What does the future hold for the US?

BlkbrryTheGreat · Post by **BlkbrryTheGreat** » 2004-06-01 01:01pm

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2004-06-01 01:24pm

That's an interesting article and having just read one on China proposing it's own industry standards instead of following international ones, it seems to be based in reality. The Chinese nation and the EU along with India are certainly not sitting down here and letting the US get another headstart. This incredible debt the US has and the spending increases and foreign incursions are going to take their toll someday, but as with any economy, predicting it is like weather forecasting.

LordShaithis · Post by **LordShaithis** » 2004-06-01 04:06pm

George W. Bush and Alan Greenspan are the dynamic men history needs. They are the men for their time. America needs to be taken down a notch, and they are just the men to do it.

I call bias.

Anyway, I hope the People's Republic of Running College Students Over with Tanks does get to be the next to run the world. It'll be fun to watch these whiny fucking Europeans long for the days when the worst thing going was mean old America beating on Saddam.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-06-01 04:20pm

I very much doubt China or the EU is destined for Great and Powerful Things, but if America keeps electing the goddamn neocons then we'll have to pull an Aurelian to stay on top.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2004-06-01 04:23pm

We don't have to worry about the future. The Rapture will happen soon and it won't matter anyway. Duh.

Boyish-Tigerlilly · Post by **Boyish-Tigerlilly** » 2004-06-01 04:53pm

No nation has lasted on top forever, and I doubt the United States will be that power to break the trend. Someone bigger, badder, and better always comes along to knock you off due to internal corruption, disease, or foreign politcal chaos.

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2004-06-01 04:54pm

HemlockGrey wrote:I very much doubt China or the EU is destined for Great and Powerful Things, but if America keeps electing the goddamn neocons then we'll have to pull an Aurelian to stay on top.

Actually, I think China may become the next Hegemon ... eventually. The US is not going to be on top forever.

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2004-06-01 05:16pm

phongn wrote: Actually, I think China may become the next Hegemon ... eventually. The US is not going to be on top forever.

I tend to see the West uniting in the long term to prevent just that, the EU will play footsy with China due to US diplomatic ineptness but once China gains sufficiently in power to begin asserting itself the EU will form a new understanding with the US. The EU and the US shouldn't have any great problem holding China in check (even assuming that China doesn't fall to internal problems) and will eventually be forced together by a common sense of being the West.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-06-01 05:21pm

So what happens to the rest of Asian countries in the region if China becomes a hegemon? Some would side with the West and probably be seen as black sheep in the region for it, others with China.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-06-01 07:13pm

China needs to figure out a way to continue her economic expansion without triggering stuff like enormous peasant uprisings or trapping half the population in the crushing vice of inescapable poverty.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-06-01 07:24pm

HemlockGrey wrote:China needs to figure out a way to continue her economic expansion without triggering stuff like enormous peasant uprisings or trapping half the population in the crushing vice of inescapable poverty.

May I suggest widespread atomic warfare out of the 1950s

Icehawk · Post by **Icehawk** » 2004-06-01 07:29pm

HemlockGrey wrote:China needs to figure out a way to continue her economic expansion without triggering stuff like enormous peasant uprisings or trapping half the population in the crushing vice of inescapable poverty.

Is it just me or does anyone else find it amusing and ironic that a self proclaimed communist country could be threatened with PEASANT uprisings?

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2004-06-01 10:07pm

HemlockGrey wrote:China needs to figure out a way to continue her economic expansion without triggering stuff like enormous peasant uprisings or trapping half the population in the crushing vice of inescapable poverty.

Not to mention it's simple population and demograpghic problems. The One Child policiy is supposed to be playing merry hell with both.

PrinceofLowLight · Post by **PrinceofLowLight** » 2004-06-01 11:28pm

See, thing is, now we're the lone superpower. We've got the highest point of power with no real threats for at least another decade. But sad as it may be, Hegemon status don't last. Now that's a hard motherfuckin' fact of life, but it's one we're going to have to start getting realistic about. History is full of unrealistic leaders who thought their countries would just age like wine and figured they'd only get more powerful.

We certainly came close to being the actual power to completely dominate the civilized world, but we never made it. And if we were gonna make it, we would have made it by now.

/Marsellus Wallace off

Anyway, competition is good. Multilaterism is more interesting than bipolarism anyway.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2004-06-02 12:53am

GrandAdmiralPrawn wrote:Anyway, I hope the People's Republic of Running College Students Over with Tanks does get to be the next to run the world. It'll be fun to watch these whiny fucking Europeans long for the days when the worst thing going was mean old America beating on Saddam.

What the fuck are you talking about? When has China ever demonstrated an interference policy of anything remotely close to what the US has at any point in its history, ever?

And what are the EU and China going to 'clash' on anyway? Or was this some clever attempt to stick to those 'euros' with a snide side swipe (say that seven times real fast)?

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2004-06-02 01:33am

Gee, I dunno, the way China invaded and conquered and continues to hold nations like Tibet, and then claimed they were "taking back old territory" or some shit like that. Sounds like pretty extreme interference to me.

I think China's going to expand so fast they pop their bubble.

We don't have to worry about the future. The Rapture will happen soon and it won't matter anyway. Duh.

Ah, a vet from the Reagan administration.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2004-06-02 01:35am

EDIT: I don't mean that China's going to expand their borders too fast, I mean they're going to expand their economy too fast.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2004-06-02 01:49am

Uraniun235 wrote:Ah, a vet from the Reagan administration.

I was hoping someone would get that.

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2004-06-02 02:17am

HemlockGrey wrote:I very much doubt China or the EU is destined for Great and Powerful Things, but if America keeps electing the goddamn neocons then we'll have to pull an Aurelian to stay on top.

The US is not going to be a superpower forever. Like all great powers Americas time as a superpower will end eventualy. When that happen some other country will replace America as the worlds next super power. Currently the EU and China are doing great and rising in power so it is possible that they will replace America as the superpower in the long run.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2004-06-02 03:49am

Uraniun235 wrote:Gee, I dunno, the way China invaded and conquered and continues to hold nations like Tibet, and then claimed they were "taking back old territory" or some shit like that. Sounds like pretty extreme interference to me.

Well, it was old territory under the Qing Dynasty. Irregardless, the fact remains that China has already taken on more than she can chew, and territorial expansion isn't going to happen anytime in the next few decades.

I think China's going to expand so fast they pop their bubble.

I be more worried over environmental, social and even food problems than a hard landing. Sure, the economy may crash, but the sheer bulk of china populace coming to the modern age will drag her out of the recession in a few years. But the pollution, desertification, lack of water for both drinking and industrial purposes, social unrest, all these are what will sink China.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2004-06-02 03:58am

Joe wrote:So what happens to the rest of Asian countries in the region if China becomes a hegemon? Some would side with the West and probably be seen as black sheep in the region for it, others with China.

Side with who? Let's see something here.

Japan, South Korea and Thailand are American allies.
Other countries friendly to America range from the Phillipines, Singapore, Taiwan,..........yeah, I think that's about it minus the Micronesian islands.

All of the above, save for Taiwan has already re-oriented themselves to china. And Taiwan economy is already interlinked with the Mainland, with only hardcore nationalism standing behind any further attempts to side with China.

Oddity · Post by **Oddity** » 2004-06-02 04:09am

evilcat4000 wrote:
HemlockGrey wrote:I very much doubt China or the EU is destined for Great and Powerful Things, but if America keeps electing the goddamn neocons then we'll have to pull an Aurelian to stay on top.
The US is not going to be a superpower forever. Like all great powers Americas time as a superpower will end eventualy. When that happen some other country will replace America as the worlds next super power. Currently the EU and China are doing great and rising in power so it is possible that they will replace America as the superpower in the long run.

A new cold war, you think?

Anhaga · Post by **Anhaga** » 2004-06-02 04:21am

HemlockGrey wrote:China needs to figure out a way to continue her economic expansion without triggering stuff like enormous peasant uprisings or trapping half the population in the crushing vice of inescapable poverty.

Don't worry- it's the dynastic cycle carrying on in a slightly modified form.

LordShaithis · Post by **LordShaithis** » 2004-06-02 09:07am

Crown wrote:What the fuck are you talking about? When has China ever demonstrated an interference policy of anything remotely close to what the US has at any point in its history, ever?

And what are the EU and China going to 'clash' on anyway? Or was this some clever attempt to stick to those 'euros' with a snide side swipe (say that seven times real fast)?

Let China develop more and more really important external economic interests. Let them become even more hungry for natural resources. Let them build a real navy. Japan used to be one of those "ignore everything outside our borders" nations too, you know.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-06-02 09:51am

evilcat4000 wrote:The US is not going to be a superpower forever. Like all great powers Americas time as a superpower will end eventualy.

That'd be a damn interesting trick considering we've got 270~m population, first world status, one of the most wired economies,
produce 1 shitload of cars a year, and have most of an entire
continent to develop and exploit. Oh yeah, and we have the Bomb.

Lots of them. In fact, several dozen thousand of 'em.

The only way we'll ever lose superpower status is if something
real catastrophic ever happens to this country, and I mean
wrath of God kind of catastrophe.