Global Peak (Part 11.0 up 05/29/09).

[Adrian Laguna]

Australia and New Zeland seem to be doing well enough for themselves that having them send men all the way to the Eastern Mediterranean and assist the remnants of the Empire there was considered as a possibility if not for the fact that they are busy fighting off SEA boat people.

[Chris OFarrell]

I can seriously see Aus and NZ becoming much closer, with much more in the way of resource sharing and so on to form a solid power block. The poor boat people are just going to keep dying out in the North, especially with the continual military pressure on them and absurdly scarce ability to forage, it probably suits the Australian Government to keep them locked up and let them kill themselves as much as possible, before they head up and reclaim the coast line...

The 'Hanson' line they will call it.

I can also see Australia and NZ aggressively probing the vast southern ocean areas for oil, there are more then a few people who think they are very significant untouched deposits. And while its not the nicest place to work, the shear value of oil is going to make it worth trying for it, even as the two counties probably move steadily to a hydrogen/nuclear base. Hard, but holding and getting better is probably what best describes a large part of Australia.

[Stuart Mackey]

Australia and New Zeland seem to be doing well enough for themselves that having them send men all the way to the Eastern Mediterranean and assist the remnants of the Empire there was considered as a possibility if not for the fact that they are busy fighting off SEA boat people.

Boat people wouldn't be a long term issue,given what Australia can produce and what crocs can eat.
I wonder what plans, equipment and plant got out of Britain before things went tits up?

[Alferd Packer]

I can also see Australia and NZ aggressively probing the vast southern ocean areas for oil, there are more then a few people who think they are very significant untouched deposits. And while its not the nicest place to work, the shear value of oil is going to make it worth trying for it, even as the two counties probably move steadily to a hydrogen/nuclear base. Hard, but holding and getting better is probably what best describes a large part of Australia.

Also, since no one's around to enforce it, they can probably claim a majority, if not all of Antarctica. Or perhaps they'd hold a summit of sorts with South Africa, Argentina, and Chile, and simply parcel it out up to, say 89 degrees south latitude, with joint ownership of the pole itself.

I imagine something similar went on with the USA, Canada, Denmark, Norway, and Russia to parcel out the extreme north before the poop hit the paddles. It's hard to say if any agreement survived the formation of FedGov, but since Russia is trading with FedGov, it stands to reason that it might.

[Stuart Mackey]

I can also see Australia and NZ aggressively probing the vast southern ocean areas for oil, there are more then a few people who think they are very significant untouched deposits. And while its not the nicest place to work, the shear value of oil is going to make it worth trying for it, even as the two counties probably move steadily to a hydrogen/nuclear base. Hard, but holding and getting better is probably what best describes a large part of Australia.

Also, since no one's around to enforce it, they can probably claim a majority, if not all of Antarctica. Or perhaps they'd hold a summit of sorts with South Africa, Argentina, and Chile, and simply parcel it out up to, say 89 degrees south latitude, with joint ownership of the pole itself.

Probably, those damn penguins have been winging their beaks at us for far too long. Perhaps the NY air guard squadron that goes to the ice would end up as part of the NZ air force given condition in the 'US'?

I imagine something similar went on with the USA, Canada, Denmark, Norway, and Russia to parcel out the extreme north before the poop hit the paddles. It's hard to say if any agreement survived the formation of FedGov, but since Russia is trading with FedGov, it stands to reason that it might.

Speaking of carve ups, what happens to China overall? chaos, warlordism, raids on other parts of the world for resources, or do they retain a centralised government still and relations on a normall basis with others?

[Warsie]

I also forgot: Would California be also implementing heavy Hydroelectric programs to deal with Global Warming (in case the ice really melts off many of the mountains) and Oil Peak (Hydroelectric Power to supplement nuclear power, and nuclear power does need a pre-existing source)

[The Duchess of Zeon]

I also forgot: Would California be also implementing heavy Hydroelectric programs to deal with Global Warming (in case the ice really melts off many of the mountains) and Oil Peak (Hydroelectric Power to supplement nuclear power, and nuclear power does need a pre-existing source)

Nuclear needs a preexisting source of what?

There's been a few hydro plants, but California is still grid-connected to Washington and Oregon and British Columbia, which retain plenty of hydroelectric capacity.

The main goal is to just build a lot of graphite moderated reactors, though LLNL and PNNL are still functioning and working to deploy a thorium-cycle, molten salt breeder to provide U-233 and power (they'd succeeded, now it's about getting mass productive development costs down to the point where they can handle it during the war).

Mass production of 2 GW very simple graphite-moderated reactors is the current solution, however.

[Warsie]

Nuclear needs a preexisting source of what?

If I'm not wrong (if so, sorry). Doesn't nuclear power require a pre-existing power supply to, for example move the moderator material in and outside the reactor.

There's been a few hydro plants, but California is still grid-connected to Washington and Oregon and British Columbia, which retain plenty of hydroelectric capacity.

The main goal is to just build a lot of graphite moderated reactors, though LLNL and PNNL are still functioning and working to deploy a thorium-cycle, molten salt breeder to provide U-233 and power (they'd succeeded, now it's about getting mass productive development costs down to the point where they can handle it during the war).

Mass production of 2 GW very simple graphite-moderated reactors is the current solution, however.

okay. also, thx for the Italy info.

[CaptainChewbacca]

Is there a chance, if the North American war goes bad, of a 'West Coast Confederacy' coming about? With the mountains as a natural defensive perimeter, California, Oregon, Washington, and British Colombia could do alright.

[Warsie]

Is there a chance, if the North American war goes bad, of a 'West Coast Confederacy' coming about? With the mountains as a natural defensive perimeter, California, Oregon, Washington, and British Colombia could do alright.

In my opinion, I thought (if the US COMPLETELY disintegrates) that Northern California, Oregon, Washington and B.C. end up becoming the Republic of Cascadia, Central California ends up becoming the California Republic and Southern California might end up taken over by hispanics. I also wondered if the Rocky Mountains having several governments, a confederation of the northern US Rocky Mountain States as well.

[Illuminatus Primus]

If I'm not wrong (if so, sorry). Doesn't nuclear power require a pre-existing power supply to, for example move the moderator material in and outside the reactor.

If you're so tapped out you can reroute power long enough to provide some power to start your reactor and operate the moderator material in and out than you're so fucked as an industrial society that building or even thinking of building nuclear plants is totally out of the question. If you need power during reactor downtimes that critically, you can just pump water into a higher-elevation reservoir and let it back out through hydroelectric turbines. In the long term, keeping in with Duchess' fetish for megaengineering solutions, I imagine we'd be looking at a huge scale implementation of hydroelectric dams equipped with massive turbopumps to push water from below back into the reservoir when the nearby solar grids and wind farms have peak operation, and letting it back out as rain and demand require. Also, I imagine she'll probably be creating a few inland seas and massive canals.

Is there a chance, if the North American war goes bad, of a 'West Coast Confederacy' coming about? With the mountains as a natural defensive perimeter, California, Oregon, Washington, and British Colombia could do alright.

In my opinion, I thought (if the US COMPLETELY disintegrates) that Northern California, Oregon, Washington and B.C. end up becoming the Republic of Cascadia, Central California ends up becoming the California Republic and Southern California might end up taken over by hispanics. I also wondered if the Rocky Mountains having several governments, a confederation of the northern US Rocky Mountain States as well.

That seems unlikely for several reasons. One the cultural and economic inertia of the continent will probably hold it together in the long term (remember the pressure caused by crisis actually caused a union of historically distinct societies in Canada and the U.S.A.). Furthermore, the Army of Canada has broke through and its victories should help link up the West and East through central Canada though the Great Plains remain disputed. The Hispanic influence has been decisively set back by the nuclear immolation of Mexico.

[CaptainChewbacca]

I missed that chapter, when was Mexico nuked, and how is the southwest handling the refugees?

[Mayabird]

I missed that chapter, when was Mexico nuked, and how is the southwest handling the refugees?

That's actually the subject of the next part I'm somewhat in the process of writing. I have the general story written in my head, but there's no telling when I'll get the time to actually type it down.

[CmdrWilkens]

I missed that chapter, when was Mexico nuked, and how is the southwest handling the refugees?

I'm pretty certain it was one of the things that Marina just mentioned as they way things are rather than being a part of any chapter (though it may be in the Imperial Valley farming chapter if I am recalling incorrectly)

[Adrian Laguna]

I missed that chapter, when was Mexico nuked, and how is the southwest handling the refugees?

Mexico decided to get cute with the borders when the United States erupted into Civil War. The FedGov retaliated by dumping part of an Ohio's payload into every major population centre in southern Mexico, with Mexico City itself getting the Claw of Death (three nukes in a triangular pattern with overlapping blast waves that compliment and boost each other). The Mexican-Americans mostly just shrugged their shoulders, they didn't really like the Southern Mexicans anyway.

[Battlehymn Republic]

What. Why would they go and use up nukes like that? Was it really so bad that it required mass genocide?

And speaking of Latin America, I'll ask again- is Brazil the Russia of the Southern Hemisphere?

[The Duchess of Zeon]

What. Why would they go and use up nukes like that? Was it really so bad that it required mass genocide?

The Mexicans couldn't return nuclear fire. It was perfect. They didn't have to lose the services of more than a single division to keep the Mexican forces in check. They just put an eight-pointed star (actually, Adrian) in Mexico city, and hit a couple of other targets--oh, I think the total for final fatalities was 30 million, fifty million dead. There's also plenty of Mexicans still alive. It has been "so bad" continuously for eight years.

And speaking of Latin America, I'll ask again- is Brazil the Russia of the Southern Hemisphere?[/quote]

Well, it isn't starving to death or falling apart. More than you can say for other sectors of South America. More on it later.

[Stuart Mackey]

Well, it isn't starving to death or falling apart. More than you can say for other sectors of South America. More on it later.

I would imagine that NZ would be most keen to support Chile, as I mentioned earlier, if no other reason that we, in RL, have good relations and because we do not need our 'right flank' to desend into chaos and the threat to our resources that may cause from unruly elements with access to military hardware.
Just to mention it now, there is no way NZ would ever be part of Australia or vice versa.
Oh, what level of military technology exists now? or what era would it equate to, roughly? NZ, especially given current lows, and Australia would be maintaining fairly large navies by historic standards, as well as the other services, but how much would depend on tech levels and our ability to meet that (which I why we would be trying to support Japan if we could).

[CmdrWilkens]

I believe its been mentioned but there is an odd mix of the highest of high tech 2030s gadgets and 1980s pre "smart" bomb tech. For instance i know Marina has poitned out that airstrikes are possible but that there is a 2037 model laser based AA system that will basically shred any air attack if it is fully powered making air warfare dicey at best. Combine that with the engineering tools that must still exist for mega-projects like the Diomede bridge/pipeline and you get a curious mixture.

[Stuart Mackey]

I believe its been mentioned but there is an odd mix of the highest of high tech 2030s gadgets and 1980s pre "smart" bomb tech. For instance i know Marina has poitned out that airstrikes are possible but that there is a 2037 model laser based AA system that will basically shred any air attack if it is fully powered making air warfare dicey at best. Combine that with the engineering tools that must still exist for mega-projects like the Diomede bridge/pipeline and you get a curious mixture.

Right, so navies would look more like some WW2 vessels with very sophisticated air defence and a heavier gun armament? an HMS Belfast with laser air defence/SAM's and assorted cruise missiles? (NZ and Australia have some involvement in that laser project IIRC, as well as Canada and the UK besides the US)

[The Duchess of Zeon]

I believe its been mentioned but there is an odd mix of the highest of high tech 2030s gadgets and 1980s pre "smart" bomb tech. For instance i know Marina has poitned out that airstrikes are possible but that there is a 2037 model laser based AA system that will basically shred any air attack if it is fully powered making air warfare dicey at best. Combine that with the engineering tools that must still exist for mega-projects like the Diomede bridge/pipeline and you get a curious mixture.

Right, so navies would look more like some WW2 vessels with very sophisticated air defence and a heavier gun armament? an HMS Belfast with laser air defence/SAM's and assorted cruise missiles? (NZ and Australia have some involvement in that laser project IIRC, as well as Canada and the UK besides the US)

The gun armament is necessary, yes. Railguns were just however introduced on some high-end nuclear powered cruisers of a couple nations before the fall. Others have chemical arms. It's very hard to get anything other than a missile swarm through against an enemy ship, so guns are important. The Kearsarge-class CBGN of which four were finished before the collapse were armed with four railguns in two twin turrets, two 64-cell VLS launchers, and two heavy ASAT-capable particle beam cannon (along with two RAM to back them up defensively, and a three-helicopter hangar). The ship was powered by two lightweight thorium-cycle molten salt reactors, in their first application (the same ones that California is trying to provide for power generation). As the navy cannot afford to keep them operational at sea they're being used for static air defence with one stationed at Philadelphia and the other in the mouth of the Delaware river, and the two on the west coast covering the Bay area and the approaches to Seattle, though they're largely just being used as power reactors now since the FSU no longer has the ability to effectively air-raid the west coast. One should also note that due to the ASAT requirements the reactors are enormously powerful and by sheer brute force of driving the ship through the water they're capable of 39kts (also their huge size helps, large hulls are fundamentally easier if you have the raw power to design for very high speeds).

[Sea Skimmer]

Why would anyone ever use a molten salt reactor in a naval vessel? It’s just as bad as liquid metal in practical terms, you can’t ever turn it all the way off, and yet it would provide lower energy density. Air defense lasers firing from sea level aren’t likely to have an effective range of much more then about 20-25km, they’d be very powerful but by the 2030s I’d bet that offensive air power was already becoming based almost completely around cruise missiles and other expendable weapon. Even today we could buy 280 Tomahawk cruise missiles for the price of a single F-22.

[Illuminatus Primus]

The gun armament is necessary, yes. Railguns were just however introduced on some high-end nuclear powered cruisers of a couple nations before the fall. Others have chemical arms. It's very hard to get anything other than a missile swarm through against an enemy ship, so guns are important.

Why are shells/projectiles any better than missiles if their PD lasers/particle beams are that good?

[CaptainChewbacca]

The gun armament is necessary, yes. Railguns were just however introduced on some high-end nuclear powered cruisers of a couple nations before the fall. Others have chemical arms. It's very hard to get anything other than a missile swarm through against an enemy ship, so guns are important.

Why are shells/projectiles any better than missiles if their PD lasers/particle beams are that good?

A shell has a lot more armor/metal to get through before it will fragment, I think.

[Illuminatus Primus]

The gun armament is necessary, yes. Railguns were just however introduced on some high-end nuclear powered cruisers of a couple nations before the fall. Others have chemical arms. It's very hard to get anything other than a missile swarm through against an enemy ship, so guns are important.

Why are shells/projectiles any better than missiles if their PD lasers/particle beams are that good?

A shell has a lot more armor/metal to get through before it will fragment, I think.

So? If you can hit them anywhere further out than point-blank, why cannot you simply fix the beam on them for longer? They're not maneuvering, like a missile might. And what you're saying only applies for hardened penetrators.