CaptainChewbacca wrote:I don't know... I do like a wild-card Iran that could be friends with the Hegemony, but an empty Africa? There'd be wars fought over its resources.
That'd make it empty. And if AIDS becomes as bad as predictions make it out to be, then I can see an international quarantine agreement being enforced. In spite of the resources. You could have 'black' operations designed to clandestinely mine Africa, regardless of the risks, and some sort of international crackdown against it. SA might be seen as the few 'safe' areas to be in, compared with the rest of the continent.
Oh, I wanted to give my opinions on some of the new stuff added. You might not care , but here it is.
1. Psions: Be very careful about what their abilities are. Also, take them away from the galactic core and bring them closer, we're not a galaxy-spanning civilization yet. Reduce their number of systems to 3 habitable worlds and 5 marginal colonies. I like them being a genetic experiment, but when they're trying to get cash and influence, why wouldn't some of them hire themselves out to wealthy men and women who want to know their enemies' secrets?
2. Spacelings=Freeholders.
3. Selenians=Subjugated freeholders. The constant influx of immigration from earth prevents a separate "moon culture" from developing in full.
4. Bob, I think before you write a whole history for the Freeholders you should talk to Thirdfain and make sure you two have the same vision. I know he wants to write a bit about them.
5. Stofsk laid out good space-tech and FTL, I especially liked the sand-tractors. The ground weapons tech is also very good and should provide a solid base.
6. To cause trouble, I talked to Thirdfain and it makes the universe more interesting if the Freeholders are currently in control of Cappella gate. That sets them up as a rising power that could give the earth superstates pause.
7. This is all very good stuff, and I think as soon as the earth question is settled, good fic will come.
8. For purposes of the thread the timeline won't be written (I'm sure I'll pay for this later) but lets set the year as somewhere between 2300-2400, and FTL/Gate tech is over a century old. Anyone have an opinion on the year?
Stuart: The only problem is, I'm losing track of which universe I'm in.
You kinda look like Jesus. With a lightsaber.- Peregrin Toker
I got some of my own ideas on these guys, but for the moment I suggest a temporary moratorium on the subject, along with aliens. My idea was to involve human psions with aliens intimately, and can't have one without the other (within reason, of course).
4. Bob, I think before you write a whole history for the Freeholders you should talk to Thirdfain and make sure you two have the same vision. I know he wants to write a bit about them.
Thirdfain seemed to like Bob's contribution toward this angle, though of course I can't speak for him.
Wait a minute, yes I can.
5. Stofsk laid out good space-tech and FTL, I especially liked the sand-tractors. The ground weapons tech is also very good and should provide a solid base.
Ok, we need a better name for sandtractors. Something like 'particle screen', or just 'screen' might do.
6. To cause trouble, I talked to Thirdfain and it makes the universe more interesting if the Freeholders are currently in control of Cappella gate. That sets them up as a rising power that could give the earth superstates pause.
Just so we're sure, there's more than one gate, right?
8. For purposes of the thread the timeline won't be written (I'm sure I'll pay for this later) but lets set the year as somewhere between 2300-2400, and FTL/Gate tech is over a century old. Anyone have an opinion on the year?
2222 - the year symmetry had a heart attack.
2400 - Four hundred years since the dreaded Y2K bug wiped out most people's self-respect, and state-sponsored paranoia reached amusing new highs.
2401 - A Space Travesty.
2410 - THE YEAR WE MADE CONTACT... AGAIN.
The year was 2442, the name of the place was BABYLON 15! ("How many more of the fucking things are you going to build?!?")
For some overwhelming reason I felt like being silly.
Sorry I came in late, but I have some ideas for new factions (I'll flesh them out later):
1. The Aryan Star Empire - a group of Neo-Nazis who were exiled from Earth to the remote prison planet Atlantis Novum, where they eventually seized the power through a revolt. They're not a major power yet, but they've been known to do suprise attacks on trading convoys belonging to everyone they don't like (getting a lot of free resources that way) - and their presence keeps a lot of interstellar travellers away from the area of space which this empire dominates. They're rather secretive and keep their constantly expanding borders totally closed, but due to bad planning of one of their infamous convoy raids, the Psions managed to capture a couple of Heinrich Himmler-class starcruisers. Due to this incident, the ASE have currently grinded their raids to a halt and are now managing a huge military buildup in order to wipe the Psions from the face of the universe.
Oh - and here's the catch: The group which would eventually go on to found the Aryan Star Empire developed their notions of Nazism from playing way too much "Return To Castle Wolfenstein". (none of them have actually read "Mein Kampf") As a result, they've faced quite an amount of ridicule from the various Earthling blocs.
2. The Interstellar Union of Soviet Republics - arch-foes of the Aryan Star Empire, though they once were allied. This were formed by a group of Leninists who migrated to another solar system. The IUSR is even more closed and secretive than the ASE, and nowhere as prone to sabre-rattling - though they occassionally fling symbolic threats at other factions. For twenty years, an uneasy peace rests between the ASE and the IUSR. (though it appears to have been sealed by the ASE's decision to concentrate all of their military towards an upcoming war against the Psions) The IUSR are currently starting to negotiate with some of the other factions in order to recover from a recent large-scale war with the ASE.
3. The Ncha. A group of aliens based upon the Elder Things from H.P. Lovecraft's "At The Mountains Of Madness". They'd be VERY elusive - known only from archeological artifacts and thought to be extinct until some explorers encounter the Ncha.
Last edited by Peregrin Toker on 2004-05-31 04:24am, edited 1 time in total.
"Hi there, would you like to have a cookie?"
"No, actually I would HATE to have a cookie, you vapid waste of inedible flesh!"
I think it would be easier to just call it the Pan-Slavic Bloc.
3. The Ncha. A group of aliens based upon the Elder Things from H.P. Lovecraft's "At The Mountains Of Madness".
We're not looking at alien ideas for awhile, though I also think we have enough. PM with your idea, 'cause I have some of my own as well that we might be able to gel.
Thanks for contributing, Toker, but I think Space Nazis facing off against Space Soviets is a little... familiar? I like your attitude for some silliness, but basing powerful interstellar empires on failed earth empires seems flawed.
As for the lovecraft, there's always room for those guys later.
P.S. If you'd like to turn those Aryans into a group of humans that are all about eugenics and the perfect human form, that would be groovy-awesome. Not quite Neitzchians, but something similar.
Stuart: The only problem is, I'm losing track of which universe I'm in.
You kinda look like Jesus. With a lightsaber.- Peregrin Toker
[Teal'c] Indeed. [/Teal'c] With racial seperatist enclaves like Elohim City forming today, why not in the future?
2. The Interstellar Union of Soviet Republics
I think it would be easier to just call it the Pan-Slavic Bloc.
I thought that the Pan-Slavic Bloc wasn't supposed to be a communist nation... just old Warsaw Pact countries which had unified because of geographical reasons.
Rather, the IUSR was formed by left-wing idealists from all over the globe (most of them from former NATO countries, actually), who went to the stars to form an utopian community.
We're not looking at alien ideas for awhile, though I also think we have enough. PM with your idea, 'cause I have some of my own as well that we might be able to gel.
Thanks.
CaptainChewbacca wrote:I like your attitude for some silliness, but basing powerful interstellar empires on failed earth empires seems flawed.
They're not supposed to be particularly powerful... in fact, I envision them as rather minor players who, however, occassionally stomp on the most insignificant factions.
"Hi there, would you like to have a cookie?"
"No, actually I would HATE to have a cookie, you vapid waste of inedible flesh!"
Hmmm...instead of Space Nazis, why don't we make them semi-cyborg-ish? Perfection not just through biological means, but also through cybernetic means. It would prove to be quite interesting, dontcha think?
"DO YOU WORSHIP HOMOSEXUALS?" - Curtis Saxton (source) shroom is a lovely boy and i wont hear a bad word against him - LUSY-CHAN! Shit! Man, I didn't think of that! It took Shroom to properly interpret the screams of dying people - PeZook Shroom, I read out the stuff you write about us. You are an endless supply of morale down here. :p - an OWS street medic Pink Sugar Heart Attack!
8. For purposes of the thread the timeline won't be written (I'm sure I'll pay for this later) but lets set the year as somewhere between 2300-2400, and FTL/Gate tech is over a century old. Anyone have an opinion on the year?
I'd like the calender to be reset, a la Gundam/Honor Harrington, just to purposely cloud the screen a bit. It also helps escape the conundrum of every science fiction series of putting things in the early third millenium. ("In the year 2000 ... ")
Ok, we need a better name for sandtractors. Something like 'particle screen', or just 'screen' might do.
Pixie (dust).
Hey, it can be a slang term :p I think modern science fiction takes itself too seriously at times. Particle screen is a description, not a name, IMHO. Nobody calls a gun an "explosive velocity-propellant", anyway. Or a fire-stick, for that matter. Even names like airplane, rocket-propelled grenade and horseless carriage get shortened. People seem to hate using nouns longer than one or two syllables.
P.S. If you'd like to turn those Aryans into a group of humans that are all about eugenics and the perfect human form, that would be groovy-awesome. Not quite Neitzchians, but something similar.
Black Lance? :p
That's the wrong way to tickle Mary, that's the wrong way to kiss!
Don't you know that, over here lad, they like it best like this!
Hooray, pour les français! Farewell, Angleterre!
We didn't know how to tickle Mary, but we learnt how, over there!
Bob McDob wrote:I'd like the calender to be reset, a la Gundam/Honor Harrington, just to purposely cloud the screen a bit. It also helps escape the conundrum of every science fiction series of putting things in the early third millenium. ("In the year 2000 ... ")
Breakaway colonies, such as the Aryan idea, might develop their own calendar. Year 0 would be the year of the "Great Colonial Landing, when we left the heathens behind." As for Earth and the rest of civilisation? Why bother? Don't mess with what works.
Pixie (dust).
'Tractors work as a slang term, as do 'Casters, while 'particle screens' works as a pseudo-technical term.
And... I uh, wanted to use the word 'Pixie' for something else.
I think modern science fiction takes itself too seriously at times. Particle screen is a description, not a name, IMHO.
Yes, but most names carry with them a description, as you demonstrate here...
Even names like airplane, rocket-propelled grenade and horseless carriage get shortened. People seem to hate using nouns longer than one or two syllables.
Alright, time to knuckle down and make a serious contribution to this thread, enough sillyness and minor bits on my part.
The Conclave of Genos
The Conclave was formed by a group of renegade geneticists who were driven from Earth's North American territories by a violent public backlash at their work. On the run in one of the first-generation FTL-capable craft, they vanished, not appearing at any of the known human colonies of the time. Contemporary society assumed they had perished while in transit, as early faster-than-light drives were somewhat less than reliable, and they were soon forgotten beyond a mention in some less sanitized history texts.
The truth, as is always the case, is far stranger than the fiction perpetrated by accounts of history. The renegades arrived at a colony world that had been established by one of the early, STL colony ships, and one that was apparently equipped by the lowest bidder. Much of the struggling colony's equipment was either failing or simply inadequate to its task, the settlement well on its way down a slide towards oblivion. Believing the landing craft to be a rescue mission from Earth, the colonists welcomed the renegades with open arms and, sensing opporunity, they did nothing to shake that faith in those who would soon become their subjects.
Their knowledge of genetics and the equipment they'd brought with them soon proved the salvation of the formerly-doomed world, modifying human crops to flourish in alien soil, plants to strain toxins from the air, and vicious guard-beasts to ward the settlement against a hostile environment. Their new wards rewarded their saviors with the rule of the planet, which they shortly re-christened Genos. The new ruling class of the previously-unnamed world, and their descendents, moved to strengthen their control over the populace, wokring quietly behind the scenes, testing, tweaking, each new generation more easily directed than the last, less capable of challening their authority of those who came to call themselves the Conclave of Genos.
By the time contact was re-established by a survey mission, Genos was peopled by two classes, nearly different species entirely. The Superior, who made up the Conclave itself, were each enhanced in a different way, each lovingly crafted by an individual forebear, each shaped to the whims and ideas of he or she who the new Superior was destined to replace. The Superior had only one facet truly in common with each other, and that was an un-altered mind, free, powerful, ambitious, and fully human. The Pure, by contrast, are called the Cattle by the Superior in private, for very good reason. They are shaped according to task, each generation altered to be better, more optimized for their purpose. As with the Superior, the only factor uniting the Pure is their brains. While they are often required for skilled labor, even original or tactical thought, they are engineered to be docile and easily-led, much of the capacity for independent thought forcibly bred out of the gene pool.
The Conclave's space industry is crude at best, as its original founders had little experience in that area, but they do possess some limitted asteroid mining operations and a crude shipyard in orbit of Genos itself. System defenses are equally weak, made up mainly of thermonuclear minefields and crude chemical-propelled kinetic weapons and missiles for lack of a superior technological base to develop from. The current generation of Superior, however, having witnessed the capabilities of even the relatively unimpressive survey vessel that rediscovered their world, are eager to obtain new technologies from the rest of human civilization, in any way possible.
Chronological Incontinence: Time warps around the poster. The thread topic winks out of existence and reappears in 1d10 posts.
Out of Context Theatre, this week starring Darth Nostril.
-'If you really want to fuck with these idiots tell them that there is a vaccine for chemtrails.'
Hmm...why not let them create genetically normal people to infiltrate the ranks of foreign nations. Maybe tweak a bit to make them intelligent, let them work in the sciences of the other nations and send technology and information back to the Fatherland. This won't be a quick process, this will be slow, gradual. Infiltrate other nations, have children grow in those nations and be educated in their sciences, go to universities and then join companies or join political parties and excell with their superior genes which give them excellent minds or faces (for charisma). They can wait, let it be decades, let it be centuries, who the hell cares? The Superiors can live for hundreds of years. They will infiltrate the heathens, weave lies and conflicts and everything and after a century of working in the shadows, Genos has developed a respectable military. And since that survey ship probably arrived early in interstellar history, I guess the Nazis have been infiltrating for scores of decades and by now, they do have a respectable military.
"DO YOU WORSHIP HOMOSEXUALS?" - Curtis Saxton (source) shroom is a lovely boy and i wont hear a bad word against him - LUSY-CHAN! Shit! Man, I didn't think of that! It took Shroom to properly interpret the screams of dying people - PeZook Shroom, I read out the stuff you write about us. You are an endless supply of morale down here. :p - an OWS street medic Pink Sugar Heart Attack!
Genos sounds good, but make sure their genetic engineering doesn't make them super-powerful gods.
And Toker, your enclave sounds good, but I have trouble with "Aryan" and "Soviet" in the names. A racial supremist group is fine, as is a militant socialist one. I just think those names wouldn't carry over and kinda undermine what you want to do. Plus, Soviets really don't build nations so much as co-opt.
Stuart: The only problem is, I'm losing track of which universe I'm in.
You kinda look like Jesus. With a lightsaber.- Peregrin Toker
CaptainChewbacca wrote:And Toker, your enclave sounds good, but I have trouble with "Aryan" and "Soviet" in the names. A racial supremist group is fine, as is a militant socialist one. I just think those names wouldn't carry over and kinda undermine what you want to do. Plus, Soviets really don't build nations so much as co-opt.
Okay, the Interstellar Union of Soviet Republics could be given another name - such as the Socialist Republic of Lyra.
But the Aryan Star Empire? Considering that there today is a white seperatist organization called the Aryan Nations, it's not that unlikely. (though the white supremacists could just be called "The Enclave"... very ominous)
"Hi there, would you like to have a cookie?"
"No, actually I would HATE to have a cookie, you vapid waste of inedible flesh!"
The depopulation of Africa due to AIDS could be a driving force for drone mining.Remotely operated machines do the mining no humn intervention needed save for maitananace.
Brotherhood of the Bear Monkey Clonemaster , Anti Care Bears League,
Bureaucrat and BOFH of the HAB,
Skunk Works director of the Mecha Maniacs,
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CaptainChewbacca wrote:You and I are fast-approaching the same end, but I think you should reread my post. I mean, how is your "Arab League" different than the "Caliphate" previously suggested?
It includes only the nations between Morocco and Iraq, inclusive--basically the Arab nations. Turkey and Iran are left out because they are too different from the Arab states, the Iranians being Shiites and cultural separate, and the Turks being very European in their outlook. Pakistan has ties, but it's cut off on the other side of Iran.
Also, it's more of a ethnic nationalist arrangement than a theocracy, though it contains theocratic elements.
Also, your arangement leaves out Africa almost entirely.
Just south of the Sahara. I think that, in our history, we could have the AIDS epidemic lead to a massive population decline and quarantine of SubSaharan Africa. The economy would completely die, national boundaries would fall apart, and the survivors would drown in bloody and pointless wars, perhaps even involving nuclear weapons. After the AIDS cure, the population situation would turn around, but it would still be a region of warring states.
I think we might have a little beacon of stability centered around South Africa (though it might be interesting to include in our history a near-total emigration of Afrikaaners to the EU and USNA). But, otherwise, SubSaharan Africa is rather poor in resources, and the power blocs write it off and not worth the trouble.
"I am gravely disappointed. Again you have made me unleash my dogs of war."
--The Lord Humungus
We could combine the Genos with the Nazis. People obsessed with creating the perfect and purest human being. No?
Maybe instead of real Nazis, we could have genetic...artists (lack of a better term)!
"DO YOU WORSHIP HOMOSEXUALS?" - Curtis Saxton (source) shroom is a lovely boy and i wont hear a bad word against him - LUSY-CHAN! Shit! Man, I didn't think of that! It took Shroom to properly interpret the screams of dying people - PeZook Shroom, I read out the stuff you write about us. You are an endless supply of morale down here. :p - an OWS street medic Pink Sugar Heart Attack!
Here's an interesting idea- during the course of the story, an Alexander the Great/Oda Nobunaga-type figure could rise in southern Africa, who would be starting to end the African Warring States period through the expedient method of using superior tactics and genious leadership to conquer and unite the fractured tribes. Imagine the dynamic- a lone figure whose cult of personality could begin bringing Africa back into the modern world, who might become the target of foreign forces, such as the Caliphate, with no interest in seeing a united and strong sub-saharan Africa... Perhaps make him or her come from Zimbabwe, a man who remembers the glory days back when the nation was just beginning to pull itself out of the morass.
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
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Besides telepathy and more accurate drives they arent 'supermen'. Thats why they were persecuted and thrown off Earth, cause people feared their telepathy but knew they could be easily killed like any normal human. The Earth Gov feared them because you cant lie to them, and they though that absolute truth would be dangerous, so they threw them out. All Psionics, i figured, are outlawed in Earthspace, hunted and killed. So the Psion Confed is like a safe haven for Psionics from all the colonies, who are an oppressed minority (cant own property, cant own a gun, cant book passage on a ship, they have to stow away or hijack one or pay a smuggler, forced to live in squalled 'reservations'), a place they can survive and live like a human being with others like them...IF you can reach it (think Psionics crossing the Berlin wall in space, darting past Earther patrol cruisers to try and make it across the 'border' region).
Anywho, they're like low-level Betazoids with some advances in FTL navigation. But they would hardly pose a threat if it werent for those few centuries they had a chance to build up a military.
I can understand lower the number of plnaets though, but i dont think they vastly outstrip the other nations by virtue of the fact they can read minds and have more accurate drives. No pyros, no TK, no mind control or any of that. Just to down grade it though, lets say they have to be within twenty feet of you to read your mind
Thirdfain wrote:Here's an interesting idea- during the course of the story, an Alexander the Great/Oda Nobunaga-type figure could rise in southern Africa, who would be starting to end the African Warring States period through the expedient method of using superior tactics and genious leadership to conquer and unite the fractured tribes. Imagine the dynamic- a lone figure whose cult of personality could begin bringing Africa back into the modern world, who might become the target of foreign forces, such as the Caliphate, with no interest in seeing a united and strong sub-saharan Africa... Perhaps make him or her come from Zimbabwe, a man who remembers the glory days back when the nation was just beginning to pull itself out of the morass.
I like that idea, actually (particularly the bit about Zimbabwe). For some reason, it reminds me of Haile Selassie. (sp?)
Couldn't our African-equivalent-of-Alexander also round up all the AIDS-infected and kill them? Considering the damage that particular disease has caused down there, I'm sure there'd be a fair deal of Africans who seriously would support such an idea if it's the only way out...
"Hi there, would you like to have a cookie?"
"No, actually I would HATE to have a cookie, you vapid waste of inedible flesh!"
Yes, but most names carry with them a description, as you demonstrate here...
But ... it's so commonplace, I mean ... but in sci-fi, it's like .... ARGH. Damn you, twentieth century
18-Till-I-Die wrote:Besides telepathy and more accurate drives they arent 'supermen'. Thats why they were persecuted and thrown off Earth, cause people feared their telepathy but knew they could be easily killed like any normal human. The Earth Gov feared them because you cant lie to them, and they though that absolute truth would be dangerous, so they threw them out. All Psionics, i figured, are outlawed in Earthspace, hunted and killed. So the Psion Confed is like a safe haven for Psionics from all the colonies, who are an oppressed minority (cant own property, cant own a gun, cant book passage on a ship, they have to stow away or hijack one or pay a smuggler, forced to live in squalled 'reservations'), a place they can survive and live like a human being with others like them...IF you can reach it (think Psionics crossing the Berlin wall in space, darting past Earther patrol cruisers to try and make it across the 'border' region).
Psychic-Israel in space?
That's the wrong way to tickle Mary, that's the wrong way to kiss!
Don't you know that, over here lad, they like it best like this!
Hooray, pour les français! Farewell, Angleterre!
We didn't know how to tickle Mary, but we learnt how, over there!
Thirdfain had a very good idea. The AIDS and an African quarantine have left a power-vaccuum in sub-saharan Africa (the north is in the hands of the EU and Arabs.
The biggest "war" going on earth right now is between our charismatic African (Shaka Sellasnie?) and his nations against South Africa. Whichever wins will fast become the dominant power on the continent. Outside powers are mostly staying out of it as part of mutual agreement, but many nations are field-testing weapons in Africa or are sending tacit support. There have even been rumors of Signan mercenaries appearing on the battlefields of Botswana.
Battlefield: Africa. I like it.
Shroom, Genos + Space Nazis = Good idea. Persuing ultimate human form is always a noble goal.
18, I can't imagine all humans would so universally persecute the psions. At least their intelligence services would recognize the potential benefits. I'd imagine attempts at capture and enslaving would be more common than extermination. Rumor and superstition would likely keep "normals" away from them. I'd say humans would be content with a "not in my neighborhood" attitude.
Oh, and in Space you can't patrol "borders" realistically. Only star systems.
Stuart: The only problem is, I'm losing track of which universe I'm in.
You kinda look like Jesus. With a lightsaber.- Peregrin Toker
BTW, I think the boundaries of earth nations and its power-blocs are pretty well established now. Thanks to Pablo and others for disagreeing with me. Dissent brooks compromise.
Stuart: The only problem is, I'm losing track of which universe I'm in.
You kinda look like Jesus. With a lightsaber.- Peregrin Toker
more ground tech Camoflage has changed radicaly all vehicles utilise stealth and emission cloaking to one extent or another. optic camoflage on vehicles is thrugh the use of liquid crystal skin. A computer controlls the patterns and schemes allowing the vehice to blend in at worst it just gves a better paint job at best think Predator camoflage.
Brotherhood of the Bear Monkey Clonemaster , Anti Care Bears League,
Bureaucrat and BOFH of the HAB,
Skunk Works director of the Mecha Maniacs,
Black Mage,
CaptainChewbacca wrote:Shroom, Genos + Space Nazis = Good idea. Persuing ultimate human form is always a noble goal.
Don't forget the conspiracy!
Plus maybe the Superiors could create their own religion to enslave the worker caste guys.
Oh, and in Space you can't patrol "borders" realistically. Only star systems.
Monitoring stations/planetoids would be nice.
@ Typhonis:
Imagine uber chameleonic paint-jobs
"DO YOU WORSHIP HOMOSEXUALS?" - Curtis Saxton (source) shroom is a lovely boy and i wont hear a bad word against him - LUSY-CHAN! Shit! Man, I didn't think of that! It took Shroom to properly interpret the screams of dying people - PeZook Shroom, I read out the stuff you write about us. You are an endless supply of morale down here. :p - an OWS street medic Pink Sugar Heart Attack!
And if AIDS becomes as bad as predictions make it out to be, then I can see an international quarantine agreement being enforced. In spite of the resources. You could have 'black' operations designed to clandestinely mine Africa, regardless of the risks, and some sort of international crackdown against it. SA might be seen as the few 'safe' areas to be in, compared with the rest of the continent.
"
- PeZook
