Evolution of America's attitude toward sex and "indecen

[Durandal]

Okay, so Congress has just approved massive fines for completely benign "offenses" like showing tits or swearing on TV. I have to wonder, will America ever grow out of this ridiculous, sexually repressive and prudish attitude? I'd like to think that my generation is more sexually liberal and comfortable than the current one, but I'm sure that the baby-boomers said the same thing. They were all about free love and all that, yet despite the baby-boomers with their sexually liberal attitudes becoming a prevalent influence today, the American government is still uptight about sex.

Why is this? It's my personal belief that, despite the public's attitudes toward such things, the same kinds of people are still the ones voting on the laws. Crusty, old white Christians who like to prattle on about "family values," which basically translate to "don't ever talk show sex on TV." So what's going on here? Are we doomed to have the same types of people voted into Congress?

[Alyrium Denryle]

Old people are the ones voting. Old people who actually did grow up with "family values" and a sexually repressive society. They are nostalgic, so try to return to "the good old days"

[Stormbringer]

Why is this? It's my personal belief that, despite the public's attitudes toward such things, the same kinds of people are still the ones voting on the laws. Crusty, old white Christians who like to prattle on about "family values," which basically translate to "don't ever talk show sex on TV." So what's going on here? Are we doomed to have the same types of people voted into Congress?

Unless people on both sides of the aisle grow brains and stop the soccer mom crap then yes we will be doomed. Might I remind you that it's not just the "crusty, old white* Christians who like to pratte on about 'family values'" who did this, it was as damn near every last Congressman and Congresswoman out there.


*PS: I really do wonder what the hell a person's race has to do with any of that. Unless of course you mean to suggest that being white makes some one more likely to want to repress free speech.

[Joe]

Like Aly said, mostly old people.

[Durandal]

Why is this? It's my personal belief that, despite the public's attitudes toward such things, the same kinds of people are still the ones voting on the laws. Crusty, old white Christians who like to prattle on about "family values," which basically translate to "don't ever talk show sex on TV." So what's going on here? Are we doomed to have the same types of people voted into Congress?

Unless people on both sides of the aisle grow brains and stop the soccer mom crap then yes we will be doomed. Might I remind you that it's not just the "crusty, old white* Christians who like to pratte on about 'family values'" who did this, it was as damn near every last Congressman and Congresswoman out there.


*PS: I really do wonder what the hell a person's race has to do with any of that. Unless of course you mean to suggest that being white makes some one more likely to want to repress free speech.

Are those not mostly the people who have been in Congress for the past 50 years? Crusty, old white guys?

[Stormbringer]

Are those not mostly the people who have been in Congress for the past 50 years? Crusty, old white guys?

Yes, but again I'm still wondering why it is that race and now sex have anything to do with it.

And might I point out that damn near everyone in Congress voted for it.

[Durandal]

Are those not mostly the people who have been in Congress for the past 50 years? Crusty, old white guys?

Yes, but again I'm still wondering why it is that race and now sex have anything to do with it.

Those have been the people making the laws so far, so I asked if we were doomed to keep electing those same people. I was being mostly facetious in my characterization, so I'm sorry if you got the wrong impression.

And might I point out that damn near everyone in Congress voted for it.

It was a tack-on, though. Not necessarily indicative of the opinions of individual Congressmen. Though it certainly doesn't speak well of them.

[Stormbringer]

Are those not mostly the people who have been in Congress for the past 50 years? Crusty, old white guys?

Yes, but again I'm still wondering why it is that race and now sex have anything to do with it.

Those have been the people making the laws so far, so I asked if we were doomed to keep electing those same people. I was being mostly facetious in my characterization, so I'm sorry if you got the wrong impression.

Well, I got the wrong impression indeed.

And might I point out that damn near everyone in Congress voted for it.

It was a tack-on, though. Not necessarily indicative of the opinions of individual Congressmen. Though it certainly doesn't speak well of them.

However, if there was any real opposition to it then it wouldn't have passed with as close to a unanimous vote as I've ever heard of on a substantial peace of legislature. So I would honestly have to say that it's an issue that is related to all of Congress. And dare I say it, it's something that's an isssue with a majority of America (or at least a very active minority).

All I've got say is Soccer Mom's strike again.

[Darth Wong]

Is there seriously any mystery about who's responsible for this ridiculous state of affairs? It's Christianity, plain and simple. The more devoutly Christian any given region is, the more sexually repressive it is. Period. This correlation is at least as strong as any you'll ever find in any form of sociology.

Of course, there are other religions which do this as well (Islam comes to mind), but in America, the culprit is Christianity, without a doubt. I don't even know why this question needs to be asked. The answer is as obvious as the nose on your face.

[Darth Wong]

All I've got say is Soccer Mom's strike again.

Oddly enough, Canada has just as many soccer moms as the US, yet we allow nudity and foul language on TV. What we don't have is your country's intense religiosity. Care to reconsider your annoying endless-bullshit claim where you invariably tie everything to "soccer moms" without a shred of evidence or reasoning?

[Stormbringer]

All I've got say is Soccer Mom's strike again.

Oddly enough, Canada has just as many soccer moms as the US, yet we allow nudity and foul language on TV. What we don't have is your country's intense religiosity. Care to reconsider your annoying endless-bullshit claim where you invariably tie everything to "soccer moms" without a shred of evidence or reasoning?

Maybe the fact that they were among the groups whining loudest and hardest? I agree with you that it was probably based on Christian family values, however the vast majority of Americans are Christian and support for this is decidely mixed.

[Darth Wong]

All I've got say is Soccer Mom's strike again.

Oddly enough, Canada has just as many soccer moms as the US, yet we allow nudity and foul language on TV. What we don't have is your country's intense religiosity. Care to reconsider your annoying endless-bullshit claim where you invariably tie everything to "soccer moms" without a shred of evidence or reasoning?

Maybe the fact that they were among the groups whining loudest and hardest?

Oh really? All the soccer moms got together and had a poll? You have evidence showing this? Present it now, because I'm sick and tired of your endless attempts to deflect painfully obvious correlations to Christianity onto soccer moms.

[Darth Wong]

I agree with you that it was probably based on Christian family values, however the vast majority of Americans are Christian and support for this is decidely mixed.

No, support for this is DIRECTLY CORRELATED to the intensity of religious faith. Not every Christian is equally devout.

I presented a piece of evidence to disprove your bullshit (the soccer moms in Canada) and you totally ignored it.

[Stormbringer]

The Soccer Moms probably are Christian (or some equally uptight religion). But then again so is most of American and support for this is hardly universal.

[Darth Wong]

The Soccer Moms probably are Christian (or some equally uptight religion). But then again so is most of American and support for this is hardly universal.

See above. Do you have a fucking reading problem? For the THIRD FUCKING TIME, explain the soccer moms in Canada then. And answer my point on religious intensity.

[Alyrium Denryle]

maybe you should use the "GOP christian soccer moms" instead of your standard soccer moms.

[Stormbringer]

The Soccer Moms probably are Christian (or some equally uptight religion). But then again so is most of American and support for this is hardly universal.

See above. Do you have a fucking reading problem? For the THIRD FUCKING TIME, explain the soccer moms in Canada then. And answer my point on religious intensity.

Candian Soccer Mom probably aren't as religious nor in all likelyhood as politically active.

[Stormbringer]

maybe you should use the "GOP christian soccer moms" instead of your standard soccer moms.

Because frankly it's not just conservative or even the far religious right that's been pushed it.

[Darth Wong]

See above. Do you have a fucking reading problem? For the THIRD FUCKING TIME, explain the soccer moms in Canada then. And answer my point on religious intensity.

Candian Soccer Mom probably aren't as religious nor in all likelyhood as politically active.

Then you admit that the problem isn't the soccer moms. It is THE RELIGION, thus making your endless attempts to tie this to "soccer moms" utterly fallacious.

As for Canadian soccer moms not being politically active, that's ridiculous. They are a huge political influence in our elections, and I would prefer that you go from fact to conclusion rather than making up facts to suit your conclusions.

[Darth Wong]

maybe you should use the "GOP christian soccer moms" instead of your standard soccer moms.

Because frankly it's not just conservative or even the far religious right that's been pushed it.

Evidence? Or are you going to assume that Democrats are all atheists?

[Stormbringer]

maybe you should use the "GOP christian soccer moms" instead of your standard soccer moms.

Because frankly it's not just conservative or even the far religious right that's been pushed it.

Evidence? Or are you going to assume that Democrats are all atheists?

Given that only one senator (who actually might be Republican) and only 22 Congressmen voted against it, I'd say that's proof that it was non-partisan. And of course there's the fact that one of the biggest witch hunts of this type prior to the current one was actually lead by a Democratic Senator's wife, Tipper Gore. I'd say that's ample evidence that it's not just an issue of the religious right.

[Darth Wong]

Because frankly it's not just conservative or even the far religious right that's been pushed it.

Evidence? Or are you going to assume that Democrats are all atheists?

Given that only one senator (who actually might be Republican) and only 22 Congressmen voted against it, I'd say that's proof that it was non-partisan. And of course there's the fact that one of the biggest witch hunts of this type prior to the current one was actually lead by a Democratic Senator's wife, Tipper Gore. I'd say that's ample evidence that it's not just an issue of the religious right.

Wow, you just did precisely what I predicted you would do. You assumed that "bipartisan" means "not related to Christianity", as if all Democrats are atheists.

[Stormbringer]

Wow, you just did precisely what I predicted you would do. You assumed that "bipartisan" means "not related to Christianity", as if all Democrats are atheists.

Uh, Mike, I've said that it's probably related to Christianity, just that it was not confined to the religious right.

[Darth Wong]

Wow, you just did precisely what I predicted you would do. You assumed that "bipartisan" means "not related to Christianity", as if all Democrats are atheists.

Uh, Mike, I've said that it's probably related to Christianity, just that it was not confined to the religious right.

Uh no, you said that it was soccer moms. Then you conceded it might be religious soccer moms. At some point, you will either concede that it is the religion itself or your head will explode from the self-contradiction, because you then tried to use Tipper Gore (a SOUTHERN BAPTIST) as proof that it's not about religion. Now, you're just hoping I won't notice if you distort my argument from "Christianity" to "Republican Christians", as if extremist Christians can only be found in the Republican party.

"Soccer moms" is a red-herring. It's all about Christianity. This is not complicated.

[Stormbringer]

Frankly, it's doesn't boil down to Christians vs everyone else. Because there are plenty of more moderate christians that don't want to see this kind of censorship for the sake of lazy parents.