Evil Star Trek: Better?

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2004-07-01 01:51pm

I was just pondering about the alternate universe with the Evil Federation... would their lack of sissy morals make them a bit more dangerous in versus threads, compared to the "normal" ST?

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-07-01 01:56pm

DPDarkPrimus wrote:I was just pondering about the alternate universe with the Evil Federation... would their lack of sissy morals make them a bit more dangerous in versus threads, compared to the "normal" ST?

Only marginally. They're still much too small to go toe to toe with the Empire (or even the Corporate Sector Authority), and there's only so much you can do when the enemy can park a warship in orbit over your homeworld in one hour and tell you to surrender or kiss 6 billion people on your capital world goodbye. Especially when one of those 6 billion people is going to be the Federation Emperor (I'm assuming the mirror-universe Terran Empire had an Emperor).

The Terran Empire would probably become another small fiefdom in the Empire, ruled by a local governor who may or may not permit the old Emperor to remain in some kind of official position.

Crazedwraith · Post by **Crazedwraith** » 2004-07-01 04:23pm

Morals or lack thereof, matters little when your outnumbered, outgunned and outrun by several orders of magnitude.

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2004-07-01 04:28pm

I don't see how morality affects competence. I mean. . .just look at the klingons.

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2004-07-02 01:15am

Even though they are evil and lot more militirized the other Federation still loses. They dont have the shielding technology or weapons to fight Imperial Star Destroyers.

Saint Marcus · Post by **Saint Marcus** » 2004-07-02 04:41am

The Terran Empire turned "good" thanks to Spock, and was subsequently defeated by the Klingon's and their posse. In DS9 days, little to nothing remained of it.

jegs2 · Post by **jegs2** » 2004-07-02 02:21pm

Saint Marcus wrote:The Terran Empire turned "good" thanks to Spock, and was subsequently defeated by the Klingon's and their posse. In DS9 days, little to nothing remained of it.

A real shame too, but thanks to fanfic writers like Happy Target we have an alternate timeline wherein the alternate Spock is arrested for treason and the Terran Empire becomes vast and powerful, laying waste to races like the vaulted Borg.

Crazedwraith · Post by **Crazedwraith** » 2004-07-02 05:25pm

Saint Marcus wrote:The Terran Empire turned "good" thanks to Spock, and was subsequently defeated by the Klingon's and their posse. In DS9 days, little to nothing remained of it.

And? but? so? Therefore?

Thtas all perfectly true but not entirely relevant, my friend.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2004-07-02 08:00pm

The mirror universe had FAR fewer ships than the UFP, although it had more than enough captains.

However, they would fare no better. Despite their willingness to go medieval on their enemies, the lack of starships and firepower would cost them dearly.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2004-07-03 12:45am

The Mirror Universe has one weapon that the Empire is unprepared for:

The Intendant!

She's a walking biological weapon! what with all the STD's she's contracted over the years...

Solauren · Post by **Solauren** » 2004-07-04 12:51am

If we are talking a Evil TNG level Federation, they'd make the Empire pay for each system they took.

'You want to take a planet? Fine. Unlike our sissy mirror counterparts, we never stopped making Genesis devices. We now use them as planetary-destruct weapons"

or maybe one of the Super-nova esque "weapons" we've seen. (i.e Trillithim weapons, Protomatter weapons, and you know damn well Pichard would have kept that Supernova weapon he found when he meet Vash), or use biological weapons on any planet the Empire was about to take.

They wouldn't do any better, but they'd give the Empire a really annoying, if not damn right hard, time.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2004-07-04 08:06am

Solauren wrote:'You want to take a planet? Fine. Unlike our sissy mirror counterparts, we never stopped making Genesis devices.

Because in our universe Kahn Noonian Singh didn't slaughter the scientific team who built it.

Solauren · Post by **Solauren** » 2004-07-04 09:54am

That's actually arguable.

I mean, consider. For a Evil Federation, would YOU not make that a top level military priority?

Hell, if an Evil Federation commander/Kirk had found Kahn, he'd either be a high level member of the Federation, or executed.

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2004-07-04 10:05am

Super nova torpedos I could see...but the Genesis Device was first the intention of a helpful device, then a weapon.

There just are easier ways to make a better planet killer then a reformatter.

So the MU Feddies may never really have thought along those lines.

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2004-07-04 11:50am

I can easily see the Terran Empire attempting to build Genesis, and for its original purpose. Instant terraformation could give the Empire an indefnite lease on life as it always has places to dump excess population. And unlike the Federation, they're not going to have any moral qualms about the existence of a device that can completely destroy an existing biosphere.

However, once the realize the damn thing doesn't work, they may abandon it. There are, as GR said, more efficient ways to kill everybody on a planet.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2004-07-04 01:03pm

Solauren wrote:Hell, if an Evil Federation commander/Kirk had found Kahn, he'd either be a high level member of the Federation, or executed.

I agree that Kahn would have quickly come to dominate the Terran Empire actually, given the chance.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2004-07-05 03:16pm

Would the Genesis device be able to "fix" a planet that had been BDZed?

Solauren · Post by **Solauren** » 2004-07-05 04:27pm

It's too unpredicatable. Mind you, you'd really have nothing to lose.

Slartibartfast · Post by **Slartibartfast** » 2004-07-05 05:02pm

We already know what the Genesis device does

Alpha-Zero · Post by **Alpha-Zero** » 2004-07-08 12:39am

Here's one that might add a challenge to the Empire. For a bit at least...

Both universes working together. Find a way to open a doorway into the normal Trek universe(done in Shatner's novels, but no where else I've seen) and you have double, maybe even triple the forces coming at the Imperials.

And if the Empire got hold of Genesis, they'd start taking out planets with it. And since the device took a nebula and made not only a planet, but possibly a sun(I didn't see one in the nebula as they were taking pot shots at each other, but there could have been one), I'd guess it could fix just about anything done to a planet...

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2004-07-08 01:06pm

Alpha-Zero wrote:Here's one that might add a challenge to the Empire. For a bit at least...

Both universes working together. Find a way to open a doorway into the normal Trek universe(done in Shatner's novels, but no where else I've seen) and you have double, maybe even triple the forces coming at the Imperials.

And if the Empire got hold of Genesis, they'd start taking out planets with it. And since the device took a nebula and made not only a planet, but possibly a sun(I didn't see one in the nebula as they were taking pot shots at each other, but there could have been one), I'd guess it could fix just about anything done to a planet...

Sorry to burst your bubble, but if you actually read Shatners books, non-canon though they may be, Tiberius couldn't actually transfer ships between universes, no transporter could be built big enough to transport an entire ship.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2004-07-08 02:04pm

Alpha-Zero wrote:And if the Empire got hold of Genesis, they'd start taking out planets with it. And since the device took a nebula and made not only a planet, but possibly a sun(I didn't see one in the nebula as they were taking pot shots at each other, but there could have been one), I'd guess it could fix just about anything done to a planet...

Think for a moment.

No warp drive. They started in a system with a sun.

Keep thinking...

Alpha-Zero · Post by **Alpha-Zero** » 2004-07-08 04:04pm

Lord Pounder wrote:Sorry to burst your bubble, but if you actually read Shatners books, non-canon though they may be, Tiberius couldn't actually transfer ships between universes, no transporter could be built big enough to transport an entire ship.

No... but Project Sign was able to open a stable opening that ships could travel between. That's how Tiberius's duplicate Enterprise moved from the Mirror universe to the regular one in Preserver.

Alpha-Zero · Post by **Alpha-Zero** » 2004-07-08 04:09pm

NecronLord wrote:Think for a moment.

No warp drive. They started in a system with a sun.

Keep thinking...

But was the Nebula in the Regula system? If it was, it was pretty damn close to the sun and pretty small, as the sun was about the same size as seen from Earth. Of course... that's assuming ths stars are the same size. Considering it's a yellow star though.. it's a plausible one.

Oh and.. forgive the double posts.

Trogdor · Post by **Trogdor** » 2004-07-09 08:25pm

In the game Shattered Universes the Terran Empire has the Doomsday Machine under their control. I know, it's not cannon, but the evil feds could probably pull off a victory or two with that if they played their cards right. It would probably get pinned down by ISDs sooner or later though.

The Terrans would probably be more of a pain in the ass than the Feds to conquer, but only after the Imps offically won. I can picture a surrender order going out to Starfleet from the conquered Terra ordering them to stand down and the captains saying, "Fuck that," and starting up terrorist activities to resist the occupation. Fed captains would probably meekly do as they're told, or at least, more of them would.

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Evil Star Trek: Better?

Evil Star Trek: Better?

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