Relationship emergency (Mike Wong, your input appreciated)

[Saurencaerthai]

So, here's the background: my "girlfriend" (we rejected the term "boyfriend" or "girlfriend" because the terms are too closely associated with the 1-2 week relationships of college) is Korean and not part of any religion (she rejected christianity). Her parents, however, are not Korean, are hard-core christians, and are a bit twisted. I myself am an atheist Jew.

Now, when we first were together, the parents were sort of fine with this. My parents don't see race or religion as an issue, so as long as it is a healthy relationship between us (which it is,) its all good.

The problem: over the past month, there has been a VERY sudden shift in her parents. They have lectured to her about how it simply cannot work between a Korean (read: racism) and a Jew (read: anti-semitism.) It recently climaxed with them telling her that she is to break it all off and if they find we are still together, she does not come back to college at all. As a result, she will not be able to persue her dance carrer and will have to pay all the tuition lost back.

Important note: Her parents said it would be alright for us to be friends still. As well, she has a suspicion that the reasons they gave are the real reason they don't want me with her.

We have decided that breaking it off is simply out of the question and will go incognito with the relationship, however, I'm wondering if you guys had any thoughts, or advice? (particularly Mr. Wong, who had to deal with the whole race and religion bullshit.)

[Stofsk]

I really wish I could advise you here, but the only thing I can think of is simply make a stand. I don't know who you are or your girlfriend, or your situation, or the parents and whatever is eating them - but if you love her and she loves you then you're already winning. If her parents are against it what about your parents? Are they supportive of you, or giving advice?

Ugh. I doubt any of the above was helpful.

[Crown]

Holy shit man, that is pretty messed up! Going incognito is probably the safest course for now, until that is she or you are old enough to no longer be on mummy or daddy's purse strings. This is a tough choice.

[Saurencaerthai]

I really wish I could advise you here, but the only thing I can think of is simply make a stand. I don't know who you are or your girlfriend, or your situation, or the parents and whatever is eating them - but if you love her and she loves you then you're already winning. If her parents are against it what about your parents? Are they supportive of you, or giving advice?

Ugh. I doubt any of the above was helpful.

Race and religion are non-issues to my parents so they are supportive of the relationship. In terms of advice, it essentially comes down to probing her parents more. Otherwise, it's a tricky situation.

Don't worry, I know its tricky situation, so thats why I'm throwing out to everyone.

[RogueIce]

Is it possible for her to get any sort of decent financial aid if worst comes to worst? And who would she need to pay tuition given back to? Parents or the school? If to parents, how serious are they (IOW, would they actually take her to court?) For that matter, could they legally do anything to get it back (again, assuming they're very serious about it)?

I'm just thinking, trying to see if you can try to blunt the effects of the "worst-case scenario" situation (of you two staying together}, namely, her parents finding out.

As to trying to get any measure of acceptence... I've never faced anything like this before, so I won't even try to give you advice. About all I can do is maybe try to help you (at least in planning for) mitigate the worst-case scenario. Sorry, bud, wish I could help more.

[Saurencaerthai]

Is it possible for her to get any sort of decent financial aid if worst comes to worst?

Possible, but considdering how expensive the Hartt school is, she'd have a VERY handsome debt to pay off at the end.

And who would she need to pay tuition given back to? Parents or the school?

Parents.

If to parents, how serious are they (IOW, would they actually take her to court?) For that matter, could they legally do anything to get it back (again, assuming they're very serious about it)?

Unless she moved out and began living independantly from them, she'd have to, as she would be living under their roof. I would feel obligated to contribute to her finances if this happened, and I'm not in any position to do so. (Although cutting them off would certainly be good for her.)

[Rogue 9]

Daaaaamn. You're in a tight spot. They're really so serious as to deny her education to keep her away from you? Do you know her parents well enough to know if this is an idle threat or whether they're serious?

[Master of Ossus]

I know a girl who is Korean. Here's what she has to say. I hope it helps!

Susan says: Korean parents have this thing where if they think a relationship is going to be very serious they will definitely freak out--especially if they are ultra-conservative, and if this is her first relationship. There isn't much you can do, but DO NOT argue with the parents [b/]and don't go out behind their backs. If you do, you are merely killing your chances with her. It's not antisemitism or anything. They just aren't used to the idea of a seriou inter-racial relationship. Instead, just give the parents time to get used to the situation and they will eventually get used to it.

[Saurencaerthai]

Daaaaamn. You're in a tight spot. They're really so serious as to deny her education to keep her away from you? Do you know her parents well enough to know if this is an idle threat or whether they're serious?

I wouldn't put it beyond them. I know, it sounds like the most un-parentlike thing to do, but I have a strong feeling they would do something like that.

I know a girl who is Korean. Here's what she has to say. I hope it helps!

Susan says: Korean parents have this thing where if they think a relationship is going to be very serious they will definitely freak out--especially if they are ultra-conservative, and if this is her first relationship. There isn't much you can do, but DO NOT argue with the parents [b/]and don't go out behind their backs. If you do, you are merely killing your chances with her. It's not antisemitism or anything. They just aren't used to the idea of a seriou inter-racial relationship. Instead, just give the parents time to get used to the situation and they will eventually get used to it.

This would help if it weren't for the fact that her parents aren't Korean.

[Crown]

MoO: Her parents aren't Korean though!

[Darth Wong]

We have decided that breaking it off is simply out of the question and will go incognito with the relationship, however, I'm wondering if you guys had any thoughts, or advice? (particularly Mr. Wong, who had to deal with the whole race and religion bullshit.)

Two questions:

1. Is your girlfriend willing to choose you over her parents if it comes to that? Rebecca's parents never did "get used to it", and appeasing them would hardly have discouraged their bigotry. It was not until we produced their first grandchild that they suddenly found it in their hearts to forgive us for the unspeakable "crime" of getting married across lines of race and religion. With all due respect to MoO's acquaintance, I think it is perhaps overly optimistic to think you can just ease them into it.
2. Can you handle it if you get caught and they carry through on their threat? When Rebecca's parents disowned her, I paid for her tuition, as well as her room and board. I was in third-year university at the time, and this was no easy task, particularly since I did not qualify for any kind of government loans or grants.

It might not be that bad for you, but I'm giving you a picture of just how bad it can get. I'm a fighter; the harder you push me, the harder I'll push back. But not everyone has that personality trait; some will become weary of the conflict, or battered down by the stress. Only fate will tell whether your situation gets as bad as mine did, and only you can say whether you'd be able to weather that storm.

On a more optimistic note, I can say that any relationship which survives such a thing will be stronger for it.

[Darth Wong]

Daaaaamn. You're in a tight spot. They're really so serious as to deny her education to keep her away from you? Do you know her parents well enough to know if this is an idle threat or whether they're serious?

I wouldn't put it beyond them. I know, it sounds like the most un-parentlike thing to do, but I have a strong feeling they would do something like that.

Rebecca's parents did that. That's why you have to ask yourself the tough question: do you have enough fight in you to handle the worst-case scenario?

[RogueIce]

Daaaaamn. You're in a tight spot. They're really so serious as to deny her education to keep her away from you? Do you know her parents well enough to know if this is an idle threat or whether they're serious?

I wouldn't put it beyond them. I know, it sounds like the most un-parentlike thing to do, but I have a strong feeling they would do something like that.

Rebecca's parents did that. That's why you have to ask yourself the tough question: do you have enough fight in you to handle the worst-case scenario?

Exactly. Hence my earlier questions.

I guess you could just hope she does really, really well, and she gets some type of money for college. I've been told repeatedly there are lots of scholarships opportunites out there. Being a female of Korean descent probably doesn't help.

Even if it's not a full ride, every little bit you can try to get from outside sources is that much less you and she have to pay for. And even if it's loans, well, it might well be easier to pay them off when you're out in the workforce than handling tuition now.

Of course, the other question is, is tuition pretty bad there? And what about your parents? Are they willing to help? And, most important, able?

[Trytostaydead]

Ah, assuming she was raised as a non-Korean, this probably makes it a lot easier.

Unless the girl's somewhat of a rebel, the Korean parents have a huge control over them.

But thankfully, this isn't the case. How old is she? Is she still in school and dependent upon her parents?

..and exactly HOW attached to you is she? Or how much further does she want to go with you?

[Shroom Man 777]

I know I'm just a kid but well, I just want to ask:

What if after you do weather the storm, what if you find out you aren't meant for her or vice versa?

What if this isn't the right relationship yet and you end up in a situation like Wong, except that you won't end up being married?

Lots of things can go wrong, lots of fuck ups can happen and having in-laws like that can seriously damage a relationship and maybe even damage yourself.

[PainRack]

Shroom, you don't know. The only thing you know is this......


if after all the shit that happens is through, and you still find yourselves loving each other, its a relationship that will stand the test of anything fate can throw at you.



Just a question: From the way you describe her parents, is she adopted?

[Shroom Man 777]

Shroom, you don't know. The only thing you know is this......


if after all the shit that happens is through, and you still find yourselves loving each other, its a relationship that will stand the test of anything fate can throw at you.

That sounds so poetic and nice, and cool at the same time. I'll agree, with that if you survived that, it will strengthen your relationship. You and Wong are right.

Just a question: From the way you describe her parents, is she adopted?

Either that or her mom is a surigate mother who bought a Korean embryo to fertilize, heh

[Saurencaerthai]

Just a question: From the way you describe her parents, is she adopted?

Adopted from Korea at a VERY young age.

[Pablo Sanchez]

I guess there's no possibility of reasoning with them? Sometimes it's possible to explain that you're in love and that if they really cared for their daughter, then they would understand and support her feelings. Anyway, I find it surprising that a family would adopt and raise a Korean girl and then have a racist viewpoint like this.

[Broomstick]

My parents married across religious lines nearly 50 years ago (and they're still married, so draw your own conclusions about whether or not it was right for them)

The day after the marriage my father's family held his funeral - sitting shiva, because he'd married outside of the faith.

My mother's family said that after he divorced her (apparently a fate worse than death in their brand of Catholicism, and inevitable in their eyes) she'd die a lonely old childless woman and no other man would touch her.

Both sides of the divide insisted that any child prodouced of such a union would die a bitter, lonely, miserable outcast from society, unable to achieve acceptance anywhere.

Well, the parents are still married, us four kids have done pretty well for ourselves, and those of us still living are married and well integrated with society. Those on my mother's side (the Catholics) who insisted divorce was inevitable are by and large divorced themselves, some of them multiple times. Oh, my.

Some on my father's side have never forgiven my parents their happy marriage, success in life, or us kids for our mere existance. Some have. At my grandmother's funeral some of the hardcases threw a scene, loudly insisted we leave, and one of them started throwing things. This, by the way, was over 40 years after the marriage occurred. The rabbi finally told them to shut up and sit down or leave. So I guess it's our fault these people were removed by security from the graveside.

Despite all the wailing about how us "halfbreed" children would live tortured lives, pretty much the only folks who have given us grief have been these same relatives. My family solved the problem by moving 600 miles away. This further infuriated the meddling relatives because it put us out of their reach, enabling us to live peaceful, happy lives while they made themselves miserable interferring with each others' affairs.

So, what I'm saying is that it can certainly work out, relationships crossing various social lines and taboos, but there will also be someone who will continue to be upset about the whole matter no matter how many years pass. And likely those most upset will be the relatives themselves. Sure, some folks in the greater outside world won't like it, either, but no matter who and what you are, somewhere there someone who is going to give you grief over it.

Granted, in my case the "halfbreed" status is a result of religion and we all look Caucasian (there actually is some Asian on my father's side, but it's back far enough it's no longer visible in our appearance) Which is different than being a visible minority.

I'm not entirely clear whether the objection in the OP is stemming from religion, race, or a combination. My experience with Fundies is that some of them DO object more to crossing the religious line than the racial line. That is, they are religous bigots, not racial. But I do agree with what Wong has said - you have to be prepared for the worst case, because they do happen.

[PainRack]

Just a question: From the way you describe her parents, is she adopted?

Adopted from Korea at a VERY young age.

No blood ties, and the only ties that bind is the debt of parenthood.....

Think about it.

[Einhander Sn0m4n]

Figure out how to get out from under the Tyrants' thumb, go incognito, then when you can, RIP THOSE ASSHOLES A NEW ONE! Not physically, of course, but I think you get the idea.

Educate them painfully as to exactly why they are wrong for doing this shit and why their extreme irrationality and pettiness is downright evil.

[Executor32]

Ugh, I hate bigotry, especially the religious sort! Unfortunately, it always seems to be members of the Judeo-Christian faiths, the most prevalent religions here in the US, that are that way. I've certainly never heard a Shintoist or Buddhist spout this kind of nonsense. Sometimes, though, it makes me wonder what the world would be like today if Constantine hadn't been converted.

Since they're hardcore Christians, I think you should twist Bible verses ala Chick or Phelps to imply that they're going to Hell if they continue their bigoted opposition of your relationship. There might actually be some that'd work, unlikely as it seems.