Asscroft goes after Greenpeace for sailor mongering

Post by **Vympel** » 2004-04-24 01:45am

Obscure 1872 law

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-04-24 02:15am

Well I don't like Greenpeace, and that's no secret, but that's just a little... Yeah.

They boarded a ship? Privately owned, no doubt? Couldn't they come up with a better charge than that?

Tsyroc · Post by **Tsyroc** » 2004-04-24 03:23am

The law was enacted to keep brothel employees from jumping aboard ships to lure sailors to port with offers of liquor and prostitutes. It has been used just twice - in New York in the 1870s and in Oregon in the 1890s. Even then, the courts found it awkward and archaic.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2004-04-24 03:57am

Hey, a law is a law. Maybe we can charge them with brigandage.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2004-04-24 04:22am

If convicted, Greenpeace could be fined $10,000 and placed on five years' probation, which the group says would chill its activism. By being required to report to a federal probation officer, Greenpeace says it would face unprecedented government scrutiny of its tactics and membership rolls.

I'm so sad. If Greenpeace was active say fifty to sixty years ago their actions probably would have gotten there ships declared pirate vessels and destroyed on sight after a couple months.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2004-04-24 04:26am

Yeah, god forbid we scrutinize a quasi-terrorist group.

Stuart Mackey · Post by **Stuart Mackey** » 2004-04-24 05:15am

I like this..greenpeace accused of soliciting sex..

Post by **Vympel** » 2004-04-24 05:52am

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Yeah, god forbid we scrutinize a quasi-terrorist group.

What exactly is "quasi-terrorist" about Greenpeace? They're a fucking advocacy group, not militants. Doesn't Ashcroft have anything better to focus Justice Department resources on? Like, I don't know ... REAL FUCKING TERRORISTS?

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-04-24 10:24am

I'm not sure who I want to win.

Solauren · Post by **Solauren** » 2004-04-24 10:31am

I'd like to see Greenpeace put under the microscope.

Half the nutters in it would disappear never to return, and the ones that wouild be left would be intelligent, know WHAT to protest over (i.e NOT nuclear fusion) and HOW to protest (i.e Signs in the street)

Tribun · Post by **Tribun** » 2004-04-24 10:32am

That's cheap....

Glocksman · Post by **Glocksman** » 2004-04-24 10:37am

HemlockGrey wrote:I'm not sure who I want to win.

No kidding.
Too bad both parties couldn't just simply vanish.

Maybe we'll get lucky and Asscroft'll get sacked and the French will blow up the Rainbow Warrior again.

Stuart Mackey · Post by **Stuart Mackey** » 2004-04-24 10:55am

Glocksman wrote:
HemlockGrey wrote:I'm not sure who I want to win.
No kidding.
Too bad both parties couldn't just simply vanish.

Maybe we'll get lucky and Asscroft'll get sacked and the French will blow up the Rainbow Warrior again.

Cept this time their bloody agent will have an accident on the way to the nick

Glocksman · Post by **Glocksman** » 2004-04-24 11:17am

Let's put it this way.

If I were the Captain of a vessel and someone tried to board it without authorization, I'd order the crew to 'repel boarders' using any and all means.

After all, I don't know if they're peaceful protesters who wouldn't hurt a fly or pirates disguised as such.

Better not to take the chance.

I hope the assholes can swim.

Plekhanov · Post by **Plekhanov** » 2004-04-24 12:58pm

Solauren wrote:I'd like to see Greenpeace put under the microscope.

Half the nutters in it would disappear never to return, and the ones that wouild be left would be intelligent, know WHAT to protest over (i.e NOT nuclear fusion) and HOW to protest (i.e Signs in the street)

Oh come on you may not like what Greenpeace stand for but can you really say they don’t know “HOW” to protest? I’d say they are pretty damned good at it and have pulled off some major successes (Brent Spar for example) with limited resources, which might be one reason why they piss off many people on this board so much.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-04-24 01:00pm

Vympel wrote:
CaptainChewbacca wrote:Yeah, god forbid we scrutinize a quasi-terrorist group.
What exactly is "quasi-terrorist" about Greenpeace? They're a fucking advocacy group, not militants. Doesn't Ashcroft have anything better to focus Justice Department resources on? Like, I don't know ... REAL FUCKING TERRORISTS?

I dunno... Tree spiking gets it up there into terrorist territory if you ask me.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-04-24 01:01pm

Plekhanov wrote:
Solauren wrote:I'd like to see Greenpeace put under the microscope.

Half the nutters in it would disappear never to return, and the ones that wouild be left would be intelligent, know WHAT to protest over (i.e NOT nuclear fusion) and HOW to protest (i.e Signs in the street)
Oh come on you may not like what Greenpeace stand for but can you really say they don’t know “HOW” to protest? I’d say they are pretty damned good at it and have pulled off some major successes (Brent Spar for example) with limited resources, which might be one reason why they piss off many people on this board so much.

No, the reason they piss me off is that they actively tried to kill me. Lets get that on the record now.

Montcalm · Post by **Montcalm** » 2004-04-24 01:11pm

Rogue 9 wrote:
Vympel wrote:
CaptainChewbacca wrote:Yeah, god forbid we scrutinize a quasi-terrorist group.
What exactly is "quasi-terrorist" about Greenpeace? They're a fucking advocacy group, not militants. Doesn't Ashcroft have anything better to focus Justice Department resources on? Like, I don't know ... REAL FUCKING TERRORISTS?
I dunno... Tree spiking gets it up there into terrorist territory if you ask me.

Are you sure it was Greenpeace that spiked the trees,it probably is a more radical fucked-up group who've done that.

Burak Gazan · Post by **Burak Gazan** » 2004-04-24 01:18pm

Glocksman wrote:Let's put it this way.

If I were the Captain of a vessel and someone tried to board it without authorization, I'd order the crew to 'repel boarders' using any and all means.

After all, I don't know if they're peaceful protesters who wouldn't hurt a fly or pirates disguised as such.

Better not to take the chance.

I hope the assholes can swim.

We generally dont have any weapons shipboard beyond cutlery and fire axes

...however, we do have fire hoses and they make nice anti-personnel weapons at full pressure

As you say, todays harmless greenpricks might be tomorrows suicide squad of fundies -- default setting = hostile boarders, treat as such.

Plekhanov · Post by **Plekhanov** » 2004-04-24 01:20pm

Rogue 9 wrote:
Plekhanov wrote:Oh come on you may not like what Greenpeace stand for but can you really say they don’t know “HOW” to protest? I’d say they are pretty damned good at it and have pulled off some major successes (Brent Spar for example) with limited resources, which might be one reason why they piss off many people on this board so much.
No, the reason they piss me off is that they actively tried to kill me. Lets get that on the record now.

But were you really that keen on them before they apparently tried to kill you?

I’m sure there are plenty of woefully ineffective groups with similarly objectionable agendas but they never achieve anything so they don’t upset you so much.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-04-24 01:24pm

I seriously didn't care until one tried to put a hammer through my forehead when I caught some of them spiking trees on our tree farm. I didn't think they could be so stupid as to spike a tree farm anyway. My account of the incident is on record here on the boards somewhere.

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2004-04-24 03:01pm

Glocksman wrote:
HemlockGrey wrote:I'm not sure who I want to win.
No kidding.
Too bad both parties couldn't just simply vanish.

Maybe we'll get lucky and Asscroft'll get sacked and the French will blow up the Rainbow Warrior again.

I'm in agreement with both.

On one side a bunch of environuts that rate up there with PETA's stupidity mixed with a penchant for trying to accomplish through sometime action vs

A man who been stripping away freedoms with the illusion of *patriotism*.

Plekhanov · Post by **Plekhanov** » 2004-04-24 03:37pm

Rogue 9 wrote:I seriously didn't care until one tried to put a hammer through my forehead when I caught some of them spiking trees on our tree farm. I didn't think they could be so stupid as to spike a tree farm anyway. My account of the incident is on record here on the boards somewhere.

I wasn't aware that Greenpeace went in for tree spiking, were these guys fully paid up members on an officially approved operation or were they a small bunch of hardliners working without authorisation?

Its just that its seems odd that Ashcroft would go after Greenpeace using archaic laws in a case he could easily loose if there are Greenpeace activists committing real, unambiguous and serious crimes elsewhere who were caught red handed.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-04-24 03:51pm

I don't know if it was an official operation; Greenpeace denied it. But they were members.

Skelron · Post by **Skelron** » 2004-04-24 11:06pm

Which would seem then to indicate it was not a official action but a group of Nut Jobs who joined Green peace as they shared it's basic agenda, if not it's methods.

green peace itself goes for the Peaceful if rather militant protest option. Such as Brent Spar, (as already mentioned) Mostly because they straddle a fence of insider and outsider groups, If they became violent and attacked people they would lose anyhope of being an Insider group.

(insider a group that has access to the government directly, Outsider those that either by choice or circumstances do not have any direct access to the government,)

Since Insider groups with their direct access have obviously a great deal of influance, they don't tend to want to throw that away, while that is not to say that Greenpeace has not gotten more militent, they have, Brent spar was a sign of this, due to steadily decreasing membership, they still are Highly unlikly to authorise any situation that would result in Physica attacks on private individuals.