CBC wrote:WASHINGTON - U.S. President George W. Bush said he was sorry Thursday for the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by U.S. soldiers, a day after he stopped short of offering an apology.
Standing in the White House Rose Garden alongside Jordan's King Abdullah II, Bush said he told the King "I was sorry for the humiliation suffered by the Iraqi prisoners and the humiliation suffered by their families."
"I told him I was as equally sorry that people seeing those pictures didn't understand the true nature and heart of America," Bush said.
During interviews on two Arab television networks on Wednesday, Bush said the abuse of prisoners was "abhorrent" and "does not represent the America that I know." Bush has been criticized for not offering an apology during the interviews
Bush also told reporters Thursday he's sticking by Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld despite calls for him to resign over the Iraqi prisoner affair.
Democratic Senator Tom Harkin demanded Rumsfeld's resignation "for the good of our country, the safety of our troops, and our image around the globe." Democratic House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi also called on Rumsfeld to quit.
But Bush dismissed the calls, saying that Rumsfeld is a "really good Secretary of Defence."
"He's an important part of my cabinet and he will stay in my cabinet," Bush said.
Rumsfeld is scheduled to testify before a Senate committee on Friday.
The White House has been scrambling to contain the scandal over physical abuse at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison since U.S. news network CBS first released photos of prisoners on its television program 60 Minutes II.
Democrats and Republicans in Congress have blasted the Pentagon and Rumsfeld for not informing them sooner about the abuse.
Bush said he told Rumsfeld in a meeting Wednesday that he was unhappy to find out for the first time on national television about the pictures of Iraqi prisoners being abused.
"I told him I should have known about the pictures and the report" done by the Pentagon two months ago.
Meanwhile, the Washington Post published more humiliating photos of what appear to be Iraqi soldiers.
One photo shows a female soldier holding a leash wrapped around the neck of a naked prisoner.
Others show naked men tied up together; one handcuffed to a cell door and another image of a bound naked man with women's panties over his head.
So he doesn't say he's sorry on Arab tv stations where it will actually do some good. He should be getting his ass on every Iraqi tv and radio station as well as every paper to apologise.
On another note: how is being handcuffed to a cell door abuse? That one is up there with having chem light fluid poured on you, how is it abusive?
Sure. He's all sorry now that it's become impossible to cover the matter up.
When ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided, there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
—Abraham Lincoln
People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
—Dr. Gregory House
Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
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Patrick Degan wrote:Sure. He's all sorry now that it's become impossible to cover the matter up.
And not that it will do any good..somehow I dont think the Middle east thinks much of his sudden sincerity, or many others.
Via money Europe could become political in five years" "... the current communities should be completed by a Finance Common Market which would lead us to European economic unity. Only then would ... the mutual commitments make it fairly easy to produce the political union which is the goal"
Patrick Degan wrote:Sure. He's all sorry now that it's become impossible to cover the matter up.
And not that it will do any good..somehow I dont think the Middle east thinks much of his sudden sincerity, or many others.
Especially since he didn't even let the dust settle before reassuring the western media that he still thinks Rumsfeld is a wonderful guy.
Indeed..I heard on the radio this morning that the Red Cross has been warning the US about these problems for about a year..so Bush cannot claim ignorance, or at least cannot evade responability.
Via money Europe could become political in five years" "... the current communities should be completed by a Finance Common Market which would lead us to European economic unity. Only then would ... the mutual commitments make it fairly easy to produce the political union which is the goal"
When ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided, there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
—Abraham Lincoln
People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
—Dr. Gregory House
Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
—The Doctor "Terror Of The Zygons" (1975)
Via money Europe could become political in five years" "... the current communities should be completed by a Finance Common Market which would lead us to European economic unity. Only then would ... the mutual commitments make it fairly easy to produce the political union which is the goal"
Anyone who believes that Bush first found out about these abuses during the national TV broadcast (when most citizens found out) is a moron.
Once again, we have a case of someone who's not really not sorry that something happened, he's sorry that it became public.
Apology not accepted, Snowman.
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Stewie: "How do you know about the machine?"
--
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--
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When I saw Bush's actual speech on the lawn, I thought to myself, what he said was, "I said I was sorry" not "I AM sorry." For someone who claims to be so direct and personal, why couldn't he just directly say it. I'm sure it'd be easy for the speechwriters to throw in, "So I repeat to the world, I AM deeply sorry for..."
Reminds me of elementary school. When the teachers actually finally caught a kid being a savage bastard to me and pretending to make the kid apologize, they would mumble something about how they said, at some previous time when I wasn't around and only the teacher heard it, that they were sorry. That way, they weaseled their way out of actually directly apologizing. The teacher would wander off to go chitchat, the little bastard got away with it and never did have to humiliatingly apologize to me, and I had yet another angry memory to repress.
Please someone tell me that politics is a little more grown up than the actions of children on a playground.
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Please someone tell me that politics is a little more grown up than the actions of children on a playground.
It would be a good thing if our politicians were as easy to handle as children.
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I'm studying for the CPA exam. Have a nice summer, and if you're down just sit back and realize that Joe is off somewhere, doing much worse than you are.
Please someone tell me that politics is a little more grown up than the actions of children on a playground.
It would be a good thing if our politicians were as easy to handle as children.
That would have to be the truest statement about politicians I have seen in at least a week
Via money Europe could become political in five years" "... the current communities should be completed by a Finance Common Market which would lead us to European economic unity. Only then would ... the mutual commitments make it fairly easy to produce the political union which is the goal"
Please someone tell me that politics is a little more grown up than the actions of children on a playground.
It would be a good thing if our politicians were as easy to handle as children.
Yeah. You can't spank a politician.
Tell that to their mistresses
Via money Europe could become political in five years" "... the current communities should be completed by a Finance Common Market which would lead us to European economic unity. Only then would ... the mutual commitments make it fairly easy to produce the political union which is the goal"
Defiant wrote:Anyone who believes that Bush first found out about these abuses during the national TV broadcast (when most citizens found out) is a moron.
On the contrary, the way things have been going with this country I wouldn't be suprised if he really was paying that little of attention.
Fucking christ... I have to come to Bush's defense on this. He was not responsible for those abuses, he did not commit them, and they were commited in a manner which is against US policies. It wasnt his fault and he should not have to apologize.
Much like the 9/11 bullshit. He didnt do it, the terrorists did, and all this mudslinging blame-fingering bullshit is just that, bullshit.
Maybe if we got our collective heads out of our asses and focused on who was actually responsible for these things we would be a bit better off. Mudslinging is, IMHO good for only one things... gridlock.
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This report raises serious concerns regarding the actions of U.S. forces in Afghanistan, specifically with regard to the use of excessive force during arrests; arbitrary or mistaken arrests and indefinite detention; and mistreatment in detention:
U.S. forces regularly use military means and methods during arrest operations in residential areas where law enforcement techniques would be more appropriate. This has resulted in unnecessary civilian casualties and may in some cases have involved indiscriminate or disproportionate force in violation of international humanitarian law.
Members of the U.S. armed forces have arrested numerous civilians not directly participating in the hostilities and numerous persons whom U.S. authorities have no legal basis for taking into custody. These cases raise serious questions about the intelligence gathering and processing that leads to arrests and call into question the practice of arresting any and sometimes all Afghan men found in the vicinity of U.S. military operations.
Persons detained by U.S. forces in Afghanistan are held without regard to the requirements of international humanitarian law or human rights law. They are not provided reasons for their arrest or detention. They are held virtually incommunicado without any legal basis for challenging their detention or seeking their release. They are held at the apparent whim of U.S. authorities, in some cases for more than a year.
The general lack of due process within the U.S. detention system violates both international humanitarian law and basic standards of human rights law. The United States, as a detaining power in Afghanistan, is essentially applying no legal principles to the persons whom they detain in Afghanistan. Simply put, the United States is acting outside the rule of law. There are no judicial processes restraining their actions in arresting persons in Afghanistan. The only real legal limits on their activities are self-imposed, and there is little evidence that the Department of Defense has seriously investigated allegations of abuses or mistreatment at Bagram, and the department has most certainly not sought on its own to correct the legal deficiencies of its detention regime.
There are serious concerns regarding the treatment of detainees at Bagram airbase, particularly in light of the failure of the United States to investigate and publicly report on several unexplained deaths in detention. There is credible evidence of beatings and other physical assaults of detainees, as well as evidence that the United States has used prolonged shackling, exposure to cold, and sleep deprivation amounting to torture or other mistreatment in violation of international law. Neither the U.S. Department of Defense nor the CIA has adequately responded to allegations of mistreatment at U.S. detention facilities in Afghanistan.
And then there is the policy of overturning suspects and terrorists to third world dictatorships so the can be tortoured or Gitmo.
It becomes more and more difficult to believe that it is not their offical policy.
Stuart Mackey wrote:
And not that it will do any good..somehow I dont think the Middle east thinks much of his sudden sincerity, or many others.
Especially since he didn't even let the dust settle before reassuring the western media that he still thinks Rumsfeld is a wonderful guy.
Indeed..I heard on the radio this morning that the Red Cross has been warning the US about these problems for about a year..so Bush cannot claim ignorance, or at least cannot evade responability.
And that ALONE is very VERY disturbing. The Red Cross as a rule trys to not comment on things. That way they always appear impartial and can get in to help people held by powers like POW's or inmates in certian countries. If they actualy speak out against something activly.....
Alyrium Denryle wrote:Fucking christ... I have to come to Bush's defense on this. He was not responsible for those abuses, he did not commit them, and they were commited in a manner which is against US policies. It wasnt his fault and he should not have to apologize.
Ever hear of the phrase "The Buck Stops Here". No, guess not...
Much like the 9/11 bullshit. He didnt do it, the terrorists did, and all this mudslinging blame-fingering bullshit is just that, bullshit.
Sure, it's all the terrorists fault that Bush simply could not be bothered to get curious about what a memo titled "Bin Laden Determined To Strike In U.S." might possibly mean and break away from the bass pond in Crawford to, oh I don't know, do his goddamn job.
Maybe if we got our collective heads out of our asses and focused on who was actually responsible for these things we would be a bit better off. Mudslinging is, IMHO good for only one things... gridlock.
And just who rammed us into an unnecessary war against a country which posed no conceivable threat on the basis of false "intelligence" which in turn created this situation in the first place?
When ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided, there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
—Abraham Lincoln
People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
—Dr. Gregory House
Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
—The Doctor "Terror Of The Zygons" (1975)
Alyrium Denryle wrote:Fucking christ... I have to come to Bush's defense on this. He was not responsible for those abuses, he did not commit them, and they were commited in a manner which is against US policies. It wasnt his fault and he should not have to apologize.
Bullshit. He's the fucking Commander-in-Chief. If he has the authority to control the military, he has to bear the responsibility if the military does something wrong. If something wrong is going on in the military, he is ultimately responsible for it.
Of course those who actively participated are also responsible, and they should face the consequences of their actions. Bush has no problem taking credit when the military does something exceptional, so he should have no problem taking blame when they fuck up.
Chris: "Way to go dad, fight the machine"
Stewie: "How do you know about the machine?"
--
"I object to you. I object to intellect without discipline. I object to power without constructive purpose."
-Spock, 'The Squire of Gothos'
--
"I'm only 56? Damn, I'll have to get a fake ID to rent ultra-porn".
-Professor Farnsworth, "Teenage Mutant Leela's Hurdles"
Please someone tell me that politics is a little more grown up than the actions of children on a playground.
It would be a good thing if our politicians were as easy to handle as children.
Yeah. You can't spank a politician.
Well, I'm sure that there are those who do. And others have the pictures.
When ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided, there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
—Abraham Lincoln
People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
—Dr. Gregory House
Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
—The Doctor "Terror Of The Zygons" (1975)
