a unified timeline for the EUFic altverse up till our NJO analogue; it need not be detailed, but address some of the strange Bantam things and give more attention to politics and the progress of the Civil War over time. It would be easier to get into the particular once we have such a thing. What do you think, everyone?

Hoth,

I put up the timeline for my NJO-replacement/crossover fic on the Wiki if you want to edit it and use it as a starting point.

Proposed timeline page

[Illuminatus Primus]

Having just browsed the EU-Fic entry in SDWiki, I have to say I'm really impressed. Thanks to Crayz and all those who contributed. The project looks real professional and gaining progress. Did you contribute the systematic list of Publius characters, Raptor?

[Darth Raptor]

Yes, though it's still under construction.

[Illuminatus Primus]

I guess I need to work on pumping out my essays on Clone Warfare, the Clone Wars, the Rise of Palpatine and the New Order, and my Incom and MJ stories, eh?

[Kartr_Kana]

I've been trying to slog through all 8 pages of this, but you guys are coming up with new stuff faster then I can assimilate the old posts. Anyway you could post a compilation of all the idea's so far, to help get me and others who've come in late to get up to speed? Thanks

[Darth Raptor]

Yes, good idea. The sheer volume of information probably is a bit overwhelming and discouraging to those with a more casual interest/less disposable time.

[Kartr_Kana]

I've noticed that there's at least three other threads on similar topics from different times in galactic history. Maybe we could have a new thread that unifies these 4+ threads and summarizes and states the conclusions reached.

[Pelranius]

Anyone got something they really want to see? I have an idea for a story involving the liberation by the New Republic of a former TradeFed world (assuming they still exist in timeline) with a surprise character. I have an idea for Luke on leave from duty with the military doing some detective work and fighting a few left over darksiders. I have an idea for a story of Incom's defection to the Rebellion.

What would people be interested in seeing?

I personally liked the TradeFed idea myself.