aid with a fanfic

Post by **Vympel** » 2002-08-03 12:27pm

Hi guys- am 10,000 words into my fan fic and have hit a snag. Very basic rundown, with stuff omitted.

SW ST galaxy linked by wormhole.

SW: Empire is in charge. Victorious at Endor, but doesn't really matter because no Death Star (Emperor wouldn't let it leave the home turf methinks- link in the chain of millions of worlds and what not). Has a force of 1,000 ships for this operation- which is basically peace and order in a new galaxy. In charge of the fleet- Thrawn. No Sith.

ST: aftermath of Dominion War.

Now; the problem- Imp and feds aren't at war ... yet. I need something to provoke the Feds into attacking the Imp force defending the wormhole (a small portion of the 1,000 ships) - but the provocation can't be blatant enough so as to be so threatening that the Romulans would jump into bed with the Feds and the Klingons.

Provisos- the provocation must be relatively quick- i.e. i considered Imps snatching some Fed and non-fed aligned worlds that are regardless in Fed territory through diplomacy (the better deal and all that) but it doesn't seem like enough to provoke a Fed attack. Will include that, but need something more.

Any suggestions?

May have an idea by tommorow, it is 2:27am over here ... but oh well.

thanks in advance if you can think of anything. If this fan-fic is any good and not a steaming pile, the person with the best idea will be awarded full credit (oooh! tell us more vympel!) hehehe.

Cpt_Frank · Post by **Cpt_Frank** » 2002-08-03 12:34pm

Now my idea would be the foolish feds trying to steal a piece of Imp technology and getting killed in the process.

Post by **Vympel** » 2002-08-03 12:36pm

Cpt Frank is in the lead ... I actually think there might be something to that ... meditate on this I will.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2002-08-03 12:43pm

Originally posted by Cpt Frank
Now my idea would be the foolish feds trying to steal a piece of Imp technology and getting killed in the process.

This is a great idea! Make it the untouchable-never-fuck-up-section-31 and I will like it even more!!!!

2000AD · Post by **2000AD** » 2002-08-03 12:46pm

quite hard as the Feds are not really offensive.
heres a few:

1) Someone , eg. Romulans/marquis/surving rebels/etc., tricks the Feds into attacking by use of false info or fake attack.

2) Some fed admiral or captain realises that the imps are bad news and goes to attack( "to hell wioth the prime directive")

3) The Feds try to colonise worlds in SW and the imps see this as tresspassing and blockade the wormhole. The feds try to break through to get their people back. ( simular, to my knowledge, to the start of the Dominion war and may also require a severe re-writing of your stroy)

4) The Feds finally get their heads out of their arses and actually go on thre offensive for once, rather than just sitting back and trying to debate everything away.

5) The klingons attack and because the feds are their allies they are co-erced into attacking.

6) The Feds read "The Biggest Pile of Sh*t Ever!" (aka Portal) by GK and think they actually stand a chance.

7) Voyager thinks the worm goes back to Earth and try to get through.

thats all i can think of right now.

Post by **Vympel** » 2002-08-03 12:52pm

This response is great. Hopefully when I log on later today there'll be even more. I'm liking the S31 idea a lot though.

2000AD;

1) All good ideas- unfortunately the rebels have been annihilated and I can't think up any motivation for a faked attack on the Imps- unless I'm just tired which is very likely. I've been writing for a few hours.

2) Too similar to Conquest. Didn't want to infringe on that excellent fanfic in any way shape or form.

3) Could be done if I jimmy the plot around a bit. Right now the Imps are defending the worm hole- i.e. no intrusions by anyone.

4) It would be most peculiar

5) Could work! Might be something to this. Will think hard.

6) I thought they'd shoot themselves with a phaser- being driven to the point of suicide at reading such poorly-written drivel.

7) Hahahah actually maybe Janeway can piss the Imps off!

Cpt_Frank · Post by **Cpt_Frank** » 2002-08-03 03:20pm

So mine and Crown's proposal would then be: after initial contact (and perhaps a little demonstration of Imperial might against the Borg) almighty Section 31 tries to steal and fucks up.
Btw Janeway pissing the Imps off would be funny but on the other hand that's what she does in nearly every Voy episode.

Post by **Vympel** » 2002-08-03 11:40pm

Actually Cpt_Frank part of the plot is an Imp campaign against the Borg- in fact 80% of the fleet is campaigning against the Borg before the war with the Feds & co begins- hmmm yes if I can figure out some way for the Feds to know that the Borg are being annihilated (I've already had Picard hearing them basically well ... screaming in agony hehe) then things should proceed quite nicely.

Crossover_Maniac · Post by **Crossover_Maniac** » 2002-08-04 12:26am

Crown wrote:
Originally posted by Cpt Frank
Now my idea would be the foolish feds trying to steal a piece of Imp technology and getting killed in the process.
This is a great idea! Make it the untouchable-never-fuck-up-section-31 and I will like it even more!!!!

At the risk of getting flamed, I like Section 31. They were working for 200+ years inside the Federation with no one knowing they existed almost beat the Founders, if not for Dr. Bashir butting in.

Jack Lain · Post by **Jack Lain** » 2002-08-04 02:25am

ah I am not going to get an answer, but here it is:

Who are the characters? What are their motivations?
You have conquored the known universe and we have as readers.....
End the story! Why do you want to continue it? Sure some part of section31 might still survive, but why bother?
What do I mean??? Easy - you need to provide more information (or post your fan fic in total) for us to help you. End the story - or tell us about the main characters. Who was the good guy? Who was the bad guy? Were there any love interests? What motivated their loyalty? What motivated their betrayal?

There really isn't a way to help you without more informaiton.
Personally I would suggest, barring MOD interferrence, that you post the whole thing up to the point you are stuck.

Post it to where you are stuck, and then we can make some really good suggestions. Otherwise, we're just waving sparklers in the dark and pretending that they are light sabres.

-Jack "need info to help" Lain.

Vapthorne · Post by **Vapthorne** » 2002-08-04 04:52am

Here's a quick thought I am sure no else had thought of.

In Voyager, they state that the Omega particle is so dangerous to the Federation (it can stop their warp travel, I believe) that it's the duty of any starship to destroy it, even at the cost of the prime directive.

Now, what the Imperials gotten their hands on some (for studym or even unintentially). What would the Feds do?

Post by **Vympel** » 2002-08-04 07:01am

Jack, the story hasn't even 'begun' so to speak

I don't want to post it until I have a more definite direction- i.e. im a seat of my pants writer and don't write from a predetermined plan- my experience that no plan survives in original form anyway, so its pointless.

I've already gotten some help and I'm close to making this provocation thing work (i.e. Feds feel they have to attack the Empire at the wormhole); I've put the Imps at a pretty severe numbers disadvantage (2,000 ships rather than original 1,000) compared to the Feds let alone the Klingons and Rommies because an overwhelming enemy force with better tech just doesnt make for an interesting story about a military campaign, its just so much masturbation about why SW kicks ST ass.

Basically this is a military campaign story. How would the Imps fight in such a situation? How would the Feds respond? There are no good or bad guys, no romances etc.

Charachters?

Feds- usual suspects. Picard & Co; maybe others later as I grow comfortable.
Imps- Thrawn, as well as introduced a few. Others will come in later methinks. The war hasn't even BEGUN yet.

Cpt_Frank · Post by **Cpt_Frank** » 2002-08-04 07:20am

2,000 ships rather than original 1,000

Now the last time I checked 2000 was more than 1000.

Post by **Vympel** » 2002-08-04 09:28am

Gah stuffed up the context pretty severely there, apologies- i doubled the number because 1,000 was simply too small I found... didn't give me enough room to do what i wanted so i jacked it up.

Vapthorne · Post by **Vapthorne** » 2002-08-04 06:02pm

Vympel,

If you don't take well to planning a story, that's all well and good, but I good piece of advice is to flesh out some characters before proceding. This might not work for everyone, but in my experience most story crop with card board characters, and the best plots come from character. If you have an idea on how what type of Imperials would be in the ST galaxy (their motives, background, etc), as well as the low down on the Federation cast. If you create a brass argoant Starfleet admirial that seeks the Imperial technology, then figuring out how to start a war isn't that hard. Stories are about people, and I find stories can write themselves with decent characters.

Just my two Imperial Scripts.

Jack Lain · Post by **Jack Lain** » 2002-08-05 12:19am

Oh, sry bro, I didn't understand. I thought you were about 20 - 30 pages into it and were stuck.
The attack on the worm hole is a good idea. But if the Feds are in the situation you're talking about I'm not so sure they would do that.

I really like the idea of the section 31 guys trying to do a covert op. That could be a really good piece of action and you could flesh out some neat "non-standard" tech to make them competitive. Just because the Enterprise doesn't have any advanced weaponry, does not mean that section 31 doesn't. That could be cool if they show up with the equivalent of a thermal detonator. I wouldn't go with the attack on the worm hole only because its been done. Give MW's fanfic a read. You'll see this event is what he does to 'justify' the aggression. You could have a real cool scene with the sec 31 covert ops theme. Just because most ships are populated by weak losers, doesn't mean that the sec 31 guys are. Make them true, real life, delta or sof types. Gung ho and willing to actually pull the trigger! :)

Anyway, I look forward to reading your first chapter or whole story.

-Jack "GL" Lain.

Cpt_Frank · Post by **Cpt_Frank** » 2002-08-05 04:44am

And make S31 fail! That'd be so cool.

Post by **Vympel** » 2002-08-05 05:39am

Ok guys new plan;

attack on wormhole dropped- covert S31 op on wormhole and defending Golan platforms in.

People used to think I was quite good at fiction (I almost always wrote sci-fi fiction, sometimes my own stuff, sometimes Wing Commander, sometimes Independence War etc) but I've fallen out of practice and lost a lot of any skill I had in doing so.

I think I'll go over the prelude or whatever and post it soon- i wanna spit and polish it and make it as tight as possible- in word.doc form its actually hit 50 pages now but my charachter development is REALLY lacking IMO.

Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman · Post by **Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman** » 2002-08-05 06:01am

Ummm........... This is only an idea, but why pitting the Empire against the Feds? Why not the Dominion? They have more reason to provoke the Empire and maybe more challenge (although not much).

Cpt_Frank · Post by **Cpt_Frank** » 2002-08-05 06:08am

Good idea, perhaps Vymp is gonna include it lateron in the story.

Post by **Vympel** » 2002-08-05 07:16am

Currently I have the Empire committing genocide against the Borg because the Emperor sees them as an affront to the Force- the Feds/ Klingons/ Rommies are also on the Imp chopping block because they're closest to the wormhole. The Imps know the Dominion exists; but with no way for them to arrive in time and no way of knowing if the Empire exists; I don't see an Imperial campaign happening against them in this fanfic- perhaps someone could try it, has it been done? My DS9 knowledge is a bit lacking unfortunately.

Anyways, here's the beginning of the fanfic. Extract of how I write- afraid it pales in comparison to the other stuff I've read on this board (Stravos and Mark S are extremely good)- but anyways.

Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman · Post by **Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman** » 2002-08-06 05:36am

Here's another idea; your story can also involve the Secret Order.

Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman · Post by **Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman** » 2002-08-06 05:50am

I mean, if Section 31 will perform covert ops on behalf of the Feds, then the Secret Order will do the same for the Empire.

Post by **Vympel** » 2002-08-06 07:49am

Another good idea I didn't think of- I pretty much glossed over imp intel work... I think I'll work them in as foiling/attempting to foil S31.

2000AD · Post by **2000AD** » 2002-08-06 03:35pm

WTF is the secret order?