Question on this torture/humiliation BS...

[EmperorMing]

Has anyone wondered if this is being setup/ used by certain parties in this election year against the current administration?

[SirNitram]

Has anyone wondered if this is being setup/ used by certain parties in this election year against the current administration?

No. It's all to do with the logical need for extraordinary evidence for extraordinary claims.

[Darth Wong]

Has anyone wondered if this is being setup/ used by certain parties in this election year against the current administration?

It's a plot by the people in the black helicopters!!!!

[jegs2]

Has anyone wondered if this is being setup/ used by certain parties in this election year against the current administration?

No. Think it was an incredibally stupid and heinous act by a few junior officers, NCOs and soldiers. The photos are being released to the press by relatives who are in effect saying, "See! It ain't just my boy/girl who was doin' bad stuff over there. Look it them here pictures of other atrocities!"

Unfortunately, good soldiers will pay for that stupidity with their lives.

[Bugsby]

Is this being promoted by the Dems more than Reps? Of course, we are an extremely partisan government. Does this mean that this is only an issue because it has been politically publicized? Hell no! This is an important matter regarding both the conduct of American troops as well as our public image abroad. By torturing and humiliating these people, we are making ourselves no better than the old regime.... there goes our last justification for war!

So yeah, I'd say its a pretty damn important issue.

[Edi]

Has anyone wondered if this is being setup/ used by certain parties in this election year against the current administration?

No. Think it was an incredibally stupid and heinous act by a few junior officers, NCOs and soldiers. The photos are being released to the press by relatives who are in effect saying, "See! It ain't just my boy/girl who was doin' bad stuff over there. Look it them here pictures of other atrocities!"

Unfortunately, good soldiers will pay for that stupidity with their lives.

A few junior officers and NCOs? When there had been reports much higher up the chain of command and nothing was being done for months, and the whole prison was turned over to MI control? Sorry, but junior officers don't get to make that kind of decisions, and the Taguba report cites system-wide problems that were not being addressed. The roots of this problem went very high up, and the consequences for the US now are proportionate to that magnitude.

Edi

[Sarevok]

Occms razor says no.

[Stofsk]

Has anyone wondered if this is being setup/ used by certain parties in this election year against the current administration?

In a perfect world the scandal would be a complete and utter fabrication perpetrated by Arseholes. They will then be hunted down and killed by the Justice League. Then there will be a report on Naked News that affirms our side as the Good Guys.

Wake up man, this is fucking reality; and it ain't pretty.

[Admiral Valdemar]

I hear a lot of stuff saying this is actually legit handling of the situation and that there's just a big dervish over this due to media frenzy.

[PainRack]

I hear a lot of stuff saying this is actually legit handling of the situation and that there's just a big dervish over this due to media frenzy.

Nudity and simulation of sexual acts??? Definitely no.

For the british side, peeing on prisoners isn't so bad.... but the alleged murder of POW is. Although let's face it, murdering a POW is easy. "Sir, he was attempting to escape/ resist me with violent force/ instigating the other prisoners...................."

[GySgt. Hartman]

For the british side, peeing on prisoners isn't so bad....

WTF ???

[Sharp-kun]

[quote="PainRack"]
For the british side, peeing on prisoners isn't so bad.... [/quote
I'm still waiting for The Mirror to exaplin the flaws in those pics...

[jegs2]

A few junior officers and NCOs? When there had been reports much higher up the chain of command and nothing was being done for months, and the whole prison was turned over to MI control? Sorry, but junior officers don't get to make that kind of decisions, and the Taguba report cites system-wide problems that were not being addressed. The roots of this problem went very high up, and the consequences for the US now are proportionate to that magnitude.

Edi

Once this washes out, we'll likely find that this mess goes no higher that captain for those who actually knew what was going on at the time and chose inaction or worse, chose to be part of it. It is an American knee-jerk reaction to blame the highest guy in the food chain, who often heard RUMINT at best and more likely was swamped with so much that the matter didn't even reach him until long after the fact. But because of such a mentality in the American culture, those higher up are forced to micromanage every detail, in effect ruling those beneath them with an iron fist, because they'll be blamed no matter what happens, despite the fact they may have known nothing about it. I would be very surprised if any general officer knew the details of what was happening, while it was happening.

[GySgt. Hartman]

It was a general officer who restructured the prison in such a way as to put a cell tract under MI control; he brought in his experience from Guantanamo, which is why he was assigned to this.
I believe that since the war in Afghanistan prisoners have systematically been tortured by the US, starting in Baghram and Guantanamo and continuing in Iraq. Prisoners have been handed to friendly Arab intel services for torture. This is not an isolated incident.

[Aaron]

Once this washes out, we'll likely find that this mess goes no higher that captain for those who actually knew what was going on at the time and chose inaction or worse, chose to be part of it. It is an American knee-jerk reaction to blame the highest guy in the food chain, who often heard RUMINT at best and more likely was swamped with so much that the matter didn't even reach him until long after the fact. But because of such a mentality in the American culture, those higher up are forced to micromanage every detail, in effect ruling those beneath them with an iron fist, because they'll be blamed no matter what happens, despite the fact they may have known nothing about it. I would be very surprised if any general officer knew the details of what was happening, while it was happening.

Perhaps if the General had kept a tighter reign on her troops than this wouldn't have happened. Regardless of whether she knew and condoend it, or this happened because of lax discipline in the unit, as the CO it is her fault. She is responsible for everything happening in 800th MP Brigade. The list of faults for the Brigade in the Tagube report reveal a unit with severe discipline problems and that is a reflection of it's commander and senior NCO's.

[Edi]

A few junior officers and NCOs? When there had been reports much higher up the chain of command and nothing was being done for months, and the whole prison was turned over to MI control? Sorry, but junior officers don't get to make that kind of decisions, and the Taguba report cites system-wide problems that were not being addressed. The roots of this problem went very high up, and the consequences for the US now are proportionate to that magnitude.

Edi

Once this washes out, we'll likely find that this mess goes no higher that captain for those who actually knew what was going on at the time and chose inaction or worse, chose to be part of it. It is an American knee-jerk reaction to blame the highest guy in the food chain, who often heard RUMINT at best and more likely was swamped with so much that the matter didn't even reach him until long after the fact. But because of such a mentality in the American culture, those higher up are forced to micromanage every detail, in effect ruling those beneath them with an iron fist, because they'll be blamed no matter what happens, despite the fact they may have known nothing about it. I would be very surprised if any general officer knew the details of what was happening, while it was happening.

Did you watch the Seante Armed Services Committee hearings yesterday, jegs? Undersecretary of Defense Cambone directly stated that interrogation procedures used in Iraq that deviated from the ones in the Army manuals had to be approved at the theater command level, which means Lt. General Sanchez at the very least. Those hearings were rather illuminating and definitely not good for the US PR image. Also, it seems to me that quite a few of the senators on the committee seemed to agree that it was not an isolated incident. Let's see what turns up, but I'm not giving nearly as strong a benefit of the doubt to the US military as you do. More specifically, it seems it's the military intelligence branch and the 800th MP Brigade that are the culprits here, but their actions had to be known, or there at least had to be suspicion of them, at the theater command level, which is not good.

Edi

[Symmetry]

Has anyone wondered if this is being setup/ used by certain parties in this election year against the current administration?

I might have considered it for an instant, but there are plenty of reasons to believe those pictures were genuine. I mean, it would have to be a pretty big conspiricy to have assembled all the evidence, and if it was that big someone would have already blabbed. I do idley wonder why the pictures were taken by people who had everything to hide, but oh well.