A Deal with A Devil (D&D)

PrinceofLowLight · Post by **PrinceofLowLight** » 2004-03-30 05:55pm

Here's the scoop, boys and girls:
You just brought a fairly powerful Baatezu (say, a Bone Devil) to the point of surrender (suspend disbelief, please). In exchange for its life, you can basically dictate terms. How do you think you can keep the contract in your favor?

Personally, I think the most important thing is YOU drafting the contract. Sounds obvious, but plenty of folks overlook it.

I'd have the beast be my eternal slave. I think a good way to accomplish this would be with Asimov's 3 Laws of Robotics. The meat of the contract would basically be..

1. I may never do anything to harm my master, or through inaction allow my master to come to harm.
2. I will follow my master's orders, except in situations where doing so would conflict with The First Law.
3. I will protect my own existence, except in situations where doing so would conflict with the First or Second Law.

A nice long speech about how the little fucker is to not say or do a single thing unless you tell it to might be necessary. That'll keep it from doing things behind my back, but it'll still save my life if it's in danger (1st Law>2nd Law).

How about you people?

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-03-30 06:56pm

If we're suspending disbelief enough to be talking in the context of D&D then its not necessary to suspend any more disbelief about defeating a bone devil; they're eminently beatable.

But it will find a way to weasel out of the contract, or it'll just break it. They're lawful, but they're also very, very evil. It would not go on serving under such an agreement, especially if the contract's one-sided enough that it doesn't get a thing out of it.

PrinceofLowLight · Post by **PrinceofLowLight** » 2004-03-30 08:02pm

Err, sorry, I first posted this at a D&D board where people tend to vastly overestimated Demons and Devils, and if I hadn't put that clause in the first few posts would undoubtably have been on mortals beating Osyluths.

Alright, for the purposes of this, the devil WILL honor the contract, but only in letter.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-03-30 09:20pm

Hehehehehehe. Where is this board? I'll learn them.

consequences · Post by **consequences** » 2004-03-30 09:39pm

PrinceofLowLight wrote:Here's the scoop, boys and girls:
You just brought a fairly powerful Baatezu (say, a Bone Devil) to the point of surrender (suspend disbelief, please). In exchange for its life, you can basically dictate terms. How do you think you can keep the contract in your favor?

Personally, I think the most important thing is YOU drafting the contract. Sounds obvious, but plenty of folks overlook it.

I'd have the beast be my eternal slave. I think a good way to accomplish this would be with Asimov's 3 Laws of Robotics. The meat of the contract would basically be..

1. I may never do anything to harm my master, or through inaction allow my master to come to harm.
2. I will follow my master's orders, except in situations where doing so would conflict with The First Law.
3. I will protect my own existence, except in situations where doing so would conflict with the First or Second Law.

A nice long speech about how the little fucker is to not say or do a single thing unless you tell it to might be necessary. That'll keep it from doing things behind my back, but it'll still save my life if it's in danger (1st Law>2nd Law).

How about you people?

Sure, but I'd back it up with a Contingency spell or two, loaded with a DemonSquisher Combo, set to go off if the thing decides to fuck with me. I also wouldn't make it my eternal slave, simply say, You are serving me for a minimum of a decade. After that time, If you wish to be free, you are to provide me with the true name of a demon of your type as powerful as you are. You will then beat it to within an inch of its life, at which time you will signal me, and I will summon and bind it. As soon as I have it fully bound, I shall release you, except for the Contingency spell and its riders, which shall explode your devious little head if you ever try to come after me for this.

PrinceofLowLight · Post by **PrinceofLowLight** » 2004-03-30 11:06pm

Rogue 9 wrote:Hehehehehehe. Where is this board? I'll learn them.

The official WOTC boards, actually.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-03-30 11:30pm

Yowza. Never mind, the stupidity there is too great to conquer without a full blown SD.net invasion-in-force, and this isn't the subject of most people here, so I don't know if that would even work.

Captain tycho · Post by **Captain tycho** » 2004-03-30 11:54pm

Rogue 9 wrote:Yowza. Never mind, the stupidity there is too great to conquer without a full blown SD.net invasion-in-force, and this isn't the subject of most people here, so I don't know if that would even work.

Tell me about it. I joined there a year ago, made one post them realized everyone there was either A) An asshole B) a poor speller C) an idiot or D) All of the above. (Excluding me of course.

)
On topic, I wouldnt risk it. I would simply kill the devil and get my share of XP.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2004-03-31 12:53am

Knowing that it would weasle out of the contract... I kill it and bind its soul to my will.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-03-31 03:01am

Not wanting to have any part in such unmitigated evil, I kill it and don't bind it to anything; I just make damn sure its not getting up again.

consequences · Post by **consequences** » 2004-03-31 03:10am

Rogue 9 wrote:Not wanting to have any part in such unmitigated evil, I kill it and don't bind it to anything; I just make damn sure its not getting up again.

Wuss.

Binding it and forcing it to hunt down and kill other demons is much more fun.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-03-31 03:42am

consequences wrote:
Rogue 9 wrote:Not wanting to have any part in such unmitigated evil, I kill it and don't bind it to anything; I just make damn sure its not getting up again.
Wuss. Binding it and forcing it to hunt down and kill other demons is much more fun.

Not wuss. Paladin.

consequences · Post by **consequences** » 2004-03-31 03:52am

Rogue 9 wrote:
consequences wrote:
Rogue 9 wrote:Not wanting to have any part in such unmitigated evil, I kill it and don't bind it to anything; I just make damn sure its not getting up again.
Wuss. Binding it and forcing it to hunt down and kill other demons is much more fun.
Not wuss. Paladin.

My bad, Uber-Wuss then

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-03-31 04:33am

consequences wrote:
Rogue 9 wrote:
consequences wrote: Wuss. Binding it and forcing it to hunt down and kill other demons is much more fun.
Not wuss. Paladin.
My bad, Uber-Wuss then

*SMITE!* You were saying?

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-03-31 04:50am

Besides, getting him to do it for you is for wusses. I'd much rather do it myself; that way I can be sure its done right. Besides, we're talking a devil here. Orders from his superiors conveniently override any fool mortal contract.

Smiling Bandit · Post by **Smiling Bandit** » 2004-03-31 11:26am

But it will find a way to weasel out of the contract, or it'll just break it. They're lawful, but they're also very, very evil. It would not go on serving under such an agreement, especially if the contract's one-sided enough that it doesn't get a thing out of it.

They'll keep contracts to the letter. Give it no way out, and it has no way out. And if you impress the thing, you just might get its loyalty. Sure, its evil, but Baatezu are strangely honorable. Its that whole lawful thing.

but frankly, if you're powerful; enough to kill one, you really have no need to make it serve you.

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2004-03-31 11:51am

Smiling Bandit wrote:
but frankly, if you're powerful; enough to kill one, you really have no need to make it serve you.

if you're an evil mage that has the power to kill a baatazu, there's no reason not to make it your pawn if you can find some use for it. after all, if you need to wipe out an enemy, get the baatazu to do it for you. especially if it's a risky situation where you would put yourself in danger but could send others to do it instead.

Master Arachnos · Post by **Master Arachnos** » 2004-04-06 11:32am

consequences wrote:
PrinceofLowLight wrote:Here's the scoop, boys and girls:
You just brought a fairly powerful Baatezu (say, a Bone Devil) to the point of surrender (suspend disbelief, please). In exchange for its life, you can basically dictate terms. How do you think you can keep the contract in your favor?

Personally, I think the most important thing is YOU drafting the contract. Sounds obvious, but plenty of folks overlook it.

I'd have the beast be my eternal slave. I think a good way to accomplish this would be with Asimov's 3 Laws of Robotics. The meat of the contract would basically be..

1. I may never do anything to harm my master, or through inaction allow my master to come to harm.
2. I will follow my master's orders, except in situations where doing so would conflict with The First Law.
3. I will protect my own existence, except in situations where doing so would conflict with the First or Second Law.

A nice long speech about how the little fucker is to not say or do a single thing unless you tell it to might be necessary. That'll keep it from doing things behind my back, but it'll still save my life if it's in danger (1st Law>2nd Law).

How about you people?
Sure, but I'd back it up with a Contingency spell or two, loaded with a DemonSquisher Combo, set to go off if the thing decides to fuck with me. I also wouldn't make it my eternal slave, simply say, You are serving me for a minimum of a decade. After that time, If you wish to be free, you are to provide me with the true name of a demon of your type as powerful as you are. You will then beat it to within an inch of its life, at which time you will signal me, and I will summon and bind it. As soon as I have it fully bound, I shall release you, except for the Contingency spell and its riders, which shall explode your devious little head if you ever try to come after me for this.

First up, I'm not sure what use a demon-squisher would be against a devil (but that's just a nitpick.

Ok then, he serves you for a decade, then whumps on another devil for you. What he has to do is pick a devil to whump on with Heal as a spell, spell-ability or feat. Once he's whumped it to within this inch (10hps, 5 hps, -5hps) his work is done. He's then free to (attempt to) kick your ass. First he heals the devil (or it heals itself). Now it's 2 on 1. They then start that annoying cycle of gate, gate, gate....

As for binding with variants on the 3 laws. If i was this devil I'd just bully/bribe/coerce losts of equiv devils or lower into attacking you, making sure that i was'nt around so that you can invoke Rule 1 or 2

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-04-06 12:25pm

What annoying cycle of gate, gate, gate? I'm telling you, summoned baatezu can't use their own summoning ability. This is the second or third thread I've had to say this in. Don't you people read the entire ability description?

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2004-04-06 12:29pm

Rogue 9 wrote:What annoying cycle of gate, gate, gate? I'm telling you, summoned baatezu can't use their own summoning ability. This is the second or third thread I've had to say this in. Don't you people read the entire ability description?

Don't get bitchy.

Just link where you've said this and correct them.

Not everyone knows this and should not be faulted...or should we think you a dumbass everytime you make a mistake on what someone else has said beforehand?

Cthulhu-chan · Post by **Cthulhu-chan** » 2004-04-07 03:32am

Master Arachnos wrote:As for binding with variants on the 3 laws. If i was this devil I'd just bully/bribe/coerce losts of equiv devils or lower into attacking you, making sure that i was'nt around so that you can invoke Rule 1 or 2

This isn't just a simple contract, with the demon agreeing to it. You are magically binding the demon to this contract, thus they cannot break it. They can, however look for any and all loopholes and exploit those. Your suggestion would violate the first condition.

Master Arachnos · Post by **Master Arachnos** » 2004-04-07 03:40am

Rogue 9 wrote:What annoying cycle of gate, gate, gate? I'm telling you, summoned baatezu can't use their own summoning ability. This is the second or third thread I've had to say this in. Don't you people read the entire ability description?

Well my preferred system is still 2ed (where the gate cycle did work), so if this trick does'nt work in 3.0 or 3.5 then my apologies. However, my scenario still leaves you with 2 very annoyed devils (not sure what state they'd be in after scrapping beforehand).

There's a thought, your pet devil is the one who supplies you with the name of the 2nd devil that you want him to whomp on. What's to say he has'nt set up an elaborate scam where the 2nd devil lets him take him down easily (with no serious hp loss, or no using of spells p/day). You'd probs be in worse straits then....

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