State of the occupation, part II

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2004-05-10 11:37pm

Vympel posted this a few weeks ago, before the whole abuse-of-prisoners thing came out. I'd be interested to see how opinions have shifted. For the record, the final tally in the last thread was as follows:

Completely Fucked_________26______32%
Bad, but salvagable________45______55%
Fair_______________________8________9%
Good______________________1________1%
I'm a Bushite idiot and
everything's peachy_________1________1%

EmperorMing · Post by **EmperorMing** » 2004-05-10 11:40pm

I see us as very fucked while over there.

jegs2 · Post by **jegs2** » 2004-05-10 11:41pm

I would assess it as being fair, considering what we've been able to accomplish with the apparant lack of a post-war plan that was in place. Keep in mind, this is the Middle East we're talking about, which has a default state of "severely messed up." They would do much better with a brutal dictator in place, but what is done is done, so we've got to see this thing through.

The prison scandal certainly didn't help, so a lot of damage control is necessary.

The Kernel · Post by **The Kernel** » 2004-05-11 12:03am

Well, it was pretty fucked a few weeks ago, but now it is on the verge of catastrophe. So I vote totally fucked.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2004-05-11 12:34am

I voted "Bad but Salvageable" last month. I've changed it to "Completely Fucked." The handling of the torture affair has been abysmal, mostly Rummy's fault for pulling a Bill Clinton and not using the word "torture," because technically, as he understood it, it wasn't torture..

We still have utterly no idea of who exactly will get power come June 30th, and the administration has been conspicuously silent on this issue as of late. You'd think they'd want to present whatever good news they had from over there in lieu of the tortures in prisons. Looks like they don't have any.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2004-05-11 01:50am

What Damien said. How are we going to win the 'hearts and minds' of the Iraqis when this shit is out and more isn't being released because it is too shocking?

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-05-11 03:12am

I voted "Bad, but salvageable" before, now the whole prison scandal has made me shift my vote to "Completely fucked."

To think, I actually believed the fucking line "We're going there as liberators!" How naive. I should have known better.

It's just un-fucking-believable.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-05-11 07:02am

I would say "Completely fucked but salvageable over a period of twenty or thirty years".

GySgt. Hartman · Post by **GySgt. Hartman** » 2004-05-11 07:13am

I'd vote completely fucked, but salvageable if the US changes its strategy (and its president).

Ubiquitous · Post by **Ubiquitous** » 2004-05-11 07:26am

Bad, but salvigable. I don't think Iraq is a lost cause just yet, no matter how bad the media makes things look. This isn't Vietnam [yet] and I don't think it ever will be.

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2004-05-11 07:53am

I am an optimist so I say it is bad but salvagable. There are still things America could do to restore its image as a force of freedom and liberty.

Chardok · Post by **Chardok** » 2004-05-11 08:43am

Fucked. Completely and totally fucked. NEver in my life would I have believed my country capable of such thing had I not seen it with my own eyes. I wonder what the sentiment in the arab world really is now. All we get is fucking soundbites and sterilized horseshit and Shrubby stroking Donnie, BIG TIME. I saw part of his glowing fucking review. I mean, come FUCKING ON!!! I don't even say shit like that to my girlfriend. Are you KIDDING ME?! Wanda Sykes had a good point on Leno last night, too. With everything that is happening in the ME, Why the FUCK is Shrubby worried about Gay Marriage? That shit shouldn't even be on his Radar! She also likened how unlike this war is compared with the civil war.

(Paraphrase) "I don't recall the union soldiers marching through the streets getting shot at by the slaves" *Takes up rifle-holding position* "I wish you would try to give me my freedom."

Anyway, without massive oppression by the U.S. military and overwhelming demonstration of force and willingness to use it, the whole iraq situation is now officially shit.

wautd · Post by **wautd** » 2004-05-11 09:17am

Completely fucked

and that was already my opinion before the torture scandals

wautd · Post by **wautd** » 2004-05-11 09:18am

IMO this so called "war on terrorism" created more terrorists (and still is creating) than it has killed

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2004-05-11 11:25am

wautd wrote:IMO this so called "war on terrorism" created more terrorists (and still is creating) than it has killed

Well said. The Iraq war is being used by Al-Queda as recruiting material.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2004-05-11 12:37pm

Completely fucked. By June 30th a worse option will be needed.

Exmoor Cat · Post by **Exmoor Cat** » 2004-05-11 12:53pm

There ought to be a category between bad, but salvagable, and completely fucked. Suggestion - Going to hell in a hand bag.

THe PoW saga is badly handled and continued to destroy Us repuation, and also British reputation out there. Continuing a unilateral occupation is gonig to mak it worse. If nothing is done to change this within the month, then the handover will change my vote to completely fucked.

Murazor · Post by **Murazor** » 2004-05-11 01:52pm

Completely fucked beyond hope for as long as the current American priestident is giving orders. Extremely bad, but salvageable with obscene ammounts of money, good will and dumb luck over a long period of time.

Anhaga · Post by **Anhaga** » 2004-05-11 02:42pm

I used to think it was fucked but salvageable. However, unless something changes, I'd now say it's completely fucked.

Vendetta · Post by **Vendetta** » 2004-05-11 08:31pm

It's on the borderline.

It is, from a presentational point of view, fucked up beyond any hope of repair.

If we stick with it and take the shit, we can leave Iraq a better place, but people won';t remember that, they;re remember the fucked up bits.

It was, when launched, the ultimate thankless escapade, no-one will like it, it will be harsh going for the people sent out there, and the ordinary people of Iraq who suffer because of the unrest, but it may end up better than it has been in a long time for the people we said we were trying to help.

And I'm sure the Smiler and his chimp friend will find a way to profit from it.

Hamel · Post by **Hamel** » 2004-05-11 08:59pm

Not salvagable, therefore fucked. At least we had the smarts to get out of Vietnam.

jegs2 · Post by **jegs2** » 2004-05-11 09:26pm

Hamel wrote:Not salvagable, therefore fucked. At least we had the smarts to get out of Vietnam.

Do you condone just pulling out all forces?

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » 2004-05-11 09:46pm

We are so far beyond fucked, the laws of relativity would have to be twisted in order for fucked to catch up with us.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » 2004-05-11 09:47pm

jegs2 wrote:
Hamel wrote:Not salvagable, therefore fucked. At least we had the smarts to get out of Vietnam.
Do you condone just pulling out all forces?

What would be the downside of doing just that?

jegs2 · Post by **jegs2** » 2004-05-11 10:07pm

Defiant wrote:What would be the downside of doing just that?

It would demonstrate to our enemies that they need only kill enough Americans and they will get what they want. It would further demonstrate to the world that the United States has no stomach for a prolonged fight with any significant casualties. If you are an enemy of the United States, then US forces simply pulling out would be a dream come true and a mission accomplished.

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State of the occupation, part II

America's prospects in Iraq are:

State of the occupation, part II