Dahak versus Empire

[Xon]

I think it's more the question of whether Dahak would choose to employ evasive maneuvers. Is that their common doctrine, or do they just trade blows while standing still á la Borg cubes?

We have seen them maneuver at FTL against an opponent while attacking

[Sokar]

True, Enchanach drive planetoids can "micro-jump" in order to engage an enemy , but they stay at sub-light while tactically manuvering. In the books they tended toward the stand there and slug it out approach due to the need for Dahak to do their thinking for a majority of them, but the crewed units of the Imperial Guard bobbed and weaved all through the Achultanni formations.

[Captain Cyran]

Yeah, the imps are definitly outmatched, the only thing that could stop Dahak is Centerpoint station.

Thank goodness this isn't the entire 4th Imperium vs. the Galactic Empire.

That is just sick.....*twitch* ow...can you say Empire gets flattened in the worst way possible?....

[XaLEv]

Thank goodness this isn't the entire 4th Imperium vs. the Galactic Empire.

That is just sick.....*twitch* ow...can you say Empire gets flattened in the worst way possible?....

Sick? No, this would be merely gruesome. Sick would be the GE vs. whole of the 4th Empire.

[HRogge]

"Dahak has a maximum speed of 0.6 c and an acceleration higher than a proton torpedo. The galaxy gun would never hit him..."

I think it's more the question of whether Dahak would choose to employ evasive maneuvers. Is that their common doctrine, or do they just trade blows while standing still á la Borg cubes?

Evasive maeuvers at 50%+ c is a standard tactics for the 4th Empire... it's the only defense ( except Jamming, Stealth ) that helps against hyper missiles...

[Shortie]

As to the DS, we've never seen a planetoid shield knocked down, but we were told what they were gonna use to trash Earth, behind a jury-rigged, heavily battered shield, which was Iapetus at more than 500km/s, ie at more than 56 ZT \ 2.4e32J.

IOW I surely wouldn't like to be in a Utu class hit by the DS, but I wouldn't guarentee it's gonna die either.

[Sokar]

Even if we assume that only the Dahak(4th Imperium version) was to be stranded in the SW universe, he could still take over , given some time and a few suitable populated planets. Dahaks internal outfitting make him perfectably capable of setting up a working Imperial techbase. Dahaks design also provided him with his own orbital factory complex for the production of weapons and sub-light parasite warships. Utu-class planetiods were long range patrol warships , able to operate away from the Imperium for upwards of 25 years. Also remember that Dahak has a large compliment of fighters and parasite warships , the largest of which still mounts enough missile and beam armament to go toe to toe with an ISD(IE the 80,000 ton Nergal and Osir type of vessels)
Unless the Empire was able to gang tackle Dhak as soon as possible, the Empire would be in for a serious fight.

[Stormbringer]

Unless the Empire was able to gang tackle Dhak as soon as possible, the Empire would be in for a serious fight.

At which point Dahak simply wipes them out assuming their mutineers. Dahak is fully capable of operating and fighting all on his own.

And Nergal type battleships would make mincemeat out of an Eclipse. They carry hypermissles and one of those is enough to trash any Imperial ship. Hell, their fighters carry hypermissles. The Imperials are so very very screwed.

[consequences]

Look, i know that dahak can make mincemeat out of any imperial fleet yet seen, but those fleets have nothing on what the empire could put together if it tried. If you have read the star wars technical commentaries, then you would know that the second death star represented the equivalent of millions of star destroyers being constructed in a 6 month period.
scenario: Dahak shows up, spends a month or two on recon, before picking a world with a suitably large industrial base to take over. Initial imperial efforts against him are slaughtered as fast as they arrive. An entire priority sector fleet is detailed to remove the threat, and again dies, but not before sending a transmission detailing some of dahak's observed capabilities. At this point, the empire gives a collective OH SHIT!! and establishes a recon globe around dahak to keep him under observation, probably from several light years out. Additional forces are sacrificed, along with ridiculous numbers of hyper capable probe droids while the empire gears up for war. After a period of trial and error, sending in large numbers of minor capital ships and fighters to get an idea of dahak's targeting limitations, an armada of star destroyers is assembled, probably within a year of first contact, and hypers to within its own combat range of dahak, firing full salvos. Acclamator troopship guns=200 gigatons, Imperator Star Destroyer is greater than twice an acclamators size, Achuultani warheads = 10,000 megatons = 10 gigatons, and enough 10 gigaton detonations took out a 4th empire planetoid. If the first wave does not succeed, follow up with ever increasing groups, attrition worked for the nest of aku'ultan(or at least killed 70+ planetoids for them) , and it can work for the empire.

I am at least as biased towards dahak as the next man, and i consider Mutineer's Moon to be one of the top 3 scifi universes i have read for sheer power, if not number 1, but dahak is not invincible, and the same factors that screw over the United Federation of Planets also work against him. I fully agree that the fourth imperium would eventually wipe the floor with the galactic empire, but i refuse to believe that duplicating an imperial hyper drive, and scaling it up to work for something with 10 times the diameter(and i don't even want to think about the difference in total volume) of anything ever built with a hyperdrive in the star wars universe is going to be as easy as everyone else here seems to be assuming.

[Captain Cyran]

You must remember that during this year of time Dahak by this time might have already built up such a fleet that most small forces would get torn apart by this fleet, Dahak wouldn't have to do a thing. Another thing, the amount of Achuultani ships in that enemy fleet was at least 5 times the force the Empire could pull together in a year, and that was even after multiple guerrilla tactics, such as causing stars to super nova while the Achuultani were near. Althoughh I must agree that if the Empire did throw enough ships at it they could destroy Dahak they would be SO weakened by it that the rebels would have little to no problem in completely taking over. The entire tactic relies on Dahak staying around one planet, and of him using Borg tactics of sitting there and doing jack squat. In the book after Mutineer's Moon (can't remember the name) you will notice that Dahak had enough of those Nergel and Osir type battleships that he kept at Earth to mostly diverge the scout force that was attacking. Now just imagine giving Dahak a year to constantly build these ships. As for the Hyperdrive, considering the level of Tech. Dahak was at, plus including the help of the rebels which was mentioned before, it wouldn't take him all to long to get his own working Hyperdrive.

[Xon]

consequences:
With that plan you might be able to break the planetiods shields. Then you have to actually damage the planetiods itself. Hypermissile would be inside the core of the ship, so you have to destroy an armoured moon. It is like saying the Empire could batter down the shields of the Deathstar and kill Deathstar with out using another planetbuster.

Also SW could NOT stop Dahak if he chose to move. If he could retro a SW hyperdrive to the parasites, or a hypermissile launcher to a SW ship, the Empire is 100% screwed.

So Dahak doesnt need to move much at all, just outfit the sublight parasites with a SW hyperdrive, and the parasites are now long range planet/star system busters.

[His Divine Shadow]

Three pages on this?
Seems rather redundant...

[consequences]

It took two years for half of dahak's industrial capability, backed by the entire industry and population of the earth, and Anu's resources, to supplement the forces carried by dahak enough to LOSE against a year long seige by 2000 warships, which were not as advanced as their opposition. Take a look at the number of ships arriving at Coruscant in the movies. The Empire could just send ships through hyperspace to ram dahak, after the first 10 million relitavistic impacts, i'm pretty sure dahak would't be happy. I would also like to know how dahak by himself is going to outdo an entire galaxy in research and development, and where he is going to capture an industrial base intact, given that his weapons are going to tend to obliterate whatever he attacks, and that imperial commanders would cheerfully bdz their own resources to keep them out of enemy hands.
Given the fact that a gravitonic warhead will completely remove any imperial ship from existence, how the hell is dahak supposed to recover an intact hyperdrive from the non-existent wreckage.


Dahak doesn't have any real choice but to sit still and protect his resource base if he is able to establish one. Without dahak present, the empire will be able to easily overwhelm any remaining defenses with sheer numbers, and with the sensor technology demonstrated, they will know the instant he leaves. 10 gigaton sublight missiles did in a number of sublight battleships, usually without having to score many hits. Turbolasers that are a minimum of 20 times more powerful than that are going to rip anything smaller than a planetoid apart, probably with the first hit. Meanwhile, in the month that the empire gave dahak to get far enough away to be out of support range, he has travelled 60 light years, or possibly subjugated a nearby world or two. If he kept a signifigant complement of parasite warships onboard to maintain security on any worlds he conquers, then the force left behind to cover his new production center will be much weaker, and even easier to eliminate. By comparison, the empire's ships have been observed at speeds that would let them cover a light year every other second. Catching up with dahak would take them no more than 2 minutes, presuming that he had travelled in a straight line for the whole month.

I don't think that dahak can win a long term campaign alone against an infrastructure that constructed 60 percent of the 2nd death star in 6 months(equivalent in volume to 3.5 billion imperial star destroyers). Oh, and berfore you claim bias on my part, go over to the all star crew thread, and check who i listed as my first alternate choice for crew.

[HRogge]

Dahaks primary advantage would be agility... there is nothing in the empire that matches the SUBLIGHT agility of Dahaks vehicles. Even the parasites would be more agile than anything the empire has ever seen ( including proton torpedos ). The best idea for Dahak would be to take a few decades to travel to the outher rim and build a support base on a unibhabited system. Build a planetary shield and a HUGE production base...

The mayor problem for Dahak is the Empires supralight speed, it takes Dahak Centuries to travel through the other side of the galaxy...