Al-Q Chems came from Syria!

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-04-20 08:09pm

From newsmax.com, other orgs are reporting it.

Al-Qaida WMDs Came From Syria

Jordan's King Abdullah revealed on Saturday that vehicles reportedly containing chemical weapons and poison gas that were part of a deadly al-Qaida bomb plot came from Syria, the country named by U.S. weapons inspector David Kay last year as a likely repository for Iraq's weapons of mass destruction.

"It was a major, major operation. It would have decapitated the government," King Abdullah told the San Francisco Chronicle. Jordanian officials estimated that the death count could have been as high as 20,000 - seven times greater than the Sept. 11 attacks.

King Abdullah said that trucks containing 17.5 tons of explosives had come from Syria, though he took pains not to implicate Syrian President Bashir Assad in the al-Qaida plot, saying, "I'm completely confident that Bashir did not know about it."

In his testimony before Congress last year, weapons inspector Kay said U.S. satellite surveillance showed substantial vehicular traffic going from Iraq to Syria just prior to the U.S. attack on March 19, 2003.

While Kay said investigators couldn't be sure the cargo contained weapons of mass destruction, one of his top advisers described the evidence as "unquestionable."

"People below the Saddam-Hussein-and-his-sons level saw what was coming and decided the best thing to do was to destroy and disperse," said James Clapper in comments reported by the New York Times on Oct. 29. Clapper heads the National Imagery and Mapping Agency.

Israeli intelligence has long believed that after the U.S. delayed invasion plans to allow U.N. weapons inspectors time to search for Iraq's WMDs, Saddam moved the banned weapons to Syria, the only other country ruled by the Ba'ath Party.

On April 1, Jordanian officials announced the arrest of several terrorist suspects, saying they were still hunting for two cars filled with explosives.

Five days later, the State Department revealed that the attackers were linked to Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, a Jordanian-based terrorist considered to be one of al-Qaida's most dangerous. One of Zarqawi's targets was the U.S. Embassy in Amman.

By Saturday morning European news services were quoting an unnamed Jordanian official, who revealed that the al-Qaida plotters planned to use weapons of mass destruction in the foiled attack.

"We found primary materials to make a chemical bomb which, if it had exploded, would have made nearly 20,000 deaths ... in an area of one square kilometre," the official told Agence France-Press.

Another operation planned by the network was to use "deadly gas against the US embassy and the prime minister's office in Amman," he added.

A car belonging to the al-Qaida plotters, containing a chemical bomb and poisonous gas, was intercepted just 75 miles from the Syrian border.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-04-20 08:12pm

Also related:

http://ap.washingtontimes.com/dynamic/s ... TE=DEFAULT

Jordan Police Kill Four Terror Suspects

By JAMAL HALABY
Associated Press Writer

AMMAN, Jordan (AP) -- Authorities
stormed a basement in a poor neighborhood of the Jordanian capital Tuesday, killing four men believed to have ties to an al-Qaida-linked cell that plotted simultaneous bombing and chemical attacks against the U.S. Embassy and other targets.

Three other men were detained at the hide-out, according to an Associated Press photographer at the scene.

It was not immediately clear what relationship the detained men had with the slain terror suspects. Three of the dead were foreigners, government spokeswoman Asma Khader said without giving their nationalities.

The bomb plot was disclosed earlier this week and was said to have been foiled following the arrests of several suspects in two raids in late March and early April. Had the chemical bomb exploded, it could have killed at least 20,000 people and wrecked buildings within a half-mile radius, government officials say.

Jordan, a moderate Arab nation with close ties to the United States and a peace treaty with Israel, has been targeted by al-Qaida and other groups.

The nearly four-hour operation began in Tuesday afternoon when hundreds of policemen, acting on a tip, surrounded a one-mile area around the one-story, white-brick building in the eastern Hashemi district of Amman, a predominantly Palestinian area.

Police called for the suspects to surrender, but they responded with gunfire, the statement said.

About 2 1/2 hours into the operation, police fired several volleys of tear gas at the hide-out.

"Open the door! Surrender!" shouted a Special Forces security man in black uniform through a loudspeaker after police arrested one of three men trying to escape from the back of the house.

Shortly afterward, about six Special Forces men wearing gas masks stormed the house, breaking down the door with an iron bar. Smoke, apparently from a tear gas canister that was fired by the security forces, was seen rising from the basement.

Two men, one bearded, were dragged out of the house. Authorities handcuffed them and forced them to lie on their bellies on the ground next to the first suspect. An official in civilian clothes slapped the men on the face and screamed abuse at them.

Joyful women on balconies of nearby buildings ululated and boys clapped and whistled as police took the three away. Some security forces were slightly injured in the operation.

A security official, speaking on condition of anonymity, told AP that the four killed were believed to have links to a group that plotted to detonate a powerful chemical bomb against Jordan's secret service, and use poison gas against the prime minister's office, the U.S. Embassy and other diplomatic missions.

"Information made available to security authorities pointed to the presence of an armed group which had plotted to carry out terror attacks," the police statement said.

The U.S. Embassy in Amman declined comment on Tuesday's shootout. But other Western diplomatic officials contacted by AP said they believed there was a link between the al-Qaida- linked terror threat and the slain suspects.

Authorities have said the suspects in the earlier raids entered Jordan from Syria, which denies the allegation.

Police said several of the terror suspects arrested last month confessed that the plots were hatched by Jordanian militant Abu-Musab al- Zarqawi, thought to be a close associate of al-Qaida boss Osama bin Laden.

U.S. officials have offered a $10 million reward for al-Zarqawi's capture, saying he is trying to build a network of foreign militants in neighboring Iraq to work on al-Qaida's behalf.

Twenty-two Arab men were convicted in a plot that targeted U.S. and Israeli tourists in the 2000 millennium celebrations in Jordan.

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2004-04-20 08:18pm

I do not see the first bit on either CNN, Reuters, BBC, or Fox News. I call bullshit.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-04-20 08:20pm

Is there any concrete information on these "materials" yet? How long before actual details come to light instead of these vague statements from Jordanian officials? Because quite frankly, I have rather serious doubts about this "could have killed 20,000 people" stuff; it sounds to me like the Jordanians are trying to make a really big deal out of their bust.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-04-20 08:24pm

Howedar wrote:I do not see the first bit on either CNN, Reuters, BBC, or Fox News. I call bullshit.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,117414,00.html

Jordanian officials say the arrests occurred after suspected militants entered Jordan from neighboring Syria in at least three vehicles filled with explosives, detonators and raw material to be used in bomb-making.

Syrian officials have denied the claims.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-04-20 08:27pm

Darth Wong wrote:Is there any concrete information on these "materials" yet?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3604857.stm

Osmium tetroxide is the chemical believed to be at the centre of an alleged bomb plot foiled by UK and US intelligence agents.

It is thought the supposed plan involved detonating an explosive device and the compound.

Osmium tetroxide is used by scientists to stain materials and as a catalyst - something that speeds chemical reactions.

It is also a toxic substance with corrosive effects on eyes and skin, making it dangerous to touch or inhale.

'Volatile substance'

And it would also have the ability to cause panic if released in a closed environment.

But given its high cost and volatile nature, scientists say it makes an unlikely ingredient for an effective "dirty bomb".

Dr Steve Simpson, a senior lecturer in chemistry at the University of Salford works with the substance.

He told BBC News Online the yellow crystalline solid is a volatile substance - it turns from solid to gas at room temperature.

The resulting vapours corrode skin and eyes and fumes damage the lungs when inhaled. In the laboratory it is only safely handled inside a fume cupboard.

"If you get the vapour in your eyes, even a small amount, it can turn them brown or black and you could be permanently blinded," said Dr Simpson.

"It is so volatile, you would be in appreciable danger just opening a bottle.

'Massive panic'

"If you had 10g and you opened it up in a normal-sized room, within a couple of minutes it would cause people's eyes to stream.

"Some people might feel a bit tight in the chest. It would cause massive panic.

"You would certainly know it was there - it has an acrid smell."

Osmium tetroxide is not a fatal substance but, said Dr Simpson "could cause trouble" if swallowed.

However it is so quick to react it would be hard to take - most likely decomposing in the mouth.

Harmful effects aside, scientists believe it is an "extremely unlikely" candidate for use in a dirty bomb.

Given its reactive nature, it is likely to be destroyed in any actual explosion. It does cause elements to burn, but is not an explosive.

Handling the chemical would be difficult for any terrorist.

And it is expensive - one gram costs about £96-£130 from chemical suppliers.

Nerve agents

So expensive that working chemists like Dr Simpson buy it in "recyclable" form where the byproducts of using it can be sold back.

There is also a radioactive form - a byproduct of the nuclear industry - described as "astronomically expensive".

"It is one of the most unlikely things to put in a bomb," said Dr Simpson.

"You wouldn't get a lot of osmium for more than £30,000. You would be better off getting something for your money, some kind of nerve gas.

"You can cause an awful lot of havoc with gas rather than have a massive amount of a very expensive chemical."

"It would be incredibly difficult to put it in a bomb."

"You could buy 10g but it wouldn't be enough to cause damage over a wide area.

"I would say this report sounds like it was dated 1 April."

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-04-20 08:32pm

So the lethal "kill 20,000 people" bomb-plot material is just osmic acid? Hey, the stuff is toxic, but modern industry is filled with toxic chemicals. It certainly doesn't sound like a worthy candidate for a bomb plot.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-04-20 09:07pm

It would have decapitated the government by...making their eyes stream and their chests tighten?

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2004-04-20 09:21pm

Someone ring me when that AQ competent nerve gas threat is looking close.

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2004-04-21 10:12am

HemlockGrey wrote:It would have decapitated the government by...making their eyes stream and their chests tighten?

OsO4 has lethal effects but I don't have information on its LD50 for higher mammals. Most MSDSs only have data on rats and mice.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-04-21 10:16am

phongn wrote:
HemlockGrey wrote:It would have decapitated the government by...making their eyes stream and their chests tighten?
OsO4 has lethal effects but I don't have information on its LD50 for higher mammals. Most MSDSs only have data on rats and mice.

Lots of things have lethal effects, but that doesn't mean you're going to be able to build a bomb that kills 20,000 people with them.

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2004-04-21 10:19am

Darth Wong wrote:Lots of things have lethal effects, but that doesn't mean you're going to be able to build a bomb that kills 20,000 people with them.

Sorry if I was unclear -- I didn't mean to say that you could build a bomb to kill 20K people, only that it didn't merely cause their victims to have their "eyes stream and their chests tighten."